Can someone debunk Vigilant Citizen?

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Oxymoron

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I see nothing about us being 'intent on invading Syria'. How many middle eastern countries do you think we have invaded?

Try moving your telescope to the eye socket which contains an actual eye.

Yes there was a program called MKUltra, but they did not work with children, like you lady claims. They did some nasty things but not those. The focus was to try to find a 'truth serum'.
Can't deny MKUltra because it is officiall... 'Ah, I'll downplay it as much as possible... that's good PR'

You are young and you do not understand the fear that gripped the US. Schools had nuclear drills, just like they have fire and tornado drills now. A visit to the State Fair would include checking out fallout shelters. Little girls drew 'houseplans' of dream fallout shelters, instead of dream houses.

And you don't think the Russian people had the same experience... especially when the U.S insisted there was nothing wrong with sticking it's missiles in Turkey, right on the Russian borders? That was ok because America had no history of nuking anyone did they? Did they? Oh yes, they did didn't they but that was ok because 'they did it for good reason'.

I suppose you haven't read the book about how one man prevented ww3

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...verted-WWIII-height-Cuban-Missile-Crisis.html

I remember Pres. Kennedy's press conference when he pointed out the missile bases in Cuba, I remember then building defense missile bases around cities
That is what happens when you play chicken and keep upping the anti. Good for business though... just think how many people would be unemployed without this massive military machine... then there is also the millions that were killed... that was lucky because where would we be if they hadn't died, all those extra people and their descendents in the world... wow, we would really be in trouble then.

And what is interesting is that much of that fear was ungrounded, it seems. But it was a lot more REAL than the world takeover by the NWO or the fears that Pres Obama is planning on becoming a dictator.

I think it was real enough and still is. You can fit biological agents into a small hip flask which are enough to wipe out all life on earth nowadays. Not only that they can be adapted for use against a particular ethnicity as well.

http://www.scotsman.com/news/sci-te...gest-threat-to-world-scientists-warn-1-559594
 
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JRBids

Senior Member.
The ruling class has generally been predicting the extermination of other folks or saying that they want more folks aborted and their populations controlled for a long time. That's generally been out in the open for a while now. For instance... after the Darwin family was done emerging from their Masonic/ruling class networks, the whole eugenics movement emerged from the bowels of the body politic "randomly" and so forth.

No one really wants to kill anyone... except that they keep on saying that they do throughout history* or that the extermination of some folks is assured by science based on evolutionists' projection of colonialism onto nature and the Darwinian doctrine of scarcity and so forth.

*E.g.:

As someone else said, I go away for a couple days and the thread grows by leaps and bounds.

And you are still making unsourced, unsubstantiated claims ans sweeping generalizations.
Funny how those "ruling folks" want more folks aborted, but in the US they've been trying to overturn Roe v Wade for years. and making a pretty good dent in it.
 

JRBids

Senior Member.
Like I say, I have no concrete evidence that they are real. But All those other videos I've shown you prove that the new world order is real.

No you don't. You have no concrete evidence of anything. Everything you talk about is just like what started this post. You heard Ted somebody mention a book called something that you didn't read that talked about something something. Then 20 posts later, "oops, like I said I have no evidence but all the other no evidence I have makes a big pile of no evidece."
 

JRBids

Senior Member.
That's just one guy's monument. It's not "their" words. It just what you think they think.


I think this monument was put up by a cter to gain more converts. Just like some make You Tube videos. Could have been someone who owned a business carving headstones.
 

Melbury's Brick

Senior Member.
"How many middle eastern countries do you think we have invaded?" Afghanistan, Iraq, Libiya, Egypt and now Syria. I count 5.

Syria? Egypt? (are you referring to the Suez crisis?)

You are using a very broad definition of the word "invaded" not to mention (in an earlier post) attributing these invasions to "the west" eg half of the world. Either way, how do these none occupying "invasions" constitute a contribution to the dreaded NWO? There is no significant Nato presence now in any of the countries you mention except Afganistan where full withdrawal has been mooted for next year (after almost inevitable negotiation with the Taliban).
 

Grieves

Senior Member
"So...you did take personally."

Ad hominem arguments are personal by nature. There's no other way to take them. It's not some big reveal.

"If you cannot handle people disagreeing with you then perhaps you shouldn't post your opinions on the internet. I apologize if I think it seems like you are whinging with some of your generalizations and categorizations. Thats just how it comes across to me. I will try to refrain from suggesting such."

Again you revert to the implication my 'feelings are hurt', suggesting that I'm Ill equipped emotionally to handle your superior arguments, another ad hominem attack. There's a very simple way to not make an argument personal. Don't make it personal. You seem to insist on it, even while denying you've done it. I'm not pointing this out to you in the tearful hope you'll stop being so mean, I'm pointing it out to you in the earnest hope you'll stick to engaging the issues.

"It would be accurate if the ancient man developed a way to fly- a plane...and the design of the plane simply changed over time as new technology is developed. Economic and military exploitation is not a new technology or practice."

We aren't discussing economic and military exploitation in general. We're discussing the 'fabled' NWO, as in a system of GLOBAL military and economic dominance. Such a thing was as impossible to ancient man as flight, no matter how much they wanted it. Men could dress up as birds, eat peyote, and leap over a bonfire to feel like they're flying, just as Ancient Pharaohs could build massive monuments and declare themselves masters of the World... but both, whether they knew it or not, were clearly kidding themselves. It wasn't until the technology caught up with the dream that forms of flight were conceived. It's now that technology has caught up with the dream that forms of global dominance can take shape.
Simply put: the desire to dominate the world is clearly not a form of global dominance. Can you acknowledge that?

"There is nothing new about the US military wanting to dominate any conflict or engagement they enter into...

That premise is not the same as "global military control"."

Explain to me the difference between full spectrum dominance and your idea of what "global military control" means.
 
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mynym

Banned
Banned
As someone else said, I go away for a couple days and the thread grows by leaps and bounds.

And you are still making unsourced, unsubstantiated claims ans sweeping generalizations.

Your apparent ignorance isn't necessarily my responsibility. You should know more about topics that you're commenting on. It's well known to anyone that takes even a marginal interest in history that the ruling class and scientists that work for them have always been interested in population control and in many cases, depopulation.

Ironically you'll probably say that everything gets too long as each claim is "substantiated" within an overall pattern of evidence. What's next, denying that the eugenics movement "existed" or wanting its existence "substantiated"? Consider that things get too long for you to read when you deny or try to atomize basic forms of knowledge or demand that everything be "substantiated" instead of reading history for yourself. But anyway, enough communication... here's to things getting way too long and so forth:
And that's the same old, same old for those dreaming of a "new" world order or dreaming of saving civilization before they head the way of the Dodo:
And yet people wonder why "conspiracy theories" proliferate among the poor peasants of the world or among poor black people and so on and so forth. If only they could be more rich and powerful, then conspiracy theories might proliferate about poor black people taking over the world too. But in the meantime, perhaps conspiracy theories proliferate mainly due to the fact that people who fancy themselves as members of the ruling class have often "conspired" in the past. So sometimes, it seems like they're still at it. No word yet on the peasants and so forth scheduling some academic meetings to discuss a purely theoretical extermination of all powerful people or how to put sterilizing agents in their drinking water and so forth. But given that Darwin could project his own family's Masonic colonialism onto biology and then read it back out as if it was a scientific theory upon which he could "lamentably" predict that other people would be exterminated, it seems that anything would be possible for a peasant pseudo-scientist too.

Ever notice how "New World Order" oligarchs* or their "philanthropists" like Sanger always want population control and sex education from the bottom of their good little hearts but never seem to want more "gun education" for peasants? Or how about Masonic front men like the Darwins (Galton, etc.) never seeming to want more money spent to educate the poor on how bankers and oligarchs have been creating money out of nothing... and instead telling people that biology and life as they know it was basically all formed based on colonialism and a monetized/capitalist "struggle"?

*
Funny how those "ruling folks" want more folks aborted...

That's not the case all the time. After all, sometimes psychopaths want more infants to send out as their infantry later.

...but in the US they've been trying to overturn Roe v Wade for years. and making a pretty good dent in it.

More theatrics... that probably has to do with the infantry side of the elite of the warfare/welfare state using abortion as a "wedge issue" to suit their interests as psychopaths and moral degenerates again. Think about it this way, Ernst Roehm and Himmler disagreed with each other on homosexuality but it wasn't due to any great moral debate about the nature of civilization and natural law or because one was "pro-life" but the other was trying to look out for the welfare of women because he was nice and gay. Instead it was merely because Roehm was a thug that thought that it made his troops better fighters as a bundle of fasces/sticks and all that. But Himmler thought that it was "unnatural" in the sense that it didn't comport with Darwinian creation myths and the pro-natalist needs of the nation for more infantry. And their disagreement became incorporated in their struggle for power in the abyss of the valley of the shadow of death, given that they were both psychopaths. And that was the extent of it. Because for the psychopaths that tend to rise to the top of any organization or group of people it's not so much about "population control" or abortion or even the money... as it is about total control, i.e. total "tool use."
 
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Oxymoron

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Banned
Your apparent ignorance isn't necessarily my responsibility. You should know more about topics that you're commenting on. It's well known to anyone that takes even a marginal interest in history that the ruling class and scientists that work for them have always been interested in population control and in many cases, depopulation.

What you mean by using Depleted Uranium munitions to promote cancers and birth defects for generation to come... that type of stuff?

US uranium to blame for deformed babies in Fallujah? — RT News
www.rt.com/news/uranium-birth-defects-fallujah-729/ - Proxy - Highlight

Some say it is the cause of horrificbirthdefects and congenital diseases in the Iraqi city. ... Poisonous USweaponsin Iraq kill thousands and mar generations 16.

US weapons cause horrific birth defects in Iraq - World ...
bbs.chinadaily.com.cn/thread-743215-1-1.html - Proxy - Highlight

US weapons cause horrific birth defects in Iraq Fri Apr 13, 2012 11:0PM GMT. Share40. War's cruel legacy continues to unleash itself on the children of Iraq as ...

Horrors of war: US, UK depleted uranium munitions continue to ...
www.beforeitsnews.com/ politics/ 2012/ 10/ horrors-of-war-us-uk-depleted-uranium-munitions-continue-to-cause-bir th-defects-in-iraq-2462618.html - Proxy - Highlight

Some say it is the cause of horrificbirthdefects and congenital diseases in the Iraqi city. ... Poisonous USweaponsin Iraq kill thousands and mar generations.

Legacy of USWeapons-CausedBirthDefects Still Haunts Iraq
english.irib.ir/ voj/ topics/ iraq-over-the-week/ item/ 82379-legacy-of-us-weapons-caused-birth-defects-still-haunts-iraq - Proxy - Highlight

Iraq over the Week; US in ... Legacy of US Weapons-Caused Birth Defects Still Haunts ... used by the U.S. have left Iraqi children with horrific birth defects, ...

Study: Half of Fallujah's Babies Born Deformed, 45% ...
www.morallowground.com/ 2012/ 10/ 16/ study-half-of-fallujahs-babies-born-deformed-45-miscarriage-rate-us-w eapons-to-blame/ - Proxy - Highlight

A recently published study found that half of babies born in Fallujah, Iraq after the US invasion were deformed and 45% of pregnant women miscarried.

The Impacts of Depleted Uranium. Cancer, Birth Defects and ...
www.globalresearch.ca/ the-impacts-of-deplete-uranium-cancer-birth-defects-and-the-children- of-iraq-how-the-bbc-turn-realities-upside/ 5329353 - Proxy - Highlight

Horrific birth defects ... Cancer Spreading In Iraq due to Depleted Uranium Weapons. ... Controversial US Weaponary Used in Iraq: Fallujah Birth Defects, ...

Iraqi Birth Defects Worse than Hiroshima | Dispatches from ...
www.raniakhalek.com/ 2013/ 03/ 20/ u-s-turns-a-blind-eye-to-iraqi-birth-defects-worse-than-hiroshima/ - Proxy - Highlight

The United States may be finished dropping bombs ... Who supplied Saddam weapons during the IRAN/IRAQ war? ... Birth Defects: Iraq & Depleted Uranium vs. Shelton ...

Legacy of US Weapons-Caused Birth Defects Still Haunts Iraq ...
www.commondreams.org/headline/2012/04/13-3 - Proxy - Highlight

War's cruel legacy continues to unleash itself on the children of Iraq as weapons used by the U.S. have left Iraqi children with horrific birth defects, and the ...

Active Denial System
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_Denial_System - Proxy - Highlight

no deleterious effect on birth defects. *the limit of damage was the ... "The decision to recall the weapons back to the US was made by commanders on ... which can cause severe burns in just a few seconds. The beam can be focused

Military Pollution: The Quintessential Universal Soldier
www.commondreams.org/views05/0327-21.htm - Proxy - Highlight

low birth weight, birth defects, kidney disease and cancer. Military ... Pollution from the manufacturing of military weapons is equally horrific. ... Afghanistan and Iraq. In Basra, Iraq, cancer rates have leapt from 11/100,

I expect SR and Cairenn will say it has nothing to do with the U.S and 'Oxy has misread it' :rolleyes:

I expect there will also be denials about the cause of 250,000 U.S servicemen and women suffering from Gulf War Syndrome as well.
 
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SR1419

Senior Member.
Ad hominem arguments are personal by nature. There's no other way to take them. It's not some big reveal.

The nonsense was your argument. I was referring directly to the content of your argument. your opinion- not you. Learn the difference.

Again you revert to the implication my 'feelings are hurt', suggesting that I'm Ill equipped emotionally to handle your superior arguments, another ad hominem attack. There's a very simple way to not make an argument personal. Don't make it personal. You seem to insist on it, even while denying you've done it. I'm not pointing this out to you in the tearful hope you'll stop being so mean, I'm pointing it out to you in the earnest hope you'll stick to engaging the issues.

Nope. I suggested your feelings were hurt because I thought your argument was nonsense...although suggesting it sounding like whining didn't help and I apologized for that.


We aren't discussing economic and military exploitation in general. We're discussing the 'fabled' NWO, as in a system of GLOBAL military and economic dominance. Such a thing was as impossible to ancient man as flight, no matter how much they wanted it. Men could dress up as birds, eat peyote, and leap over a bonfire to feel like they're flying, just as Ancient Pharaohs could build massive monuments and declare themselves masters of the World... but both, whether they knew it or not, were clearly kidding themselves. It wasn't until the technology caught up with the dream that forms of flight were conceived. It's now that technology has caught up with the dream that forms of global dominance can take shape.
Simply put: the desire to dominate the world is clearly not a form of global dominance. Can you acknowledge that?

We are discussing a supposed "new form" of global dominance. Its not a new form, its the same form - military and economic- with new tools- jets instead of chariots- but the essence is the same. Nor is it clear that is even possible today...and those who desire it could be clearly kidding themselves just as much as Genghis Khan was as he conquered most of Eurasia.


Explain to me the difference between full spectrum dominance and your idea of what "global military control" means.

Full Spectrum Dominance means being able to defeat your adversary in any battle- no matter what the venue or type- symmetrical, asymmetrical, air,land, cyber, space etc...across the full spectrum of possible engagements.

Global Military Control means controlling the globe with your military.
 

SR1419

Senior Member.
I expect SR and Cairenn will say it has nothing to do with the U.S and 'Oxy has misread it' :rolleyes:

I expect there will also be denials about the cause of 250,000 U.S servicemen and women suffering from Gulf War Syndrome as well.


Stop with this Oxymoron

[Admin: post edited for politeness]
 
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mynym

Banned
Banned
What you mean by using Depleted Uranium munitions to promote cancers and birth defects for generation to come... that type of stuff?

I think some coincidence theorists may want a memo or something along the lines of: "We are elite conspirators. And we plan to depopulate peasants through a combination of war, starvation, sterilization, mutation, death and destruction. This will save the planet and help life evolve. Order evolving out of chaos and all that. Remember your creation myths, like good peasants. Forward."

Never happen... to begin with, from the perspective of most conspirators they're not being evil and don't see themselves as conspiring. Instead it's probably more just a shared "elite"/geopolitical perspective and they're calculating the interests of multinational corporations and/or powerful factions like AIPAC and so forth.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Depends on what you mean by short lived, as some organizations ruled by almost nothing but psychopaths may last your entire life span. For instance... Maddoff could only push his paper ponzi so far but there seems to be no end in sight for the Fed and the private banking families that own the paradigm of ponzi he operated within as a fellow traveller.

Perhaps you'd like to take that up in a separate thread. Getting a bit off topic here.
 

Pete Tar

Senior Member.
That is the site that YOU posted and that the video seems to point to. I do not watch videos, because of the speed of my computer and my internet and the simple fact that I want some REAL facts and most are high on opinions and low of facts that are verifiable.

And still that is ONE guy's movement, not something being done by the UN or the US. Is there any evidence tying Channon to the NWO or the Illuminati?


I have the book the movie was based on. Both are fun.
 
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Oxymoron

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Banned
Re D.U as a means of mass destruction. The effects were well known.

Just a taster... there is much more on it in the link:

http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/USknowDU.html

And for those who like youtube... this is a very compelling video which sets out first hand evidence from weapons inspectors and Gulf War Vets who tell it how it was.

For those who believe it is not a conspiracy, guess it must be ignorance, clowns or serious coincidences all mashed up.

 

Oxymoron

Banned
Banned
Why are you using a second tier actress, like Roseanne Barr as an expert on war and military? I might listen to her on how to sing badly or on how to scratch an itch on national TV, but not on this subject.
But what if she supported your arguments?

I was unaware that actresses and actors were not allowed 'know stuff', have opinions or to say anything controversial or 'against the grain', until she told me and you just confirmed it :)

And your qualifications to post here were?
 

xenon

Active Member
Never happen... to begin with, from the perspective of most conspirators they're not being evil and don't see themselves as conspiring. Instead it's probably more just a shared "elite"/geopolitical perspective and they're calculating the interests of multinational corporations and/or powerful factions like AIPAC and so forth.

Well Cinnabon was happy that Libyan Socialism was extinguished.

Cinnabon in Tripoli as Libya Opens Up to Foreign Business
Bloomberg Businessweek December 13, 2012

After 42 years, the country formerly known as the Great Socialist People’s Libyan Arab Jamahiriya is getting its first taste of consumer capitalism in an unlikely form: sweet, sticky cinnamon rolls. Cinnabon, the Atlanta-based bakery chain, is at the vanguard of a potential business boom in the North African country, which deposed dictator Muammar Qaddafi last year in a bloody civil war. In July the unit of Focus Brands became the first U.S. franchise to open since the revolution, with a two-level Tripoli outlet. It’s become a popular destination in a city with few diversions for residents.



Cinnabon’s bet on Libya—it plans to open at least 10 new locations over the next five years—shows the perils and potential of this wealthy new consumer market, which is being eyed by a growing number of foreign companies. Yes, Libya has a rickety electricity grid and few formal property rights. And due to ongoing sectarian violence, it remains a dangerous place. But the country sits atop Africa’s biggest oil reserves, which may generate as much as $55 billion for the state oil company this year. That means there are plenty of well-off locals and expats who can afford to pay for a Western-style sweet...
------------snipped---------------
http://www.businessweek.com/article...tripoli-as-libya-opens-up-to-foreign-business

I'll bet the citizens of Libya were ever so happy to finally have "sweet sticky cinnamon rolls"

Hillary thought it was funny

(that's the "Chief Diplomat" of the "World's Greatest Superpower")

This is the real reason for these wars.

A 13 year old article was terribly prescient. There are a few missed predictions but the essence holds up remarkably well over time.

Backing up Globalization with Military Might
New World Order Onslaught by Karen Talbot Covert Action Quarterly, Issue 68, Fall 1999
http://www.globalissues.org/article/448/backing-up-globalization-with-military-might

McDonald's Needs McDonnell Douglas to Flourish

An article by Thomas Friedman in the New York Times entitled "What the World Needs Now" tells it all. Illustrated by an American Flag on a fist it said, among other things: "For globalism to work, America can't be afraid to act like the almighty superpower that it is....The hidden hand of the market will never work without a hidden fist-McDonald's cannot flourish without McDonnell Douglas, the designer of the F-15. And the hidden fist that keeps the world safe for Silicon Valley's technologies is called the United States Army, Air Force, Navy and Marine Corps."

Corporations will stop at nothing

To achieve maximum profits these transnationals will stop at nothing. After all, they are non-human institutions that must expand through ever-greater profits, or go out of business. In so doing they have shown willingness to violate human rights-particularly workers' rights—to throw millions out of work, eliminate unions, use sweat-shops and slave labor, destroy the environment, destabilize governments, install or bolster tyrants who oppress, repress, torture and kill with impunity.
-----------snip----------
Much more...​

In fact, those who read that article will know exactly what the motive of these wars is.

And that article details why Syria is called "A Cancer affecting the region" by those who want to spread the almighty Western Capitalism by force

Here's an explanation of the Syrian "Conflict" that you won't hear on ABC or the BBC


History will note that many people didn't care enough to fully inform themselves. That isn't exactly new, either.
 
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SR1419

Senior Member.
Just a taster... there is much more on it in the link:

Of course, keep in mind that the person who wrote that material- Leuren Moret- also claims that the Fukishima disaster was false flag event done by HAARP and designed to depopulate the planet.

http://www.ufodigest.com/article/leuren-moret-fukushima-haarp-nuclear-attack-cia-doe-bp-london-banks


 

Oxymoron

Banned
Banned
Here's an explanation of the Syrian "Conflict" that you won't hear on ABC or the BBC


History will note that many people didn't care enough to fully inform themselves. That isn't exactly new, either.

Lol... She's a feisty one

 

Oxymoron

Banned
Banned
Of course, keep in mind that the person who wrote that material- Leuren Moret- also claims that the Fukishima disaster was false flag event done by HAARP and designed to depopulate the planet.

[/ex]

But she didn't write the reports, (I am guessing her name is on the top because she compiled/collated the reports), but clearly she didn't write the actual reports.
 

JRBids

Senior Member.
Your apparent ignorance isn't necessarily my responsibility. You should know more about topics that you're commenting on. It's well known to anyone that takes even a marginal interest in history that the ruling class and scientists that work for them have always been interested in population control and in many cases, depopulation.

Please let's have some proof of your claim that they are promoting abortion for depopulation.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Multiple topics within one thread are a waste of time. please try to keep to a single topic in a tread.

Request a thread split by reporting the first post in the thread that forms the new topic.

Please also report posts that seem to be in the wrong thread.

This thread is closed. If you want to continue the discussion, then start a new, more specific thread.
 
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