Charlie Wiser
Senior Member.
Okay, who did this? 

I've noticed that the location of the irrigation circles is very close to Schreiver AFB - isn't that where David Grusch was stationed?
https://maps.app.goo.gl/HzNQj8JJLnivkZpv5
Article: David C. Grusch
....
September 2011 – December 2013, Intelligence Flight Commander, 3d Space Experimentation Squadron, Schriever AFB, CO (USAF Active Duty)
Never thought about this before, and I think it's worth having an intuitive feel for why your number is correct.If the plane is flying at 21000 feet no shadow would be visible; you only get a shadow when the plane covers the sun completely, or almost completely, as seen from the ground. Airplane shadows disappear above about 2000-3000 feet.
From the air, a pilot in that area should be familiar with the marks of center-pivot irrigation. In natural color, which I assume would make the "dark" circle green, it would be obvious. Rendering it in black and white was, I think, a deliberate choice in order to invent a story, though that could have been done by anyone, not necessarily the pilot.I have a hard time believing a pilot thought they were seeing a flying alien spacecraft when they took this photograph.
It's difficult to imagine the optical illusion when actually flying over it.
Article: David C. Grusch
....
September 2011 – December 2013, Intelligence Flight Commander, 3d Space Experimentation Squadron, Schriever AFB, CO (USAF Active Duty) Source: https://docs.house.gov/meetings/GO/GO06/20230726/116282/HHRG-118-GO06-Bio-GruschD-20230726.pdf
I've noticed that the location of the irrigation circles is very close to Schreiver AFB - isn't that where David Grusch was stationed?
https://maps.app.goo.gl/HzNQj8JJLnivkZpv5
I totally agree.From the air, a pilot in that area should be familiar with the marks of center-pivot irrigation. In natural color, which I assume would make the "dark" circle green, it would be obvious. Rendering it in black and white was, I think, a deliberate choice in order to invent a story, though that could have been done by anyone, not necessarily the pilot.
Looks like you have to go back to early 2017 for the circles and nearby field colours to match the photo. They didn't look anything like the photo at any time in 2021.
I'm salty I didn't keep looking further east in Colorado. I was so close to the region lmfao.Well done sir!!!
Of course, it's closer to f'ing Kansas than the 4 corners but hey, what's a couple hundred miles. I'm off to the McMinnville UFO festival in a couple of weeks, where Lue is a featured speaker. There's a panel Q&A, maybe I'll take your photos with me![]()
Seems like someone was trolling Lue more than anythingI have a hard time believing a pilot thought they were seeing a flying alien spacecraft when they took this photograph.
It's difficult to imagine the optical illusion when actually flying over it.
I thought it was a colour photo also. The landscape appears pretty monochromatic in satellite photos.it appears Lue's photo may have a bit of color?
He seems to be going for the "I never said I think this is legit", but that's hard to believe when he described it as a "lenticular object casting a large shadow", "silver", "600-1000 feet in diameter". That is as close to describing a flying saucer as "a large hairy beast walking on two feet" is to describing Big Foot.External Quote:
As you know, I am always first to admit mistakes, but this is not one of those times. The facts regarding the photo I shared from a private pilot (as I emphasized several times yesterday during the forum) are as follows:
1. The specific photo had only just been provided to me (by a private pilot) that morning, prior to the forum.
2. The photo had NOT YET been vetted.
3. The dimensions I quoted, were per the pilot's own assessment of what he saw, based on altitude and experience.
The purpose of me showing the photo was to illustrate the need for civilian and commercial pilots to have a central reporting mechanism to report potential anomalous sightings. In this case, the pilot who took the photo, using his own camera, did not have a way to report what he believed was anomalous.
Once again, as I stated during the forum, I only received permission to release it that morning and only was made aware of it shortly before.
Not sure how many times I need to say it, so I will say it again. The photo was not yet vetted, and I made that perfectly clear.
This illustrates a bigger point here. When pilots, or anyone else for that matter, come out to share what they feel may be anomalous, are faced with fierce ridicule (instead of productive dialogue) from some in the UFO community, they learn quickly not to ever share again.
As I communicated during the forum, my purpose of sharing the photo was to simply illustrate there is no central reporting mechanism in place for private and commercial pilots to report what they believe might be anomalous and for these photos or videos to be vetted. This remains a serious issue. Pilots see things on a daily basis they can't explain (some identified, some mis-identified, and some truly anomalous) that require additional analysis.
In the end, whether a private pilot sees what turns out to be a cloud, a balloon, a tennis shoe, or a UAP, we need a reporting mechanism to ensure it can be analyzed and resolved. This was the reason I shared the photo, and I emphasized that several times during the forum.
I could have used a photo of an innertube to prove my point, but I used instead a real photo, taken by a real pilot, of something he thought was anomalous (which I emphasized had not been analyzed yet).
The ones who are screaming about it (instead of discussing respectfully it as I hoped) missed the entire point of the photo and are not helping other pilots in the future from coming forward.
Lue has responded to the debunk on this tweet.
Source: https://x.com/LueElizondo/status/1918309243041522153
He seems to be going for the "I never said I think this is legit", but that's hard to believe when he described it as a "lenticular object casting a large shadow", "silver", "600-1000 feet in diameter". That is as close to describing a flying saucer as "a large hairy beast walking on two feet" is to describing Big Foot.External Quote:
As you know, I am always first to admit mistakes, but this is not one of those times. The facts regarding the photo I shared from a private pilot (as I emphasized several times yesterday during the forum) are as follows:
1. The specific photo had only just been provided to me (by a private pilot) that morning, prior to the forum.
2. The photo had NOT YET been vetted.
3. The dimensions I quoted, were per the pilot's own assessment of what he saw, based on altitude and experience.
The purpose of me showing the photo was to illustrate the need for civilian and commercial pilots to have a central reporting mechanism to report potential anomalous sightings. In this case, the pilot who took the photo, using his own camera, did not have a way to report what he believed was anomalous.
Once again, as I stated during the forum, I only received permission to release it that morning and only was made aware of it shortly before.
Not sure how many times I need to say it, so I will say it again. The photo was not yet vetted, and I made that perfectly clear.
This illustrates a bigger point here. When pilots, or anyone else for that matter, come out to share what they feel may be anomalous, are faced with fierce ridicule (instead of productive dialogue) from some in the UFO community, they learn quickly not to ever share again.
As I communicated during the forum, my purpose of sharing the photo was to simply illustrate there is no central reporting mechanism in place for private and commercial pilots to report what they believe might be anomalous and for these photos or videos to be vetted. This remains a serious issue. Pilots see things on a daily basis they can't explain (some identified, some mis-identified, and some truly anomalous) that require additional analysis.
In the end, whether a private pilot sees what turns out to be a cloud, a balloon, a tennis shoe, or a UAP, we need a reporting mechanism to ensure it can be analyzed and resolved. This was the reason I shared the photo, and I emphasized that several times during the forum.
I could have used a photo of an innertube to prove my point, but I used instead a real photo, taken by a real pilot, of something he thought was anomalous (which I emphasized had not been analyzed yet).
The ones who are screaming about it (instead of discussing respectfully it as I hoped) missed the entire point of the photo and are not helping other pilots in the future from coming forward.
He could have said "I don't know what this is, the pilot didn't know what this is, and while it might have been something mundane, it is not a good thing that the pilot has nowhere to report this kind of stuff". But no, he leaned into the UFO and now everyone else is stupid for missing his larger point.
It's also insane that he got the picture that same day and decided to present it??? Like, he says this is "one of many, many, many incidents involving commercial pilots" yet the only real picture he has is one he got the same day by a random pilot? You'd think the dude would be swimming in these kind of photographs by now after years of being essentially a champion for this cause.
Do we really need a federal Department of Pareidolia?External Quote:
This illustrates a bigger point here. When pilots, or anyone else for that matter, come out to share what they feel may be anomalous, are faced with fierce ridicule (instead of productive dialogue) from some in the UFO community, they learn quickly not to ever share again.
As I communicated during the forum, my purpose of sharing the photo was to simply illustrate there is no central reporting mechanism in place for private and commercial pilots to report what they believe might be anomalous and for these photos or videos to be vetted. This remains a serious issue. Pilots see things on a daily basis they can't explain (some identified, some mis-identified, and some truly anomalous) that require additional analysis.
Silly me. OF COURSE he can still hide behind other people here.but I used instead a real photo, taken by a real pilot, of something he thought was anomalous
Ha, it reminds me of this from dumb and dumber. Someone mentioned earlier about people on reddit accusing Elizondo of being a dis-info agent, isn't this (along with the new Immaculate Conception story) just more proof that what was sold ages ago as a top secret Pentagon program was just little more than enthusiasts messing around in their spare time.Well done sir!!!
Of course, it's closer to f'ing Kansas than the 4 corners but hey, what's a couple hundred miles. I'm off to the McMinnville UFO festival in a couple of weeks, where Lue is a featured speaker. There's a panel Q&A, maybe I'll take your photos with me![]()
Why do we need this? What will it achieve?In the end, whether a private pilot sees what turns out to be a cloud, a balloon, a tennis shoe, or a UAP, we need a reporting mechanism to ensure it can be analyzed and resolved. This was the reason I shared the photo, and I emphasized that several times during the forum.
Instead of spending public money, there could be some sort of website where people could upload images of things they see in the sky that they can't identify and a group of obsessives could pore over those images and try to identify what's actually in those photos. What if something like that were to exist?Why do we need this? What will it achieve?
Other than having pictures of things that can't be identified because of a lack of data that can sells books.
It's annoying that they have an air of wanting to identify things when all they are interested in is the stuff that's impossible to identify, as though we (humans) should be able to identify EVERYTHING.
All he wants is "credible" people to say they don't know what it is and so OMG what could it be if those guys don't know?!?!
It would probably not be deemed credible.Instead of spending public money, there could be some sort of website where people could upload images of things they see in the sky that they can't identify and a group of obsessives could pore over those images and try to identify what's actually in those photos. What if something like that were to exist?
![]()
elizondo is used to the taxpayers paying for his hobby, so i think he means he wants the FAA to do it. and then the FAA can coordinate with AARO (because the US Government is known for it's efficient cross agency collaboration skills and unlimited budgets).Instead of spending public money, there could be some sort of website where people could upload images of things they see in the sky that they can't identify and a group of obsessives could pore over those images and try to identify what's actually in those photos. What if something like that were to exist?
![]()
This non-apology apology is just soooooo flawed.Source: https://x.com/LueElizondo/status/1918309243041522153
External Quote:
As you know, I am always first to admit mistakes, but this is not one of those times. The facts regarding the photo I shared from a private pilot (as I emphasized several times yesterday during the forum) are as follows:
1. The specific photo had only just been provided to me (by a private pilot) that morning, prior to the forum.
2. The photo had NOT YET been vetted.
3. The dimensions I quoted, were per the pilot's own assessment of what he saw, based on altitude and experience.
The purpose of me showing the photo was to illustrate the need for civilian and commercial pilots to have a central reporting mechanism to report potential anomalous sightings. In this case, the pilot who took the photo, using his own camera, did not have a way to report what he believed was anomalous.
Once again, as I stated during the forum, I only received permission to release it that morning and only was made aware of it shortly before.
Not sure how many times I need to say it, so I will say it again. The photo was not yet vetted, and I made that perfectly clear.
This illustrates a bigger point here. When pilots, or anyone else for that matter, come out to share what they feel may be anomalous, are faced with fierce ridicule (instead of productive dialogue) from some in the UFO community, they learn quickly not to ever share again.
As I communicated during the forum, my purpose of sharing the photo was to simply illustrate there is no central reporting mechanism in place for private and commercial pilots to report what they believe might be anomalous and for these photos or videos to be vetted. This remains a serious issue. Pilots see things on a daily basis they can't explain (some identified, some mis-identified, and some truly anomalous) that require additional analysis.
In the end, whether a private pilot sees what turns out to be a cloud, a balloon, a tennis shoe, or a UAP, we need a reporting mechanism to ensure it can be analyzed and resolved. This was the reason I shared the photo, and I emphasized that several times during the forum.
I could have used a photo of an innertube to prove my point, but I used instead a real photo, taken by a real pilot, of something he thought was anomalous (which I emphasized had not been analyzed yet).
The ones who are screaming about it (instead of discussing respectfully it as I hoped) missed the entire point of the photo and are not helping other pilots in the future from coming forward.
Seems like someone was trolling Lue more than anything
they can report, and should report, anything they see in the sky that may be dangerous to other pilots to the FAA already. obviously if the alien ufo was parked on the ground that would not be a danger, but this one apparently was casting a shadow so flying not on radar.But can't they already report anything they want, with
their names or anonymously, to guys like Lue?
External Quote:As I communicated during the forum, my purpose of sharing the photo was to simply illustrate there is no central reporting mechanism in place for private and commercial pilots to report what they believe might be anomalous and for these photos or videos to be vetted. This remains a serious issue. Pilots see things on a daily basis they can't explain (some identified, some mis-identified, and some truly anomalous) that require additional analysis.
Instead of spending public money, there could be some sort of website where people could upload images of things they see in the sky that they can't identify and a group of obsessives could pore over those images and try to identify what's actually in those photos. What if something like that were to exist?
![]()
Maybe I'm missing something here, but why does AARO not already fit exactly into this? Did Lue speak to that at all?
From "How can I share information with AARO or report a UAP?", AARO website https://www.aaro.mil/External Quote:
- Military and DoD civilian personnel must report through their command or service in accordance with GENADMIN Joint Staff J3 Washington DC 191452ZMAY23 "Unidentified Anomalous Phenomena Reporting and Material Disposition."
- Civilian pilots are encouraged to promptly report UAP sightings to air traffic control. AARO receives UAP-related Pilot Reports (PIREPs) from the Federal Aviation Administration
- AARO will announce when a reporting mechanism is available to the public.
At no time in this forum did the pilot face "fierce ridicule" ...although the reaction to Elizondo might be characterized thus, as we have heard his credulous conclusions before. And yet, HE has never learned "not to share", but goes off half-cocked at any gee-whiz image. Methinks he is offended by being debunked, and is trying very hard to pretend that it's the pilot who might be offended. How many hands did this photo go through between the unnamed pilot and his presentation of it, and how many people might therefore have rendered it in monochrome? We don't know, but apparently Elizondo never bothered to ask.External Quote:This illustrates a bigger point here. When pilots, or anyone else for that matter, come out to share what they feel may be anomalous, are faced with fierce ridicule (instead of productive dialogue) from some in the UFO community, they learn quickly not to ever share again.
Lue has responded to the debunk on this tweet.
External Quote:In the end, whether a private pilot sees what turns out to be a cloud, a balloon, a tennis shoe, or a UAP, we need a reporting mechanism to ensure it can be analyzed and resolved.
The pilots will learn whether it's a cloud, a tennis shoe, a balloon, or that we don't know (probably because of missing data). I can't offhand recall any pilots who misidentified clouds or shoes, so I think Lue is taking the piss here at their expense. "We need to help pilots who can't recognize shoes." Yeah, that should go over well?Why do we need this? What will it achieve?
It does.Maybe I'm missing something here, but why does AARO not already fit exactly into this?
Not really. ATC has radar data that can explain or confirm a report, which helps investigations. It's logical that this data be collected with the report.AARO encourages civilian pilots to contact air traffic control at the time of the sighting. Reports are then forwarded to AARO via the FAA. I'd guess this arrangement prioritises safety over subsequent issues of identification.
Not quite.It's Obviously just "Two Circular Water Reservoirs."
Article: Center-pivot irrigation (sometimes called central pivot irrigation), also called water-wheel and circle irrigation, is a method of crop irrigation in which equipment rotates around a pivot and crops are watered with sprinklers.![]()
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Article: ![]()
This despite the fact that so many of their fellow UFO adherents also hold the belief that "the government" is involved in the cover up.I'll take the bait and say you're talking about here. But beyond Metabunk, there are numerus sites and places to report UFOs and have been for a long time. MUFON, NUFORC, CUFOS to name just a few. The point Elizondo, Graves and others are making is that the government needs to do it, so as to legitimize the unidentified ones as real UFOs. Thus the stressing of the dangers posed by
crop circles and ceiling lampsUFOs to aviation.
Like with the chemtrail movement, government involvement legitimizes the claims.
Maybe I'm missing something here, but why does AARO not already fit exactly into this? Did Lue speak to that at all?
External Quote:As I communicated during the forum, my purpose of sharing the photo was to simply illustrate there is no central reporting mechanism in place for private and commercial pilots to report what they believe might be anomalous and for these photos or videos to be vetted. This remains a serious issue. Pilots see things on a daily basis they can't explain (some identified, some mis-identified, and some truly anomalous) that require additional analysis.
Note also that https://www.safeaerospace.org/press-releases/uap-witness-campaign-2023 also solicits reports. And then Ryan Graves presented sightings of Starlink flares on social media as UAP, making the pilots look like UFO believers or conspiracy theorists.The pilots will learn whether it's a cloud, a tennis shoe, a balloon, or that we don't know (probably because of missing data). I can't offhand recall any pilots who misidentified clouds or shoes, so I think Lue is taking the piss here at their expense. "We need to help pilots who can't recognize shoes." Yeah, that should go over well?