UAP Disclosure Fund Presentation with House Oversight Committee, May 2025

[elvenwear]

The problem I see is that there's no money in it.

You just add extra links to the illuminati, freemasons, George Soros and Hillary Clinton and/or Satan. You set up a webpage that sells vitamins and cleanses. Have you learned nothing from your time here?

 

[jarlrmai]

I am not sure I understand the FOMO China stuff, isn't the claim of Grusch etc that the US government already knows about this and has recovered this technology? If so then we are way ahead of or along the same path China, and studying blurry old photos isn't going to help any.

 

[MonkeeSage]

I am not sure I understand the FOMO China stuff, isn't the claim of Grusch etc that the US government already knows about this and has recovered this technology? If so then we are way ahead of or along the same path China, and studying blurry old photos isn't going to help any.

We never know what China might be doing and we don't want to fall behind, so we better fund a bunch of silly psychic research (or whatever). At least that was the old playbook with SRI/Stargate and USSR.

 

[Mendel]

It's kinda hard to fathom how looking through old NASA photos is going to give the US a technological edge.

 

[jarlrmai]

Indeed, often the claims of one set of UFO enthusiasts can seem at odds or seem quaint when contrasted with the claims of another

If Grusch is right then studying old photos is seemingly pointless, so is Grusch wrong?

If Skywatcher is right then Grusch's claims are almost irrelevant because you don't need the US military to show you the aliens when Skywatcher can summon them to a Texas desert for you on demand.

Yet there is often crossover between these groups and no intra-group criticism, everyone is equally correct.

 

[owntheissue]

Good breakdown and analysis.

All roads in the study of UFO's (eventually) lead to "The Aviary" (or someone connected to it).

think this once again supports the idea that a small, though connected, group has created a tautological inner world where they share stories back and forth and ultimately become each other's source, to the point where they end up re-sharing their own stories.

It's a fascinating idea — and given the duration and number of people involved so far, it should form the basis of someone's occupational psychosis thesis.

Adversaries will have already taken note.

If this turns out to be something other than an anomalous trend among paranoid mill/intel professionals, the possible reasons/causes seem to be fairly limited given the circumstances.

 

[jarlrmai]

Someone here was maintaining a list of all the links, but I think it's too overwhelming especially given the current extended flap and the ammount of new names coming on board.

 

[Ann K]

It's kinda hard to fathom how looking through old NASA photos is going to give the US a technological edge.

"Well...OLD photos gave us the "face on Mars", remember? It's not our fault that you spoilsports at NASA took better pics later to disprove that contention, but it was fun while it lasted."

It's hard to escape the conclusion that talking points seem to be of more importance to the UFO community than genuine scientific progress.

 

[JMartJr]

36:56
(Davis) well the well the grays I'm familiar with from ... are 4 foot tall and um the Nordics are typically human size uh probably I five six feet tall Um and same with the people who mis mislabel reptilian and insecttoid they're roughly at that height too I haven't heard anything about anything seven feet or 9 foot tall

From Post 39 by NorCal Dave
Davis may need to bone up on the Lore a bit...

It interests me that there seems to be an effort to "retcon" the amazing diversity of reported UFO occupants (including several in the 7-9 foot tall range) before the lore settled on just a few standard types.


It's understandable, on the one hand, in that the improbable number of totally different alien species was becoming a bit unwieldy (and seemed more than a bit unlikely) but on the other hand it is going to require tossing out most of the Lore about occupants prior to the early 90s.

-----------------------------------------------------------
This seems like a group who will mostly know what a "retcon" is, but just in case:
Retcon = "retroactive continuity," a story-telling technique in which inconvenient bits of the established story are changed (Bobby Ewing's death and Season Eight of the series "Dallas" was suddenly all a dream because they wanted to bring Bobby back!) or just ignored (on "Happy Days," the Cunningham's older son Chuck disappears after season 2 and is never referred to again -- there are even instances of the Cunninghams mentioning that they have two children rather than the three they started the series with!)

 

[NorCal Dave]

Someone here was maintaining a list of all the links, but I think it's too overwhelming especially given the current extended flap and the ammount of new names coming on board.

You may be referring to @Luis Cayetano, who was a member at one point. He was creating flow charts or maybe they're organizational charts that showed different people and programs and how they related. Here is one of his creations showing how convoluted it is:

He made several others as well. What's interesting is the core people remain as new folks are added and the programs come and go. This chart has TTSA in the center of things, which from ~'17-'22 it probably was. 3 years later it's gone and defunct, but several of the important members of it were at this presentation to Congress. People like Melon, Elizondo and Davis moved onto the UAPDF, which likely didn't even exist at the time of this chart.

If you're bored, here is his latest update, from April '25, including Barber, Kuklos and the House Oversight Committee. He really puts a lot of work into these things, I may have to print out a big version for my shop (I had to do it as a screenshot, as the image is too big!):

https://www.ufologyiscorrupt.com/post/mapping-the-ufo-scene-using-association-charts

 

[Mendel]

Someone here was maintaining a list of all the links, but I think it's too overwhelming especially given the current extended flap and the ammount of new names coming on board.

@Luis Cayetano has kept at it on his own website, at https://www.ufologyiscorrupt.com/post/mapping-the-ufo-scene-using-association-charts . The third chart has Grusch and Jack Barber on it, and it's fairly up to date.

 

[Mendel]

It's kinda hard to fathom how looking through old NASA photos is going to give the US a technological edge.

Indeed, often the claims of one set of UFO enthusiasts can seem at odds or seem quaint when contrasted with the claims of another

This isn't two sets of enthusiasts, this is one person (Gold) in the space of 10 minutes (after the 3-hour-mark), per @MonkeeSage above:

And what I would ask of our brave members of Congress here is, again, with relatively little effort and money, we should be leveraging AI and ML to go into the NASA archives, so much of it has been digitized, more every day, and conduct a review of what's publicly available at your agency.

We spend so much time here, justifiably so, talking about classified material, what's being hidden. Yet there is a treasure trove of data that, if not a smoking gun, certainly is fascinating and worth looking at and applying the scientific method to.

[...]

Gold: If we're truly going to explore space, we're going to need some innovative technology. [...] And let me just end by saying, the reverse of that is we do not want to fall behind China relative to leveraging extraordinary technology.

 

[Skalman]

Davis then carries on and contends, yet again with NO evidence, that the government has crashed UFOs and that the problem is, there are no physicist, like him, working on these crafts (bold by me):

33:46
Yeah So we have good ideas about these things and we can speculate on it uh on what the best approach to take to build a warp bubble or the shell digital energy that would create a jurist swarm which will be a shortcut through space time between two distant points but um we have we have craft in our possession um there are no physicists literally working in this program basically mechanical aerodynamics aerospace thermal control engineers electronic electrical engineers and material scientists and material science This is a part of the engineering offer uh usually kind of overlaps chemistry as well and they've never had a physicist like him or I uh they've never had an applied physicist or an experimental physicist and so they are really lacking in the ability to
understand how these things fly
Again and again, how does Davis know any of this? How does he know who is and who isn't working on these crashed UFOs. He makes a point that he is NOT, so how does he know who is?

This is very interesting to me, because he says that the US government has never had a physicist employed on their secret reverse-engineering programs, which seems like a pretty huge oversight from said government. It also means that what he is saying goes directly against any claims from others about any physicist working on these purported projects. I'm sure people who are more well-versed in the lore can find better examples of this, but what it should mean for the people who think these programs exist is that if what Davies is saying is true, then what Bob Lazar says about his involvement in a program can't be true, or at the very least, Lazar's claims to be a physicist can't be true. Of course, there is the third option of Davies not knowing of the program Lazar was involved in and that it just happens that every program he does know of didn't have any physicists. One could also question how Davies knows this in the first place, but asking questions that could actually be of use to sort out the incongruities that plagues the larger narratives doesn't seem to be a priority of anyone in ufology.

I mean, I don't think either person's claims are true (though I am much more charitable as to Davies perhaps not intentionally being a liar than I am in the case of obvious huckster Lazar) but this should be such an obvious case for the people who thinks there is some grand conspiracy here to see that there are inconsistencies here. And I would think that those people, who seem to be very distrustful of the government and "official" stories/explanations should have a keen interest in sniffing out any malignant actors spreading disinformation.

 

[MapperGuy]

This is very interesting to me, because he says that the US government has never had a physicist employed on their secret reverse-engineering programs, which seems like a pretty huge oversight from said government. It also means that what he is saying goes directly against any claims from others about any physicist working on these purported projects. I'm sure people who are more well-versed in the lore can find better examples of this, but what it should mean for the people who think these programs exist is that if what Davies is saying is true, then what Bob Lazar says about his involvement in a program can't be true, or at the very least, Lazar's claims to be a physicist can't be true. Of course, there is the third option of Davies not knowing of the program Lazar was involved in and that it just happens that every program he does know of didn't have any physicists. One could also question how Davies knows this in the first place, but asking questions that could actually be of use to sort out the incongruities that plagues the larger narratives doesn't seem to be a priority of anyone in ufology.

I mean, I don't think either person's claims are true (though I am much more charitable as to Davies perhaps not intentionally being a liar than I am in the case of obvious huckster Lazar) but this should be such an obvious case for the people who thinks there is some grand conspiracy here to see that there are inconsistencies here. And I would think that those people, who seem to be very distrustful of the government and "official" stories/explanations should have a keen interest in sniffing out any malignant actors spreading disinformation.

It is part of the standard UFOologist storyline that they have been prevented from knowing anything while simultaneously knowing everything. Like the identify and scientific background of everybody who has ever worked on a reverse-engineering program.

Kind of hard to square the 'we know nothing' with the 'we know everything' concept.

 

[Mendel]

he says that the US government has never had a physicist employed on their secret [UFO] reverse-engineering programs

That's literally true. It's also literally true that the USG employs physicists on all of its UFO reverse-engineering programs.

 

[JMartJr]

That's literally true. It's also literally true that the USG employs physicists on all of its UFO reverse-engineering programs.

Or perhaps "There are no government UFO reverse-engineering programs that do not employ physicists."

 

[Fin]

... if what Davies is saying is true, then what Bob Lazar says about his involvement in a program can't be true, or at the very least, Lazar's claims to be a physicist can't be true. Of course, there is the third option of Davies not knowing of the program Lazar was involved in and that it just happens that every program he does know of didn't have any physicists....

Eric Davis: "Bob Lazar made up his entire cockamamie story"
Also:

 

[Mendel]

Eric Davis: "Bob Lazar made up his entire cockamamie story"
Also:
View attachment 80788

Where did you find that?

 

[owntheissue]

Where did you find that?

Looks like it was a post via Davis on Knapps FB page according to UFOJoe.

Weird debunking angle for Davis to go in on when the core facets of Lazar's tale are proven to have been publicly talked about prior to his 89 "leak":

A51 = First mentioned in TV show (featuring the Aviary) UFO Cover Up? Live in 1988.
Element 115= Articles in science journals of the 80's about pioneering methods in transuranic element synthesis.

 

[Fin]

Where did you find that?

@owntheissue is right. I found the quotes through twitter but they originally came from a facebook discussion group/other where Eric occasionally appears