Congress. Immediately. You may select one, but not both.
No, I wouldn't think so. Assume for a moment a legitimate whistle blower case, where some agency had in fact been withholding information from Congress. members of Congress, in that scenario, would not be aware of any evidence, yet, and an individual Congressman (or several) saying there is no evidence is not an official statement from Congress.
Your post reminded me of something filmmaker Jeremy Corbell said on C2C back in Nov 2018. He and Bob Lazar were promoting Corbell's (then) new documentary on Lazar and were being interviewed by rent-a-host/intrepid investigative journalist George Knapp.
The video has gone private. It was still missing the parts where he talked about exotic materials and craft the size of a football field.
The video is on the NewsNation website.
Unavailable in Europe.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alien_(law)In law, an alien is any person (including an organization) who is not a citizen or a national of a specific country
https://www.daytondailynews.com/loc...mail&utm_campaign=ddn_AfternoonUpdate_7031287A spokeswoman for the National Air and Space Intelligence Center (NASIC) said the Wright-Patterson Air Force Base center has no record of an employee who has adopted the alias of “Jonathan Grey,” the person who was recently quoted in a news article outlining the claims of an Air Force veteran who said the federal government had spacecraft of non-human origin.
Jonathan Grey is a generational officer of the United States Intelligence Community with a Top-Secret Clearance who currently works for the National Air and Space Intelligence Center (NASIC), where the analysis of UAP has been his focus. Previously he had experience serving Private Aerospace and Department of Defense Special Directive Task Forces.
“The non-human intelligence phenomenon is real. We are not alone,” Grey said. “Retrievals of this kind are not limited to the United States. This is a global phenomenon, and yet a global solution continues to elude us.”
Grusch’s willingness to take risks and speak out appears to be emboldening others with similar knowledge who believe in greater transparency.
Jonathan Grey, the intelligence officer specializing in UAP analysis at the National Air and Space Intelligence Center, is speaking publicly for the first time, identified here under the identity he uses inside the agency.
https://web.archive.org/web/2023060...icials-say-u-s-has-retrieved-non-human-craft/Grey said that such immense capabilities are not merely relegated to the study of the prosaic. “The existence of complex historical programs involving the coordinated retrieval and study of exotic materials, dating back to the early 20th century, should no longer remain a secret,” he said. “The majority of retrieved, foreign exotic materials have a prosaic terrestrial explanation and origin – but not all, and any number higher than zero in this category represents an undeniably significant statistical percentage.”
My original thought was "Jonathan Grey" was a fictitious name used by the media to protect his true identity, but no, the claim was it was the name he worked under at NASIC. It was if he was trying to give the impression he was a covert operative.
Reading that you'd get that impression, but not the way it's been interpreted here. But if that is true, it's still a blow to Grusch's credibility if he had a "generational officer" from NASIC who doesn't exist vouch for him.
I've gone back to look for the article(s) I read that implied Grey and Grusch were the same guy, but no luck. Maybe I misinterpreted what I read, if so that's on me.
Are you referencing Wikileaks?
Are you talking about Gary McKinnon from the UK? That's been 20 or so years ago?
https://www.wired.com/2006/06/ufo-hacker-tells-what-he-found/After allegedly hacking into NASA websites -- where he says he found images of what looked like extraterrestrial spaceships -- the 40-year-old Briton faces extradition to the United States from his North London home. If convicted, McKinnon could receive a 70-year prison term and up to $2 million in fines.
That's why we've been using "extraterrestrial" in this discussion. The alternative, "non-human species", covers the animals that were sent to space in the 1950s. Of course, Grusch also likes to think of dimension travellers...
I'm reading this as not backing Grusch up.
| Grusch | "Grey" |
|---|---|
| retrieval program | retrieval program at NASIC |
| for downed craft | for exotic materials |
| of extraterrestrial origin | the majority is terrestrial |
| including pilots | including unexplained stuff |
| lots of it (12 craft) | little of it (a percentage higher than zero) |
He's referring to the GIMBAL video. We have a thread on the shape of the glare at https://www.metabunk.org/threads/the-shape-and-size-of-glare-around-bright-lights.10596/ , and a debunk on Travis Taylor's contention that the temperature is too high for a jet at https://www.metabunk.org/threads/re...nd-range-and-temp-to-of-the-gimbal-uap.12486/ .Ross Coulthart 20:33
These are the videos that started it all, footage captured by naval aviators on military grade cameras that defied all prosaic explanation. Dave Grusch has investigated this one, shot in 2015 off the east coast by fighter pilots from the USS Theodore Roosevelt. There is an industry of debunkers out there on the web, who say, Oh, they’ve got this wrong. It’s a jet exhaust at a distance and the aircraft’s turning. Give me an answer on that.
David Grusch 21:05
I had some optical engineering experts look at that and Raytheon ATFLIR system. Based on the pixel saturation and apparent size, it’s certainly something that’s not a jet. It might be some kind of natural phenomenon. It’s quite strange, but it’s not as simple as a jet.
Ross Coulthart 09:42
Why are you doing this?
David Grusch 09:44
It’s a sense of service you know, call me a boy scout or whatever it just when I saw the kind of wrongdoing I did, I don’t want to be 60, 70 years old in the future and have that you know, coulda, shoulda woulda kind of feeling where I could have made a difference. I did not want to live a life of regret.
Every serious whistleblower with a mission like this has named names and faced jail time, for example Manning and Snowdon.Ross Coulthart 40:25
Whoever they are. How will the nonhuman intelligence react to the revelation that human beings now know? They’re here?
David Grusch 40:35
Yeah, I mean, obviously, the nonhuman intelligence is have been around for a while, at least multiple decades in modern history, and they’ve allowed ourselves to annihilate ourselves, genocide, war, famine, etc. So at the very least, I think they’re kind of neutral on what humans decide to do with their free will.
How close an interaction did they even have with Grey? Have they claimed to have met him, video called him, just had a voice call with him, or just exchanged emails? If they expect us to trust their reporting on what he's said we at least need to know to what extent they trust him, and on what basis that trust is founded.
"Generational officer" doesn't say anything to me apart from "daddy worked there before him" - am I missing something more coherent than that?
Googling around generational officer means just that, following on from one of your parents in the same organisation as an officer. Usually I see it in police contexts but it would apply to the military as well.
This is the biggest red flag for me when it comes to things feeling like someone is selling a scam, and not just caught up in what they want to believe. Why would any reasonable person say, without evidence, that an extraordinary thing not only exists but that it is obvious... unless they lack confidence in the statement? This is con-artistry 101: elevate the perception of your reality by stating your extraordinary claims require no evidence because they're "obviously" true.
He was vague to the point of saying nothing of substance, while inviting his listeners to fill in the blanks with their own preconceptions and speculations. Meanwhile his own self-importance shone through every sentence: "Look at all the secret stuff I know!" All he did was stir the conspiracy pot, while whining about how he is being mistreated. It's impossible at the moment to decide if he is the monkey or the organ grinder. I suspect the former.
I can't bring myself to nitpick this way, it adds nothing useful to the conversation, it only adds toxicity between the two sides. Maybe he doesn't know an actual number, maybe all he knows is "quite a few". If he does have a number, the smart thing for him to say is "quite a few", because there may be more (or less) than the number he was given - either way, it doesn't matter. What matters is can he prove that ONE exists. Mick has been nitpicking about the number of crashed craft compared to crashed airplanes. But the "quite a few" craft don't all have to be "crashed", they can be shot down, landed and handed over, etc. But none of that matters to the question of "do we have an alien space craft and can Grusch prove it?". I think all this petty nitpicking is what gives skeptics a bad look.
He probably does not know the exact numbers, as simple as that. Some of his answers are his own speculations based on the information he has heard. They are subsequently exaggerated in the press ('murdering aliens').
I understand what you mean about nitpicking, I wish he would have just said 1 , that would be the safest bet if he can even prove just 1 , a lot easier than trying to prove quite a few. I will wait to see when that data is available.
Ross Coulthart
I would have to think any level headed person that believes people like Graves and Favor and really thinks there are issues with UAPs flying around has got know that the vast majority of the Roswell story was tacked on 30 years after the fact by the guy that popularized the Bermuda Triangle. Don't they?17:24
Most people would tell you the Roswell incident has been thoroughly debunked. In fact, the Air Force published this report in 1994. To put the issue to rest once and for all Grusch has read it,
David Grusch 17:39
That analysis that didn’t was a total hack job and even anybody with analytical skills. If you read it, you can, you can deduce that they’re conflating multiple situations with crash test dummies and then mogul balloons. And they’re just saying that the townsfolk who personally witnessed it are totally imagining things, they concocted that whole report just a different form.
Ross Coulthart
https://www.theblackvault.com/docum...eblower-full-newsnation-interview-transcript/18:17
Grusch says that through the 50s and 60s encounters with the NHI continued, as did the cover up one incident in 1967, about which multiple Air Force veterans have gone public involved UAPs tampering with the nuclear missiles at Malmstrom Air Base in Montana, they saw a craft appearing to be intelligently controlled, hovered over a nuclear weapons silo, and shut down 10 Nuclear ICBM missiles.
David Grusch 18:51
It certainly looks like they want to understand how far we’ve advanced in our nucular fissile kind of technologies at the very least, I mean, it looks like preparatory probing activity, it might be innocent kind of scientific gathering could be ISR probing.
That's what Grusch says it is. It's not their assumption, they're going along with Grusch's claims.
I think we all agree that we want actual data to analyse.
Just out of curiosity, would you please confirm the people names you're referring to here? It didn't get clear to me whom they are. Robert Salas springs to mind though.
Corbell and Knapp:
I haven't listened to their podcast, so I can't speak on that. Do they make transcripts available?
Yes, that's perfectly fine.
In late 89, I was seconded to Foreign Technology Division (today's NASIC) to assist them in analyzing what they gleamed from the Soviet MiG-29 crash at the Paris Air Show. FTD had a core team, but augmented it with a few of us SMEs in engineering disciplines they lacked. This type activity shouldn't be a surprise to anyone, I'm sure most countries have similar capabilities.
"Intelligence Officials Say U.S. Has Retrieved Craft Of Non-Human Origin", The Debrief, Leslie Keane and Ralph Blumenthal, June 05 2023 (accessed via Internet Archive Wayback Machine,Jonathan Grey is a generational officer of the United States Intelligence Community with a Top-Secret Clearance who currently works for the National Air and Space Intelligence Center (NASIC), where the analysis of UAP has been his focus. Previously he had experience serving Private Aerospace and Department of Defense Special Directive Task Forces.
“The non-human intelligence phenomenon is real. We are not alone,” Grey said. “Retrievals of this kind are not limited to the United States. This is a global phenomenon, and yet a global solution continues to elude us.”
(My emphasis; link as above).Jonathan Grey, the intelligence officer specializing in UAP analysis at the National Air and Space Intelligence Center, is speaking publicly for the first time, identified here under the identity he uses inside the agency.
From Wikipedia, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luis_Elizondo, my emphasis.New York Times Pentagon correspondent Helene Cooper interviewed Elizondo in 2017. Cooper characterized Elizondo's behavior as typical of intelligence officers, who are "really spooky guys, they're very secretive, they tend to be more paranoid". According to Cooper, "There was a lot of looking over to make sure nobody was seeing us, he sat with his back to the wall. He said, because he wanted to see if anybody came in".
