Quote: We’ll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false.

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
George Tenet (CIA director) famously said that when what every person in the US believes to be true is false, then the CIA will have completed its disinformation work. Some reference, that. We know we can rely on George to uphold the lie then....
I believe that quote was actually attributed to William J. Casey in 1981, and is unsubstantiated.
 

lee h oswald

Banned
Banned
I believe that quote was actually attributed to William J. Casey in 1981, and is unsubstantiated.
Yes, Casey - short-circuit!

But they're all liars, whatever the name, it's their job! It's a small point - hardly detracting from the greater reality. I'm pretty sure Casey would have lied too. Or did he have principles?
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
But nonetheless true
Ah, the old "it does not matter if it's made up, because I agree with it" justification.

How exactly can the quote literally be true? How can the statement: "“We’ll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false,”" actually work? I can see it holding for a specific event, like (contrived example:) "“We’ll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes about The CIA's role with the mujahadeen is false”" - but not really as a general quote. I think it's one that really needs some context. And there is none, as it seems to be made up.
 

Oxymoron

Banned
Banned
Ah, the old "it does not matter if it's made up, because I agree with it" justification.

How exactly can the quote literally be true? How can the statement: "“We’ll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false,”" actually work? I can see it holding for a specific event, like (contrived example:) "“We’ll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes about The CIA's role with the mujahadeen is false”" - but not really as a general quote. I think it's one that really needs some context. And there is none, as it seems to be made up.
I think it a metaphoric/satirical statement. Do metaphors/satires need to be factually correct? I think it makes a perfectly valid point and if no one actually said it... perhaps Lee can take the credit:)
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Seems like that quote actually was created by conspiracy radio show host Mae Brussel, probably it exists somewhere in her radio archives.
 
Last edited:

Sqrt-1

New Member
I have seen this rather often, but haven’t really gotten around to do some more research on it. As far as I can tell, there's only one "source" for this attribution, a journalist named Mae Brussell. No one else, at least to my current knowledge, which can tend to be quite problematic in that one has little way of knowing if it's in fact accurate; if a quote was transcribed incorrectly, or misunderstood, taken out of context, said ironicall, or made up all together, we'd be none the wiser.

Furthermore, we don't have any idea of the context in which the alleged quote was said. All that there is is the single sentence which, all on its own, becomes pretty worthless unless you want to imprint pre-existing beliefs on it.

Adding to this was the fact that Brussell had a reputation for being something of a conspiracy theorist. While that, in and of itself, shouldn't necessarily make what she claimed wrong, it certainly means that we ought to adopt a much more stringent approach to dealing with stuff she said happened.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mae_Brussell
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
I've merged in some older discussion here, and updated the title. You can't really say something is entirely "debunked" based on dodgy provenance.
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
https://www.quora.com/Did-CIA-Direc...rything-the-American-public-believes-is-false
On Sep 21, 2014, at 8:59 PM, Barbara Honegger wrote:

> Seriously -- I personally was the Source
> for that William Casey quote. He said it
> at an early Feb. 1981 meeting in the
> Roosevelt Room in the West Wing of
> the White House which I attended, and
> I immediately told my close friend and
> political godmother Senior White House
> Correspondent Sarah McClendon, who
> then went public with it without naming
> the source ...
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Honegger is a bit of a fabulist who thinks no plane hit the Pentagon. I'm not sure her 33 year-old memory is a good source.
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
Honegger is a bit of a fabulist who thinks no plane hit the Pentagon. I'm not sure her 33 year-old memory is a good source.
no but it has claims that can be checked out. i find no evidence of Sarah McClendon going public with it. In fact i find no evidence of anyone using it in the 1980s (not even "counterspy" magazine.. copies on cia website).

I would think if the quote was real the conspiracy tabloids would be using it all over the place as apparently there were accusations of Casey and disinformation campaigns against the russians and Quaddafi in those publications. and Honeggers book 1989 "October Surprise"... I would have definitely worked that quote into my conspiracy book about Casey and the Iran hostages if it was a quote then.

add: and there were only 2 early meetings in feb 1981 (feb 6 and feb 11) i read through feb 6th in the reagan files, some mention of using information to get public support but nothing like the above type quote. links to the meeting paperwork here
http://www.thereaganfiles.com/document-collections/national-security-council.html
 
Last edited:

Sqrt-1

New Member
I did a quick google search, and found a CounterPunch article. Not a credible source, they have an obvious bias and sometimes cite conspiratorial sources. Here it is...
https://www.counterpunch.org/2020/01/03/the-dangers-of-privatized-intelligence/
To support this, they cite another news source with lower than average credibility and a record of citing conspiratorial sources, Consortium News.
https://consortiumnews.com/2019/11/22/ray-mcgovern-the-pitfalls-of-a-pit-bull-russophobe/
To support this, they cite... the quora profile of Barbara Honegger?!
https://www.quora.com/profile/Barbara-Honegger
I tried to open the link using the way back machine, and there was no entry of it, so it was probably of no importance and did not have some redirect to actual sources.
https://web.archive.org/web/*/https://www.quora.com/profile/Barbara-Honegger
They may have linked to it because she answered a quora question about it saying...
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12597526
https://www.quora.com/Did-CIA-Direc...lic-believes-is-false/answer/Barbara-Honegger
The problem is, that in Reagan’s first cabinet, William Casey was not even present...
https://www.reaganlibrary.gov/photo-galleries/cabinet
The date of Reagan’s first cabinet was 01/21/1981. In the picture and it’s description, there is no mention of William Casey.
The only place where you can actually see him with Reagan is a class photo of 02/4/1981.
The first cabinet meeting of Casey with Reagan I could find is this.
There is a very high chance I may be dead wrong about this, because I know nothing about America, much less it’s politics, and nor am I proficient in practical debunking. But this should maybe help someone else debunk this with a more rigorous methodology.
 
Last edited:

deirdre

Senior Member.
The first cabinet meeting of Casey with Reagan I could find is this.
there are articles in mid Feb 1981 that talk about full cabinet meetings (although why in heck he would say such a thing in front of a full cabinet and their assistants seems pretty far fetched to me).

article date feb 15, 1981
but after meeting with the full Cabinet eight times he wanted to try the Cabinet council system.
https://www.nytimes.com/1981/02/15/us/reagan-setting-up-6-cabinet-councils-to-shape-policies.html
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
(although why in heck he would say such a thing in front of a full cabinet and their assistants seems pretty far fetched to me).
And that's always been a significant strike against this "quote", it just does not make any sense. For one thing it's literally impossible, and for another it would be a very poor strategy to simply maximize the amount of false information. And using that as a metric of success makes no sense at all. That's not a goal.

The only context it does make sense is in something like the Iran-Contra affair (1985-1987), where, theoretically, if he was a part of it he would want to establish a consistent false narrative. But, as you say, this is not something you are going to explain in a full cabinet meeting (in 1981), which is practically public (as there are so many people there that leaks are inevitable)
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
this is not something you are going to explain in a full cabinet meeting (in 1981), which is practically public
maybe the voice she heard was a psychic voice :) and she just assumed it was Casey's real voice.
https://people.com/archive/dream-ba...f-reagan-rebel-barbara-honegger-vol-20-no-11/

*i'm not making fun of the psychic bit, just the masters degree in parapsychology.


Martin Anderson was her boss and they both left the position in March 1982. so it couldnt be Iran-Contra.
https://www.reaganlibrary.gov/sites/default/files/archives/textual/personal papers/anderson_m.pdf
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
The first cabinet meeting of Casey with Reagan I could find is this.
he was in the first one Jan 21, 1981. but the press is there and no barbara. and it was the cabinet room, not the roosevelt room which is probably too small for the whole cabinet to fit in, let alone with assistants in tow.
so it wasnt the first cabinet meeting like counterpunch suggests.

you can see him better in this Getty image
https://www.gettyimages.com/detail/...ey-general-news-photo/901709056?adppopup=true

casey3.png


the reagan cabinet photos show from different angles.
(on far right nearest us) https://www.reaganlibrary.gov/sites/default/files/archives/photographs/large/c184-16a.jpg
(far back left) https://www.reaganlibrary.gov/sites/default/files/archives/photographs/large/c181-23a.jpg
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
No verification of Honegger's claims:

https://www.reaganlibrary.gov/digital-library/daily-diary
i went through reagan's presidential schedule diary which is fairly specific. jan-february. There are zero meetings in the Roosevelt room that would even remotely need the CIA director to attend. and only 2 that Anderson likely attended (one is documented in diary he attended). 1 for Black caucus leaders and 1 for hispanic organizations.

i did a brief summary of diary, attached. Casey is only mentioned once: Feb 23, talking about how he and the Secretary of Defense just got back from Europe.

No organizational type meetings, except regular cabinet meetings all held in the Cabinet Room. Most of which had press coverage so photos might be found to document attendees since the attendees lists are missing for most in the digital archive. might be possible to get FOIA docs of those attendees since we know the dates, but covid has the library closed for now.
 

Attachments

Thread starter Related Articles Forum Replies Date
Rory Fake quote? "World events do not occur by accident. They are made to happen [...] by those who hold the purse strings" (attributed to Denis Healey) Quotes Debunked 12
Inti Confirmed Tesla quote; "Today's scientists have substituted mathematics for experiments" Quotes Debunked 12
Rory Debunked: "You must love yourself before you love another" - fake Buddha quote Quotes Debunked 7
Robin Evans Lenin quote check Quotes Debunked 8
D The World is Rudderless:Conspiracy Theory quote General Discussion 27
Mick West Conspiracy? Trump Repeating Falsely Attributed Quote from Russian Media. Conspiracy Theories 26
Mick West Debunked: 9/11 Truth New York Times Billboard Quote 9/11 53
Rory Debunked: "Buddha said, 'Enlightenment is found in the Yoni'" Quotes Debunked 20
Hartski Charles Bukowski quote Quotes Debunked 8
McGurnicle Brock Chisholm(first Director-General of the World Health Organization) Quote Quotes Debunked 30
Jean-François A false quote attributed to Aldous Huxley Quotes Debunked 30
derwoodii any help to prove or disprove this quote or claim Quotes Debunked 22
TemplarJLS Context: George Washington acknowledges the Illuminati Exists? Quotes Debunked 16
TemplarJLS Can someone debunk this George Washington quote? Quotes Debunked 6
TemplarJLS Debunked:"If I were reincarnated, I would wish to be... - Prince Philip Quotes Debunked 3
TemplarJLS Some depopulation quotes to debunk? Quotes Debunked 16
Leifer "If you can't pronounce it, don't eat it" ...commonly seen quote General Discussion 32
Graham2001 George Ellery Hale: "No time has been lost." Quotes Debunked 5
Mick West Context: "The Eyes of that Species of Extinct Giants ..." - Abraham Lincoln Quotes Debunked 10
Mick West Debunked: "There are many ways to make the death rate increase." - Robert McNamara Quotes Debunked 0
Critical Thinker Can't find if De Niro "apartheid" quote is legit or not Quotes Debunked 3
Leifer "Atheists' billboard quote isn't Jefferson's" Quotes Debunked 0
Mick West Debunked: "The CIA owns everyone of any significance in the major media" Quotes Debunked 91
derwoodii Retweet Networks Spreading Coronavirus Disinformation Coronavirus COVID-19 2
JDubyah Disinformation Directory General Discussion 30
Zane O'Neill Is Contrail Science a CIA Disinformation site? Contrails and Chemtrails 51
Nick " Evidence of deliberate disinformation in CHEMTRAILS KILL Group." Contrails and Chemtrails 1
David Fraser The Truth Denied: Evidence of deliberate disinformation in CHEMTRAILS KILL Group Contrails and Chemtrails 12
Clock The members of Metabunk are a "Disinformation Group" General Discussion 18
Mick West Debunked: 2013 NDAA Thornberry amendment, domestic propaganda, disinformation Conspiracy Theories 12
Mendel MediaWise #IsThisLegit program Practical Debunking 1
Oxymoron What To Do About The Surveillance Program General Discussion 0
N NASA National and Interdepartmental Program for Weather Modification 1966 Contrails and Chemtrails 8
BlueCollarCritic Stellar Wind - The CIA's Illegal Domestic Spying Program Conspiracy Theories 0
George B How could you prove Intentional Covert Atmospheric Aerosol Injection Program exists Contrails and Chemtrails 176
George B If I designed an Intentional Covert Atmospheric Aerosol Injection Program Contrails and Chemtrails 430
Mick West Debunked: "we should have stopped the nuclear program of Israel" ... JFK Quotes Debunked 24
George B I am a Chemtrail Advocate . . . I believe there is an Aerosol Injection Program Contrails and Chemtrails 1316
Mick West The Secret Space Program Conspiracy Theories 0
Related Articles







































Related Articles

Top