Post Election Social Media Crackdowns

Mendel

Senior Member.
Amazon canceled their cloud contract with Parler.
Article:
“Over the past several weeks, we’ve reported 98 examples to Parler of posts that clearly encourage and incite violence... It’s clear that Parler does not have an effective process to comply with the AWS terms of service. It also seems that Parler is still trying to determine its position on content moderation,” the letter reads. “Because Parler cannot comply with our terms of service and poses a very real risk to public safety, we plan to suspend Parler’s account effective Sunday, January 10th, at 11:59PM PST.”

With the app also kicked from the app stores, Parler can't update the app, but have to migrate to a new hosting service. That's quite a challenge. “There is the possibility Parler will be unavailable on the internet for up to a week as we rebuild from scratch."

It feels a little like quarantining, but for conspiracy theories: stop the spread!
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
but for conspiracy theories: stop the spread!

it's not gonna stop the spread. You are just not going to have to see it.

It is great news for those of use who missed buying amazon and google stock when they were start ups though! Trump will build his own server farm and host Ourtube and Parler type sites (where speech wont be moderated at all, aside from illegal stuff :( ) and i'm fairly confident at least half my Democrat friends will start using those sites once enough people switch over. They hate the conspiracy stuff and victim harassment and all, but they love free speech more.

As long as those sites dont censor us debunkers anyway. if they start censoring the debunkers, then even i would sell my stocks.
 

Mendel

Senior Member.
it's not gonna stop the spread. You are just not going to have to see it.
Let me explain the simile further.

Prohibiting large events when the pandemic started has not stopped it from spreading, but it has slowed it down. Depriving conspiracy theorists of platforms where they can reach a large group of people quickly does the same for conspiracy spread: it doesn't stop it completely, but it slows it down.

I've before posted a source on this site that looked at how much misinformation in the media can be attributed to Donald Trump. Limiting Trump's output to press releases and in-person appearances does not "censor" him, but it slows him down.

"Free Speech" as a concept is the idea that speech should not be regulated by the government. What we're seeing here is companies (not the government!) refusing service to individuals and entities who broke their service contracts, which include Terms Of Service prohibiting certain types of content. If you intended to publish that kind of content, you shouldn't have used that service.

"Free Speech" does not give you the right to demand help in saying what you want to say.
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
What we're seeing here is companies (not the government!) refusing service to individuals and entities who broke their service contracts, which include Terms Of Service prohibiting certain types of content. If you intended to publish that kind of content, you shouldn't have used that service.
yup. i agree.

which is why they/we will just build their own large service companies.
 

Amber Robot

Active Member
yup. i agree.

which is why they/we will just build their own large service companies.
It’s also why there should be governmental regulations against monopolies. People who cherish their free speech should be against the kind of capitalism that reduces their options of outlets for their speech.
 

Mendel

Senior Member.
Debunking resource: https://jilliancyork.com/2021/01/10...oment-in-platform-regulation-an-ongoing-list/

 

econ41

Senior Member
People who cherish their free speech should be against the kind of capitalism that reduces their options of outlets for their speech.
That actually glosses over the fundamental issue. Which is where to draw the line - where is the balance - between individual rights and community responsibility. AKA other persons' rights. The problems which arise often are because persons want their own "freedom of speech" to do some harm to some other person or class of persons. How much "harm" and whereto draw the line is the complex issue grey area issue which most debate ignores and adopts polarised positions over.

And US cultural values and expectations are more towards the "individual rights" side of the balance than many other countries.
 

Mendel

Senior Member.
It’s also why there should be governmental regulations against monopolies.
That's not a free speech issue. Monopolies are bad in any industry.

That said, we don't have a cloud hosting monopoly, we don't have a messenger monopoly; and you don't have to use the Play Store to install an app on your Android phone. (For Apple, you have to use their store, but they don't have a monopoly on phones, so...). What the insurrection is up against is an alliance of civic-minded businesses who have decided that they can neither lose the business of democrats nor risk the legal implications of aiding a rebellion. The fact reason that people get thrown off these services is that they don't stick to their contractual obligations. And that includes Donald J. Trump.

Free Speech as a civil right is not affected by deplatforming.
And there is no monopoly on hosting or messenger services.
 
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deirdre

Senior Member.
That actually glosses over the fundamental issue. Which is where to draw the line - where is the balance - between individual rights and community responsibility. AKA other persons' rights. The problems which arise often are because persons want their own "freedom of speech" to do some harm to some other person or class of persons. How much "harm" and whereto draw the line is the complex issue grey area issue which most debate ignores and adopts polarised positions over.

And US cultural values and expectations are more towards the "individual rights" side of the balance than many other countries.
The issues discussed by "classical liberals" (they call themselves) is
1. Hypocrisy. "Rules for me, but not for thee". If everyone was treated equally people might tone down their behavior. But harm and incitements to violence are allowed if you have the correct ideology. You see others posting inciteful rhetoric, or outright calls to violence so you figure "then i can post that way too".
2. Changing rules on the fly, and banning people when at the time of the posting they did not break the rules.



There are already laws about illegal speech. Companies do have a right to do what they wish, but then it becomes the issue of: are you a platform or a publisher.
If you are enacting policies because of public sentiment, or personal "feelings", then you are a publisher, not a platform.

It will all iron out eventually. People will be [are] forced into their own echo chambers even more. and ALL social media will collapse because they will lose their "Platform" protections and be sued into annihilation. Which is a good thing. Social media encourages violence because of their Golem like desire for the almighty dollar. (you'd think they have enough, but no, they want always more).
 

DavidB66

Active Member
As a general principle, private (i.e. non-government) institutions should be free to control whatever is done in their name, or by the use of their facilities. Control of 'speech' is just one application of this principle. No-one (I presume) would argue that mosques should be required to allow Christian evangelists to preach to their members, or that Christian churches should open their pulpits to Muslims or Jews. (Some do, but that is their choice.) Nor do we expect newspapers and magazines to offer a platform to political views contrary to their own political orientation.

Like most general principles, this one could have some exceptions or grey areas. Monopoly has been mentioned. Monopolies are already subject to regulation (anti-trust in the USA, or the Competition rules of the EU or the UK). The regulation of online businesses has however been weak (up till now), on the understanding that excessive regulation of 'infant industries' would hamper their growth. I think regulation should now be toughened up, as the infant industries argument is no longer valid. But personally I would baulk at the thought of a general obligation on internet companies to allow 'free speech'. If anything there is too much of that already!

Another possible exception is where private companies enjoy statutory privileges, or where competition is restricted by licensing systems. For example that applies to broadcast TV and radio in most of the world, originally for technical reasons (limited bandwidth). Online businesses do in fact enjoy statutory privileges under the DMCA, etc, which give them exemptions from many of the obligations of traditional publishers. Again, I think this should be reviewed, but personally I would favour reducing or limiting the exemptions. At present the problem is that no-one is effectively responsible for what appears online. The platforms (Twitter, etc) are not liable for it, while those who originate the 'content' are usually anonymous and untraceable. As a result, many kinds of 'speech' which would normally be subject to legal action are effectively immune to the law when they occur online: libel, 'hate speech' (in jurisdictions which have laws against it), incitement to crime, disclosure of military or diplomatic secrets, 'revenge porn', harassment, copyright infringement, etc, etc. I don't think that is sustainable.
 

JMartJr

Active Member
an alliance of civic-minded businesses who have decided that they can neither lose the business of democrats
Nor, presumably, of Republicans and unaffiliated voters who do not support insurrection. And they might as well hang on to the Libertarians and Greens and such, though there are fewer of them and I suppose that technically they COULD afford to lose them -- but would just as soon not.
 

Mendel

Senior Member.
This quote is heavily excerpted, the full article provides more context to the restrictions:
Article:

All the platforms that have banned or restricted Trump so far​

  • Reddit has banned the subreddit group "r/DonaldTrump,"
  • Twitch disabled Trump's channel,
  • Shopify took down two online stores affiliated with Trump — his organization and his campaign's merchandise sites
  • Twitter announced Friday the platform will permanently ban President Trump's account
  • Google has pulled Parler, a social media app for conservatives and far-right extremists.
  • YouTube is accelerating its enforcement of election misinformation and voter fraud claims against Trump and other channels.
  • Facebook and Instagram banned Donald Trump from posting on his Facebook accounts for at least the next two weeks
  • Snapchat disabled Trump's Snapchat account Wednesday
  • TikTok is removing content violations and redirecting hashtags like #stormthecapitol and #patriotparty to its community guidelines.
  • Apple on Friday threatened to remove right-wing-friendly social media app Parler from its App Store
  • Discord says it has banned server The Donald,
  • Pinterest has been limiting hashtags related to pro-Trump topics such as #StopTheSteal since around the November election
  • Stripe will no longer process payments for President Trump's campaign
 
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Mendel

Senior Member.
Amazon's letter of suspension to Parler (emphasis mine):
Article:
Dear Amy,

Thank you for speaking with us earlier today.

As we discussed on the phone yesterday and this morning, we remain troubled by the repeated violations of our terms of service. Over the past several weeks, we’ve reported 98 examples to Parler of posts that clearly encourage and incite violence. Here are a few examples below from the ones we’ve sent previously: [See images above.]

Recently, we’ve seen a steady increase in this violent content on your website, all of which violates our terms. It’s clear that Parler does not have an effective process to comply with the AWS terms of service. It also seems that Parler is still trying to determine its position on content moderation. You remove some violent content when contacted by us or others, but not always with urgency. Your CEO recently stated publicly that he doesn’t “feel responsible for any of this, and neither should the platform.” This morning, you shared that you have a plan to more proactively moderate violent content, but plan to do so manually with volunteers. It’s our view that this nascent plan to use volunteers to promptly identify and remove dangerous content will not work in light of the rapidly growing number of violent posts. This is further demonstrated by the fact that you still have not taken down much of the content that we’ve sent you. Given the unfortunate events that transpired this past week in Washington, D.C., there is serious risk that this type of content will further incite violence.

AWS provides technology and services to customers across the political spectrum, and we continue to respect Parler’s right to determine for itself what content it will allow on its site. However, we cannot provide services to a customer that is unable to effectively identify and remove content that encourages or incites violence against others. Because Parler cannot comply with our terms of service and poses a very real risk to public safety, we plan to suspend Parler’s account effective Sunday, January 10th, at 11:59PM PST. We will ensure that all of your data is preserved for you to migrate to your own servers, and will work with you as best as we can to help your migration.

– AWS Trust & Safety Team
 
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Mendel

Senior Member.
Source: https://twitter.com/okta/status/1348191370528256002

"Okta, Inc. provides cloud software that helps companies manage and secure user authentication into applications, and for developers to build identity controls into applications, website web services and devices." (Wikipedia)
 

derwoodii

Senior Member.
ah my bad ok take 2 without so much article cut an paste and a few memes to help illustrate


When your government thinks banning Trump from Twitter is the real injustice​

https://theaimn.com/when-your-government-thinks-banning-trump-from-twitter-is-the-real-injustice/

136095184_124392142843782_1358715238668491016_n.png136066267_124393206177009_4405327348294988171_n.pngthumbnail_138592177_10221375109099559_4905209533018970854_n.jpg
 

Mendel

Senior Member.
Article:
Per CNN, Parler’s domain is currently registered with Epik, a DNS provider known for offering a safe haven to websites like 8chan and The Daily Stormer in the past. A tweet from Dave Temkin, Netflix’s vice-president of network and systems, suggests Russia’s DDOS Guard is hosting the website.
Confirmation:
Article:
The internet protocol (IP) address it used is owned by DDos-Guard, which is controlled by two Russian men and provides services including protection from distributed denial of service attacks, infrastructure expert Ronald Guilmette told Reuters.

DDoS-Guard’s other clients include the Russian ministry of defence, as well as media organisations in Moscow. Until recently, it offered 8kun – which was previously known as 8chan – protection from DDoS. Last week, DDoS-Guard became the latest company to cut ties with 8kun’s hosting company, VanwaTech, following inquiries from the Guardian.
 
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