Trump's Ear wound

[Mendel]

I continue to be shocked at how prevalent this conspiracy theory has become — surely among the most absurd of the decade. It's yet more proof that there is just as much conspiracy ideation on the far left as there is on the far right. As the saying goes: "It doesn't matter whether you go around the left side of the goat or the right side; go too far and you end up at the asshole."

MTG has been pushing this recently, and we've been discussing it on https://www.metabunk.org/threads/trump-shot-at-rally.13550/post-367442 .
Not sure if she counts as "far left", or if your "just as much" is justified, but there are certainly some conspiracy theories and belief in the paranormal on the left as well.

 

[Dan Burt]

You might well be right.

I can't remember what my source was, but it might be outdated or inaccurate. It might have been Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attempted_assassination_of_Donald_Trump_in_Pennsylvania) which says

Aaron Zaliponi, a member of Butler County's Emergency Services Unit, fired the first shot four seconds after Crooks began shooting at Trump. The bullet is believed to have struck Crooks's rifle stock, causing it to fragment and send debris flying, which hit his face, neck, and right shoulder. The impact forced Crooks to stop shooting and reposition himself. Located on a building behind Trump's left shoulder, a team of Secret Service countersnipers were facing in a different direction and reoriented toward Crooks to aim the second shot at him before he could resume firing; a member of that team then fatally shot Crooks 16 seconds after Crooks had begun firing.

-but your reference is much more authoritative!


Right again, for most practical purposes.

The .223 cartridge was developed by Remington in the late 1950s. It was used in the original (military, not civilian spec.) prototype ArmaLite AR-15 rifles.

In July 1962, operational testing ended with a recommendation for the adoption of the ArmaLite AR-15 rifle chambered in .223 Remington. In September 1963, the .223 Remington cartridge was officially accepted and named "Cartridge, 5.56 mm ball, M193". The following year, the ArmaLite AR-15 was adopted by the United States Army as the M16 rifle, and it would later become the standard U.S. military rifle.

.223 Remington, Wikipedia.

The current NATO 5.56x45mm cartridge, designed by FN of Belgium and adopted by NATO (including the USA) in 1980, is the SS109 / M855. (Wikipedia, 5.56x45mm NATO). It is very similar but not identical to the .233" cartridge.
The "original" .223" cartridge continues to be made by a number of manufacturers, mainly for civilian use.

5.56mm NATO versus .223 Remington
The exterior dimensions of the 5.56mm NATO and .223 Remington cartridges are identical. While the cartridges are identical other than powder load, the chamber leade, i.e. the area where the rifling begins, is cut to a sharper angle on some .223 commercial chambers. Because of this, a cartridge loaded to generate 5.56mm pressures in a 5.56mm chamber may develop pressures that exceed SAAMI limits when fired from a short-leade .223 Remington chamber.

Wikipedia, 5.56x45mm NATO ; the "5.56mm NATO versus .223 Remington" section carries on for a while and I won't pretend to understand it all, but cut a long story short, the NATO round causes higher chamber pressure, so
(1) 5.56mm NATO-chambered weapons can fire .223 Remington cartridges safely
(2) Most (but not all) .223 Remington-chambered weapons can fire 5.56mm NATO cartridges safely
(3) If you use 5.56x45 NATO in a .233 Remington-chambered weapon not built to handle the pressure of the NATO round, you might be severely injured or worse.


Rarely have I spent so long on a post only to think, " I set myself up for that."
I'm not a gun guy, but somehow I'm not sure I feel any better...

On the serious side,

An examination of the ammunition collected by the FBI found .223 Remington caliber cartridges with a federal ammunition headstamp, 5.56 NATO cartridges with an Advance Armament Corporation ammunition headstamp, and .223 Remington caliber cartridges with a Hornady ammunition headstamp

...If Crooks was carrying mixed ammunition types, it suggests (to me) he was buying it "as and when" he came across it or could afford it; perhaps a "professional" assassin- or at least someone who had made a methodical plan, over some time, to attempt an assasination with a rifle- would use a preferred/ optimal type of ammunition.

At the gun range I have shot at, they don't allow .556 ammunition (Green tip M855 NATO) to be used but allow .223. Could be why he had both. Simply due to having the option of shooting at multiple ranges. The .556 is a steel core round and can cause damage to targets or ricochet that .223 doesn't.

 

[Ann K]

It's yet more proof that there is just as much conspiracy ideation on the far left as there is on the far right.

Sorry, I missed the part where you decided who is on the "left", who is on the "right", and how the term "just as much" is quantified.

Edit to add: I see @Mendel has just questioned you regarding the same.

 

[enilc]

On the day of the assassination attempt, he asked if he could borrow his father's AR-15-style rifle, saying he planned to go to a shooting range, sources said. Because Crooks' father had previously let him use the gun for target shooting, he was not suspicious that his son was planning anything of concern.

Crooks went to a local gun shop that day, where he bought 50 rounds of 5.56 mm ammo. He also stopped at a Home Depot to buy a 5-foot ladder, though it was not found at the scene and is not believed to have been used to access the roof.

https://abc7ny.com/post/what-thomas...ading-up-to-attempted-assassination/15067382/

This was pretty early reporting, but the only thing I could find about sourcing the ammunition. Seems inconsistent with the different brands, but could be that he was purchasing reloads or something from the "gun store." Or maybe he never managed to use that purchased ammunition.

 

[NoParty]

...It's yet more proof that there is just as much conspiracy ideation on the far left as there is on the far right."

To this point (4/24/26) the vast majority of the spreading of this particular conspiracy theory, that I have seem,
has been from the Right...so I don't see this as "proof" of the "both sides" trope.

To be clear, I don't think there's anything to Ear-gate, and spreading such nonsense should be condemned no matter
who is doing it. In this case though, I think this ct is a better proof that the Right is just way more into conspiracy theories,
than the left: They just can't help themselves: Even though this one degrades the image of a man that they've spent years
pushing on us, a fake assassination attempt is just too delicious to pass up.

That said, I'm enjoying watching the absurdity, and seeing Trump on the other end of a dopey conspiracy theory.

 

[Edward Current]

I continue to be shocked at how prevalent this conspiracy theory has become — surely among the most absurd of the decade. It's yet more proof that there is just as much conspiracy ideation on the far left as there is on the far right. As the saying goes: "It doesn't matter whether you go around the left side of the goat or the right side; go too far and you end up at the asshole."

What shocks me is how casually social-media users with hundreds of thousands of followers will throw this out like it's an assumed fact, an open secret. (Yeah, I am talking about liberal influencers on Twitter, a common example being "Mrs. Thelma Johnson.") And then I go down the replies looking for one reasonable person, and it's nothing but more of the same. No one mentioning that someone in the crowd was killed. No one asking for a coherent theory of what happened exactly. Nothing but "Staged hoax, everyone knows, ho hum."

 

[Mendel]

What shocks me is how casually social-media users with hundreds of thousands of followers will throw this out like it's an assumed fact, an open secret. (Yeah, I am talking about liberal influencers on Twitter, a common example being "Mrs. Thelma Johnson.") And then I go down the replies looking for one reasonable person, and it's nothing but more of the same. No one mentioning that someone in the crowd was killed. No one asking for a coherent theory of what happened exactly. Nothing but "Staged hoax, everyone knows, ho hum."

Yeah, but you know how Sandy Hook went down. The "paid actors" CT didn't make sense either, that didn't keep Alex Jones from pushing it.

 

[Edward Current]

Yeah, but you know how Sandy Hook went down. The "paid actors" CT didn't make sense either, didn't keep Alex Jones from pushing it.

I don't have any numbers, but Sandy Hook CT seemed much more fringe than Staged Assassination Attempt CT. That is why it's shocking to me — these aren't dedicated CT peddlers like Jones, and they aren't nobodies with 50 followers, they are very popular accounts who normally post extremely mainstream liberal takes. Then out of the blue they'll say something like, "This is the mentality that believes an ear can be blown off and grow back in a week." Sorry for paraphrasing. I can find some screenshots but I'm not sure that will demonstrate anything.

 

[FatPhil]

In this case though, I think this ct is a better proof that the Right is just way more into conspiracy theories, than the left:

Beware, it might not be the right-leaningness that's the cause, you'd need to control for intelligence. It might be that a medium-intelligence rightie is just as likely to fall for CTs as a medium-intelligence leftie (and likewise other strata along the intelligence axis).

Or, viewed from another angle: if you find a left-leaning CT-er, the surprising thing might be that he's left-leaning more than him being a CT-er, as the CT tendency might be accompanied by a whole bunch of other traits that you also wouldn't expect from someone who leans left.

 

[Mendel]

In this case though, I think this ct is a better proof that the Right is just way more into conspiracy theories,
than the left:

The best proof is data.

Beware, it might not be the right-leaningness that's the cause, you'd need to control for intelligence.

I found a study at https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9009899/ about vaccine hesirancy, which correlates nicely with conspiracy theory belief, that identifies both ideology and education as correlated with vaccine attitude, but unfortunately does not crosswise control for these factors.

 

[FatPhil]

The best proof is data.

I found a study at https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9009899/ about vaccine hesirancy, which correlates nicely with conspiracy theory belief, that identifies both ideology and education as correlated with vaccine attitude, but unfortunately does not crosswise control for these factors.

Yeah, data's always good. I've seen this cited a few times, and I'd like to dive in, because it is not US-centric (and I've alas seen plenty of CT thinking in Europe), but alas I can't find a copy of it:

Conspiracy Thinking in Europe and America: A Comparative Study

Annemarie S Walter https://orcid.org/0000-0003-0116-0631 and Hugo Drochon
Volume 70, Issue 2
https://doi.org/10.1177/0032321720972616

Abstract
What explains conspiracy thinking in Europe and America? This is the first and largest comparative study of conspiracy thinking to date, presenting findings using a representative sample of 11,523 respondents in nine countries. First, it shows that the overall level of conspiracy thinking in Europe is equal to or slightly lower than the United States, contradicting the notion that conspiracy theories is an especially American phenomenon. Second, people more inclined to conspiracy thinking position themselves towards the right of the political spectrum, engage in magical thinking, feel distrust towards public officials and reject the political system. Finally, we find that – surprisingly – the country context in which respondents reside has hardly any effect as predictor of levels of conspiracy thinking or as a moderator of individual-level determinants. Heterogeneity in conspiratorial thinking seems to be largely a function of individual traits.

-- https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0032321720972616

 

[Todd Feinman]

Of course you know you could request it through your local public library, depending on where you are. Takes a bit of time.

 

[jdog]

I don't have any numbers, but Sandy Hook CT seemed much more fringe than Staged Assassination Attempt CT. That is why it's shocking to me — these aren't dedicated CT peddlers like Jones, and they aren't nobodies with 50 followers, they are very popular accounts who normally post extremely mainstream liberal takes. Then out of the blue they'll say something like, "This is the mentality that believes an ear can be blown off and grow back in a week." Sorry for paraphrasing. I can find some screenshots but I'm not sure that will demonstrate anything.

There's a spectrum there from contending the whole thing was staged (which is contradicted by the death of someone in the crowd) to contending that Trump wasn't actually nicked by a bullet (since the Trump cadre has a habit of making things up and not providing proof).

Some speakers use vague language that lets them later say, "I never said it was *all* a hoax."

 

[Mendel]

Is there any precedent for a sniper shooting at someone and planning to miss? at the behest of the target?