Plane with Yellow Tail over Redding, CA [Polar Air Cargo Flight]
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Igrokush1
Member
And as I indicated yesterday, the ozone is in fact repairing itself, which someone dubbed as mainly due to CFC reduction. Well guess what, our technology suggests there are other possible alternatives. Sorry to disappoint. Seed a cloud, un seed a cloud. In chemistry and physics, every action has an equal and opposite reaction. Yin yang 
Igrokush1
Member
Int
interesting.....
Igrokush1
Member
Not if you're attempting to help the ozone globally. See thread on stratospheric sulfur aerosols and dispersal. Think out of the box for once people.
Igrokush1
Member
Really, that's way cool. I'm going to get that app ASAP!
With an iPhone, there's a few apps that you can use to point the phone at a plane, and see what it is, and how high it is. I just used this one:
https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/plane-finder-ar/id390039844?mt=8
So that's what a 737-900 looks like on a regular un-zoomed iPhone photograph at 8,500 feet, 1 mile away. A 747 would look twice as big. Compare to your photo of the 747:
And it does not matter what angle a contrail looks like it's at. The vast majority (like this one) are in level flight, or at the most in a shallow 5% slope.
Igrokush1
Member
I'm sincerely really, really glad I could provide all this amusing debunking study on a perfectly normal plane flying on a perfectly un normal flight path over my town, redding ca. Woo hoo, can I at least get one thumbs up for that?? (Crickets...)
MikeC
Closed Account
Wikipedia doesn't say it is happen - it says it is a PROPOSED technique - which is well known.
And yes, ballast tanks - again you are making conclusions before you understand what you are talking about.
MikeC
Closed Account
You didn't supply the debunking. Other people did. You get no thumbs up for their efforts.
Igrokush1
Member
No I supplied the topic mike. That's what I meant, the topic for all those hard working debunkers. And proposed means it could very well be used for all you know. Again think outside your debunking station for once. Nighty nite mike.
Gundersen
Senior Member.
It just seems like you got annoyed when there was natural explanations for the claims. Maybe you should think outside your box, mate. Good night.
Pete Tar
Senior Member.
Nice photo though. I gave you one for that. Don't make me take it back by making claims about what cannot be proven and you have no evidence for other than 'well gee you never know, open your mind man'.
That's not going to go down well here. Stick to what you can show to be the case, or what you would like to get confirmation on.
That's not going to go down well here. Stick to what you can show to be the case, or what you would like to get confirmation on.
deirdre
Senior Member.
the topic is old hat here at Metabunk. if you had done some research and read a few other threads you would have seen that already.
StratMatt777
Member
Great collection! I've noted a moment at 1:13, when the US Mil Charter 767 flushes toilets or something, the "100% proof of spraying".
View attachment 9824
I have seen a few videos like that where a small third trail that, at first, looks like it is coming from the APU exhaust, but upon further inspection appears to be coming from the exhaust air port of the air conditioning packs which are mounted to the underside of the center wing tank and then covered by the wing-to-body aerodynamic fairing. Most airplanes have two PACs (Power Air Conditioning Units), but the 747 has 3.
The PAC takes hot engine bleed air from the compressor section of the engine (before the combustors) and then mixes it with the cold outside air which comes in the RAM air scoops in the w-t-b fairing just below the leading edge of the wing.
Of course the PACs have a little drain for excess moisture.
The same thing happens with this British Airways 777-300 at :45
Pete Tar
Senior Member.
Think, box, outside.External Quote:
Igrokush1
Member
Well wiki says, man, I can't dispute that!
You obviously haven't read these threads where these exact photos, and dozens like them, have been researched and identified. You are not presenting anything new.
https://www.metabunk.org/threads/debunked-chemtrail-plane-interior-ballast-barrels.661/
https://www.metabunk.org/threads/de...ther-unlabeled-photos-from-facebook-etc.1318/
The latter is the very same thread which this one was split off from!
So, ballast barrels, "ya". That is exactly what they are and those threads will show you the original sources, plane registration numbers etc etc.
If you want to explain something "strange", then you do research to get to the bottom of it. What does the photo show, who took it, when and where? You don't just google "chemtrail tanks" and swallow what you see without checking it out.
But yes. It was a good pic and you were correct about the yellow tail and the fact it wasn't a passenger plane (could you make out the lack of windows?). So have a grudging thumbs up from me IF you download a phone app and use it to observe those perfectly normal planes. Deal?
Igrokush1
Member
Although I cannot 'prove' wiki and a 'proposal' to be right, I can't prove it to be wrong either. Hence, box, outside, think, lol
Igrokush1
Member
Yep, deal. I'll get the app ASAP!
You obviously haven't read these threads where these exact photos, and dozens like them, have been researched and identified. You are not presenting anything new.
https://www.metabunk.org/threads/debunked-chemtrail-plane-interior-ballast-barrels.661/
https://www.metabunk.org/threads/de...ther-unlabeled-photos-from-facebook-etc.1318/
The latter is the very same thread which this one was split off from!
So, ballast barrels, "ya". That is exactly what they are and those threads will show you the original sources, plane registration numbers etc etc.
If you want to explain something "strange", then you do research to get to the bottom of it. What does the photo show, who took it, when and where? You don't just google "chemtrail tanks" and swallow what you see without checking it out.
But yes. It was a good pic and you were correct about the yellow tail and the fact it wasn't a passenger plane (could you make out the lack of windows?). So have a grudging thumbs up from me IF you download a phone app and use it to observe those perfectly normal planes. Deal?
Pete Tar
Senior Member.
Yes but for what purpose are you thinking outside that box of established facts? To come up with an interesting sci-fi or comic-book plot, then yes it's a good maxim.
But to investigate something that is actually happening and taking place in this physical universe? You need to have a through knowledge of the contents of the box first before you decide to go outside it.
StratMatt777
Member
I read the wiki article/entry.
The first issue is the word "proposed" in the text you pasted in above.
But the significant issue is the jump that is being made by suggesting that a government proposal/study means that the contrails coming from airliners are not contrails.
Why would an airline, which exists solely to make profit (and has great difficulty doing so due to fuel prices), spend one extra cent on something that doesn't add to their profit?
How does a recent proposal/study of geo-engineering suddenly turn the contrails that jets have been making since 1958 into "chemtrails"? Based on what evidence?
Are the airlines owned by the government that did the study?
No, they are privately owned- and have zero tolerance for reducing profit for any reason.
I apologize for my tone if you felt that I was talking down to you in any way...
I'm just saying that an unsubstantiated theory requires evidence- or else it is fantasy.
The burden of proof is on those putting forth the theory.
There is plenty of proof that contrails are contrails- so it wont be easy to disprove their existence and substitute something different.
I'm not arguing with you (or with Wikipedia). I do not disagree with Wikipedia.
I am aware that there are scientific studies for geo-engineering.
The study of geo-engineering proposals is a fact that has nothing to do with airliners.
Also, cloud seeding is something that exists (see www.weathermodification.com).
The U.S. military flooded the Ho Chi Min Trail during the Vietnam war by doing it.
Neither of these facts turns contrails into "chemtrails".
There is no connection.
That's fantastic! Don't ever stop until you find the truth! Don't give up early.
Try to disprove contrails and try to disprove "chemtrails".
Then you will know the truth!
StratMatt777
Member
I don't even have a problem with assuming that the proposal is true. There are videos on youtube of scientists presenting proposals or talking about studies of geo-engineering.
Proposals are a fact. But they don't turn contrails into "chemtrails".
A proposal doesn't magically outfit passenger and cargo airliners with spray tanks, pumps, nozzles etc...
Here is the trailing edge of the left wing of an Air Bridge Cargo 747-8F (the same model of the DHL [operated by Atlas Air] 747-8F that flew over you on that weird diversion)! It must have been empty and there was not a load to take from LA, it's original destination, so it returned to its home base (probably where it was going after LA).
Do you see any spray nozzles on the trailing edge?
Here is a shot of an Air Bridge Cargo 747-8F making contrails: http://www.planespotters.net/Aviation_Photos/photo.show?id=250263
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I've posted this before, but it is specific to the 747-8, which is the plane type being discussed (albeit not the freight/cargo variant, which was also present). It's a video of the plane's very first international appearance, at the 2011 Paris Air Show. Several photos taken on this aircraft are circulating online as "chemtrail tank" photos. You can see them in detail from 6:29 here:
This plane was on public display at an air show. And yet the conspiracy theorists claim they have got hold of "secret leaked photos". And the believers who follow them don't bother to do any research to prove them wrong. Which makes their claims to be "campaigners for truth" very baffling indeed.
By that do you mean "stop searching for the truth and take the lazy way out by spreading bunk without checking it"?
Short off-topic aside: my day job is as a copy-editor. That involves lots of fact-checking. It's a paradox of the internet age that fact-checking is much EASIER (because there is so much information available at your fingertips, which when I started out would have required endless library searches, if it was even available at all) but it also seems to be much LESS VALUED (because hey, who cares about facts - this is a fast-moving digital world and we have to be first and get the clicks with sensationalist headlines). So that is why I am interested in debunking. Truth is becoming a scarce commodity.
This plane was on public display at an air show. And yet the conspiracy theorists claim they have got hold of "secret leaked photos". And the believers who follow them don't bother to do any research to prove them wrong. Which makes their claims to be "campaigners for truth" very baffling indeed.
Igrokush1 said:
By that do you mean "stop searching for the truth and take the lazy way out by spreading bunk without checking it"?
Short off-topic aside: my day job is as a copy-editor. That involves lots of fact-checking. It's a paradox of the internet age that fact-checking is much EASIER (because there is so much information available at your fingertips, which when I started out would have required endless library searches, if it was even available at all) but it also seems to be much LESS VALUED (because hey, who cares about facts - this is a fast-moving digital world and we have to be first and get the clicks with sensationalist headlines). So that is why I am interested in debunking. Truth is becoming a scarce commodity.
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Trailspotter
Senior Member.
I have refined the photo overlay on a bigger screen using near and far ground features and 3D vegetation. Also I have downloaded the KML file of the flight path directly from FlightAware, it produced a perfect match for the position of the plane:
Note that the contrail does not have to coincide with the flight path; it deviates from it due to high altitude wind, like, for example, the smoke from a steam locomotive deviates from the rail track.
EDIT: According to the flight track log, the plane was at this position at about 18:13 PDT that, I believe, matches almost exactly the time of the photo.
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Looking at the high-altitude winds for the time in question, the wind was blowing slightly from the north of west over northern California, and sure enough the trail is being blown slightly to the south of the flight track.
(That's the nearest chart I could get - it is about one hour before the photo was taken, and the winds shown are at the 200mb level, which in a standard atmosphere equates to 38,662ft, i.e. 3,662ft above the plane.)
It never ceases to amaze me just how much information is out there these days to explain and identify every aspect. And everything fits!
Chew
Senior Member.
From the patent description: https://encrypted.google.com/patents/US7413145?hl=en&lr=all
Yeah, sounds exactly like a "chemtrail".External Quote:
WeedWhacker
Senior Member
That is EXACTLY what they are. Simple. Do you understand their purpose??
They simulate the weight of passengers and cargo and baggage. Also, the added bonus is that water can be pumped around to alter the balance, saving time in the flight testing phase.
So, why did you "lol"?
SR1419
Senior Member.
If you are unaware of them...then how do you know they are "out there" ?
Hama Neggs
Senior Member.
If you intend to play the "anything-is-possible" game you can avoid ever coming to any conclusion. You can point at any aircraft and say it "might be" doing something nefarious.
Hama Neggs
Senior Member.
You mean, invent conspiracy theories to "explain" things which are not mysterious in the first place?
Igrokush1
Member
WeedWhacker
Senior Member
Sure...why not? "weather modification"....you might wish to Google the phrase, rather than simply read the words, and infer wrongly.
Here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weather_modification
It is vitally critical to understand the different meanings of the words "weather" and "climate".External Quote:
Weather is localized and regional. Climate is more far-reaching.
In ANY case, however, "cloud seeding" is always done at lower altitudes, generally below the freezing level (so, almost always below 10,000 feet).
It is pointless to attempt "cloud seeding" at 30,000 feet!!! Therefore, the (now identified) jet with the yellow tail certainly was NOT "spraying" anything for "weather modification" purposes. All that came out would be the normal result of burning jet fuel in the engines, in order to provide thrust for flight. The burning of fossils fuels DOES result also in the production of H2O (water), as one of the by-products.
Pete Tar
Senior Member.
David Fraser
Senior Member.
Are you claiming Evergreen may be spraying chemtrails?
WeedWhacker
Senior Member
THAT would indeed be a feat....since they are no longer in business:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evergreen_International_Aviation
Demise:
(BTW, off-topic, but McMinnville Oregon is a really beautiful, quaint little city. I've had some wonderful lay-overs, there....in the past).External Quote:
David Fraser
Senior Member.
Yeah I know, and the fleet has been sold for spares to Jet Midwest (or at least they are buying it).
I was more interested to see if someone had done more research than reading GeoengineeringWatch.
Igrokush1
Member
Uh, again I don't recall inferring anything, I just simply stated what the article read the patent could be for. I never stated a thing about altitudes and/or spraying, especially about the yellow tail jet that Mick kindly asked you all to cease about, the jet I said we don't know what's on it, which we don't. I'm done on this topic, have a last stab at me if you choose.
,
deirdre
Senior Member.
you did infer. just like you are now inferring that DHL is carrying evil toxic substances across the ocean to Cincinnati.
and, you can talk about the yellow tail plane all you want since that's the topic of the thread. but since you have already admitted it is a "normal plane" I don't see why you would bother.
I'm glad you're finally done with all your speculations about this topic. so I'm giving you a thumbs up for that.
WeedWhacker
Senior Member
AND....that is the point, here.
IN FACT, it could easily be researched, as to what that particular airplane was carrying, as cargo.
(Hint....NOT so-called "chem"-trails). Because, "chem"trails do not exist!
The airplane with the "yellow tail" has been sufficiently identified. It was NOT a "Chem"-plane. Just a normal, everyday CARGO jet....making contrails, from the four engines, as do ALL everyday jets are prone to do, when the conditions (aloft) are conducive to contrail formation.
It is science.
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