New "black chemtrail" video

deirdre

Senior Member.
seems the iphone (4?) does have hdr feature for videos. not sure if that would give you that grey a contrail as in the video. hdr does make pure white (plane) whiter. we cant tell of course from this video clip as we don't know the real life cloud color. (pretty soon we'll never know whats real with all this new technology). http://vimeo.com/66859682
 

Mark Barrington

Active Member
HDR works by taking more than one exposure (typically 2) and digitally combining them to give an extended dynamic range. As you can see in the example above, you can see more detail in the shadows, and also the highlights are less overexposed. It's an attempt to compensate for the fact that the dynamic contrast range available in a CCD sensor is much much less than the contrast range of conventional silver-based film. Human eyes in good condition have a much greater dynamic range than either, but extending it to that range requires a lot more exposures and makes the photograph look even more unreal-looking to eyes that are used to looking at photographs. Party because the monitor or printing medium cannot render the same contrast range as the original scene, and compressing it into that range just looks compressed and fake.

Sorry if this is all too basic for the audience.
 

Pete Tar

Senior Member.
So is there anything to be determined about time of day and sun angle from horizon in the original video, given that the second picture isn't the anomaly it appears to be?

Sorry if this is all too basic for the audience.

Not at all. The more basic explanation the better.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
I missed this from the YouTube discussion:


 
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captfitch

Senior Member.
Well, all that exposure and HDR and levels stuff is well and good but in real life it looks black. And no, I can't take a pic as I work in the sim now mostly. I feel like a chemtrail believer right now. I don't know the explanation for it but I've seen it with my own eyes.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Well, all that exposure and HDR and levels stuff is well and good but in real life it looks black. And no, I can't take a pic as I work in the sim now mostly. I feel like a chemtrail believer right now. I don't know the explanation for it but I've seen it with my own eyes.

Which one of these do you think would be closer to what would be seen in reality?
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
Well, all that exposure and HDR and levels stuff is well and good but in real life it looks black. And no, I can't take a pic as I work in the sim now mostly. I feel like a chemtrail believer right now. I don't know the explanation for it but I've seen it with my own eyes.
it looks black even if the plane is full white?
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
it looks black even if the plane is full white?
Darkness is very relative in visual perception. For example here the squares marked A and B are exactly the same color and brightness.


So light grey might be perceived as dark grey, or even black.

Even in the high contrast image, it's not really black, more a dark grey. There it is with a solid black area underneath


But you naturally think of this as being created by black particles, like soot, so you think of it as black,
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
Darkness is very relative in visual perception. For example here the squares marked A and B are exactly the same color and brightness.


So light grey might be perceived as dark grey, or even black.

Even in the high contrast image, it's not really black, more a dark grey. There it is with a solid black area underneath


But you naturally think of this as being created by black particles, like soot, so you think of it as black,

: ) except B is in shadow. I guess it doesn't matter, its not like they would tint a chemtrail black (or grey) and be so obvious about it. Besides, the video poster obviously lived, despite being seen photographing it!
 

Ross Marsden

Senior Member.
: ) except B is in shadow. I guess it doesn't matter, its not like they would tint a chemtrail black (or grey) and be so obvious about it. Besides, the video poster obviously lived, despite being seen photographing it!

Yeah, but:

The image on the right is the same image but two stripes (the same shade/brightness as A and B) have been added.

It's amazing(?)
 

captfitch

Senior Member.
Which one of these do you think would be closer to what would be seen in reality?
The one on the left. Full sun. In my mind the most common condition must be the other aircraft is between the sun and my position and the sun must be low and the other plane must be below me. And I want to say you have to view the contrail head on, or close to head on. I. E., the plane has to be pointed right at you or nearly so. There is some sort of process where the light is changed and some high contrast is there or something. Black!! Not gray, no shadows, black! I seen it with mine own eyes!
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
The one on the left. Full sun. In my mind the most common condition must be the other aircraft is between the sun and my position and the sun must be low and the other plane must be below me. And I want to say you have to view the contrail head on, or close to head on. I. E., the plane has to be pointed right at you or nearly so. There is some sort of process where the light is changed and some high contrast is there or something. Black!! Not gray, no shadows, black! I seen it with mine own eyes!

I don't think anyone is doubting what you say. I'm just trying to nail down the specifics.

Here thought the contrails is viewed side on.

Viewed head on (or tail on) the optical density of the contrail would be very high, making a light grey contrail be much darker, as less of the background would show though.
 
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captfitch

Senior Member.
Yes, density makes sense. I don't think I've seen a video or picture that captures what I've (we've) seen. I can't recall seeing a "black" contrail from the side. Maybe justan has. I know I've never seen one from far away or from over my position that I can think of. So it must be a combination of density and contrast and one more light property that involves angles and something.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Update from Muzza Pratt, the creator of the video:
 
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deirdre

Senior Member.
Update from Muzza Pratt, the creator of the video:

Firstly, the trail was not in a shadow of any kind and was extremely long. As they headed due north away from us I could see more and more of the trail all be it further away. I never saw the end as I was restricted by the starboard wing but would estimate the trail being well over 5 kilometers in length and all the same colour when the distance between us was to great to see any detail of significance.

.[/ex]
huh. well at least it wasn't at 10:28, that would have been freaky. we would have had to switch this convo to supernatural phenomenon!

can the plane guys here track down the plane from the info the video guy gave?

did you direct him to your contrail site, he's still referring to them as chemtrails. if you google 'dirty exhaust' 'engine trouble' type searches, its perfectly reasonable to think its bad gas, or blown rings? unless an expert tells you the plane couldn't fly. or do all guys know that innately?
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Update from Muzza via email
HD Photo:
https://www.metabunk.org/sk/1DSCF0747.JPG

Close up:


This identifies the plane as Emirates Airline, possibly a 777
 

Balance

Senior Member.
I'm no engineer except it looks like uncombusted fuel where the air/fuel ratio is oxygen rare. I would have thought the engines on that airliner wouldn't have lasted long as the turbine blades coated up.

I've only ever seen that dark exhaust from B-52's at Miledenhall.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Closer up:


The gap between the left engine and the darkness of the trail could indicate any of:

A) It's an oddly lit contrail, so the gap is a normal contrail gap
B) The left engine is pumping out black smoke, but the bright fuselage blows it out
C) The right engine is puming out black smoke, so it becomes visible behind and under the fuselage

It's quite hard to say for sure. Now A (contrails) seems the simplest explanation, and this is supported somewhat by the right contrail seeming possibly be staggered back at the same angle as the wings. But unfortunately detail is lacking.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Remember it looked rather different in the video:

Which lends considerable weight to the contrail explanation.
 

Balance

Senior Member.
Yes, without any evidence whatsoever, I'm inclined to believe it's a problem of photography not representing true contrasts/colours and that it's a normal contrail.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Thinking about the science behind a contrail being so dark when viewed from the side. Looking at the video frame above.

It's hazy. The landscape and background are a long way off. Most of the light reaching the eye is is diffuse haze light, and not reflected light.

This haze light is relatively bright.

The contrail is facing roughly away from the sun (flying about north west), so it self-shadows itself to some degree, but most importantly it's blocking the haze light.

The plane is solid white, and above the contrail, so it's a lot brighter. There is very little haze between the plane and the camera, but many miles of haze behind it.

The polarizing filter on the photo makes this all look way more dramatic than it actually was.

Basically it's kind on an optical illusion. Here's a white plane leaving irrefutable contrails:


Nice blue sky, because there is no haze. But even here look at the brightness of the contrails, and the brightness of the plane.

The difficult thing here the three dimensional volumetric nature of the air, and the way it affects the light.
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
Thinking about the science behind a contrail being so dark when viewed from the side. Looking at the video frame above.

It's hazy. The landscape and background are a long way off. Most of the light reaching the eye is is diffuse haze light, and not reflected light.

This haze light is relatively bright.

The contrail is facing roughly away from the sun (flying about north west), so it self-shadows itself to some degree, but most importantly it's blocking the haze light.

The plane is solid white, and above the contrail, so it's a lot brighter. There is very little haze between the plane and the camera, but many miles of haze behind it.

The polarizing filter on the photo makes this all look way more dramatic than it actually was.

Basically it's kind on an optical illusion. Here's a white plane leaving irrefutable contrails:


Nice blue sky, because there is no haze. But even here look at the brightness of the contrails, and the brightness of the plane.

The difficult thing here the three dimensional volumetric nature of the air, and the way it affects the light.
but can the illusion be so strong with the naked eye?
 

Alhazred The Sane

Senior Member.
Mick why are you placing an argument? It's technology. I has no replacement for the human eye. Your comment is weird.

I'm sorry if you're serious.

Given your prowess with technology you should be able to determine if this jet was having trouble...
I understand why Mick questioned your post. It's not sufficient to simply tell folk that you've lots of experience, have seen it loads of times, and it's just normal. It looks weird enough to deserve a proper explanation.
 

TEEJ

Senior Member.
From an article in 1962. Taken from The Sixth Seat. Riding on a Victor Training Sortie by Humphrey Wynn

Vulcan = Avro Vulcan

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avro_Vulcan

http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1962/1962 - 0248.html

http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1962/1962 - 0245.html
 
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