Ross Coulthart Shows Patch Claimed of "Reverse Engineering Program at Area 51"

[testchamber1]

There is discussion on the always fun ufo subreddit about a claim by [Ross Coulthart]

That can be quickly debunked: it's not an area 51 patch or something like that. It's clearly this old project .

Opinions?

 

[Mendel]

Link content (please review the link policy):

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/15ov0ua/ross_coulthart_just_revealed_the_patch_for_the/


Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/15ov0ua/comment/jvu03j5/

Article:

MAP (Measure, Analyze, Protect) project (2005-2008)

Overview: Security through measurement for wireless LANs

We take a three-point, MAP (Measure, Analyze, Protect) approach to develop an integrated and extensible framework to address existing and future attacks on WiFi networks.

Source: https://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~dfk/research/project/map/index.html

 

[Mendel]

Ross discussed the story behind the patch on the latest episode of Need To Know (8:50 - 13:30). The individual who shared the picture has testified to AARO and is also prepared to testify to congress under oath.

The guy in question served in the air force for 28 years at 'E8' level before being hired to work with EG&G at Area 51 from 1997-2014. This is supposedly the insignia patch for the EG&G engineering group tasked with reverse engineering a craft that was recovered in the 1980s. The craft was described as an egg shape about the size of an SUV, completely smooth and seamless, with no control surfaces or obvious method of propulsion. Two men could lift it, yet it was impossible to cut open and the craft could not be penetrated by x-rays. The best engineers at EG&G could not work out how to activate it or determine a power source.

Ross said today he gets many 'trust me bro' stories like this one, but what made him interested was the fact that the individual shared a photo of the engineering group and recognised certain faces amongst them that led him to believe it was legitimate.

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/15ov0ua/comment/jvuwygj/

 

[Mendel]

Source: https://youtu.be/0oVa3xU34Dk?t=470
starting at 7:52 Coulthart spins the tale, I don't have the time when the patch is shown

 

[jplaza]

The "11001001" is the binary representation of number 201, which in ASCII corresponds to letter 'E'.

 

[jarlrmai]

Also HTTP 201

https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTTP/Status/201

The HTTP 201 Created success status response code indicates that the request has succeeded and has led to the creation of a resource. The new resource, or a description and link to the new resource, is effectively created before the response is sent back and the newly created items are returned in the body of the message, located at either the URL of the request, or at the URL in the value of the Location header.

 

[Mendel]

The "11001001" is the binary representation of number 201, which in ASCII corresponds to letter 'E'.

No. ASCII extends to 127 only. 'E' is 69 in ASCII.

In ISO-8859-1, 201 = 0xC9 is 'É'.

 

[testchamber1]

Thanks for doing the hard work Mendel, I promise to read the guidelines next time.

One theory about the patch symbolism is that the yellow thunder is a modem, turning analog signals to binary ones and viceversa. It makes sense in the context of the MAP Project:

Wireless networks are pervasive, but concerns remain about their security. In the MAP (Measure, Analyze, Protect) project we developed methods for large-scale monitoring and real-time analysis of Wi-Fi network traffic to identify attacks on the network. Specifically, the MAP effort focused on attacks that disable the network, denying access to legitimate clients or reducing the quality of their network performance. The MAP papers provide effective mechanisms for sampling network traffic using sniffers placed throughout the enterprise, a new way to detect whether a given client MAC address is being "spoofed" by an attacker node, and new methods for active fingerprinting of wireless devices.

 

[jarlrmai]

I think it's more specifically about getting binary digital data from wireless signals. Which could be considered analogue demodulation I guess.

RF waves

Binary data

 

[jplaza]

No. ASCII extends to 127 only. 'E' is 69 in ASCII.

In ISO-8859-1, 201 = 0xC9 is 'É'.

Just remind me not to trust python anymore... (edit: or maybe better increase the fontsize!!)

 

[Mick West]

201 (0xC9) is one of my favorite bytes, as it's the Z80 code for "return" and would have used all the time by anyone (like me) hacking Z80 based hardware, like the ZX Spectrum in the 1980s.

The patch was supposedly from some uncle who retired from EG&G in the 1980s, but I doubt there's any connection to video game hacking.

I'm not convinced it's "clearly" the Dartmouth MAP project from 2005-2008.

 

[Mendel]

I'm not convinced it's "clearly" the Dartmouth MAP project from 2005-2008.

I haven't seen Ross Coulthard present the patch, I assume this week's episode is subscriber-only for now?

I haven't seen anything linking the patch to the Dartmouth project. I don't expect university projects to have mission patches.

Article:

Sponsor

Sponsored by HSARPA as part of the Cyber Security Research and Development (CSRD) program

Source: https://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~dfk/research/project/map/index.html

 

[Amathia]

Man, some people get really carried away trying to "decode" the symbolism in government patches.

Here's a video of former CIA officer John Ramirez giving a presentation over at the Unity Project channel. At timestamp 1:53:31-ish he goes through a ton of these and interprets them through the lens of the Ufology mythos.


Source: https://youtu.be/cQfySY_2BLc

 

[Mendel]

A cursory google search seems to show some EG&G mission patches related to NASA.

Closest match to the patch under discussion is "6948 Security Squadron Mobile"

 

[deirdre]

the military "communications squadrons" do seem to like their lightning bolts

https://military-history.fandom.com/wiki/List_of_United_States_Air_Force_communications_squadrons

i imagine someone could email on of the MAP guys and see if one of the young workers made one up.

 

[Mick West]

i imagine someone could email on of the MAP guys and see if one of the young workers made one up.

I emailed David Kotz, who replied with "Huh. Never seen it before!"

 

[Mick West]

I think it's more specifically about getting binary digital data from wireless signals. Which could be considered analogue demodulation I guess.

That would make sense in the context of WiFi security. The "analog" side has a grey disk, and on the digital side it's military-looking star in some crosshairs/reticle.

But then Kotz has never seen it.

 

[deirdre]

I emailed David Kotz, who replied with "Huh. Never seen it before!"

i googled pics of all the separate guys on the team..didnt see anyone wearing that patch. (didnt check social media though, just google images)

some crosshairs/reticle

the only cross hair i saw was a space thing

and all the ones (3)with a binary code background said "cyber" on them (which makes sense)

Although anyone can get any patch made up at any time.

The craft was described as an egg shape about the size of an SUV, completely smooth and seamless, with no control surfaces or obvious method of propulsion. Two men could lift it, yet it was impossible to cut open and the craft could not be penetrated by x-rays. The best engineers at EG&G could not work out how to activate it or determine a power source.

if they cant cut it open, how do they know it's not a dragon egg? or some such?

 

[John J.]

I've been looking at the container on the table of testchamber1's reddit image.
At a glance, I assumed it was a refreshment drink for the speaker, but maybe this is wrong.

I've tried image-matching the whole image (no useful results), and for the (apparently cylindrical) container by itself.

The container appears to be labelled "showtime" (I also considered "glowtime").
I guess there's a small chance that it's a made-up brand name, maybe "ghowtime"- rather inelegant if so.
It's hard to estimate size.

Did some googling; unsurprisingly there are several cosmetics/ toiletries companies, ranges and brand names called "Showtime",
including animal grooming products, plus a fragrance endorsed by Aussie songstress Kylie Minogue.

Nothing I found matches the container on the table.
However, I suspect that the foreground of the reddit image might be from a launch or promotional event by a minor cosmetics company or similar.
Although I can't find any obvious clues, I think the picture might be a portmanteau image.

If addressing, or lecturing about, a military unit, an image of the appropriate unit badge (as opposed to an enormous image of the fabric badge as worn, still in its wrapping) would seem more appropriate. Unless you're saying,
"At ease, men. This is the actual patch you'll soon be wearing, so outsiders can identify which deniable black project you work for outside of Congressional oversight. There'll be a different badge for the team sent to silence the badge producers, but we haven't worked out how we'll make those yet.
...And while you're here, would you like to try some of our new bronzer?"

Although anyone can get any patch made up at any time.

Deirdre's right, there are lots of set-ups with machine-guided sewing (or, cheaper, printing directly onto fabric) used by small sports/ social clubs, cosplayers, fans who want fictitious unit badges from their favourite TV series or film, etc. etc.

 

[jarlrmai]

I've been looking at the container on the table of testchamber1's reddit image.
At a glance, I assumed it was a refreshment drink for the speaker, but maybe this is wrong.

View attachment 61229

I've tried image-matching the whole image (no useful results), and for the (apparently cylindrical) container by itself.

View attachment 61230
The container appears to be labelled "showtime" (I also considered "glowtime").
I guess there's a small chance that it's a made-up brand name, maybe "ghowtime"- rather inelegant if so.
It's hard to estimate size.

Did some googling; unsurprisingly there are several cosmetics/ toiletries companies, ranges and brand names called "Showtime",
including animal grooming products, plus a fragrance endorsed by Aussie songstress Kylie Minogue.

View attachment 61236

Nothing I found matches the container on the table.
However, I suspect that the foreground of the reddit image might be from a launch or promotional event by a minor cosmetics company or similar.
Although I can't find any obvious clues, I think the picture might be a portmanteau image.

If addressing, or lecturing about, a military unit, an image of the appropriate unit badge (as opposed to an enormous image of the fabric badge as worn, still in its wrapping) would seem more appropriate. Unless you're saying,
"At ease, men. This is the actual patch you'll soon be wearing, so outsiders can identify which deniable black project you work for outside of Congressional oversight. There'll be a different badge for the team sent to silence the badge producers, but we haven't worked out how we'll make those yet.
...And while you're here, would you like to try some of our new bronzer?"


Deirdre's right, there are lots of set-ups with machine-guided sewing (or, cheaper, printing directly onto fabric) used by small sports/ social clubs, cosplayers, fans who want fictitious unit badges from their favourite TV series or film, etc. etc.

I think that image is from Coulthard's presentation

 

[deirdre]

ah another "Art's Parts" story

Article:

The individual who sent the photo to Ross gave him permission to share it publicly. The original owner of the patch unfortunately passed away, so ramifications aren't really a concern.

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/15ov0ua/comment/jvuznpq/

Article:

Interesting! The individual supposedly worked in a secure vaulted data storage room managing the data generated by the reverse engineering program, so the binary code very much makes sense. I guess the question is why "11001001". I like the wave theory. And the two programs having the same motto is definitely interesting.

Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/15ov0ua/comment/jvuy009/

 

[deirdre]

give me a break. why would the uncle have the patch? and the uncle only saw a picture and was told a story. so this is a story of a story of a story.

Article:

9:25
uncle had a conversation with a senior engineer when he first arrived in 1997. whose EG and G
9:33
group was tasked with trying to reverse engineer and objects that was recovered and brought to Area
9:39
51 in the 1980s by some CIA Folk shortly after that conversation the senior engineer retired
9:46
their great uncle also saw an up-close Crystal Clear photograph of the same exact object attached
9:56
to the wall of a secure vaulted data storage room at Area 51 sometime after the great uncle stated
10:03
it was absolute proof of a non-human craft but the public would probably never get to see that photograph he said quote the object was egg-shaped about the size of an SUV silverish gray
10:15
in color smooth seamless no control surfaces or propulsion visible no writing no symbols of
10:22
any kind a few men could pick it up yet it could not be cut open and x-rays couldn't penetrate it

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0oVa3xU34Dk

 

[John J.]

I think that image is from Coulthard's presentation

If so, *Doh!* Dammit, thought I was onto something.

 

[John J.]

about the size of an SUV silverish gray
10:15
in color smooth seamless no control surfaces or propulsion visible no writing no symbols of
10:22
any kind a few men could pick it up

If an alien craft had been held for some years, you'd think those involved would be able to relate its exact size and weight.

 

[Mendel]

Nothing I found matches the container on the table.
However, I suspect that the foreground of the reddit image might be from a launch or promotional event by a minor cosmetics company or similar.

The foreground shows chairs and a table, as at a conference, with a video wall as backdrop; the video wall is displaying the patch that speaker Coulthart is talking about. The conference video appears to not be public yet.

The bottle is possibly a customized water bottle (you can e.g. order them on etsy), lensing the brown-white image behind it. Water is often provided to speakers.

 

[Mendel]

If an alien craft had been held for some years, you'd think those involved would be able to relate its exact size and weight.

scales can't penetrate it

 

[deirdre]

The bottle is possibly a customized water bottle (you can e.g. order them on etsy), lensing the brown-white image behind it. Water is often provided to speakers.

Showtime events, does that theater.

Ross's event
https://www.eventbrite.com.au/e/in-plain-sight-ross-coulthart-tickets-662750593867

 

[Mendel]

The craft was described as an egg shape about the size of an SUV, completely smooth and seamless, with no control surfaces or obvious method of propulsion.

Sounds like a description of the Mosul sphere.

Good thing he saw a crystal clear photograph of a featureless surface.

 

[Ann K]

scales can't penetrate it

Darn that anti-gravity!

 

[deirdre]

I just realized EG&G spells "egg". I think the great nephew got played.

 

[John J.]

I just realized EG&G spells "egg".

This is no time for boasting!

 

[Mendel]

I just realized EG&G spells "egg". I think the great nephew got played.

Article:

EG&G, formally known as Edgerton, Germeshausen, and Grier, Inc., was a United States national defense contractor and provider of management and technical services. The company was involved in contracting services to the United States government during World War II and conducted weapons research and development during the Cold war era (from 1948 and onward).[1]: 3 It had close involvement with some of the government's most sensitive technologies.

Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/EG%26G

 

[NorCal Dave]

I just realized EG&G spells "egg". I think the great nephew got played.

EG&G is legit:

EG&G

, formally known as Edgerton, Germeshausen, and Grier, Inc., was a United States national defense contractor and provider of management and technical services. The company was involved in contracting services to the United States government during World War II and conducted weapons research and development during the Cold war era (from 1948 and onward).[1]: 3 It had close involvement with some of the government's most sensitive technologies.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EG&G

Their name is often tossed around with Area 51 as they were a contractor there.

 

[deirdre]

EG&G is legit:

i know it's legit.

but the ufo is an giant egg. i guess noone else has a deadpan uncle with a weird sense of humor. I could totally see my uncle telling me this story with his deadpan straight face.

 

[John J.]

i guess noone else has a deadpan uncle with a weird sense of humor.

My nieces and nephews say they do, but I think Stewart and Peter are pretty sound.

 

[jackfrostvc]

It's funny that when you google 11001001 , the result comes back in reference to a Star Trek episode

 

[NorCal Dave]

i know it's legit.

but the ufo is an giant egg. i guess noone else has a deadpan uncle with a weird sense of humor. I could totally see my uncle telling me this story with his deadpan straight face.

Sorry, I was being a little dense.

Honestly though, does Coulthart actually believe that the people that reverse engineered crashed alien spacecraft in a super top-secret cave at Area 51 had a patch to sew onto their coveralls? I have a friend that was Army Special Forces/Green Berets in the '80s. According to him (I know, 2nd hand info) if he got deployed in a secret operation (mostly advisory/training missions in the Mid East) they took off all their insignia and dog-tags. It was top-secret, therefore they were unidentifiable, unknown and deniable.

But the guys working on the blackest of black secret programs that presidents don't know about, have a patch identifying said program for their coveralls?

 

[jackfrostvc]

The patch seems to me, to be something to do with cyber warfare

Just my opinion.

 

[tobigtofool]

This patch is the last nail in this guys credibility coffin for me.

 

[Mendel]

It's funny that when you google 11001001 , the result comes back in reference to a Star Trek episode

Article:

[..] two pairs of small humanoid aliens known as Bynars; the Bynars heavily rely on their computer technology and work in pairs for best efficiency.

The name "11001001" is a binary number, a concatenation of the names of the Bynars (One One, Zero Zero, One Zero, and Zero One).

Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/11001001