"An Unconventional Shade of Grey" - Michael J. Murphy new Film

Hama Neggs

Senior Member.
But for many they've skipped that part and moved on to *knowing* they're right. Lot's have already decided the proof is undeniable and there is no logical argument to be had establishing whether it's happening or not.

Yes, it's gone to: "You're either stupid or a troll" from a lot of them, because they feel they have SOOO much evidence on their side. Funny.. that's exactly how we feel about a lot of them. ;)
 

mrfintoil

Senior Member.
So Murphy didn't manage to come up with any positive samples..? Is he letting this experimet fade out with history in hopes no one will ask about it?
 

skephu

Senior Member.
So Murphy didn't manage to come up with any positive samples..? Is he letting this experimet fade out with history in hopes no one will ask about it?
No, he did talk about his testing in the radio interview, but apparently it is still going on, he didn't mention any results but indicated that he expects decisive proof of the spraying.
 

mrfintoil

Senior Member.
No, he did talk about his testing in the radio interview, but apparently it is still going on, he didn't mention any results but indicated that he expects decisive proof of the spraying.

Well let's hope he'll present some kind of result at least. From an objective point of view "expecting to find" doesn't sound that promising. It makes me expect some kind of distorted interpretation of the results just to maintain the illusion of conspiracy, similar to how rain samples are interpreted in an overly exaggerated manner.

Or will Murphy have the guts to admit that they found nothing? Or maybe claim a sampled trail to be "faked by them" as a decoy. This is just speculation on my part.

I'm keen on a conclusive result regardless of positive or negative.
 

Balance

Senior Member.
First he says he has proof the planet is colli


Since he's using an aircraft that can't reach the altitude of the trails, that would be a difficult claim to push.

But it can sample from ships and he mentions intent to do so. Either way, they're moot points I think. These are all just carrots dangled and the donkeys relenlessly follow. Delivering the promise (court-admissable evidence) is open to interpretation and going by the standards of evidence accepted by the herd of donkeys, my guess it won't be much of a legal argument at all. Who was it that said all publicity is good publicity?
 

Trailblazer

Moderator
Staff member
Murphy has just published a "letter to activists" ahead of the climate conference in Paris next month. http://wp.coalitionagainstgeoengine...agreement-and-the-coming-carbon-dictatorship/

This part is worth highlighting:

A global climate agreement that will most likely legalize geoengineering is expected to be signed in Paris, France in December of 2015. After signing, we are looking at a planned five-year implementation schedule.” – Michael J Murphy.
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Hasn't Murphy been telling anyone who would listen that geoengineering has been implemented for years?
 

keefe

Active Member
First he says he has proof the planet is colli


Since he's using an aircraft that can't reach the altitude of the trails, that would be a difficult claim to push.
Just saw this today https://chemtrailsnorthnz.wordpress...l-air-test-planned-to-examine-geoengineering/
The Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) will be granting waivers to allow two pilots to surpass the current Guinness altitude record in a powered para gliding aircraft of 24,898 feet. With State of the art air monitoring equipment, the two pilots will be flying into the chem trails at around 30,000 feet above sea level, battling winds in excess of 100 miles per hour and temperatures around -70 degrees Fahrenheit. The two pilots will be collecting air samples and data never before seen.
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Spectrar Ghost

Senior Member.
Just saw this today https://chemtrailsnorthnz.wordpress...l-air-test-planned-to-examine-geoengineering/
The Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) will be granting waivers to allow two pilots to surpass the current Guinness altitude record in a powered para gliding aircraft of 24,898 feet. With State of the art air monitoring equipment, the two pilots will be flying into the chem trails at around 30,000 feet above sea level, battling winds in excess of 100 miles per hour and temperatures around -70 degrees Fahrenheit. The two pilots will be collecting air samples and data never before seen.
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And exposing themselves to toxic... Something... By flying an unpressurized aircraft into a trail of something that can be smelled by Pat Roddie after dispersing and falling for 30kft.
 

Ray Von Geezer

Senior Member.
Just saw this today https://chemtrailsnorthnz.wordpress...l-air-test-planned-to-examine-geoengineering/
The Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) will be granting waivers to allow two pilots to surpass the current Guinness altitude record in a powered para gliding aircraft of 24,898 feet. With State of the art air monitoring equipment, the two pilots will be flying into the chem trails at around 30,000 feet above sea level, battling winds in excess of 100 miles per hour and temperatures around -70 degrees Fahrenheit. The two pilots will be collecting air samples and data never before seen.
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Can anyone find any mention anywhere of the guy named as one of the pilots, "Enzo Pagani"? Might be mis-spelled I guess. His parents look like they might be Italian sportscar fans.

Ray Von
 

Spectrar Ghost

Senior Member.
One of the signs of a CT is you can identify different personalities based on their particular, and sometimes mutually contradictory, beliefs.
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
Just saw this today https://chemtrailsnorthnz.wordpress...l-air-test-planned-to-examine-geoengineering/
The Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) will be granting waivers to allow two pilots to surpass the current Guinness altitude record in a powered para gliding aircraft of 24,898 feet. With State of the art air monitoring equipment, the two pilots will be flying into the chem trails at around 30,000 feet above sea level, battling winds in excess of 100 miles per hour and temperatures around -70 degrees Fahrenheit. The two pilots will be collecting air samples and data never before seen.
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i cant find what an "e pilot" is. do you know?

and why are they waiting for Spring, arent there more contrails in winter?
 

Auldy

Senior Member.
I wonder if Murphy et al know this guys shady back story, or if they are being conned by him.
 

Auldy

Senior Member.
Surely, if they knew his backstory, they wouldn't pursue his services in case it brought what they are trying to do into disrepute, right?



Reading that sentence back to myself, I realise, of course they would.
 

Dan Page

Senior Member.
No, it's him. Salvatore Pane, convicted of mortgage fraud, then got into the crime scene cleanup business, and changed his name to Enzo Pagani.
https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/1371305-sal-pane-name-change.html

He's probably just doing it as a publicity thing.
After reading the Buzzfeed article and the name change, I have to conclude (among other things) that he is a pathological lier. After googling his new name I find two possibilities, a lawyer in Buenos Aires with the same name that kinda looks like Pane, or Pane is a sports car fan and took the names of race cars, Ferrari Enzo and Pegani Zonda. One wonders if he has ANY experience flying a powered paraglider. There a few problems he will encounter in an attempt to get to 30000 ft.
1. Paragliders are VERY sensitive to the wind and turbulence, both of which will likely increase the higher he goes.
2. He will need to carry an oxygen tank (extra weight), and start using it once above about 10000 ft.
3. He will need to carry a LOT of fuel (more weight), likely 5 times (or more) what a paraglider normally carries.
4. The paraglider will have to be equipped with some kind of air sampling/retrieval unit (more weight).
5. He will have to be dressed for temps in the -40 to -60F range (more weight).
6. He will need to aim for a contrail, which by the time he gets up to it, will quite possibly have dissipated, or moved away from him.
7. I have a hard time believing that the FAA will give him a waiver for this, if they do, it will likely stipulate some specific airspace that he will have to remain within. He may also be required to carry a radio and a transponder (more weight) as he will be in controlled airspace above 17999 ft, and will have to be in contact with air traffic control.
8. The previous record being nearly 25000 ft, is pretty amazing, but getting another 5000 ft (20%) higher is a whole other task as the air gets pretty thin up there. How much lift will there be? How much thrust from the NORMALLY ASPIRATED engine? Will the engine even run at 30000 ft?

I am quite sure that this attempt will NOT happen, due to the reasons stated above.
 

Hama Neggs

Senior Member.
And exposing themselves to toxic... Something... By flying an unpressurized aircraft into a trail of something that can be smelled by Pat Roddie after dispersing and falling for 30kft.

So Roddie says he can smell them too? I thought that was just Russ Tanner's thing. Tanner says he can smell them after only 20 min. I assume those guys have to carry oxygen. How much gear CAN they carry on those rigs?

PS: Thanks for the info, Dan Page.
 
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Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
NCSCA responds
https://www.facebook.com/ncsca2014/posts/655766261230045
https://archive.is/HMS5R
National Crime Scene Cleanup Association The reason why NCSCA is involved is because it involves hazardous materials potentially. The Association was one of the most qualified for the job also the reason why planes are not being used is because with internal gas combustion engines they will be creating carbon and other potentially discrediting variables in the testing the powered paragliders will be flying up upon reaching the chemtrails their engines will be turned off recorded by three separate cameras and they will hover around gliding collecting data that will be 100% unadultered by any variables such as leaded gas jet engines carbon admissions and hundreds of other materials that jets may have.
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Spectrar Ghost

Senior Member.
If they're worried about IC engine exhaust fouling the readings, what are the gliders using? They can't be carrying enough batteries to get to 30kft, can they?
 

SR1419

Senior Member.
Do they know there are planes specifically designed to do what it it they are attempting to do?

This is starting to turn into a comedy...hopefully not a tragic one.
 

Dan Page

Senior Member.
NCSCA responds
https://www.facebook.com/ncsca2014/posts/655766261230045
https://archive.is/HMS5R
National Crime Scene Cleanup Association The reason why NCSCA is involved is because it involves hazardous materials potentially. The Association was one of the most qualified for the job also the reason why planes are not being used is because with internal gas combustion engines they will be creating carbon and other potentially discrediting variables in the testing the powered paragliders will be flying up upon reaching the chemtrails their engines will be turned off recorded by three separate cameras and they will hover around gliding collecting data that will be 100% unadultered by any variables such as leaded gas jet engines carbon admissions and hundreds of other materials that jets may have.
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That's just ridiculous, once they shut the engine off (if it will even run at 30000 ft), it will drop rapidly. They are not going to be "hovering" around, that's just not possible at that altitude. Maybe if it was a super-efficient glider, in the most perfect conditions, it may be able to stay at altitude for a bit. And I would like to add another reason this won't happen:
9. Getting to say 15000 ft could happen fairly quickly, I would say within 90 minutes, but after that it's going to be slow going, to get from 15000 to 30000 ft (if it can even be done at all) will take in the order of 4-5 hours!

Is there any info on the previous record, what they were using for an engine, and how long it took, oxygen etc?
 

Trailblazer

Moderator
Staff member
Is there any info on the previous record, what they were using for an engine, and how long it took, oxygen etc?


According to this, the altitude record is 29,494 feet, not 24,898 feet as they claim.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6666889.stm


A British Everest summiteer has become the first man to fly higher than the top of the world in a powered paraglider.

Bear Grylls, who at the age of 23 became the youngest British climber to scale Mount Everest in 1998, achieved a feat that had been deemed impossible by many critics prior to the mission.

On 14 May 2007, Grylls and his fellow pilot and inventor of the parajet engine, Giles Cardozo, took off from the small Himalayan village of Pheriche, which lies at an altitude of 4,400m (14,435ft) about 20 miles (32km) south of Mount Everest in eastern Nepal.

For their amazing adventure the two pilots chose the main Himalayan climbing season, which is currently seeing more than 100 expeditions on both the north and south sides of Mount Everest.


However, Grylls, who reached the top of the world on 26 May 1998 and has lived through many other adventures, said the challenges of flying a paraglider at such a high altitude were different from mountaineering.

"The propeller, oxygen bottle and all the other equipment strapped to my back weighed more than 120kg (264lbs). It took me three attempts to get off the ground but when I was finally in the air, I noticed the crowd of people sitting on the ridge clapping and cheering," Grylls said on his return to Kathmandu.

Grylls and Cardozo flew successfully to 8,535m (28,001ft) when a fault in Cardozo's engine forced him to abort only 300m (984ft) below the summit. Grylls continued to ascend until he reached 8,990m (29,494ft) at 0933 local time.

After having waited for about two hours for the launch, which kept on being delayed due to technical difficulties, the Sherpas and employees of GKN, the UK-based technology company that sponsored the Everest mission, had started having their doubts whether this ambitious adventure would actually get off the ground.

"I thought they had a 30% chance at best as it meant getting all the equipment to the mountain at the right time and being lucky with the weather. They only had a three-day weather window, which is very tight," said Andy Elson, British adventure engineer and first man to fly over Mount Everest in a balloon in 1991.
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So they only actually gained about 15,000ft from their starting point, one of the two engines failed, and they had to carry over 260lb of kit.
 

Dan Page

Senior Member.
So, a specially designed jet engine, and likely a specially designed parasail. They took off at nearly 15000 ft, and may have had topographic updrafts to help them climb. And they spent time acclimatizing to the high altitude. Is Pegani going to be doing all this, I doubt it.



"It felt weird just hanging off a few strings with an engine on your back that produces more power than a truck. It was an incredible experience to be up there and to look down at all these mountains. But I don't think we will ever do this again and I doubt that anybody else will either," Cardozo said.






e175a372082ed56fc6020372d68f3cea.jpg
Giles and Bear celebrate their epic flight


Prior to their mission both pilots and their 14-member strong team had to go through the regular acclimatisation process, which is necessary to survive at high altitude. The team and 3,000 kg of technical and filming equipment flew to Namche Bazaar, the colourful Sherpa capital that lies at an altitude of 3,400m (11,154ft).
 
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