Debunked: Agenda 21, ICLEI, Sovereignty, UN, Depopulation

[Svartbjørn]

The United Nations has a Socialist agenda ... Gro Brutland and Maury Strong (names maybe misspelled) are hardcore socialist .

Where did you find this information?

Though I don't like the facts that the 1% is acquiring more of the wealth and the globalists are debasing the currency and an economic collaps

Same question as above.

Also keep in mind, that we're not debunking theories.. but specific claims.. for example thermite being used etc.

Ive said this once, and I'll probably say it another googolplex ( 10 to the 10th to the 100th ) times.. the vast majority of us that post here are scientifically driven. We fololowWe look at evidence, not supposition.. we use our combined skills and experiences to remove the bunk (read: misconceptions) from the claim and try to provide GOOD information. There's no guesswork involved, we dedicate hundreds of hours to research (combined and solitary at times) and are more than open/welcome to having the research disputed with counter evidence. Keep in mind though that evidence doesnt -necessarily- mean youtube videos, or links to websites that are known to skew material left or right.. but peer reviewed research papers, or scientifically based evidence are MORE than welcome. We enjoy being wrong, its how we learn.. and its how science and the understanding of the world advances.

*EDIT: edited for clarity and better explanation

 

[Robin Vanderpool]

I do not have enough knowledge of Agenda 21. . . .but if it is similar to "Bio-Diversity" a concept which seems to be code for removing or limiting access to private property or by limiting private property's use to make it almost useless or worthless to the rightful and legal owners . . . I feel it could be a a very sophisticated tool of a conspiracy to return private property to wilderness or natural conditions. . . .

Absolutely is ... YouTube behind the Green Mask ...or Google UN Agenda 21 biodiversity map

 

[WeedWhacker]

Absolutely is ... YouTube behind the Green Mask ...or Google UN Agenda 21 biodiversity map

I believe you have been fooled, conned (taken in) by the people responsible for that YouTube video you cited. It is hysterical fretting (and needless) hand-wringing over a rather benign concept.

Perhaps reading the text would show the truth, and dispel the hyperbolic rumors from the likes of Alex Jones, et al...:

http://sustainabledevelopment.un.org/content/documents/Agenda21.pdf

 

[Robin Vanderpool]

Where did you find this information?



Same question as above.

Also keep in mind, that we're not debunking theories.. but specific claims.. for example thermite being used etc.

Ive said this once, and I'll probably say it another googolplex ( 10 to the 10th to the 100th ) times.. the vast majority of us that post here are scientifically driven. We fololowWe look at evidence, not supposition.. we use our combined skills and experiences to remove the bunk (read: misconceptions) from the claim and try to provide GOOD information. There's no guesswork involved, we dedicate hundreds of hours to research (combined and solitary at times) and are more than open/welcome to having the research disputed with counter evidence. Keep in mind though that evidence doesnt -necessarily- mean youtube videos, or links to websites that are known to skew material left or right.. but peer reviewed research papers, or scientifically based evidence are MORE than welcome. We enjoy being wrong, its how we learn.. and its how science and the understanding of the world advances.

*EDIT: edited for clarity and better explanation

Address questions

I believe you have been fooled, conned (taken in) by the people responsible for that YouTube video you cited. It is hysterical fretting (and needless) hand-wringing over a rather benign concept.

Perhaps reading the text would show the truth, and dispel the hyperbolic rumors from the likes of Alex Jones, et al...:

http://sustainabledevelopment.un.org/content/documents/Agenda21.pdf

Sorry [...] ... Not only are you not an authority but obviously have not done enough study...thus the authoritative talking out of the flatulence zone ... debunking for debunking sake is embarrassing yourself and a psuedo scientific imposter does not make you a winner ... With selective reading you actually perceive yourself and other posters here to be in consensus ....but reading the threads ....you are the minority .... I'll stick with the slant that Rosa Koirre author of Behind the Green Mask has ... don't bother trying to punk me because I simply observe all sides of an argument ... at 60 years of age I have learned to keep my opinion more of a floating decimal point .... At this date it's pretty obvious to me that economy will crash and the UN will come in as saviors and will achieve the biodiversity scam contained in the 40 chapters of Agenda 21 which I have read carefully.

 

[Pete Tar]

Post within politeness policy or not at all.
https://www.metabunk.org/threads/politeness-policy.1224/

 

[Belfrey]

Sorry [...] ... Not only are you not an authority but obviously have not done enough study...thus the authoritative talking out of the flatulence zone ... debunking for debunking sake is embarrassing yourself and a psuedo scientific imposter does not make you a winner ... With selective reading you actually perceive yourself and other posters here to be in consensus ....but reading the threads ....you are the minority .... I'll stick with the slant that Rosa Koirre author of Behind the Green Mask has ... don't bother trying to punk me because I simply observe all sides of an argument ... at 60 years of age I have learned to keep my opinion more of a floating decimal point .... At this date it's pretty obvious to me that economy will crash and the UN will come in as saviors and will achieve the biodiversity scam contained in the 40 chapters of Agenda 21 which I have read carefully.

Well, you didn't get that map from reading Agenda 21. I'd like to see exactly what the parameters were that went into creating that map, and where they came from.

 

[WeedWhacker]

Not only are you not an authority but obviously have not done enough study...

I'd suggest a more thorough study on the part of those who seem convinced of some "evil plot" RE: this 'Agenda 21' concept.

Did you read the link to the PDF that I offered? If so, then would you please cite from it specific examples wherein it advocates "depopulation" (for example, since this is but one of the assertions made by those who apparently misinterpret the data).

At this date it's pretty obvious to me that economy will crash and the UN will come in as saviors and will achieve the biodiversity scam contained in the 40 chapters of Agenda 21 which I have read carefully.

"Obvious" to you? How so? The "economy" (you seem to be focusing on the USA only) was in eminent danger just a few years ago, and steps were able to be taken to prevent a "crash". Again, this is hyperbole, and unwarranted fear-based exposition and mongering.

And, just precisely what is a "biodiversity scam"? Do you think this planet does not have a diverse biosphere? Sorry, but that quoted phrase seems nonsensical (to me).

I'll stick with the slant that Rosa Koirre author of Behind the Green Mask has...

Perhaps she is a candidate for a full debunk. No search yet in Google, someone needs to take apart her claims thoroughly, it seems, and post them.

 

[Trigger Hippie]

I'd like to see exactly what the parameters were that went into creating that map, and where they came from.

I've seen that map many times and often wondered the same. It seems to have been created in the mid 90's by Dr. Michael S. Coffman, the president of Environmental Perspectives, Inc.

Dr. Coffman is a prolific writer and speaker. He's often be found at 'Liberty' conferences and events sponsered by the John Birch Society and the Tea party. Full bio... Dr. Michael S. Coffman

The maps themselves can be found at the Environmental Perspectives, Inc. web store where a whole array of informative books, maps and pamphlets can be downloaded for free or for a price. (They even accept the Discover card)

According to the fine print on the map, it was used to stop the ratification of the Convention on Biological Diversity. That event took place in 1994, so that should give an approximate date to its creation.

I found one link that credits Dr. Michael S. Coffman as having prepared the maps and sources the data as coming from various UN studies and treaties.
http://ebookbrowsee.net/agenda-21-new-7-31-pdf-d458217641

The United Nations Convention on Biological Diversity, Article 8a-e; United Nations Global Biodiversity Assessment, Section 13.4.2.2.3
"The Wildlands Project," WildEarth, 1992
Science, "The High Cost of Biodiversity," 25 June, 1993, pp 1968-1871

But really if we want more info best to contact Dr. Coffman directly at:

Environmental Perspectives, Inc.
6 Heather Road
Bangor, ME 04401
United States
Phone: 207-945-9878
Toll Free: 877-271-7639
info@epi-us.com

 

[WeedWhacker]

He's often be found at 'Liberty' conferences and events sponsered by the John Birch Society and the Tea party.

Ahhh.....he's one of "those", then.

No really, now the true "agenda" is on display.

 

[WeedWhacker]

Ahhh.....he's one of "those", then.

No really, now the true "agenda" is on display.

I ALSO wish to add that i contemplated what I wrote and posted (RE: "Someone should 'debunk' Rosa Koirre).

Seems to be a valiant effort on someone's part, and I have a relatively new computer, and don't want to break my monitor.....because, unless my fists were strapped down, I'm afraid I'd punch the screen.

 

[Joe]

I've seen that map many times and often wondered the same. It seems to have been created in the mid 90's by Dr. Michael S. Coffman, the president of Environmental Perspectives, Inc.

View attachment 7554

Dr. Coffman is a prolific writer and speaker. He's often be found at 'Liberty' conferences and events sponsered by the John Birch Society and the Tea party. Full bio... Dr. Michael S. Coffman

View attachment 7556

The maps themselves can be found at the Environmental Perspectives, Inc. web store where a whole array of informative books, maps and pamphlets can be downloaded for free or for a price. (They even accept the Discover card)

View attachment 7557

According to the fine print on the map, it was used to stop the ratification of the Convention on Biological Diversity. That event took place in 1994, so that should give an approximate date to its creation.

View attachment 7558


I found one link that credits Dr. Michael S. Coffman as having prepared the maps and sources the data as coming from various UN studies and treaties.
http://ebookbrowsee.net/agenda-21-new-7-31-pdf-d458217641

The United Nations Convention on Biological Diversity, Article 8a-e; United Nations Global Biodiversity Assessment, Section 13.4.2.2.3
"The Wildlands Project," WildEarth, 1992
Science, "The High Cost of Biodiversity," 25 June, 1993, pp 1968-1871

But really if we want more info best to contact Dr. Coffman directly at:

Environmental Perspectives, Inc.
6 Heather Road
Bangor, ME 04401
United States
Phone: 207-945-9878
Toll Free: 877-271-7639
info@epi-us.com

So because he is not a leftist its all lies ? who do I trust more ? A American or a bunch of Socialist Globalist United Nations ? http://www.cbd.int/convention/

 

[Trigger Hippie]

So because he is not a leftist its all lies ?

Is that what I said? No... I'm pretty sure I never said that.

who do I trust more ?

I don't know.

Let me cut to the chase. The issue I addressed was the origin and the source data of the maps. If there is anything factually incorrect about what I wrote, then point it out, and I'll correct it. I don't care about your opinions and views on partisan politics, they are completely irrelevant to the issue of the maps.

 

[WeedWhacker]

who do I trust more ? A American or a bunch of Socialist Globalist United Nations ?

"Joe"....I believe this quote, above, hits to the heart of a bias that I perceive within you.

Of course, this topic might merit its own thread.

 

[Joe]

Is that what I said? No... I'm pretty sure I never said that.



I don't know.

Let me cut to the chase. The issue I addressed was the origin and the source data of the maps. If there is anything factually incorrect about what I wrote, then point it out, and I'll correct it. I don't care about your opinions and views on partisan politics, they are completely irrelevant to the issue of the maps.

well you went out of your way to describe him as a Bircher and a Tea Party supporter ? Was that relevant ? Where might he have got the idea for the map ? Did he just pull it out of his arse ? Agenda 21 is a political issue . Those who see no problem with it are left and those who oppose it are right most of the time .

 

[Joe]

"Joe"....I believe this quote, above, hits to the heart of a bias that I perceive within you.

Of course, this topic might merit its own thread.

Yes the Darkside is strong with me

 

[Landru]

Let's keep on topic please. Political discussions in PMs.

 

[Trigger Hippie]

well you went out of your way to describe him as a Bircher and a Tea Party supporter ? Was that relevant ?

What I said was that he spoke at Bircher and Tea Party events. I stated a fact. Irrelevant to the issue is whether or not you trust Americans or UN socialist globalists. I didn't ask nor do I care.

I didn't talk about my opinion of Bircher or Tea Party politics as this is not a political forum. I'm sure this has been explained to you many times although I'm not sure why you can't seem to understand it.

Where might he have got the idea for the map ? Did he just pull it out of his arse ?

As I already quoted in the post, he got it from:

The United Nations Convention on Biological Diversity, Article 8a-e; United Nations Global Biodiversity Assessment, Section 13.4.2.2.3
"The Wildlands Project," WildEarth, 1992
Science, "The High Cost of Biodiversity," 25 June, 1993, pp 1968-1871

The map was created in the mid 1990's by a right wing environmental analyst who claims to have derived it from UN reports, although, he doesn't give the source data.

Please stop taking about your political views and your rear end. Neither of them are interesting and both of them stink.

 

[Trigger Hippie]

It is a political forum

No, it is not.

"This is not a politics and economics forum." --Mick West

https://www.metabunk.org/threads/do-we-need-government.2552/#post-72743

 

[Efftup]

It is a political forum because it is Pro Government pro leftist Pro UN . Koch Bros threads . ect ect

No it is not.
It is not political nor is it Pro anything that you are against.
If someone who is Anti Government promotes a load of bunk, then it will get debunked here.
if someone who is Pro government promotes bunk that will ALSO get debunked here.
NO-ONE on this site that I have seen has EVER then said, "Yeah trust your government everything is fine, it's all OK " etc, all they have done is show that the "facts" that people read and parrot on are nothing of the sort. you should not assume everything is black and white. If I am against one of your arguments cos it is bunk, does not mean I am Pro Govt, or a paid shill or a troll or just blindly trusting them.

As this site is designed to look at one piece of evidence at a time, each thread should be about how this one piece of "evidence" is bunk.
The reason this approach gets lots of criticism of CT'ers is that it mostly prevents gish galloping and concentrates on each piece of evidence by itself.

The reason a lot of people get sucked into conspiracy theories is because proponents tend to construct lawyers' arguments and stack up a huge mound of circumstantial evidence to "prove" their case. normally when you debunk something , someone can go "well what about this? or this?" and keep dancing round changing the subject.
What often happens is that if you actually look at ALL the "evidence" one after the other you see that they are ALL flawed so there is no argument.
Evidence should stand or fall by itself.
for example, if you think you have proof of Thermite in building 7 of the WTC, whether or not anyone got told to stay at home, what Larry Silverstein may or may not have meant by his comments in an interview or what the collapse LOOKED like are all irrelevant to whether or not the tests ACTUALLY showed the presence of thermite or not. All the other stuff is usually added to sway the thinking of the jury, as it were.

if you can find exactly where Dr Coffman got the data for his map from (the one you appear to have trusted without even trying to find out exactly where it came from) then please share it so we can see whether or not there IS something to worry about or if that map is just more bunk.

 

[Pete Tar]

Well right-wing/republican conservation is an oxymoron (google search says 'did you mean right wing conservative?'), so pointing out that concern about environmental sustainability is 'left-wing' seems pointlessly divisive, unless there is a 'right-wing' sustainability program to compare it to.

 

[Mick West]

Joe has been banned for one week.

 

[Robin Vanderpool]

Well, you didn't get that map from reading Agenda 21. I'd like to see exactly what the parameters were that went into creating that map, and where they came from.

Fair enough ...There are many posted on Google under Biodiversity ...I cannot vouch for it's origins but have seen many versions ...

 

[Robin Vanderpool]

View attachment 7549
Address questions


Sorry [...] ... Not only are you not an authority but obviously have not done enough study...thus the authoritative talking out of the flatulence zone ... debunking for debunking sake is embarrassing yourself and a psuedo scientific imposter does not make you a winner ... With selective reading you actually perceive yourself and other posters here to be in consensus ....but reading the threads ....you are the minority .... I'll stick with the slant that Rosa Koirre author of Behind the Green Mask has ... don't bother trying to punk me because I simply observe all sides of an argument ... at 60 years of age I have learned to keep my opinion more of a floating decimal point .... At this date it's pretty obvious to me that economy will crash and the UN will come in as saviors and will achieve the biodiversity scam contained in the 40 chapters of Agenda 21 which I have read carefully.

I am learning to be a better participant here ... I am just grateful to have feedback at all ...Facebook has offered few if any responses ...believe me IWANT TO DEBUNK ALL OF THE THINGS THAT SCARE THE BAJEEZUS OUT OF ME.

 

[Belfrey]

The United Nations Convention on Biological Diversity, Article 8a-e; United Nations Global Biodiversity Assessment, Section 13.4.2.2.3
"The Wildlands Project," WildEarth, 1992
Science, "The High Cost of Biodiversity," 25 June, 1993, pp 1968-1871

I saw that, but it's not very explanatory. The cited portion of the Convention on Biological Diversity says the following:

Each Contracting Party shall, as far as possible and as appropriate:
(a) Establish a system of protected areas or areas where special measures need to be taken to conserve biological diversity;
(b) Develop, where necessary, guidelines for the selection, establishment and management of protected areas or areas where
special measures need to be taken to conserve biological diversity;
(c) Regulate or manage biological resources important for the conservation of biological diversity whether within or outside
protected areas, with a view to ensuring their conservation and sustainable use;
(d) Promote the protection of ecosystems, natural habitats and the maintenance of viable populations of species in natural
surroundings;
(e) Promote environmentally sound and sustainable development in areas adjacent to protected areas with a view to furthering
protection of these areas;

There's not much to build a map from in there. It basically states that the governments would establish conservation areas, and manage to protect them. We already do that, we've been doing it in the US for about a century. And as it's all "as far as possible and appropriate," it leaves it up to each country to decide what that means. Nothing is specifically mandated.

The Wildlands Project isn't any sort of UN or government program or mandate, it's an NGO. http://www.twp.org/about-us

I'll have to see if I can get a copy of the Global Biodiversity Assessment to see what Section 13.4.2.2.3 really says.

But really if we want more info best to contact Dr. Coffman directly at:

Environmental Perspectives, Inc.
6 Heather Road
Bangor, ME 04401
United States
Phone: 207-945-9878
Toll Free: 877-271-7639
info@epi-us.com

Since his company is selling these maps on their website, I'd be somewhat surprised if they disclosed their source data.

 

[Trigger Hippie]

I'll have to see if I can get a copy of the Global Biodiversity Assessment to see what Section 13.4.2.2.3 really says.

Same here. I think I still have on-line access to a university library. I'll post what I find.

 

[Belfrey]

Same here. I think I still have on-line access to a university library. I'll post what I find.

I do too, but mine didn't have access to an online copy. It's a rather big book.

 

[Hama Neggs]

this so called 'debunking' site seeks to literally debunk everything ... for what could be the administrators and his friends purpose of debunking everything and convincing us that 'everything is okay, it's a false alarm' ... EVERYTHING IS NOT OKAY

I challenge you to find anyone here who has proclaimed anything even remotely resembling: "Everything is OK".

 

[Hama Neggs]

At this date it's pretty obvious to me that economy will crash

I've been hearing that for 40 years.

 

[Jason]

believe me IWANT TO DEBUNK ALL OF THE THINGS THAT SCARE THE BAJEEZUS OUT OF ME.

Why does this "scare the bejeezus" out of you? It's not so much debunking everything that scares you, its learning how to do the right research and where to look to find the truth. In doing so, it will help you not only with this CT, but others as well and in life in general.

 

[JeffreyNotGeoffrey]

Why does this "scare the bejeezus" out of you? It's not so much debunking everything that scares you, its learning how to do the right research and where to look to find the truth. In doing so, it will help you not only with this CT, but others as well and in life in general.

Also it's figuring out what scares you and whether it's worthy of debunking. Walking outside in a dress and heels to go to the Strip scares the bejeezus out of me, but I'm not quite sure how to debunk that. Ditto with standing up in the bath tub.

 

[Mick West]

Since the original post on this thread was made in 2011, it preceded the posting guidelines which call for more focussed debunking and less arguing. I'm going to close this thread, and if people feel there's material in it that would make a good single-topic debunk (perhaps the map?) then I encourage them to extricate or re-work it into a new thread.