Flight MH370 missing - Two passengers board with false ID

[Soulfly]

Missing flight with 227 passengers and 12 crew.
http://www.ibtimes.com/malaysia-air...rs-emerge-after-two-passengers-boarded-stolen

Malaysia Airlines flight MH370 departed from Kuala Lumpur at 12:41 a.m. Saturday morning and was scheduled to land in Beijing at 6:30 a.m. Air-traffic control lost contact with the aircraft carrying 227 passengers, most of whom were Chinese, and 12 crew members two hours after the flight left Kuala, but the last radar contact was at 1:19 a.m., just 40 minutes after the flight began.

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Two passengers used stolen passports to board the flight.

According to the New York Times, the names of two passengers listed on the flight’s manifest, passengers 63 and 101, match the names of two passports that were stolen in Asia a few years ago. The passports belonged to two men – one Austrian and one Italian – who authorities have confirmed were not on Malaysia Airlines flight MH370 and are in fact alive. The Italian man, Luigi Maraldi, told reporters that he lives in Bangkok.

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[WeedWhacker]

Missing flight with 227 passengers and 12 crew.
http://www.ibtimes.com/malaysia-air...rs-emerge-after-two-passengers-boarded-stolen

Malaysia Airlines flight MH370 departed from Kuala Lumpur at 12:41 a.m. Saturday morning and was scheduled to land in Beijing at 6:30 a.m. Air-traffic control lost contact with the aircraft carrying 227 passengers, most of whom were Chinese, and 12 crew members two hours after the flight left Kuala, but the last radar contact was at 1:19 a.m., just 40 minutes after the flight began.

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Two passengers used stolen passports to board the flight.

According to the New York Times, the names of two passengers listed on the flight’s manifest, passengers 63 and 101, match the names of two passports that were stolen in Asia a few years ago. The passports belonged to two men – one Austrian and one Italian – who authorities have confirmed were not on Malaysia Airlines flight MH370 and are in fact alive. The Italian man, Luigi Maraldi, told reporters that he lives in Bangkok.

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I have been following this story since yesterday, via Flight Aware:
http://flightaware.com/squawks/view/linked/email/alert/40633/


As yet, I have no firm opinion as to the cause of the downing of this airplane. I tend to think it's rather early to speculate, absent full facts.

EDIT: However, this thread is worth a watch.

 

[Soulfly]

Most defiantly too early to determine anything, the information just isn't there.

 

[WeedWhacker]

Most defiantly too early to determine anything, the information just isn't there.

Yes, agreed. If you go to the FlightAware site that I linked, you will see extensive discussions, some of which I participated in....but keeping in mind that I tried only to deflect wild and ridiculous speculations.

Knowing what I know, there is less than 0.1% chance of mechanical failure. Other ideas occur to me:

Terrorism, i.e. a bomb

Suicide, i.e. Egypt Air 990

Or...an accidental "shoot-down".

(There may be more possibilities that haven't occurred to me)

One 'positive' aspect of this is the depth of the waters, where the airplane was lost. Not nearly as difficult as in the deep Atlantic Ocean, as was the case for Air France 447.

Stay tuned.

EDIT: A post from FlightAware which seems fairly pertinent:
http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/tr...-terrorism-fears/story-fniztvnh-1226848860442

ANOTHER pilot who was flying ahead of the missing Malaysia Airlines plane has revealed he made contact with aircraft minutes after he was asked to do so by Vietnamese air traffic control.

The captain, who requested to remain anonymous, told Malaysian media outlets his plane, which was bound for Narita, Japan, was in Vietnamese airspace when he was asked to contact the pilot flying the missing plane.

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More info, from the FA site:
http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BiN32qFCEAAsBqH.jpg#twimg

And, I just realized that contrary to my earlier post, I have engaged in "speculation". So, I will attempt to focus on the (apparent) possible "conspiracy" about two suspicious passports. AND, as I "predicted" on the FlightAware site, a "conspiracy" always seems to crop up, with these major news events.....

 

[derwoodii]

well it don't take them long before they started up with the bunk


POSSIBILITY NUMERIC ORDERS OF MH370:
38 Malaysian Passengers : 3+8=11
29 employees from Freescale Semiconductors Factory : 2+9=11
March 8 = 8+3=11

But report from Freescale company says 20 staff missing not the above claimed 29 so numeric maths debunked

http://media.freescale.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=196520&p=irol-newsArticle_print&ID=1907348&highlight=

 

[Mick West]

well it don't take them long before they started up with the bunk

POSSIBILITY NUMERIC ORDERS OF MH370:
38 Malaysian Passengers : 3+8=11
29 employees from Freescale Semiconductors Factory : 2+9=11
March 8 = 8+3=11

But report from Freescale company says 20 staff missing not the above claimed 29 so numeric maths debunked

I'd recommend just ignoring nonsense like that. It's such obvious bunk that it debunks itself. Unfortunately all you do by debunking it is help spread the nonsense around.

 

[Soulfly]

With no real information you can't even attempt debunk (or verify) any of it yet.

 

[Pete Tar]

Today, a Texas-based semiconductor firm said that 20 of its employees were confirmed passengers on board.

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I'm sure I saw someone already change that to 20 *executives* and emphasising that it produces products for high-grade military tech, but wiki mentions nothing of the sort.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freescale_Semiconductor
The company focuses on the automotive, consumer, industrial and networking markets...
Since then, Freescale has continued to provide the technology behind consumer, medical, networking and automotive products from microprocessors for the world’s first tubing-free wireless insulin pump,[9] to and automotive microcontrollers for efficient engine design. Freescale’s motion-sensing accelerometer powers the interactivity of the Guitar Hero video games.[10] The number one provider of eReader applications processors worldwide is Freescale.[11]

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[Mark Barrington]

The press release on the Freescale site doesn't provide much in the way of names or details, but to say that 12 of the employees are from Malaysia, and 8 are from China, which is not surprising for a flight between Malaysia and China. It's a terrible tragedy for the families involved, but I don't see any unusual involvement by Freescale.

http://media.freescale.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=196520&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=1907348&highlight=

AUSTIN, Texas--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Mar. 8, 2014-- Freescale Semiconductor (NYSE:FSL) has confirmed that 20 of its employees were confirmed passengers on Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370 en route from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing. Twelve are from Malaysia and eight are from China. The entire Freescale Semiconductor community is deeply saddened by this news. The company is continuing to monitor the situation and will provide more information as it becomes available.

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[Mick West]

Freescale came up on Infowars Prison Planet last year , seemingly hinting at RFID implants.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/worlds-smallest-chip-to-be-swallowable.html

Also mentioned in a Michael Hastings story:
http://planet.infowars.com/worldnew...-body-was-cremated-against-his-familys-wishes

How they have done this is unclear. “My best guess is that they have managed to put the ECU into an unencrypted test state, possibly by playing around with power-up sequences,” says Peter Highton, a senior engineer with Freescale Semiconductor in Aylesbury, UK, which makes ECU microchips for racing cars as well as ordinary vehicles.

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If there are dots, someone will join them, randomness be damned!

 

[NoParty]

We still don't know jack-squat.
Except that--this long in--the fate of the passengers is almost certainly catastrophic.

The passports angle definitely holds a bit of early intrigue…but could easily be a minor immigration issue.

In short, definitely still prudent to wait before jumping to any conclusions.

 

[MikeC]

Apart from the obvious safety issues, what I am surprised about is that stolen passports were apparently used to board the aircraft at all - I thought the numbers would be in all customs/immigration databases, and they would have been flagged when scanned at exit??

 

[WeedWhacker]

If there are dots, someone will join them, randomness be damned!

Yes, exactly. Isn't this just the "way", with the Internet so handy and at everyone's fingertips?

So much BUNK, so little time.

 

[MikeC]

Interpol have said that no-one checked their database of suspect passport numbers prior to the flight - see this article.

Apparently it is not actually common to do so at all - even without this disaster that has to be pretty damned stupid by a lot of countries!!

In an interview with The Associated Press in January 2010, Noble had warned that "the greatest threat in the world" was that at the time, a half-billion international air arrivals worldwide took place in which travel documents were not compared against Interpol databases.

Some countries have woken up to the threat more than others: In 2006, US authorities scanned the database about 2,000 times - but did so 78 million times just three years later.
For years, Interpol has asked why countries would "wait for a tragedy to put prudent security measures in place at borders and boarding gates," Noble said Sunday.

"Now, we have a real case where the world is speculating whether the stolen passport holders were terrorists, while Interpol is asking why only a handful of countries worldwide are taking care to make sure that persons possessing stolen passports are not boarding international flights."

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[Mick West]

Interpol have said that no-one checked their database of suspect passport numbers prior to the flight - see this article.

which would have to be a stupendous blunder at the best of times.........which this is not!

Only if it were standard practice at the originating airport, which it apparently is not.

 

[Pete Tar]

There's probably a small percentage of people travelling on fake passports on normal flights that don't crash, it's only when they crash that it gets becomes obvious.

 

[WeedWhacker]

There's probably a small percentage of people travelling on fake passports on normal flights that don't crash, it's only when they crash that it gets becomes obvious.

Indeed....and ONLY then do "conspiracy theories" arise.

 

[Soulfly]

I'm sure we will get the full gambit of theories from analyzing photos, to saying it's all a hoax, to speculating on the passengers jobs/lives.

 

[Josh Heuer]

I was just driving home listening to NPR and they mentioned a little more 'mystery' involving passengers. (Or would-be passengers I guess)

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2014/03/10/288518809/missing-planes-fate-still-a-mystery

It's also been revealed that five passengers who checked in for the Malaysia Airlines flight never got on board, NPR's Anthony Kuhn reports from Beijing. Malaysian aviation officials say those passengers' bags were taken off the jet before its departure.

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Probably nothing of importance though since these folks never got on the flight, but I'm curious as to why they didn't get on.

 

[Trigger Hippie]

I'm sure we will get the full gambit of theories from analyzing photos, to saying it's all a hoax, to speculating on the passengers jobs/lives.

...to claiming it's all a false flag operation. Don't forget the false flag theories:

*ALERT* Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370 Mystery = False Flag = Global Biometrics Agenda Push - YouTube

I've been reading several reports that the use of forged travel papers is not uncommon in that part of the world. Apparently very popular in China.

 

[Soulfly]

http://www.ibtimes.com/obscure-grou...rigade-claims-responsibility-missing-malaysia

A group called Chinese Martyrs’ Brigade has claimed responsibility for the disappearance of Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370, without providing many details about the fate of the plane itself, even as at least one official dismissed the group's claims, local news reports said.

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[MikeC]

I was just driving home listening to NPR and they mentioned a little more 'mystery' involving passengers. (Or would-be passengers I guess)

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2014/03/10/288518809/missing-planes-fate-still-a-mystery

It's also been revealed that five passengers who checked in for the Malaysia Airlines flight never got on board, NPR's Anthony Kuhn reports from Beijing. Malaysian aviation officials say those passengers' bags were taken off the jet before its departure.

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Probably nothing of importance though since these folks never got on the flight, but I'm curious as to why they didn't get on.

It is quite a common occurrence for a handful of passengers on a large a/c to not board and the bags to be removed - unaccompanied baggage has not been allowed for many years now.

reasons I've encountered include getting lost in the airport, being taken ill, or being "recalled" by urgent work or family concerns.

 

[Bill]

The two passengers using stolen passports have been identified as Iranian nationals. I'm going to go out on a limb and guess their final destination was North Korea. Fly into China incognito and travel by land to North Korea leaving no record of them entering the country.

 

[Mick West]

The two passengers using stolen passports have been identified as Iranian nationals. I'm going to go out on a limb and guess their final destination was North Korea. Fly into China incognito and travel by land to North Korea leaving no record of them entering the country.

Looks more like they were simply illegal immigrants to Europe:
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-26525281

Two men travelling on stolen passports on board a missing Malaysian airliner were Iranians with no apparent links to terrorist groups, officials say.

Malaysian police named one as Pouria Nour Mohammad Mehrdad, 18, and said he was probably migrating to Germany.

Interpol identified the other as Delavar Seyed Mohammadreza, 29.
...
The authorities' statement supports an account given to the BBC by a young Iranian in Kuala Lumpur, who says he was a school friend of one of the men who boarded the airliner using stolen documents.

He says the friend and another Iranian stayed with him before taking the Malaysia Airlines flight, and that they had hoped to settle in Europe

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[Bill]

Looks more like they were simply illegal immigrants to Europe:
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-26525281

Two men travelling on stolen passports on board a missing Malaysian airliner were Iranians with no apparent links to terrorist groups, officials say.

Malaysian police named one as Pouria Nour Mohammad Mehrdad, 18, and said he was probably migrating to Germany.

Interpol identified the other as Delavar Seyed Mohammadreza, 29.
...
The authorities' statement supports an account given to the BBC by a young Iranian in Kuala Lumpur, who says he was a school friend of one of the men who boarded the airliner using stolen documents.

He says the friend and another Iranian stayed with him before taking the Malaysia Airlines flight, and that they had hoped to settle in Europe

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I've since heard that but do you travel to Europe by way of Beijing?

 

[Mick West]

I've since heard that but do you travel to Europe by way of Beijing?

Yes, they wanted the cheapest fare, this is the cheapest first from Kuala Lumpur to Amsterdam:
http://www.expedia.com/Flights-Sear...ss:coach,nopenalty:N,sortby:price&mode=search

 

[Mick West]

It seems likely that this event will spawn a whole wave of conspiracy theories. I'm reluctant to get into it though, in the almost total absence of any real facts. But it might eventually warrant a new sub-forum.

 

[MikeC]

Cheap airfares can get you to lots of strange places. I flew to Oklahoma in 2000 - the cheapest fare was a "world" ticket where I had to pass through London - so my flight was Auckland-LA-Chicago-Okl (2 week course) then back to Chicago -London-San Francisco (visit sister)-Auckland.

 

[WeedWhacker]

Cheap airfares can get you to lots of strange places. I flew to Oklahoma in 2000 - the cheapest fare was a "world" ticket where I had to pass through London - so my flight was Auckland-LA-Chicago-Okl (2 week course) then back to Chicago -London-San Francisco (visit sister)-Auckland.

The beauty about that is how you can rack up Airline FF Mileage!!

 

[Pete Tar]

Asked why police believed the man was seeking to emigrate to Germany, Khalid said authorities had been in contact with his mother, who was waiting for him to reach Frankfurt, but he gave no further details.

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/world/2014/03/11/19/32/photos-of-iranian-passengers-released

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[Soulfly]

I fear that my earlier post (#31) may have steered this particular thread in a wrong direction...there is cross-interest in MH370, but this thread is specific to the question of the "fake passports".

On that topic: Regardless of the "reason" for the apparent disappearance of MH370, it seems that the fact of these two falsified passports may be irrelevant. Still, it is a mystery.

I didn't really put the Passport in the title to debunk. It was just the most intriguing info at the time. I made the thread and stuck it in chitchat just because I know there a lot of pilots and aviation enthusiast here. Also figured it would spawn CTs for future threads.

 

[WeedWhacker]

I made the thread and stuck it in chitchat....

Yes, it was after my posts that I was reminded it is in "Chit-Chat". But, thanks much for the comments!

 

[Bill]

Yes, they wanted the cheapest fare, this is the cheapest first from Kuala Lumpur to Amsterdam:
http://www.expedia.com/Flights-Search?trip=oneway&leg1=from:KUL,to:AMS,departure:04/08/2014TANYT&passengers=children:0,adults:1,seniors:0,infantinlap:Y&options=cabinclass:coach,nopenalty:N,sortbyrice&mode=search

Okay. I tried travelocity and was routed through the middle east.

 

[WeedWhacker]

Okay. I tried travelocity and was routed through the middle east.

'Expedia' versus 'Travelocity'?

Now, THAT'S an advert worth creating!!

(Sorry...all we need now is another "PriceLine" commercial with William Shatner, and my life will be complete. An epic battle, the 'Shat' in a duel with the 'Gnome'? One can dream.....).

 

[Bill]

Watching Wolf Blitzer - Getting lots of uninformed speculation on this topic labeled as news.

 

[Mark Barrington]

Watching Wolf Blitzer - Getting lots of uninformed speculation on this topic labeled as news.

So, basically, you're watching cable news. CNN has to fill 24 hours a day. Actually, most of Wolf's guests are being fairly cautious, and most of the speculation is being driven by him.

 

[WeedWhacker]

Watching Wolf Blitzer - Getting lots of uninformed speculation on this topic labeled as news.

I expect that many of the "24 Hour News Networks" feel compelled to fill airtime in any ways they can.

It rather makes a mockery of the word, and profession, of "journalism"

 

[WeedWhacker]

Again, since this is "Chit-Chat"...more unconfirmed, but from Reuters:

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/...me=GCA-GoogleNewsUK&google_editors_picks=true

Investigators trying to solve the disappearance without trace of a Malaysia Airlines jetliner face an extremely rare challenge that could hinder their efforts: they lack the powers of a formal air safety investigation.

Four days after Flight MH370 went missing in mid-air with 239 people on board, no nation has stepped forward to initiate and lead an official probe, leaving a formal leadership vacuum that industry experts say appears unprecedented.

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Take of it as you will.

 

[Soulfly]

Watching Wolf Blitzer - Getting lots of uninformed speculation on this topic labeled as news.

That's pretty much what he does all the time. Even after his guest pretty much disagree with him he still tries to ask them the same stupid speculative questions.

 

[Bill]

I expect that many of the "24 Hour News Networks" feel compelled to fill airtime in any ways they can.

It rather makes a mockery of the word, and profession, of "journalism"

CNN coverage - "There's no evidence of terrorism and experts are leaning against terrorism so lets talk about terrorism".