Roswell PD New Patch

[john.phil]

Roswell Police Department (RPD) introduced their new patch, it reads "Protect and Serve Those that Land Here":

source: https://roswell-nm.gov/CivicAlerts.aspx?AID=1248

It replaces the previous more sober patch:

It also goes four-fingered hand-to-hand with Roswell new logo adopted in 2019:

 

[NorCal Dave]

Apparently the RPD is unaware of the details involved in the Roswell case. The alien buggers "crashed", they didn't "land". Maybe if the patch had a crashed UFO, it might be a bit better. If they want to go with something more authentic, they can just look at the photos and read the FIRST HAND accounts of what was collected on Mack Brazil's ranch and create a patch with some broken sticks and bits of torn mylar.

Alas, there is nothing sexy about broken sticks and mylar, so they go with what brings in the tourists. When the McMenamins Hotel tried to cash in on a couple of photos from the '50s and created a UFO festival in McMinnville OR 20 years ago, nobody much cared. Now it's a major event drawing more people than McMinnville's former wine festival, despite being in the heart of Oregon's wine country.

One of this year's keynote speakers is Ryan Graves:

https://ufofest.com/events/

 

[deirdre]

The alien buggers "crashed", they didn't "land". Maybe if the patch had a crashed UFO,

That's not what that means. The Roswell Police aren't paid to protect extraterrestrial aliens, they are paid to protect and serve illegal aliens, tourists, and residents.
"those who land" as in "those who end up here". Like when you play monopoly and you land on my Park Avenue.

 

[Ann K]

Roswell Police Department (RPD) introduced their new patch, it reads "Protect and Serve Those that Land Here":

Methinks someone in the Roswell PD has a great sense of humor. That's a good thing, since they've had years of dealing with kooks showing up on their doorstep,

 

[NorCal Dave]

That's a good thing, since they've had years of dealing with kooks showing up on their doorstep,

The 'kooks" may have just shown up 30-40 years ago, but now the town has fully embraced them and their dollars. They're invited and catered too. It's the model McMinnville has copied, though theirs is a bit more playful up front even if the speakers are supposed to be serious. Like I noted in another thread, I would totally take the RV up to McMinnville if we weren't heading back east to see the kids at the same time.

That's not what that means. The Roswell Police aren't paid to protect extraterrestrial aliens, they are paid to protect and serve illegal aliens, tourists, and residents.
"those who land" as in "those who end up here". Like when you play monopoly and you land on my Park Avenue.

Maybe. But when one puts "land here" and a flying saucer together on the same patch, there is a definite implication there. And if I did land on Park Avenue, I might just claim COVID and not pay the rent

 

[JMartJr]

I'm curious to see how that looks as an embroidered patch. Those thin lines are not going to read well, I'd worry. But as is the case with many, many problems, this one is not one of mine!

 

[deirdre]

there is a definite implication there

obviously.

I might just claim COVID and not pay the rent

then i'll file for government money and help raise inflation which hurts the poor people. Shame on you. tsk tsk.

Those thin lines are not going to read well, I'd worry.

it looks ok. it basically all disappears except for the big white ROSWELL POLICE.

 

[john.phil]

I'm curious to see how that looks as an embroidered patch.

Some got it on their uniform already, it turned out better than expected:


Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vRV1F85tIQ0

 

[JMartJr]

it turned out better than expected:

Agreed. The lines are fine, though they won't red at any distance. Looks like the alien faces were less successful.

 

[deirdre]

Looks like the alien faces were less successful.

They are an actual police department. doing some rather serious police stuff. (meaning i think the alien faces were very successful for a Police Department when many citizens are not happy with the new patches.)

 

[JMartJr]

They are an actual police department. doing some rather serious police stuff.

I just meant the design does not translate well to the embroidery on the patch in terms of the faces.

 

[John J.]

I don't think I lack a sense of humour, but if this patch is worn on everyday police uniforms, it's a terrible idea.

Imagine an officer delivering the news to someone that their child has died in an accident, or interviewing a rape victim,
with this 3rd-rate pop-culture-referencing crap on their arm. It's inappropriate, and should be an embarrassment to whoever approved its use. No-one should be asked to risk their life in the line of duty wearing a cartoon.

Additionally, if the US is anything like the UK, I'd imagine police in communities like Roswell spend a lot of time dealing with people having mental health crises which in a better world might be dealt with by social services/ healthcare professionals.
On this forum we've seen some examples of people holding UFO-related and/ or conspiratorial beliefs which many of us find bizarre. Someone with acute psychiatric illness having delusions related to such beliefs might not be reassured by real police officers turning up wearing a sodding flying saucer badge.

As a behind-closed-doors "morale" patch, or on sports kit for charity runs etc. it might be acceptable.
But this patch doesn't belong on police officer uniforms.

 

[john.phil]

No-one should be asked to risk their life in the line of duty wearing a cartoon.

A police officer came up with the design, and the officers voted internally.

The process to create a new patch began with an invitation to RPD employees – commissioned law enforcement officers as well as civilian staff – to submit design ideas. The submissions were reviewed by the department's command staff – consisting of RPD's chief, two deputy chiefs, two captains and five lieutenants – and four designs were selected as finalists. The new patch that will now represent the department was the one, from among the finalists, that proved the most popular among department employees who participated in an online survey. The chosen patch was designed by Support Services Sgt. Trong Nguyen.

source: https://roswell-nm.gov/CivicAlerts.aspx?AID=1248

 

[jarlrmai]

It's still a bad idea for all the other reasons given, hold a contest sure, they should get a say but vet the entrants.

 

[Ann K]

I'm curious to see how that looks as an embroidered patch. Those thin lines are not going to read well, I'd worry. But as is the case with many, many problems, this one is not one of mine!

The thin lines are for the flag of New Mexico. If they were strongly delineated it would make the whole thing hard to read at a glance, so they're tucked demurely into the background where they belong. It says "Roswell Police", and the other aspects of it are inconspicuous.

 

[deirdre]

It's still a bad idea for all the other reasons given, hold a contest sure, they should get a say but vet the entrants.

I agree. Although i imagine their town culture is different then what i might be used to. (i'm in NorthEast)

The chief gave an interview to Ross Coulthart.

I think he did an ok job brushing off aliens. He never heard of aliens growing up in Roswell. That kinda sprang up in the 1990s. Doesnt sound like people who live there go around much talking aliens , so not sure how much he knows about all the current goings on with this newest surge.

He says its good for the town's economy. edit: <aliens good for economy, not the patch

 

[FatPhil]

It's still a bad idea for all the other reasons given, hold a contest sure, they should get a say but vet the entrants.

C.f. Boaty McBoatface

 

[NorCal Dave]

I don't think I lack a sense of humour, but if this patch is worn on everyday police uniforms, it's a terrible idea.

Yeah, but...

Some numbers:

After getting to just under 40,000 residents in 1980, the population of Roswell has stayed below 50,000 since:

1980	39,676		17.0%
1990	44,654		12.5%
2000	45,293		1.4%
2010	48,366		6.8%
2020	48,422		0.1%

With a 2019 median income of $43,372 and a poverty rate of 19.7%:

The median income for a household in the city was $43,372, and per capita income was $22,119 (2015–2019 in 2019 dollars). In 2019, 19.7% of the population were living below the poverty line.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roswell,_New_Mexico

Compared to the rest of the country:

Median U.S. household income increased 6.8% to $68,700, the U.S. Census Bureau said Tuesday.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...-income-rises-6-8-t-o-68-700-2019/5800117002/

• The official poverty rate in 2019 was 10.5 percent, down 1.3 percentage points from 11.8 percent in 2018. This is the fifth consecutive annual decline in poverty. Since 2014, the poverty rate has fallen 4.3 percentage points, from 14.8 percent to 10.5 percent (Figure 7 and Table B-5).
• The 2019 poverty rate of 10.5 percent is the lowest rate observed since estimates were initially published in 1959 (Figure 7 and Table B-5).

• https://www.census.gov/library/publications/2020/demo/p60-270.html

Roswell is a relatively poor town of 40-50,000 people. We can compare it to some other Southwest towns with similar populations and income levels, such a Prescott AZ with 45,384 people:

The median income for a household in the city was $35,446, and the median income for a family was $46,481. Males had a median income of $31,834 versus $22,982 for females. The per capita income for the city was $22,565. About 7.4% of families and 13.1% of the population were below the poverty line, including 14.4% of those under age 18 and 6.4% of those age 65 or over.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prescott,_Arizona

Or the similar sized El Centro CA:

There are 44,322 residents in El Centro, with a median age of 31.

The average annual household income in El Centro is $68,056, while the median household income sits at $49,244 per year.

https://www.point2homes.com/US/Neighborhood/CA/El-Centro-Demographics.html

The real comparison is how many people have heard of Prescott or El Centro? Or Hanford CA, Kyle TX, Lake Havasu AZ or Pahrump NV. Maybe some, but everybody knows Roswell and the Police Department knows why. Without the aliens, Roswell is just another mid sized town no one is interested in.

 

[jarlrmai]

Yeah, but...

Some numbers:

After getting to just under 40,000 residents in 1980, the population of Roswell has stayed below 50,000 since:

1980	39,676		17.0%
1990	44,654		12.5%
2000	45,293		1.4%
2010	48,366		6.8%
2020	48,422		0.1%

With a 2019 median income of $43,372 and a poverty rate of 19.7%:

The median income for a household in the city was $43,372, and per capita income was $22,119 (2015–2019 in 2019 dollars). In 2019, 19.7% of the population were living below the poverty line.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roswell,_New_Mexico

Compared to the rest of the country:

Median U.S. household income increased 6.8% to $68,700, the U.S. Census Bureau said Tuesday.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...-income-rises-6-8-t-o-68-700-2019/5800117002/

• The official poverty rate in 2019 was 10.5 percent, down 1.3 percentage points from 11.8 percent in 2018. This is the fifth consecutive annual decline in poverty. Since 2014, the poverty rate has fallen 4.3 percentage points, from 14.8 percent to 10.5 percent (Figure 7 and Table B-5).
• The 2019 poverty rate of 10.5 percent is the lowest rate observed since estimates were initially published in 1959 (Figure 7 and Table B-5).

• https://www.census.gov/library/publications/2020/demo/p60-270.html

Roswell is a relatively poor town of 40-50,000 people. We can compare it to some other Southwest towns with similar populations and income levels, such a Prescott AZ with 45,384 people:

The median income for a household in the city was $35,446, and the median income for a family was $46,481. Males had a median income of $31,834 versus $22,982 for females. The per capita income for the city was $22,565. About 7.4% of families and 13.1% of the population were below the poverty line, including 14.4% of those under age 18 and 6.4% of those age 65 or over.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prescott,_Arizona

Or the similar sized El Centro CA:

There are 44,322 residents in El Centro, with a median age of 31.

The average annual household income in El Centro is $68,056, while the median household income sits at $49,244 per year.

https://www.point2homes.com/US/Neighborhood/CA/El-Centro-Demographics.html

The real comparison is how many people have heard of Prescott or El Centro? Or Hanford CA, Kyle TX, Lake Havasu AZ or Pahrump NV. Maybe some, but everybody knows Roswell and the Police Department knows why. Without the aliens, Roswell is just another mid sized town no one is interested in.

I'm unsure what the point of this is?

 

[john.phil]

The chief gave an interview to Ross Coulthart.

The interview link and highlights from RPD Chief Lance Bateman:

(02:24 - 03:01) - The department wanted a new patch, there was a vote among the department staff. Four designs were downselected by the command staff, the winning one was the most voted by the department.
(03:10 - 03:38) - Design theme was free, most chose an alien theme due to it being a big part of the community now, for the last 30 years, which was not a thing in the chief's childhood.
(05:02 - 05:40) - His father was stationed at Walker Air Force base in the 60's, and never heard about the alleged crash until the early 90's. The chief also never heard about it as a kid. But now it brings money to Roswell every year.
(05:55 - 06:25) - Some retired officers didn't like the theme of the patch, some people disliked it online. But police officers all over the US want to buy the new patch, and people in the community who saw it on the uniform already, liked it, so overall it was positive.
(08:10 - 09:17) - The alien subject is good for the local economy. The chief disagrees with the critique that the alien patch takes away their reputation, because the officers themselves designed and voted for it, moreover: "I don't think a patch can take away what they do every day", the community agrees, and within a few years the officers may decide to change the design if they want it.
(17:15 - 17:23) - "If you don't accept it, laugh about it, it's just going to probably drive you nuts. So, I'm good, glad to do it".
(17:46 - 18:07) - Some people were trying to correct the grammar online, but they kept it as designed by the sergeant.


Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vTJdpJ7rHHw

 

[deirdre]

ok. he initially bought 500 patches and then bought 8000.

that's like 85 patches per person.
(ironically that is the patch designer, SWAT sergeant, on the building ad in this article)

Article:

The ad goes on to state that the Roswell Police Department has lost 39 officers since January 2021. According to the department's September report, there were 87 sworn officers on the job with 17 more openings for sworn personnel, which is a total of 104 sworn, certified employee positions. This report was given to members of the city's Public Safety Committee in mid-October.

"The Roswell Police Department does not have a hiring problem, it has a retention problem," Basile said.

Basile stated on Nov. 2 that six officer candidates are at the academy and 10 more are in training but not at the academy. Some officers are also out on extended leave. He estimates the number of sworn officer openings will soon exceed 40 and "there are more coming."

Source: https://www.rdrnews.com/news/local/roswell-police-buy-ad-with-hope-of-rallying-public-support-in-pay-negotiations/article_9a4888d0-7abd-11ee-a87e-f7173e1ce711.html

Article:

16:37
the uniform um we ordered 8,000 more to
16:42
outfit the rest of the department and
16:44
all officers will have all their
16:46
uniforms changed over

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vTJdpJ7rHHw

 

[JMartJr]

One wonders if they intend to sell a gazillion of them to supplement their budget, then (possibly) switch to somethign a bit less silly for their uniforms once sales start to wind down. (This one wonders, anyway!) Maybe not, maybe they really like it and will keep it into the foreseeable future... let's watch, shall we?

 

[Ann K]

I'm unsure what the point of this is?

The point is that if publicity turns into dollars to support a town with a high poverty level, perhaps it is churlish to criticize them for that. Another much smaller town in the southwest actually changed its name to win a radio contest, and Hot Springs, New Mexico, became Truth or Consequences. It brought fiestas and parades. Is that something I would not want to do? Yes. But it would appear to be what they needed at the time, publicity that brought in dollars.

 

[john.phil]

About the economic impact of the UFO Festival in Roswell:

The 2022 UFO Festival had a $2.19 million direct economic impact for Roswell and brought more than 40,000 visitors to the city.

source 1: https://roswell-nm.gov/1757/UFO-Festival-Report-2022
source 2: https://roswell-nm.gov/DocumentCenter/View/20308/UFO-2022-Report

2023 event was weak in comparison:

The 2023 UFO Festival had a $510,205 direct economic impact for Roswell and brought more than 3,370 visitors to the city.

source 3: https://roswell-nm.gov/1852/UFO-Festival-Report-2023

THE ROSWELL INCIDENT UFO Festival 2023 marked the 76th anniversary of the 'Roswell Incident'. The purpose of holding the UFO Festival is to increase lodgers' tax and income for local businesses within the city of Roswell, as well as bring notoriety to Roswell to increase sustained tourism throughout the year by making it a familiar vacation destination.

source 4: https://roswell-nm.gov/DocumentCenter/View/24040/UFO-2023-Report-FINAL

 

[John J.]

Without the aliens, Roswell is just another mid sized town no one is interested in.

Agreed, NorCal Dave, but the police will be required whether they're "on-brand" or not. They don't need to advertise, as it were.
I kind of fear they might be (unintentionally) compromising their professional appearance for, in effect, the local tourist board.


We don't know the percentage of officers who voted on patch designs, or what percentage of that vote each of the four designs received. We haven't seen the other designs, and maybe there wasn't a "none of the above" option.

As @FatPhil alluded to with Boaty McBoatface, popular votes for organisational names/ insignia don't always return an appropriate result- "Boaty McBoatface" was the UK public's choice of name for a new Antarctic survey ship

In March 2016, the Natural Environment Research Council (NERC) announced that members of the public were being asked to suggest names for the ship. ...The NERC stated that they would have the final say...
...Former BBC Radio Jersey presenter James Hand jokingly suggested RRS "Boaty McBoatface". This quickly became the most popular choice and was the runaway winner when the poll closed, with 124,109 votes.

The Research Council instead opted to name the ship RRS Sir David Attenborough after the popular naturalist; a remotely-piloted submersible carried by the ship got the Boaty McBoatface moniker
(Wikipedia, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RRS_Sir_David_Attenborough).

If Roswell police officers like the patch that's fair enough, but it does mean that they're associating their department with bunk.
It implies that the most notable thing about their community is (a) an alien UFO crash covered up by the US State,
or (b) a lot of people being fooled into believing in (a).

Claims of alien bodies retrieved at Roswell date back to c. 1980 AFAIK, with the (supposedly) factual book The Roswell Incident
by Charles Berlitz and William L. Moore.
The Roswell "crash" is much-discussed (and I believe effectively debunked) elsewhere on this forum; see also Wikipedia links
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roswell_incident, and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Roswell_Incident_(1980_book)

The new patch won't affect the competence of Roswell's police officers, and might be an interesting talking point for visitors.
I guess it's fine for summer fares and the like.
But with all the goodwill in the world, I don't think it's an emblem suitable for a domestic violence unit, child protection investigators, homicide detectives etc. etc.
It lacks gravity (pun not intended); and
it literally makes unreliable / untruthful accounts emblematic of that police department.

Personally, I think that a more "small-c" conservative badge might be more representative of the often serious nature of police work, and maybe more respectful to those encountered in times of distress.

Maybe the local police leadership could have provided (or sought) a bit more guidance on the matter of emblems beforehand,
or maybe they could have taken the Boaty McBoatface option and chosen a different patch design, perhaps retaining the voted-for design in limited use outside of more serious policing tasks.

Regardless; I'm sure we all wish successful and safe careers for Roswell's police, and peaceful, prosperous neighbourhoods for Roswell.

But police officers all over the US want to buy the new patch

Yep, there's a large market for Roswell "memorabilia", and many collectors of police / military etc. patches,
which was touched on in this thread
Ross Coulthart Shows Patch Claimed of "Reverse Engineering Program at Area 51"-

-hang on a minute,

The chief gave an interview to Ross Coulthart.

Maybe Ross Coulthart is a patch collector! But when it comes to UFOs, it might be fair to say some members here think he's not necessarily an accurate reporter.

(Edited to add: Just read @deirdre's post about officer numbers, I guess it's possible Roswell PD won't have all the policing specialties I mentioned but I hope what I was trying to say is reasonably clear.)

 

[NorCal Dave]

I'm unsure what the point of this is?

Roswell is just one of hundreds of towns/cities of similar size, with below average median income and above average poverty rate. It's not on I40 or I25. One doesn't "pass through" Roswell unless they're heading to Dexter or maybe Elida or some other small town no one has ever heard of:

It's not Napa or Bath. The only reason people know about it is the supposed UFO crash. As @john.phil noted above, that supposed crash brought in 1/2 million and over $2 million in the last 2 years. It put an otherwise unknown, unvisited and uninteresting town on the map. The PD is leaning into this legacy.

I agree with you and @John J., its looks bad, unprofessional and makes a mockery of serious police work. My dad was the 2nd Police chief in a small town and when he took over, he had the badges, hats and uniforms changed. As a new department he felt the original look was way to urban big city and not reflective of the rural nature of the town.

I was just offering what I think is part of why they did it. As I noted above, McMinnville OR is like a St. Helena (Napa county) in the Oregon wine country, but their wine festival didn't survive COVID. Their UFO festival did.

 

[deirdre]

I guess it's possible Roswell PD won't have all the policing specialties

they would still cover all those specialties.

as i think about it more, since their population is about 47k. But as they get 2-5x that in tourism -depending on source- youre much more likely to get assaulted by a ufo lover who "landed there". so yea, not really a good idea for that.

Article:

Jun 28, 2021

Roswell Mayor Denis Kintigh is upbeat about the future of his famous city and embraces its reputation as the epicenter of the modern fable of an alien craft crash landing more than 70 years ago.

It's a small city, but bulging with quality businesses, Kintigh says, so the 250,000 visitors who trek to what he describes as an out-of-the-way oasis in the semi-arid southeastern corner of New Mexico help sustain the quality of life to attract needed talent.

Source: https://newmexicosun.com/stories/604237448-roswell-mayor-upbeat-on-future-visitors-renewed-close-encounters-quality-of-life-for-residents

 

[JMartJr]

Perhaps the best news in the thread is the bit in @deirdre 's post above where the NM Sun refers to the Roswell story as a "fable." Celebrate the small victories!