Needs Debunking: Proposed COVID Vaccine will become part of our DNA, make us programmable

[Annapolis]

Good afternoon everyone. This is my first time posting, and I will try to follow the posting guidelines as best as possible. My apologies if I do this incorrectly.

I have an immediate relative who is sending anti-vax youtube videos via emails to people (not sure how many, the list is bcc). The latest one that is being sent is a youtube video which is 4:19 in length and features an interview with Dr. Christiane Northrup. It comes from the "Vaxxed TV" Youtube channel. Here is the link:

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNZ59wbwg44&feature=youtu.be

The claims of the video are as follows:

• "The" covid vaccine is an RNA (trans-infections) vaccine that will fundamentally change people's DNA
• There is a patent for Luciferase which, under a light, would show who is vaccinated and who isn't
• The vaccine would store your biometric information
• The vaccine will carry "nano-particals" which are little robots, that will have the ability to take your biometric data (not only your vaccine record but also your breathing, heart rate, sexual activity, medication and drugs you are taking, where you travel - and take all of that information and store in the cloud.
• The Bill and Melinda Gates foundation applied for a patent (060606) to take that data, connect it (your data) to a barcode and then connect each vaccinated person to cryptocurrency.
• Then we would all become a commodity.
• Once the nano particles go in - there is no detoxing from them. You will not be able to rid your body of them as they combine with your DNA and they make you "programmable".
• With the proposed 5g networks, anybody who is vaccinated would essentially become an antenna where you could become controlled. Dr. Northrup does state that this would be the worst-case scenario.

I searched an earlier forum posted by Mick (thank you!) about the science behind the nano-particles within vaccines, but will admit, I became very confused as it was quite scientific. Is anyone else able to help me make sense of the above claims and if they hold any water? I have bolded the most concerning claims. My relative believes the claims wholeheartedly and wants to warn people out of misguided love. Any help with debunking this would be very much appreciated.

 

[DavidB66]

I found this article on Snopes.com which examines the claim about Bill Gates and a patent 060606:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/microsoft-own-patent-666/

As often happens, there is a grain of truth in the claim, but it has been wildly misinterpreted. I can't comment on the other points, except to say:

a) there really is such a thing as Luciferase. Whoever thought up the name probably didn't think it through.
b) surely we are all commodities already. It is kind of ironic that anyone who worries about this should have a channel on YouTube.

 

[deirdre]

an earlier forum posted by Mick (thank you!) about the science behind the nano-particles within vaccines,

Mick posted a thread about nano-particles within vaccines? can you link it here so the rest of us can see what you are talking about?

 

[Annapolis]

I found this article on Snopes.com which examines the claim about Bill Gates and a patent 060606:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/microsoft-own-patent-666/

As often happens, there is a grain of truth in the claim, but it has been wildly misinterpreted. I can't comment on the other points, except to say:

a) there really is such a thing as Luciferase. Whoever thought up the name probably didn't think it through.
b) surely we are all commodities already. It is kind of ironic that anyone who worries about this should have a channel on YouTube.

Thank you for the info from Snopes. There was so much to unpack in that video that I am very happy to have even one bit of it debunked.

 

[Annapolis]

Mick posted a thread about nano-particles within vaccines? can you link it here so the rest of us can see what you are talking about?

Yes, let me see if I can find it again.

 

[Annapolis]

Yes, let me see if I can find it again.

Deidre - here is the thread. It looks like you had already commented on it, so I'm sure you're familiar with it. I looks like I had remembered incorrectly - it isn't directly related to vaccines - more about implanting medical info beneath the skins surface, but not necessarily through a vaccine.

https://www.metabunk.org/threads/storing-medical-information-below-the-skin's-surface.11218/#post-238297

 

[Mendel]

Particles are particles, and robots are machines. Nano-particles are not nano-machines. Somebody got very confused.

The "connect each vaccinated person to cryptocurrency" feels like uninformed nonsense, I can't imagine how that would work in any sense. "Connect the data to a barcode" is equally nonsensical.

Patent 1. WO2020060606 - CRYPTOCURRENCY SYSTEM USING BODY ACTIVITY DATA does exist.

Article:

Human body activity associated with a task provided to a user may be used in a mining process of a cryptocurrency system. A server may provide a task to a device of a user which is communicatively coupled to the server. A sensor communicatively coupled to or comprised in the device of the user may sense body activity of the user. Body activity data may be generated based on the sensed body activity of the user. The cryptocurrency system communicatively coupled to the device of the user may verify if the body activity data satisfies one or more conditions set by the cryptocurrency system, and award cryptocurrency to the user whose body activity data is verified.

Source: https://patentscope.wipo.int/search/en/detail.jsf?docId=WO2020060606

Basically, the idea is that you wear a fitbit or something like that, and use that to earn a cryptocurrency.

The problem that cryptocurrencies have is that you have to limit how much money is created in the system. If you're tying that to some physical activity, that sets a limit on how much any one person could mine.

It's basically a very advanced version of Pokemon Go.

 

[deirdre]

The Bill and Melinda Gates foundation applied for a patent (060606) to take that data

we normally look at specific claims of EVIDENCE. not just claims. but this random claim was easy enough to look up. the patent was not filed by the Gates Foundation, it was filed by Microsoft Technologies. Bill Gates no longer has any ties to Microsoft (except teh 5% of stock i believe he still owns).

2019-06-20
Application filed by Microsoft Technology Licensing, Llc

Inventor Dustin AbramsonDerrick FuJoseph Edwin Johnson, Jr.

https://patents.google.com/patent/WO2020060606A1/en?oq=WO2020060606+

Bill was still on the Board of Directors when the application was filed but he stepped down this spring.

 

[Mendel]

Bill was still on the Board of Directors when the application was filed but he stepped down this spring.

From your source:

2019-06-20 Application filed by Microsoft Technology Licensing, Llc

 

[Annapolis]

we normally look at specific claims of EVIDENCE. not just claims. but this random claim was easy enough to look up. the patent was not filed by the Gates Foundation, it was filed by Microsoft Technologies. Bill Gates no longer has any ties to Microsoft (except teh 5% of stock i believe he still owns).

2019-06-20
Application filed by Microsoft Technology Licensing, Llc

Inventor Dustin AbramsonDerrick FuJoseph Edwin Johnson, Jr.

https://patents.google.com/patent/WO2020060606A1/en?oq=WO2020060606+

Bill was still on the Board of Directors when the application was filed but he stepped down this spring.

Thank you for this information.

 

[Vaeltaja]

The patent WO2020060606 is not patent number 666. The real WO patent 2020 number 666 is this one:
https://patents.google.com/patent/WO2020000666A1/en?oq=WO2020000666+

What comes to lusiferase, it's an entsyme that makes bioluminesense = brings light. Firefly for example has it. So the name makes sense, because luci fer in latin means carrying light, tho I wouldn't myself name my discoveries like that. If I've understood it correctly, the entsyme is being used as a "signal light" to show if the thing that is being developed works properly, kind of an easy to use indicator.

 

[Leifer]

Perhaps the best debunking explained about a Bill Gates conspiracy....
....this video poster explains why Gates has no reason to pull-off any conspiracy.....

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tf6aSU2RWrg

 

[Rory]

What's the explanation @Leifer? Timestamp?

 

[Leifer]

@ 6:01, Gates invests funds in Covid research (via Perbright) before pandemic.....but a lot of people and orgs knew about the threat also.

@ 6:08, digital certificates are not implants or skin flags.

@ 8::51, Gates warned of a pandemic before this pandemic.... but so did many others. Were all the warners in on a conspiracy ?

@ 9:22, Gate's "depopulation efforts" conspiracy idea.....is non-conspiritorial, if people lived longer - population rates would slow down. In other words, short lives require more offspring but longer lives require less offspring...... and yet both get the same job done.

@ 10:04, Gates stockpiles goods and supplies, so he also fears the same ideas as "anti-Gates" proponents. I call that ironic and possibly a re-thought ?
...more ?

I think we know that the video speaks abundantly of ideas we all discuss here. However, there is a sort of "school hallway monitor" way of policing the "no click" rule. I don't think I violated that rule.... let me quote my OP.....

"Perhaps the best debunking explained about a Bill Gates conspiracy....
....this video poster explains why Gates has no reason to pull-off any conspiracy....."

If these 16 minutes were wasted, I would not be posting them at all.
I realize that if this were the case, then anybody could post 16 minutes of froth. I do get it. But to be required to paraphrase very elequent statements ....is this about paraphrasing ?

 

[Mendel]

If these 16 minutes were wasted, I would not be posting them at all.

If I could be reading what he's saying, it'd take me 5 minutes. That's 10 of my minutes wasted even if everything he said was new to me. But many of the points you're citing have been discussed here on this forum.

Your original summary had the properties of clickbait, in fact saying "this is important" without explaining why.

With many videos, you can use a site such as downsub to extract the subtitles and edit them into a quote of "the important bits" (not a paraphrase). This effort saves every reader time.

 

[Landru]

@ 6:01, Gates invests funds in Covid research (via Perbright) before pandemic.....but a lot of people and orgs knew about the threat also.

@ 6:08, digital certificates are not implants or skin flags.

@ 8::51, Gates warned of a pandemic before this pandemic.... but so did many others. Were all the warners in on a conspiracy ?

@ 9:22, Gate's "depopulation efforts" conspiracy idea.....is non-conspiritorial, if people lived longer - population rates would slow down. In other words, short lives require more offspring but longer lives require less offspring...... and yet both get the same job done.

@ 10:04, Gates stockpiles goods and supplies, so he also fears the same ideas as "anti-Gates" proponents. I call that ironic and possibly a re-thought ?
...more ?

I think we know that the video speaks abundantly of ideas we all discuss here. However, there is a sort of "school hallway monitor" way of policing the "no click" rule. I don't think I violated that rule.... let me quote my OP.....


If these 16 minutes were wasted, I would not be posting them at all.
I realize that if this were the case, then anybody could post 16 minutes of froth. I do get it. But to be required to paraphrase very elequent statements ....is this about paraphrasing ?

The Posting Guidelines require it.

 

[Leifer]

I understand.
It's a rule, and possibly a necessary rule. Everyone needs to be held to the same standards.
It prevents people posting worthless or confusing videos, and grit my teeth, everyone has to abide, for fairness.
There is a certain genuine quality where a person is speaking, rather than a printed dialog...but this is simply my personal opinion.

 

[deirdre]

and grit my teeth,

think of it as a brain exercise to stave off dementia like doing crosswords and jigsaws. that's what i do

because it is annoying to transcribe stuff. but it's good for you.

 

[Leifer]

.... but it's good for you.

laughs/enjoys......while my dentures fall out

 

[ConcernedBriton]

This one is quite a particular one which hits home with a situation I am in.

I am glad it is on the site, but I have to say I'm a little disappointed in the 'debunk' on this one so far, including the video.

Up to press in the video, we seem to have just as much opinion and conjecture as the conspiracy theorists. To summarise:

1) Yes, Bill gates is wealthy and is interfering in monopolising and implicating himself in viruses and vaccines, but because he is already wealthy and powerful, there is no reason to think he wants any more power and influence? Nobody is to really know that either way, surely?

2) He is a major donor to the WHO etc, and other organisations which he needs to be able to influence to push his agenda and interests (whether they are good or bad). Again, that doesn't particularly set a record straight.

3) He doesn't think Bill Gates is psychopathic? Again, that is not really all that water-tight, and furthermore, does having some kind of 'God delusion' (like the much discussed George Soros: "'It is a sort of disease when you consider yourself some kind of god, the creator of everything, but I feel comfortable about it now since I began to live it out." The Independent interview 23rd October 2011) qualify as psychopathic? He may well be dangerous and delusional for these kinds of reasons, without necessarily being clinically defined as 'psychotic'. I'm not saying he is, but for a conspiracy theorist who takes up this particular conspiracy being discussed, it isn't all that convincing, unfortunately.

4) He is in fact connected to the institutes involved with studying Corona virus, they do have patents on them, but just not this particular strain of it we have at the moment. They do receive funding from Gates and his offshoots. Of course, it may be natural for him to be doing so, but to the conspiracy theorist, it will be getting too much of a coincidence.

5) Event 201 simulated a corona virus not long before the pandemic, Gates was involved and they were discussing things with organisations involved in deciding how to shape events after a pandemic occurred. Sure, it could be a coincidence, it probably was a coincidence, but again, for the conspiracy theorist who believes in this, it is not particularly going to alter their vantage point a great deal.

6) They are putting tracking into vaccines, albeit not in the way people may fear, with it being a luminous die (badly named luciferese I believe) and whatever else is being put in there can, in theory, according to a patent, be linked to a device like a watch or mobile device in order to gain rewards or whatever for bitcoins or such like. This doesn't do much to deter the idea that there may be forcible vaccinations and, in the future, as a theory may go, be tied into vaccines to be able to go about your business.

7) Bill Gates does support curbing population growth after all, only it's just that he does not seem to believe that vaccines are the right way to do it. He doesn't want to 'kill people off' as such, but engineer a situation where population growths are curtailed. It's hardly a glowing refutation that Gates is to be trusted on doing more than just 'doing good' with his medical and technological power. It can get a bit subjective as to what is good and who ought to be the populations being curtailed.

8) It's not likely he is doing anything bad because 'he won't have time to enjoy any further wealth or power' etc. If he wants to leave a legacy to the world and go down in history, he may not be interested in any further wealth or power - it could be his actions and influences and how they trickle forth into the future. I can see a conspiracy theorist being persuaded by that latter idea.

I agree with the video and I agree with his concluding remarks about what drives this kind of stuff. I know it is hard to impossible to really disprove some things or prove a false negative (or whatever it is), but unlike Flat Earth and other outright obvious and demonstrable evidences that can be shown to people, this particular 'debunk' is not going to be all that hard-hitting if I was to try and send it to a believer in the conspiracy theory.

I know the answer is to to try and do better myself. I've been looking around for stuff on this - in particular the idea that it is going to allow people to be "controlled like robots" in the future if they have the Covid vaccinations - but I'm not finding all that much yet. I have yet to scour the rest of this site on vaccination material.

 

[Mendel]

6) They are putting tracking into vaccines, albeit not in the way people may fear, with it being a luminous die (badly named luciferese I believe) and whatever else is being put in there can, in theory, according to a patent, be linked to a device like a watch or mobile device in order to gain rewards or whatever for bitcoins or such like

I have not seen any evidence that this is happening.

7) Bill Gates does support curbing population growth after all, only it's just that he does not seem to believe that vaccines are the right way to do it. He doesn't want to 'kill people off' as such, but engineer a situation where population growths are curtailed. It's hardly a glowing refutation that Gates is to be trusted on doing more than just 'doing good' with his medical and technological power. It can get a bit subjective as to what is good and who ought to be the populations being curtailed.

Investigate this. It's been known for decades that once you raise the living standards of a populations, its birth rate falls. Western countries have had a "shrinking" birth rate for decades. To argue that to improve a country's living conditions is somehow evil is a long stretch. So the way to debunk this is to investigate exactly what Bill Gates proposes we do to achieve this, instead of assuming that it's somehow evil without knowing the details.

 

[ConcernedBriton]

From what have been gathering so far, as part of trying to debunk the idea that the corona vaccines have "nano-robots" and "metal particles" that can make you "controllable through 5g masts as your body will be a conductor" etc, there has been some discussion to how it may actually be possible to add something into the body which can monitor a 'patient' or user of a vaccine and give off vital signs (much like you may get on an apple watch or fitbit) so that a person can be tracked (in terms of their wellness or fitness) and have that (self applied) monitoring device linked to an account with, say, bitcoin or other crypto-currency to "reward" somebody for doing better or being better in their health.

This is what the 'patent' is about, I believe, In terms of what may be coming down the track. Conspiracy theorists seem to believe it is already in it, that it can be monitored externally to the individual, and so on.

"Tracking", again, seems to be being misunderstood by the conspiracy theorists, in terms of the coloured die (discussed in the above video) called "luciferese" (which is apparently Greek for luminosity or "to be seen", but a sure sign of evil at foot and the devils mark etc if you're the conspiracy theorist)...where rather than the person being tracked or monitored externally in their activities, it is a means of scanning the body to see if this luminous stuff is present and therefore proof of having taken the vaccine (or that it is working), for example. Again, I don't believe it is being rolled out at the moment, but it seems to have been floated as a concept in the medical world.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not believing in the theories, I am playing devils advocate in trying to point out why some of the points raised are not 'silver bullets' to refute a conspiracy (to a conspiracy theorist) and can be subjective to opinion and different assessments of what is moral and immoral to be doing, how it ought to be done, to whom and by whom.

(I just remembered that there are posting guidelines on this site and I need to be more mindful of rambling on about things that are not strictly "on point" debunk and counter-claims, so I have edited it to keep it shorter).

 

[Mendel]

If you cite actual claims, we can look at them and see what's wrong with them. (I'm fairly sure we already did that for the tracking issue.) If you present the claims vaguely, we can't.

You can't debunk a fantasy conspiracy for which there is no evidence; but then you shouldn't really need to.

 

[hennakoto]

a) there really is such a thing as Luciferase. Whoever thought up the name probably didn't think it through.

Ah well, you see, Raphaël Dubois did think it through. It's originally a reference to Venus as the morning star or light-bringer. Luciferase is the enzyme that allows living beings to bioluminesce.

You might also be aware of the WW1 song Pack Up Your Troubles which has a line which shows that at the start of the 20th century, the word lucifer referred to a kind of forerunner of the safety match:

While you've a lucifer to light your fag

... with 'fag', of course, being the British variety (i.e. a cigarette).

 

[vladimir711]

Here is the original 060606 patent. The patent is about rewarding physical activity with cryptocurrency. There is nothing about nano-particles or robots in it.

 

[Leifer]

6) They are putting tracking into vaccines, albeit not in the way people may fear, with it being a luminous die (badly named luciferese I believe) and whatever else is being put in there can, in theory, according to a patent, be linked to a device like a watch or mobile device in order to gain rewards or whatever for bitcoins or such like. This doesn't do much to deter the idea that there may be forcible vaccinations and, in the future, as a theory may go, be tied into vaccines to be able to go about your business.

I have other issues with this suggestive post, but #6 stands as an outlier.
Firstly and mostly not criminal, is the misspelling of the word"die" (it's actually spelled "dye").
As far as I can tell "luciferese" is a temporary dye marker to help suggest and track a transfer of a fluid within a system of choice.. It is not permenant. Like digestible barium, it's used to temporally track movements within a fluid based system (like a human body).
Key word... "temporary".

 

[derrick06]

I have other issues with this suggestive post, but #6 stands as an outlier.
Firstly and mostly not criminal, is the misspelling of the word"die" (it's actually spelled "dye").
As far as I can tell "luciferese" is a temporary dye marker to help suggest and track a transfer of a fluid within a system of choice.. It is not permenant. Like digestible barium, it's used to temporally track movements within a fluid based system (like a human body).
Key word... "temporary".

From my understanding of the ingredients in the Phizer and Moderna vaccine, I don't see any reference to "Luciferase" being a present ingredient as well so I'm not sure what this aspect is based on outside of conspiratorial accusations.

 

[Leifer]

Neither can I, find Luciferase to be a widely used substance amongst public vaccine distrubution. I see it is sometimes used as a tracker in vaccine trials, or other antibody tests not related to Covid 19.

https://www.fda.gov/vaccines-blood-biologics/science-research-biologics/luciferase-immunoprecipitation-system-lips-assay-rapid-simple-and-sensitive-test-detect-antibody

Researchers at the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) have developed a simple, rapid, and sensitive test that identifies individuals who have made antibodies against respiratory syncytial virus (RSV), the most common cause of serious lower respiratory tract infection in infants and young children worldwide. RSV also affects many elderly individuals, especially those with underlying heart or lung disease, accounting for nearly as many hospitalizations as influenza.

or this @ https://www.technologyreview.com/20...-the-ingredients-of-pfizers-covid-19-vaccine/

In the face of rumors suggesting that Bill Gates has installed tracking microchips in the shots, or that the inoculations contain luciferase, a glowing chemical from fireflies whose name makes some people think of the devil, the company suggested it would be policing such claims by making reference to the "official vaccine ingredient list."

 

[Leifer]

This one is quite a particular one which hits home with a situation I am in.

I am glad it is on the site, but I have to say I'm a little disappointed in the 'debunk' on this one so far, including the video.

Up to press in the video, we seem to have just as much opinion and conjecture as the conspiracy theorists. To summarise:

1) Yes, Bill gates is wealthy and is interfering ...............

So I am not sure whether you are suggesting a conspiracy, or questioning some conspiracy (conspiracies). Hmm. Maybe I am misunderstanding things. ??

 

[Leifer]

dis em bowled while making fun of dinosaur history.... ok, that's funny.
Then, a dianasaur suddenly eats you..
(yes I know dinos and humans were not alive at the same time..... but It's a fabulous story.)

 

[ConcernedBriton]

So I am not sure whether you are suggesting a conspiracy, or questioning some conspiracy (conspiracies). Hmm. Maybe I am misunderstanding things. ??

The situation is that, in the process of being in a bit of a nightmare vicious circle with a family member whose life is being ruined by scores of conspiracy material (with vaccines and Gates, etc being just one small fraction of a heaving mass of subjects), I stumble over a "debunk" on it, that, to me, would not remotely satisfy this person.

This is for the 8 reasons I cited above. In those regards, it is full of holes and opinions/beliefs on what may be going on, which, for the conspiracy minded, does little to allay their beliefs or quell their alternative opinions on what they believe may be going on both now and in the future.

Please be aware that I am not personally insinuating anything or promoting any of the theories around all this to be factual or taking place in some way.

I am pointing out that some of the "opinions" that "Dr Grande" puts forward are in some aspects missing the point or completely unprovable (see points "3" and "8" on my post above) and that, in general, there ARE connections with Gates to various matters, that there are plans for dyes in the future (that may not be temporary) and that this is being floated in the medical world, etc.

If I was to go and give that video and this 'debunk' to the person I know, it would fail terribly on them. I am just being honest about how it is and what would happen.

I wanted people to know this and not to think that this one was somehow nailed down and a definitively water-tight enough rebuttal to help cure somebody of their mistrusts and fears.

 

[deirdre]

If I was to go and give that video and this 'debunk' to the person I know, it would fail terribly on them.

the only actual claim of evidence in this thread is the patent. and you can show the claims about the patent are false.

other than that, one cannot prove a negative. all you can do is ask for actual proof of these fantastical theories. and respond to the gish gallop they give you with a simple, brief "but that is speculation, not proof." ie. focus on teaching them the difference between actual evidence and opinion. you can't debunk someone's "feelings".

(i agree with you about the video.)

i would stick to specific claims of evidence your family member gives, that CAN actually be confirmed or debunked, and avoid opinion based philosophical what-if scenarios. Most ex- CTers say that they came across one thing that was proven wrong and that started them questioning what else they believed was wrong.

 

[NoParty]

The situation is that, in the process of being in a bit of a nightmare vicious circle with a family member whose life is being ruined by scores of conspiracy material (with vaccines and Gates, etc being just one small fraction of a heaving mass of subjects), I stumble over a "debunk" on it, that, to me, would not remotely satisfy this person.

This is for the 8 reasons I cited above. In those regards, it is full of holes and opinions/beliefs on what may be going on, which, for the conspiracy minded, does little to allay their beliefs or quell their alternative opinions on what they believe may be going on both now and in the future.

Please be aware that I am not personally insinuating anything or promoting any of the theories around all this to be factual or taking place in some way.

I am pointing out that some of the "opinions" that "Dr Grande" puts forward are in some aspects missing the point or completely unprovable (see points "3" and "8" on my post above) and that, in general, there ARE connections with Gates to various matters, that there are plans for dyes in the future (that may not be temporary) and that this is being floated in the medical world, etc.

If I was to go and give that video and this 'debunk' to the person I know, it would fail terribly on them. I am just being honest about how it is and what would happen.

I wanted people to know this and not to think that this one was somehow nailed down and a definitively water-tight enough rebuttal to help cure somebody of their mistrusts and fears.

Hi. Welcome to the site. Sorry you're a little disappointed.

Without getting too into-the-weeds on this specific issue,
I'd just like to say (as a long time debunker, virtually all of my adult life) that I don't think that hardly any on-line thread--by people one doesn't know--is likely to profoundly change the views of someone who is deep in on one or more conspiracy theories. Many people really don't want their beliefs debunked...or will assert that unrealistically high standards of evidence must be met (much higher than the low levels of "proof" of stuff they believe). Maybe I'm a bit jaded, but I think that if just showing a loved one a good thread
moved them away from sketchy material, there would be a whole lot less people down various rabbit holes, than there actually are.

Don't get me wrong, I think you're right to try...it's admirable.
And you know this person better than any of us do. So maybe
just share little bits (baby steps) that you think might move the needle, a bit. This is a great site, with lots of good people and
useful information. For me, the idea that any given "debunk" here,
given to someone holding illogical conspiracy beliefs,
"would fail terribly on them" would not be an indictment of the debunk...rather, it would be pretty normal, for human nature.

 

[ConcernedBriton]

Thanks both.

There are some things which can be pure black and white I suppose. Take for example the moon and how everybody on Earth seeing the same side of it is evidence that it is not circulating over a flat Earth, or that atmospheric conditions and different altitudes give off different "contrails", some of which last longer and are not "chemtrails", or that, say a repeatable 90%+ of peer reviewed studies have found no link between autism and vaccines, or similar for harm caused by radio-frequency waves and how the science of such waves cannot be harmful to human cells at the frequencies they operate at.

You can at least go to somebody deep down the rabbit hole and say "look, these are what appear to be the facts on this, please consider that you may be wrong and the people you are watching on Bitchute are not qualified in these fields of science (even though they claim to be doctors or scientists) or are misunderstanding the science and proper methodology to make their claims."

With this one, it just doesn't work. There's too much conjecture, too many opinions,. Gates was actually involved to groups that the CT's said he was (despite the video moving it a side-step to another virus), there are the plans for dyes called 'luciferese', he is interested in achieving population control, he is powerful and meddlesome, shaping the world without being voted for or otherwise appointed, aborted baby cells (HEK) are being used in developing vaccines.... (I know it isn't in it, etc, but it cannot be denied that these things are often being used as a scientific benchmark).

It kind of goes on. It'd therefore still be "open season "for the CT'er to fill in the gaps and have suspicions and weave together various 'unknowns' and grey-areas about the whole scenario.

As you say, it is damned near impossible to get a committed and deep rooted conspiracy addict to concede to anything.

Quite honestly, having to watch somebody rapidly deteriorate, age, suffer depression, stress, anxiety, live in an ever more child-like fear of the entire world, believe in nothing at all that's mainstream, make decisions about their health, their spouses health, financial decisions, turn into a shadow of their former self, have next to zero enjoyment in life, etc with all this stuff swimming around their mind is horrible.

For people who may be trying to help such cases, it comes to take over their lives too, worrying about the person and what's going to happen in the future, spending hours of spare time having to try and read-up, understand science, find the best material to debunk it all in your own mind before even going with anything to the other person! If I wasn't satisfied with what I saw and heard, its a damned sure shot that it's never going to chime with the CT addicted.

 

[deirdre]

If I wasn't satisfied with what I saw and heard, its a damned sure shot that it's never going to chime with the CT addicted.

actually that might not be true. most of us aren't satisfied with what we see and hear in CT videos and blogs, and yet the CT addicted are all over them! so can you really judge what will reach them based on what reaches you?

Personally i would point out that Bill Gates can't even make an efficient computer, how the heck is he going to pull off a efficient nanobot? and how is he gonna upgrade them every 8 days like his computers need? and even if they could upgrade them with 5g there wouldn't be enough storage after a year tops for upgrades. you ever look to see how much computer space your upgrades are taking? and you need to defragment and clean your hardrives... there's no way Bill Gates could pull off what is being suggested. or that he would spend the 50,000$ plus a person to do it.

seriously what would be the point.

 

[Leifer]

Thanks both.

....both bring up very good degrees of observation.

 

[Leifer]

Gates was actually involved to groups that the CT's said he was (despite the video moving it a side-step to another virus), there are the plans for dyes called 'luciferese', he is interested in achieving population control, he is powerful and meddlesome, shaping the world without being voted for or otherwise appointed, aborted baby cells (HEK) are being used in developing vaccines....

This is factual nonsense , simply based on conjectorial popycock..... if you want to get all fancy-talky.

 

[Leifer]

SGU podcast talks about this topic ..... does/or can the SARs CoVid place it's way into the human genome....
This is the only sensible (easy to follow) link I could find..... (skip into about 1/4 into the podcast....)
https://www.theskepticsguide.org/podcasts/episode-827

https://www.sciencealert.com/we-hav...-sars-cov-2-can-insert-itself-into-our-genome

Our genome is a graveyard littered with genetic fragments of viruses that once plagued our ancestors. If a controversial claim by MIT researchers withstands the criticisms being leveled at it, the virus behind the current pandemic has a fair chance of joining them.

 

[KalleMP]

Reposting this here as links to and extracts from the published papers were required.

In relation to the assertion that human DNA may be changed with the mRNA technology there seems to be various studies that have predicted and even detected this occurring. As it is not the intended mechanism and rather a side effect I expect that it would be a rare event rather than a foregone conclusion. The possibility sure does seem to be there and while it may not matter much if some cells suffer DNA alteration I agree with some others that having reproductive cells suffer such a change could be a big problem with progeny that have unintended gene in all their cells.


Here is a preprint paper from earlier in the pandemic. It explain how RNA from the SARS-CoV-2 virus can get transcribed into cellular DNA by way of a LINE-1 effect.
SARS-CoV-2 RNA reverse-transcribed and integrated into the human genome
DOI: 10.1101/2020.12.12.422516

https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.12.12.422516v1

These analyses support the hypothesis that SARS-CoV-2 RNA may retro-integrate into the genome of infected cells resulting in the production of chimeric viral-cellular transcripts.

.....

Human LINE-1 accounts for ~17% of the human genome, ~100 out of 500,000 copies of which are active21,23. LINE-1 – encoded reverse-transcriptase (ORF2p) and supporting protein (ORF1p) are known to retro-transpose not only LINE-1 transcripts (in Cis), but also other RNA species such as Alu (SINE) and cellular mRNA (in Trans, creating processed pseudogenes), with a "target-site – primed reverse transcription" mechanism21. LINE-1 proteins have been shown as nucleic acid chaperones with high RNA binding affinity39, therefore it is perhaps not surprising that they can retro-integrate exogenous viral RNAs. From an evolutionarily perspective, retro-integration of viral RNA by LINE-1 could be an adaptive response by the host to provide sustaining antigen expression possibly enhancing protective immunity. Conversely, retro-integration of viral RNAs could be detrimental and cause a more severe immune response in patients such as a "cytokine storm" or auto-immune reactions.

This one from the time when this thread was active by mostly the same authors as above
Reverse-transcribed SARS-CoV-2 RNA can integrate into the genome of cultured human cells and can be expressed in patient-derived tissues
DOI: 10.1073/pnas.2105968118

https://www.pnas.org/doi/full/10.1073/pnas.2105968118

In support of this hypothesis, we found that DNA copies of SARS-CoV-2 sequences can be integrated into the genome of infected human cells. We found target site duplications flanking the viral sequences and consensus LINE1 endonuclease recognition sequences at the integration sites, consistent with a LINE1 retrotransposon-mediated, target-primed reverse transcription and retroposition mechanism. We also found, in some patient-derived tissues, evidence suggesting that a large fraction of the viral sequences is transcribed from integrated DNA copies of viral sequences, generating viral–host chimeric transcripts. The integration and transcription of viral sequences may thus contribute to the detection of viral RNA by PCR in patients after infection and clinical recovery. Because we have detected only subgenomic sequences derived mainly from the 3′ end of the viral genome integrated into the DNA of the host cell, infectious virus cannot be produced from the integrated subgenomic SARS-CoV-2 sequences.

One that is more recent that shows a similar effect occurring in cultured liver cells from the mRNA used in the vaccines.
Intracellular Reverse Transcription of Pfizer BioNTech COVID-19 mRNA Vaccine BNT162b2 In Vitro in Human Liver Cell Line
DOI: 10.3390/cimb44030073

https://www.mdpi.com/1467-3045/44/3/73

Our results indicate a fast up-take of BNT162b2 into human liver cell line Huh7, leading to changes in LINE-1 expression and distribution. We also show that BNT162b2 mRNA is reverse transcribed intracellularly into DNA in as fast as 6 h upon BNT162b2 exposure.

These are mostly experimental results that have not been confirmed in clinical tests or trials as far as I know but they do seem to be credible research.

While I am inclined to say this is not a very likely event or the biggest threat from the vaccines and the disease I do believe it should be acknowledged and I suppose this thread should be labelled perhaps as "Partially Possible:" or something of that kind. Debunking does not seem to be a option any longer, though the remote control option seems very far fetched.

 

[deirdre]

Here is a preprint paper from earlier in the pandemic.

why is it still a preprint?


why does the first line of your second paper say
"In support of this hypothesis, we found that DNA copies of SARS-CoV-2 sequences can be integrated into the genome of infected human cells. " ? what does that have to do with the vaccine?


why does your 3rd paper say (in bold orange at top of page)? did you click that to read the comment?