MH17.....claiming responsibility ?

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Leifer

Senior Member.
Am I expecting too much to eventually see some party take responsibility for this ?
......and why would that be expecting too much ?
Maybe, because it is a war/conflict ?
Misdirected targets need an apology if unsuspecting civilians are killed.
If there is no apology or claim of responsibility, someone is lying and placing rhetoric before innocence. (or guilt)
It's disheartening.
There has been ample time for the shooters to raise their hands, in a highly regrettable "oops".
They know who they are......and they are the hidden greased pivot for any resulting bunk or conspiracy.

The 4th Geneva Convention addresses the issue of among other things, civilian casualties.
http://www.wipo.int/wipolex/en/other_treaties/text.jsp?file_id=197507
....and so on.....

I suspect there will be some claim of responsibility, eventually.
 

Landru

Moderator
Staff member
Am I expecting too much to eventually see some party take responsibility for this ?
......and why would that be expecting too much ?
Maybe, because it is a war/conflict ?
Misdirected targets need an apology if unsuspecting civilians are killed.
If there is no apology or claim of responsibility, someone is lying and placing rhetoric before innocence. (or guilt)
It's disheartening.
There has been ample time for the shooters to raise their hands, in a highly regrettable "oops".
They know who they are......and they are the hidden greased pivot for any resulting bunk or conspiracy.

The 4th Geneva Convention addresses the issue of among other things, civilian casualties.
http://www.wipo.int/wipolex/en/other_treaties/text.jsp?file_id=197507
....and so on.....

I suspect there will be some claim of responsibility, eventually.
Why? All evidence thus far points to a mistake in identifying the aircraft.
 

Leifer

Senior Member.
A mistake, yes, but the shooting party remains silent ??
Maybe I'm expecting too much, in this war/conflict thing.

Devil's advocate:
I shouldn't expect war to be a responsible playground.
 

Jason

Senior Member
Am I expecting too much to eventually see some party take responsibility for this ?
......and why would that be expecting too much ?
I too am hoping for some resolve on this front, but I fear with the Russians and their propaganda machine involved we might not get the truth for some time to come. It took the Russians 10 yrs to admit to the Korean plane flight 007 they shot down in 1983, so I wouldn't hold our breath waiting for them. We will have to rely on the investigative parties involved.
 

Soulfly

Banned
Banned
Am I expecting too much to eventually see some party take responsibility for this ?
Yes.
......and why would that be expecting too much ?
Because Humans don't like to admit mistake. Especially if they will get in trouble for it.

There would be hard repercussions, mot likely in the form of sanctions, so blame will not be admitted (if at all) until their war is over, or significant time has passed.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
It seems like there are two issues being raised here.

1. Who shot down the plane?
2. Was there negligence involved in the plane being at that location?

These are separate issues. This thread is about the first issue, not the second.
 

Gary Cook

Active Member
Am I expecting too much to eventually see some party take responsibility for this ?
......and why would that be expecting too much ?
Maybe, because it is a war/conflict ?
Misdirected targets need an apology if unsuspecting civilians are killed.
If there is no apology or claim of responsibility, someone is lying and placing rhetoric before innocence. (or guilt)
It's disheartening.
There has been ample time for the shooters to raise their hands, in a highly regrettable "oops".
They know who they are......and they are the hidden greased pivot for any resulting bunk or conspiracy.

The 4th Geneva Convention addresses the issue of among other things, civilian casualties.
http://www.wipo.int/wipolex/en/other_treaties/text.jsp?file_id=197507
....and so on.....

I suspect there will be some claim of responsibility, eventually.

Seems everybody is blaming everybody else. Maybe we should all just put it down to human error and work hard not to make the same mistakes again. It doesnt seem like anybody dont it intentionally in that at least nobody has claimed to.
 

Gary Cook

Active Member
It's still mass-manslaughter, not something to be shrugged off. Potentially a war crime.

There are war crimes all over the world going unpunished. But its a warzone. It wasn't the first plane to be shot down there recently. Other planes have been too. Albeit military. They were warned not to fly there I believe. The FAA issued more than one warning. Not that I like war or condone murder.
 

Jason

Senior Member
I think it pretty clear who fired the missile after watching the events unfold over the last couple of days. We have our Secretary of State, John Kerry discussing that they are "certain" the Russian separatist fired the missile on CNN today with Candy Crowly. http://cnnpressroom.blogs.cnn.com/2...-crowley-there-is-no-trust-with-the-russians/
Why would the separatist be removing evidence from the crime scene? I'm my experience anyone who tries to tamper with a crime scene is usually trying to cover up something. So, whether or not anyone actually claims responsibility might be irrelevant since we have enough evidence that the separatist are the ones who fired the missile. Their actions only add to the suspicion. Lastly, and if it's true, which I'm willing to take John Kerry's word on this, if they are covering up evidence, I doubt that the rebels are sophisticated enough to realize which evidence needs to be removed and that could likely be coming from Russian Intelligence.
 

Gary Cook

Active Member
I think it pretty clear who fired the missile after watching the events unfold over the last couple of days. We have our Secretary of State, John Kerry discussing that they are "certain" the Russian separatist fired the missile on CNN today with Candy Crowly. http://cnnpressroom.blogs.cnn.com/2...-crowley-there-is-no-trust-with-the-russians/

So, 'because they moved something that may have been a BUK missile they did it?' MAYBE they just didnt want the world to punish their people for something they didnt do. Your evidence is just speculation. I didnt think we are allowed to do that on this forum but hey I am not Admin. Ukraine have removed the bodies. They are implicated in this also. Would of been nice if they were independently examined but it is their country technically so that's normal.

Just as an aside, Kerry has little credibility, in my opinion. That post taken down was posted by fans of the person in question. Not him it seems.

 
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Pete Tar

Senior Member.
Ukraine have removed the bodies.
Huh?
I've heard the rebels are the ones removing the bodies.
For an overview of the history of the Strelkov's account, see here...
You seem really eager to give them a lot of benefit of doubt and blame Ukraine instead. Why? That's exactly what Russia Today wants to do as well, I wonder why?
 

Gary Cook

Active Member
Huh?
I've heard the rebels are the ones removing the bodies.
For an overview of the history of the Strelkov's account, see here...
You seem really eager to give them a lot of benefit of doubt and blame Ukraine instead. Why? That's exactly what Russia Today wants to do as well, I wonder why?

I dont want anything except maybe not getting blown up in WW3 potentially. I have a child also. A rather beautiful one I may add. =)

But in terms of this forum, I want there to be no bunk. Either from individuals, media or governments.

I have never said Russian Separatists didnt do it but I am open to other parties being potential culprits and I think claims that 'Putin did it' are bunk.

Since you asked my motives.
 

Pete Tar

Senior Member.
okay. Where did you hear Ukrainians and not rebels were moving the bodies, can you post the article?
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
This thread is a about claims of responsibility, not who moved the bodies.

Nobody has accepted responsibility yet. Let's just wait until either they do, or it gets figured out.
 
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