John Massaria latest video.

SR1419

Senior Member.
The wake is basically up to the wingtip vorticies, and if the plane is leaving a contrail the contrail gets entrained in the vortices, so the size of the contrail should give an indication of the size of the wake.

There will also (I imagine) be ripples in the air, that propagate sideways like the V shape of a boat, but that's a different type of thing
How long does the wake last....if the contrail persist in line shape for a long time does the wake also persist or dissipate?

The vortices spread out? The spreading wake of boat provides the biggest bump as opposed the wash behind the prop.
 

justanairlinepilot

Senior Member.
The wake felt by an aircraft following another aircraft is definitely a result of lift generation, or wake, not jet wash, which is the contrail. So they are very different. The attached picture is a contrail of a 757, not the greatest picture but if you can zoom in on it (if you can't I'll try to take a better one, maybe a video), you'll see the contrail has a tubular look. it is indicative of a 757 with prat engines; common in the US (and an amazing engine). In the early 90s, there were several aircraft crashes as a result of those aircraft following a Boeing 757. It forced the FAA to impose special separation requirements behind 757's for landing. It's a different aircraft in that regard.

Pilots chime in if you have anything to add.






IMG_0628[1].JPG
 

captfitch

Senior Member.
It's an absolute joy to fly ( except it gets old after 11 hours). It's the new global vision cockpit and I can't begin to explain the capabilities. HUD with synthetic vision and enhanced vision. You need to get out of the 121 world and come to the good side.

 
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justanairlinepilot

Senior Member.
It's an absolute joy to fly ( except it gets old after 11 hours). It's the new global vision cockpit and I can't begin to explain the capabilities. HUD with synthetic vision and enhanced vision. You need to get out of the 121 world and come to the good side.

You're a (edit) spoiled bitch!! And if you're cool you'll get that...
 

justanairlinepilot

Senior Member.
I don't want to ruin the thread but there is too much money working for the majors. Although you guys obviously are experiencing the latest technology. DAMN!!!
 

justanairlinepilot

Senior Member.
No worries...

I ask because some "chemtrail" Believers say they can taste "chemtrails" after they have been "sprayed" whilst others claim to feel sick and see illness around them after "spraying"- to see someone fly right through it without any repercussions is noteworthy- or should be.

How long does the wake last- how many miles behind until you do not feel it any? ...and does the wake spread out like a boat on a lake?

wineandflyguy?
I've been firm in my observations that contrails do not!!! do not!!! sink. Contrails are part of the atmosphere and are subject to the surroundings. Contrails are obviously magic.
 

Ross Marsden

Senior Member.
Yes, my word, what a great instructive video!

You can see there, after a short while (~10 miles) that the contrail has considerable depth as well as limited lateral spread.
Now it is wind shear acting on this depth that produces the s-p-r-e-a-d-i-n-g of the contrail.

Remember, wind shear is simply a change in speed or direction in the vertical sense. It does not have to be much. Over time, just a knot or two in 1000 feet will spread a persistent contrail over a broad area - a mile wider every hour.

Pilots will know and fear "wind shear" in versions of much greater magnitude near the ground, but it is essentially the same thing.

Why do contrails spread? "Wind shear", is the answer, not simply "wind". Wind just translates the thing, bodily.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
The wake felt by an aircraft following another aircraft is definitely a result of lift generation, or wake, not jet wash, which is the contrail. So they are very different. The attached picture is a contrail of a 757, not the greatest picture but if you can zoom in on it (if you can't I'll try to take a better one, maybe a video), you'll see the contrail has a tubular look. it is indicative of a 757 with prat engines; common in the US (and an amazing engine). In the early 90s, there were several aircraft crashes as a result of those aircraft following a Boeing 757. It forced the FAA to impose special separation requirements behind 757's for landing. It's a different aircraft in that regard.

Pilots chime in if you have anything to add.






View attachment 2181
That's what I call a hybrid contrail, where the portion of the contrail in the wake vortices is persisting longer in a more tubular manner. It's more dependent on atmospheric conditions than on the engines.
http://contrailscience.com/hybrid-contrails-a-new-classification/

Contrails are not the wake turbulence, they simply show where it is, just as if there were smoke generators on the wing. There's a discussion of this with lots of nice pictures here:
https://www.metabunk.org/threads/1220-Donut-Chemtrail-Why
 
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Jazzy

Closed Account
The wake is basically up to the wingtip vorticies, and if the plane is leaving a contrail the contrail gets entrained in the vortices, so the size of the contrail should give an indication of the size of the wake. There will also (I imagine) be ripples in the air, that propagate sideways like the V shape of a boat, but that's a different type of thing
If you can imagine the above rolled up like a carpet from both sides... :)
 

captfitch

Senior Member.
I would suggest there are probably no ripples in the air as fluid reacts quite differently at the surface than air does. I picture it as the energy of the boat only acting on one plane so the energy is more visible and stays "together" better. In the air, however, the energy of the aircraft can be dispersed through multiple planes in three dimensions so it dissipates quicker. The bump seen in the video was a combination of wingtip vortices and the down wash created by the previous plane. If you pause the video as he pans into the cockpit you'll notice his VSI (the instrument indicating a climb or descent) is showing about a three hundred feet per minute climb as the plane attempted to get back up to altitude.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
I would suggest there are probably no ripples in the air as fluid reacts quite differently at the surface than air does. I picture it as the energy of the boat only acting on one plane so the energy is more visible and stays "together" better. In the air, however, the energy of the aircraft can be dispersed through multiple planes in three dimensions so it dissipates quicker. The bump seen in the video was a combination of wingtip vortices and the down wash created by the previous plane. If you pause the video as he pans into the cockpit you'll notice his VSI (the instrument indicating a climb or descent) is showing about a three hundred feet per minute climb as the plane attempted to get back up to altitude.
Yes, sorry, there won't be ripples anything like the ripples on the surface of the water. I was thinking that there would be some disturbance in the air that extend out on either side of the vortices. There will be SOME, with all that air swirling around, but of course it's not going to extend out very far, so there won't be any large invisible V shape.
 

Jay Reynolds

Senior Member.
A recent series of videos has emerged which shows some of the hallmarks of a John Massaria con-job. The video consists of an audio track of Dane Wigington being interviewed by George Noory overlaid by slides of people with severely diseased skin on head, feet, and abdomen.
Images such as this are shown:

back.JPG

symptoms-of-psoriasis-in-wo.jpg

The two images above come from psoriasis treatment websites, and were inserted into the slide show for SHOCK value, with the implication that a skin disease which has plagued mankind for millenia is somehow related to claims by Wigington about geoengineering. This is done in an extremely familiar manner, exactly the style which Massaria used with his Ballast Barrel Hoax video.



The audio contains the following dialogue @ ~1:30 minutes:

NOORY: Now, the residue which comes from the traditional contrails, which is of course the vapor discharge coming off the engine exhaust from a jet, normal, can they hurt you at all?

WIGINGTON: "In comparison with a big payload dispersement, George, a big difference, and this is a big argument, people, is it a contrail, is it a chemtrail, and again, chemtrail being the layman's term for geoengineering, people should consider things, if you're on a very cold day and you're walking down the street, and your breath is condensing behind you as you go, you don't look behind you and see a trail stretching behind you for a mile covering the horizon.

Again, NOAA's original data for a naturally occurring contrail called for 70 below and 70% humidity, they've since scrubbed that from the net just like they do after a nuclear accident they change the "safe" levels and "up it by 10,000%", we know science is completely flexible when it comes to government agencies.

These trails that we see which cover the sky to such an extent that "Global Dimming" is estimated now to be 20%, that is 20% of the suns rays are no longer reaching the surface of the planet."

How can Wigington hold himself out as any sort of authority when he cannot even tell the true facts about ordinary contrail formation temperatures after being involved in this for a decade, and what does it tell you of Noory, Massaria and anyone else connected to the man? They don't give a damn. Global dimming ended back in 2006, anyways. This is a complete crank you are listening to, a man totally divorced from reality.
 

Cairenn

Senior Member.
I wonder if the sites he stole those images from need to be notified so that they can make him remove the images with copyright
 

Jay Reynolds

Senior Member.
I wonder if the sites he stole those images from need to be notified so that they can make him remove the images with copyright
Fighting him directly probably suits his purpose. He has many many you tube channels he owns under various monikers, so he says, just like he has on Facebook, many fake ID's. All he has to do is upload to another channel. The best you can do is expose him and record the event. He has some other problems which will overtake him soon enough.
 

JRBids

Senior Member.
In the interview, he and Russ Tanner said they feel free to censor opposing opinions on their various sites.
Ha!

No kidding. That's what he did with me after I disagreed with him on my friend's page. Then he went back to Chemtrails Global Skywatch and told his accolytes to pressure my friend to delete the thread.

russ12.jpg
 

Jazzy

Closed Account
Yes, sorry, there won't be ripples anything like the ripples on the surface of the water. I was thinking that there would be some disturbance in the air that extend out on either side of the vortices. There will be SOME, with all that air swirling around, but of course it's not going to extend out very far, so there won't be any large invisible V shape.
You reminded me of rocket take-off sonic phenomena.

[video=youtube_share;q9S0z1ofcIc]http://youtu.be/q9S0z1ofcIc[/video]
 

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