What does Greenpeace think about chemtrails?

Critical Thinker

Senior Member.
http://thenextbigblog.wordpress.com...-not-real-they-are-just-contrails-greenpeace/


“Chemtrails are not real, they are just contrails”….GREENPEACE???

By lehasardnexistepas
Hello my friends,
here are the ” Greenpeace transcripts” !
Once aware to the program of chemtrailing I started to investigate, to learn all I could about chemtrails. I then developed the need to share with people. I talked with friends and started to realise how uncomfortable an issue this would be. There was a big transition in my social skills as I was stone-walled and experienced a lot of denial. Why not, it’s harsh news. I did not want to be a greek messenger of doom and be held responsible. A local man, with whom I had heated almost confrontational talks with, had later told me he had contacted Greenpeace ( as if they were a dependable source). He had said “ I might find it interesting and would forward their response to his query on chemtrails.”
He did not forward Greenpeace’s response but I was intrigued and so I emailed an inquiry as to their understanding of ” Chemtrails” and what action were they taking?
This is my first point of contact with Greenpeace, a European based international activist group, gaining noterity for they exploits hampering the Japanese whaling fleet over the years.
> > Sent: 26 July 2012 09:01
> > To: info UK
> > Subject: Form submission from: General Information
> > Submitted on Thursday, 26 July, 2012 – 09:01

> > I have a very large dossier on the largest clandestine world wide chemical aerosol program that is the biggest threat to mankind, birds, animals, crops and sea life. The program is commonly known as ” chemtrails” amongst the million of protesters world wide. I have a you tube channel “mrmaxbliss” please have a look. This massive world wide program has a lot of international support from governments although unofficially. It is used in conjunction with Haarps to create weather modification and climate change hoax. The air temperature at the poles is still below-30 but the ice is melting because the powers that be are using Haarps and similar programs to shift the poles- which will be catastrophic but of course they are prepared.
> > There obviously is a lot more informations to be exposed so please look at
> > my you tube channel ” mrmaxbliss” as time is running out.
> > I assume that your organisation is closely monitored by the governements and other agencies, simply because you guys have the abilities to gleen these widely exposed facts and do very little. WHAT THE HELL sheeple, find out the facts and fast, I have used verifiable facts where possible. Many people have already died trying to expose this, now if you are human and are really concerned about the planet and all of it residents I hope to provoke some action.
> > If you don’t respond to this appeal, I will assume you have been instructed not to. If you do reply with a fob off, think again, look at some facts and grow a real conscious as what is going on is truely the worst threat on mass genocide levels.
> > Ask your self why Mosanto has applied for many patents for developing aluminum resistant crops…..Aluminum is one of the metals used in the nano-particles in the sprays we see world wide, many soil and water and blood samples show over 60 times the accepted safe levels.
> > If some of you are genuine but are not able to act, find a way to help any way.
> > I would hope some of you are .
Yours Sincerely and Hopefully
> > Max Bliss
> > you tube “mrmaxbliss” have a look and see.
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> On 26/07/2012 at 13:48, info UK wrote:
>
Hello Max,
> > Thank you for this email. I have investigated chemtrails quite thoroughly over the last ten years, and concluded that there is no evidence to support their existence. Please note that photographs of contrails are not evidence of chemtrails.
> HAARP does exist, but again, there is no evidence whatsoever that it does what you think it does.
> > If you would like to persuade me and Greenpeace otherwise, then the first thing you will need to do is to explain why the science of climate change is a hoax. Please bear in mind that the science was developed in the nineteenth century, initially by Joseph Fourrier in 1824, then by John Tyndall, and then, moist significantly, by Svante Arrhenius, a Swedish chemist and Nobel prize winner, who predicted our current problems highly accurately in 1896.
> > We’re not interested in the shadowy conspiracies which motivated these Victorian scientists to falsify their work, we’re interested in the falsifications themselves. Send us precise details of where Fourrier, Tyndall and Arrhenius went wrong, exactly where the errors in their theories occur, and then we’ll talk about chemtrails.
> > In fact, just disproving Arrhenius would be enough. Here’s the relevant paper -
http://www.rsc.org/images/Arrhenius1896_tcm18-173546.pdf
> > Regards,
> > Graham Thompson
> > Supporter Services
> > Greenpeace UK
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From: Max Bliss
Sent: 01 August 2012 07:15
To: info UK
Subject: RE: Form submission from: General Information
Hello Graham,
thank you for your response. I am disappointed but not surprised with the content. Sadly it is clear that you or your organisation has deteriorated into a government propaganda organisation. Clearly you did not look at my you tube channel mrmaxbliss, where I have video clearly demonstrating the chemtrails being turned on and off. You do not need to be a hallowed scientist to explain the fundamentals of thermal dynamics to see exactly what is happening.
I keep records and archive messages. You and your organisation will be exposed and the old ladies paying into feeling good contributing to something worthwhile will find out what a sham greenpeace has become.
If you have anyone you love or care about and a future is something that is important, beware United Nations Agenda 21, involves large scale de-population. Chemtrails are part of a sophisticated weather control program but it is also used for delivery of toxic elements. Samples of snow, and waster, earth and blood consisently show hazardous to life excessive quantities of Aluminum, Barium, Strontium and other pathogens. There is lots of evidence and documents pertaining to the facts and you looked into for 10 years. What is your capacity or expertise (MI5/6)?
I urge you to think about the actual facts available and if you love anyone, question your motives on denial. Grow some responsibility and shake off your orders and join the rest of the true activists.
I have a myriad of evidence, but summed up in the following link is something for you to think about. By covering up this huge crime of weather manipulation you have the blood of over 500,000 people on your hands too, as we all do until we hold those responsible to account.
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—– Original Message —–
From: info UK
Sent: 08/01/12 10:53 AM
To: Max Bliss
Subject: RE: Form submission from: General Information
So, any luck with that Arrhenius paper?
Graham Thompson
Supporter Services
Greenpeace UK
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______________________________________________________________________________________________
> —–Original Message—–
From: Max.Bliss

> Sent: 01 August 2012 16:19
> To: info UK
Subject: Re: RE: Form submission from: General Information
> http://www.lightwatcher.com/chemtrails/special_report_pp1.html
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______________________________________________________________________________________________
—– Original Message —–
From: info UK
Sent: 08/02/12 12:12 PM
To: Max Bliss

Subject: RE: RE: Form submission from: General Information
Hello Max, You can contact the CIA directly via this page –https://www.cia.gov/contact-cia/index.html Of course, I’m assuming you really do believe that Greenpeace are part of a sinister government conspiracy, and you’re not just wasting our time.
Regards,
Graham Thompson
Supporter Services Greenpeace UK
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—–Original Message—– From: Max.Bliss
Sent: 02 August 2012 14:22
Hello Graham,
I am confused why you have sent me a link to contact the CIA ? Why not simply view my captured evidence of a chemtrail being turned off. The use of thermal dynamics and contrails explanations falls flat. I have lots of verifiable facts that you can easily refer to and verify. Why the resistance and CIA retort? You are not helping to convince anyone here of Greenpeace’s integrity with your replies. Why not pick up the gauntlet, look over the evidence and use your tens years of investigation to explain what you see? It will only take you a few minutes. I am certain the CIA amongst others are already aware of my efforts. The world is in trouble, once the axis of evil nations are conquered the banks of the world will be under control. Cash will be eradicated , electric money and then total control implemented. You will never protest anything again. I have docs. Facts are out there. Chemtrails is part of a program to modify (weaponised) weather and also part of a stage of depopulation ( UN Agenda 21). Do you have family or friends that you love? Are you thinking the world is ok? It’s heading toward total control. In Obama care legislation they want to introduce chipping newborns. It’s only a matter of time. I have facts on all issues, but chemtrails is world wide but interesting not everywhere, work together on this and save your loved ones. Good luck with the facts and waking up. Only with a critical mass of participants can we free people from the conditioning. I bet you do consider yourself to be a good person, it wont take long to see the facts and think about what’s really going on. Don’t be frightened and held back, think for a while ,you are needed for the greater good of earthlings, not the global elite.
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________________________________________________________________________________________________
—– Original Message —–
From: info UK
Sent: 08/02/12 03:39 PM
To: Max.Bliss
Hello again Max, So you don’t think Greenpeace are part of a sinister government conspiracy? Or, you don’t if we agree with you, but you will if we don’t? Hmmm. Unfortunately, the problem here is less that you believe in something which I have spent a few dozen hours investigating and found to be fake, and more that you think something which I have spent many thousands of hours investigating, climate change, is a hoax. That, to me, means that your judgement is not just unreliable, but a reliable guide to being wrong, and your idea of ‘evidence’ clearly isn’t the traditional, scientific view of ‘evidence’. But you can prove me wrong by showing where Arrhenius was wrong. If, that is, you’d like to prove me wrong. Or we can go on campaigning on climate change, and you can go on campaigning on chemtrails, with both of us thinking the other has been taken in by a hoax, and I’m perfectly happy with that outcome.
Regards,
Graham Thompson
Supporter Services Greenpeace UK
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From: Max Bliss
Sent: 02 August 2012 22:22
To: info UK
Hello again Graham,
we seem to be getting knotted up here or you are being evasive and blocking direct and simole evidence, hmm. You should know that these emails not only are archived but will be published to allow the public to assess the legitamcy of you as a individual and the organisation you represent. I am not pulling any punches, I am letting you realize your situation. You have not yet made commentary on the clear evidence of a chemtrail being switched off. If it was a persistent contrail, where exactly does the law of thermal dynamics allow for vapour or condensation trails to just stop Turn off) mid flight?
Climate change is definately occurring but not for the stated reasons at all. Nasa has documented that we now have 20% less sunlight due to increased cloud cover produced from commercial airlines. Climate change is occuring because when the fragile ionasphere is heated by HAARP it swells and distorts, the stratasphere fills the void created and the jet stream is re-routed thus causing climate change. Hurricanes such as that demonstration of a deniable weapon on the south coast of the UK in Oct 1987 (Michael Fish), the Fierce destructive storm of France in 1999, Kattrina, Tusanmis of the Malacla straights, Malaysia even had UK, French and US warships assisting the next day with food supplies and emergancy equipment, just as the Earthquake in Haiti with a massive US Naval exercise ready to help immediately. HAARP and facilities in Dubai, Puerto Rico Suri(Russia) , North Australia and other facilties in conjunction with GWEN towers are allowing the US led coalition weaponise the weather.
Companies like Monsanto are making massive profits from their patented aluminium resistent crops. Aluminium being present in large quantities in the chemical sprays used by NATO, UN and co-opted commercial airlines. The nano particles sprayed in the thousands of tons of chemicals dumped in our atmoshere daily. Samples can be taken from snow ( Virgin water from the sky), soil, food, animal blood etc and are consistently demonstrating excessive higher than natural levels of Aluminium, Barium and Strontium.
I have invited you to comment on the visual evidence of chemtrails being turned off, I believe the video is just 3mins but conclusive. You have blocked and evaded, why? Your email responses have taken you longer to compose.
Climate change is apparent but not for the official stated reasons as many, many scientists also concur. There is a mass deception going on, partly to cripple different nations food production, (food as a weapon-Henry Kisseger) and partly to raise the costs of food world wide as we are plunged into an economic crisis and its easy to manipulate the public under these conditions.
Chemtrails are no longer a conspiracy theory and I have various references from the US, British and German governments admittingat times to chemspraying and a program of geo-engineering. Clearly your dozens of hours over the last tens years must need to be updated or you are not very good at your investigations. Geo-engineering using Barium to absorb radiation and aluminium to reflect the sun ( I have seen them spraying late in the evening?) and what might they be using Strontium for Graham??
Are you are aware of the 1992 Rio climate summit? It was there that over 100 heads of state signed up to the UN charter for AGENDA 21 and since then many more have signed up. You can purchase your own copy to inspect but you can find many examples on line. Chemtrails is also being linked with AGENDA 21 for use in depopulation and there have been numerous links with chemtrails and Morgellions disease. Chemtrails deserve your utmost attention, greenpeace… I am searching for a commitment from you to help restore peace. We all do have blood on our hands, some of us are trying wash it off.
I am offering you some evidence and I also have a lot of veriafiable evidence and documentaion as you will no doubt realize by now. I don’t know where your skills lie, but I am driven now that I am aware of actual facts to expose the truth behind the lies and repulsive cover ups and official denials.
As you seem to give my enquiries so little credence it is only fair to assume Graham that your organisation also has protocols of denial, to deter, confuse and frustrate genuine activists. If that is so, Shame on you. I urge you to examine some of the evidence, you may be compelled to do some more research and change your views. It is possible your not that conditioned are you? UN Angenda 21, its all there for you. Chemtrails are a part of this program now unoffically called geo-engineering. Graham, people you know, we all know we are all in deep trouble. Spend a short amount of time from your agenda of detering people or giving them tasks to meet your satisfaction and wake up to the biggest ” dark,sinister” clandestine project going on in many places of the world ( more people involved than the manhatten project- were 150,000 people worked on building the atomic bomb and did not know).
The worlds first ever world carbon tax is introduced because of this artifically induced climate change and there are many people working for the global elite and do not or choose not to know it and play their part, even greenpeace support workers.
If you love anyone, give it alook over Graham, good people all over are waking up and turning their backs on a corrupt establishment. Facts are available and you may know how to help raise awareness to new levels. Check out the evidence and be a better person. Even if you are government, you can still see whats happening?? Forget about your ” Oath of alleigence ” and develop your loyalty back into people and the enviroment, the air we breath, the food we eat, the blue skies you use to enjoy?
Try not to react Graham, take your time and think it over before you continue on.
I am hoping for you to sneak a peak, I am confident I am giving you a good chance.
I wish you success and every happiness and I am looking forward to your informative comments.
mrmaxbliss (youtube) ‘ Clear evidence of chemtrail planes turning off’
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> —– Original Message —–
> To: Max Bliss
> Hello Max,
> OK, watched it, it’s a film of some contrails behaving exactly like contrails. If that’s your ‘best evidence so far’ then that proves my point – there’s absolutely no evidence. Even the Loch Ness monster, even the Abominable Snowman has more evidence to support him than this.
> Max, Greenpeace only work on issues where the majority of qualified scientists agree on the nature of the problem.
> Between 97% and 98% of climate scientists agree with us, and each other, on the causes of climate change –
> http://www.pnas.org/content/early/2010/06/04/1003187107
> and the 2 – 3% who disagree are on average significantly less qualified and less prominent than those who agree.
> If you wanted to get Greenpeace campaging on chemtrails, convincing me that they’re real would do you no good at all. The only situation in which we would work on it is if the majority of atmospheric physicists thought they were a real problem. So you need to convince them, and they will convince us.
> Please don’t email back to tell me that scientists have been wrong in the past, and every new theory starts out with only one supporter, these are arguments for you to have with atmospheric physicists.
> So I guess that must mean I work for MI6. I’m gointg to ask for a pay rise.
>
> Regards,,
>
> Graham Thompson
> Supporter Services
> Greenpeace UK
> From: info UK
> Sent: 08/03/12 11:59 AM
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________________________________________________________________________________________________
—– Original Message —–
From: Max Bliss
Sent: 08/03/12 03:20 PM
To: info UK

Hello Graham,
You are disappointing. How did you manage to get the job?Your critical observations and lack of scientific explanation for the ability of a condensation trail to just stop mid flight is frustratingly inept. Explain what a contrail is please and how they occur, ( hot exhaust interacting with ice particles at high altitude) but after a relatively short time the atmospheric conditions return to normal, hence these dissipate. Strangely enough whilst watching the film of a chemtrail and it being abruptly stopped in mid flight, you can see crossing the chemtrail a plane actually displaying a real contrail !!! Your powers of observation are sadly lacking, do you really feel competent enough to be doing your job??I would like to understand your explanation of how a contrail can suddenly stop mid flight ?? The long elongated chemtrail and a similar plane fying across in the background with a genuine dissipating contrail? A legitimate example of both phenomena!Also, I sympathize that you obviously have strict protocols and must be frightened, who would like to be discredited and end their career by standing up against the mighty Royal Society and its oath and power within the scientific community world wide??If you or Greenpeace can only act with the support of 98% of scientists agreement, then why is Greenpeace in existence, because with a consensus of 98% you dont need to protest. Quite a safe margin to operate in, I might add.What actually is your role and what is the role of Greenpeace? I am baffled at the moment.I have appealed to you on every sincere level and you are evasive and blocking answers to my simple questions. Did you have training to do this? You still have a chance to redeem yourself or demonstrate to me your comprehensive and convincing explanation of the elongated persistent contrail (aka chemtrail). Air samples. water samples and soil sample are presumably not so expensive for an organisation to fund considering the wills donated to your organisation? How many supporters will it take for you to start minimal investigations?I have a link here to a German group http://www.chemtrails-info.de, being Germans they are very efficient with data collection etc…Also there is a copy of a letter from a former board member of Greenpeace admitting the existence of a chemtrailing program.The link is “http://http://www.chemtrails.ch/briefe/briefgreifahn.htmMonika Griefahn was a board member of Greenpeace from 1984 -1990. The link is a copy of a letter from Monika Griefahn to a Chemtrails activists group, admitting there is a program of chemtrailing. She was Minister for Environment 1990-98 in Niedersachesen, Germany.As I said to you before I have a large dossier and its obviously growing with lots of veriafiable facts. I am an amatuer though and I do not profess to have the skills or knowledge of a specialist working for Greenpeace. However perhaps my unconditioned approach my facilitate some real progress.How can I get a job with your organisation? ( I probably could not qualify, I suspect.)
Or preferably, realizing your obvious constraints can you advise me on how to appeal for sponsorship to do this research and exposure full time?I appeal to you to search deep inside and help. I am certain you are more knowledgeable and can be more effective.
Yours sincerely, mrmaxbliss ( with lots of other information on you tube to stir and stimulate some action.)
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Greenpeace UK
—– Original Message —–
From: info UK
Sent: 08/03/12 05:39 PM
To: Max Bliss
Which job? Information officer at Greenpeace, or propaganda officer for MI6?
I will not be looking at any more ‘evidence’ for chemtrails, or discussing chemtrails, as I’ve already wasted far more time than necessary doing so, both with you and with all the other chemtrail conspiracy theorists who have emailed us, all of whom had no evidence whatsoever, apart from pictures of contrails which they insisted on showing me, despite my explaining to them, in advance, that pictures of contrails are not evidence of chemtrails.
I will not be redeeming myself, I’m afraid.
Regards,
Graham Thompson
Supporter Services
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Well there they are!!!!
I have lots of thought and comments to add but I think that I will wait and let you make your own appraisals and lets get talking about the content and examine these transcripts carefully.
mrmaxbliss________________________________________________________________________________________________




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This entry was posted on Sunday, August 19th, 2012 at 7:45 pm and posted inUncategorized. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed.



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5 Responses to ““Chemtrails are not real, they are just contrails”….GREENPEACE???”



  • enouranois
    December 23rd, 2012 at 7:31 am
    It has been known for over ten years that Greenpeace does not take a position against chemtrails so why “go ballistic” at them after being told by them to “take the issue” elsewhere? Why not do what they say and “take the issue elsewhere”, such as to Greenpeace founder and now prominent Greenpeace critic Patrick Moorehttp://www.greenspirit.com/contact.cfm whose criticisms of Greenpeace are much cited by chemtrails activists.

  • bezberry
    November 9th, 2012 at 6:13 am
    on greenpeace int. facebook page i commented every few minutes for days and days, there was hundreds commenting about the pictures i was commenting on, and not one made reference to me even commenting, there was at least 2000 likes on the pictures also. every comment was 2 word comments like well done and great job. eventually i got a comment back from one person telling me that my issue(geo-engineering) wasnt an issue for green peace and to take it else where, i went ballistic at them, telling them that if we couldnt turn to them who could we turn to, but after the comment they made they never commented again. greenpeace are now owned by greedy facists too, they do do some good work to get good pr, but thats about it.

  • mrmaxbliss
    October 14th, 2012 at 11:20 pm
    Reblogged this on mrmaxbliss.

  • Jack Hernandez
    August 23rd, 2012 at 3:23 pm
    I can prove that chemtrails exist,
    if it were contrails then the trails wouldnt start and stop on comand, they turn them on and off, and if they were contrails why would planes fly is s shapes, it’s not fuel efficiant, I’ve even seen a plane fly in straight line then turn around and loop back on itself just to fill a gap in the sky, also Chemical analysis has shown the presence of unexpected chemicals in rain water, People Get sick after Chemtrail Spraying, unidentified spray planes have been photographed, Trails appear in grid patterns, Persistent trails have been observed in conditions that would not support persistent contrails (Specifically RH -40F) and Persistent trails were not observed before 1998 (date varies), obviously evidences such as conventions or witness accounts of planning such things are impossible to find since such things are kept under wraps, but what can be observed can prove that these sprays are not “contrails” at all.
Content from External Source
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Most interesting . . . like two people speaking different languages thinking they are communicating . . .
 
Clearly correspondence borne of frustration on both sides. Shame to see this CT wasting the time of that organisation too.
 
The error for Graham Thompson was responding further than his first sentence in his initial reply. That's all he needed to say.
 
Max Bliss is a very aggressive individual . . . seems most disturbed by the rejection by Greenpeace . . . this is the first time I have actually felt sorry for Greenpeace !! :)
 
I was taking a look at the letter he links (or tries to link, he messed up the URL), from Monika Griefhan, in which he says she is "admitting there is a program of chemtrailing." My German is rusty and was never very great, but if I'm reading it right, she's saying that she is aware of research and experimentation into geo-engineering, but she is firmly opposed to such strategies, which treat the symptoms rather than addressing the cause: greenhouse gas emissions. She says that while the release of aluminum and barium compounds could have some toxic effects, to her knowledge any amounts released up to then had been very small. Furthermore, she states that such a program would involve release of materials into the stratosphere, rather than the troposphere.

As far as I can see, she doesn't "admit" to an ongoing chemtrails program. If Freizeitgeist reads this, I'm sure this could be cleared up.

Edited to add: She starts out by saying something to the effect of, "I'm sorry that your previous attempts at communication were so frustrating, that you felt the need to fill your letter with so many unfriendly and hurtful remarks." Judging from Max Bliss above, this is a standard practice.
 
I was taking a look at the letter he links (or tries to link, he messed up the URL), from Monika Griefhan, in which he says she is "admitting there is a program of chemtrailing." My German is rusty and was never very great, but if I'm reading it right, she's saying that she is aware of research and experimentation into geo-engineering, but she is firmly opposed to such strategies, which treat the symptoms rather than addressing the cause: greenhouse gas emissions. She says that while the release of aluminum and barium compounds could have some toxic effects, to her knowledge any amounts released up to then had been very small. Furthermore, she states that such a program would involve release of materials into the stratosphere, rather than the troposphere.

As far as I can see, she doesn't "admit" to an ongoing chemtrails program. If Freizeitgeist reads this, I'm sure this could be cleared up.

Monika Griefhahn is member of the german Parlament ("Bundestag") for the socialdemocratic Party and a member of GReenpeace.

As she wroted this letter 2004, the Chemtrail-hypothesis was very unknown in Germany, She answered very polite and just doesn´t know if these chemtrails are real or not. So she answered for the posibility if someone would do this.


Years later she was asked again, and this is the Answer the chemtrail-Belieers doesn´t like so much like her first Letter:

Zu Ihrer Frage nach sogenannten Chemtrails, also chemisch zugesetzten Kondensstreifen von Verkehrsflugzeugen, gab es verschiedene Untersuchungen öffentlicher Einrichtungen, die diese Sorgen ernst genommen haben.

Doch trotz eingehender Prüfungen gibt es bisher keine Erkenntnisse zu diesem Sachverhalt. Im Jahre 2007 sagte das Umweltbundesamt, dass es für derartige Vorgänge keine wissenschaftlichen Belege gibt. Daneben beschäftigt sich das Deutschen Zentrum für Luft- und Raumfahrt (DLR) anhand zahlreicher Messungen der Emissionen von Verkehrsflugzeugen mit den Auswirkungen des Flugverkehrs auf die Atmosphäre. Dabei konnte das DLR solche Chemtrails in ihren Messungen nicht nachweisen. Neben diesen beiden Einrichtungen haben auch weitere Behörden, die sich mit dieser Thematik beschäftigen, keine Anhaltspunkte, die die Existenz von Chemtrails belegen.

Mit freundlichem Gruß

Monika Griefahn

Google-Translation:

To your question about the so-called chemtrails, so chemically added contrails of airliners, there have been several investigations of public institutions who have taken these concerns seriously.

However, despite thorough testing there have been no findings on this issue. In 2007, the Federal Environment Agency said that there is no scientific evidence for such operations. In addition, the German Aerospace Center (DLR) employed by numerous measurements of emissions from commercial aircraft with the impact of aviation on the atmosphere. It could not demonstrate such DLR chemtrails in their measurements. Besides these two institutions have also other authorities that deal with this issue, no evidence to prove the existence of chemtrails.

Sincerely,

Monika Griefahn

Source: http://www.abgeordnetenwatch.de/monika_griefahn-650-5584--f167323.html#q167323

But there is an official Statement about Chemtrails from Greenpeace-Germany. Our german "Carnicom", Mr. Werner Altnickel was a Greenpeace-Activist and was thrown out by them

Greenpeace Germany wroted in on of their magazins for members 2004

Google-Translation:

A sky full of conspirators

greenpeace magazin 5:04

For strange cloud phenomena can be only one reason, believes a growing number of people: Secret U.S. experiments with the climate.

The day on which Werner Altnickel rose the full extent of the conspiracy began, as the weather forecast for this 5 Had promised in March 2004: Following the dissolution of early morning fog fields clear and sunny, despite the overnight frost, the air would warm up to six degrees and at noon, the first time giving off a hint of spring this year, in Oldenburg.



Altnickel installed solar panels on a house roof in the Lower Saxon town when he saw a vapor trail in the sky. Later he noticed that the strip was surprisingly not disappeared, even new ones that constantly came the firmament finally "woven into a sloppy mass as the sky turned rührter milk foam" is.



For Werner Altnickel it was clear "that such a thing can not be normal." Finally, the independent solar technicians is 15 years on roofs between Frankfurt and Wilhelmshaven and has numerous contrails swell and disappear at will. However, he had some months previously read an article about clouds obscure phenomena: the U.S. government was in the January issue of the esoteric magazine "Space and Time", would be sprayed by aircraft chemicals in the air - and top secret world. Washington knew that the Earth is heading for a devastating environmental disaster, but still did not save energy or change the American way of life. Instead traktiere the superpower of the sky with deadly chemicals - with the concoction of metal oxides and plastic compounds not only affecting the weather. It also makes people sick, on all herunterregne sometime.



It is this horror scenario does the solar craftsmen on 5 March have discovered the domestic skies. He shot 1,500 photographs of the supernatural events, he had to "cry properly for the first time in years." Since then, dedicated Altnickel, two-time winner of the Oldenburg Environmental Prize and winner of the German Solar Prize 1997 with full force the battle against chemtrails.



He is not the only one. Under the search word "chemtrails" the Internet search engine Google found 79,100 hits in early August, a month earlier there were 28,500. The theme is becoming the mother of all conspiracy theories: whether UFOs or CIA experiments with consciousness altering drugs - nothing seems too far-fetched as it would not integrate into the dark world view of pervasive cult contrails.



"The thing with the chemtrails has spread incredibly quickly," says Thomas Hagbeck also firmly until recently spokesman for the Federal Environment Agency and now in the same capacity in the Ministry of Environment. Anyway, his ministry, politicians, federal intelligence service, research institutions, and not least Greenpeace have received hundreds of concerned calls and emails in recent weeks, the report unison of "criminal experiments in the atmosphere."



While most politicians and scientists throw the emails as "spam chemtrail" (the meteorologist Joerg tile man) in the trash, the SPD deputy Monika Griefahn has at least promised a parliamentary question on the subject. Federal Environment Agency Greenpeace or reply with the scientific facts: Yes, some contrails stay longer visible. This has always been so, and can be explained with different humidity and natural turbulence of the atmosphere. Yes, theoretically you can influence the climate by sprayed chemicals in the stratosphere. But there is no indication that this is really happening. Anyway always have to be sprayed to ever achieve a climate effect, which would require thousands of planes, tens of thousands confidant and billion-euro budget - hardly a mammoth operation to be kept secret.



Werner Altnickel contests this to yourself. "We must not forget who else is in the cover-up in the boat," he says, and makes a seemingly endless list: UN and WHO, secret CIA to BND, the IPCC climate scientists Panel, airlines, politicians and the media. Without their help, he argues, in a reversal of the burden of proof to chemtrails could not even keep it a secret - "and that they exist, I have seen with my own eyes."



The weather forecast announced for the 5th March incidentally also a zoom pulling deep, on the day of Oldenburg with increasing cloudiness veil manifested itself later. No wonder Altnickel believes: "The weather service also infected with it."

Source: http://www.greenpeace-magazin.de/?id=3121

Since this, there is a kind of love&hate relationship between Altnickel and his fans and Greenpeace. For Example they made a smal Greenpeace-like Action in front of the headquarter of Greenpeace Germany.

 
Max Bliss. What a wonderful character. He is the one that told me rainwater should only contain 0.08 ug/l of Al and when asked how he had arrived at that figure he had "calculated" it.

I notice that Patrick Moore has been mentioned in the comments above. He is often cited by chemtrailers and their favourite quote of

Greenpeace became increasingly senseless as it adopted an agenda that is anti-science, anti-business, and downright anti-human.”
Content from External Source
http://chemtrailsplanet.net/2012/12...ipcc-revealed-as-basis-for-chemtrails-denial/

Strong words indeed, and totally misquoted, yet the chemtrailers conveniently ignore the fact that he is pro-nuclear, pro-GMO and worked for a logging company, essentially against all that Greenpeace stands for.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrick_Moore_(environmentalist)


However there is the unescapable fact that no environmental group accepts the premise of chemtrails, and many would wet themselves over an issue like this.
 
Max Bliss. What a wonderful character. He is the one that told me rainwater should only contain 0.08 ug/l of Al and when asked how he had arrived at that figure he had "calculated" it.

0.08 ug/L of aluminum? That is less than 1/10th of one microgram(ug) in one Liter. Consider that a grain of sand weighs about 100 micrograms (ug). What 'Max Bliss' is claiming is that natural rain water should only contain 1/10th of one percent of one grain of sand worth of the most common metal found in earth's crust? Bear in mind that almost all clay dusts contain large amounts of aluminum, between 2 and 3 percent! Max's claim simply boggles the mind.

What's worse though, perhaps, is that 'Max Bliss' seems blissfully unaware that the minimum detection limit for aluminum in these water tests is 750 ug/L.

People like 'Max Bliss' are both a boon and a liability for the hoax. On the one hand they target folks who don't bother to really understand the sometimes technical issues. The effect of that is to develop the belief system towards a membership with a 'low information' standard as well as proven gullibility. Effectively, this selects out from the group those who might otherwise question what they are told.

However, this process also prevents progress by excluding those with technical expertise such as scientists or environmental professionals like the Greenpeace guy. 'Max Bliss' doesn't even want Greenpeace to be involved, whether he knows it or not.
They threaten his dominance of the table and are actually the last sort of people he really wants to be involved. Unconsciously, perhaps, what he is doing is throwing up a wall between Greenpeace and his followers in order to maintain the status quo.

That is why we don't see Michael J. Murphy, Dane Wigington, or Max Bliss engaging in debate or conversation about these matters, they don't want to know, but perhaps more significantly they don't want others to know where they have made serious mistakes. Not very honorable behavior, in my opinion.
 
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Has anyone ever seen him do a debate on the subject?
Would he be willing to do a fair debate with me?

I have been blocked by all their FB pages and I really want to go to a "meet". Ask him Jay. I seem to have burned my bridges as obviously they read here so block me on FB. How could we organise a
 
Max was the guy who told me I eat Borax to ward off the effects of flying in chemtrails. I comment a lot on his YT videos and got this reply from him after I questioned why chemtrail believers never appear to really believe the theory as none ever seem to wear face masks....which I would consider crucial if one were being poisoned. The response is interesting.

Hey Mike, do you ever question why you are doing your troll work? You seem intelligent, why not turn around and whistleblow...? You could be a hero to many more than your psychopathic bosses. Worth thinking about as more and more people get informed and the truth will come out, you know it, your bosses know it too... Have you ever checked out your own rain water analysis or had your own hair tested? Checked out the effects of the toxins from scientific journals? Look in the mirror and join us

So, apart from their standard definition of "troll" (someone who disagrees with your position????) he does appear to accept I am a pilot. I might see if he would contemplate a debate.
 
Because I haven't seen this done before, I propose a third party manage a Youtube video debatebetween two parties.

The third party could manage the video channel and commentary, and debaters would each create videos following the Lincoln-Douglas debate format as seen here:
http://facstaff.bloomu.edu/jtomlins/debate_formats.htm

There should be a time limit within which the videos must be completed, say within 2-3 days of the last exchange, and the complete debate should not be made public until it is completed.
 
Max Bliss. What a wonderful character. He is the one that told me rainwater should only contain 0.08 ug/l of Al and when asked how he had arrived at that figure he had "calculated" it.

I'm not sure what to think about Max, except that it would be fun to debate him.

This is what he is currently saying at his website:

Excessively high, the normal amount of alu in the air in a built up city is 0.08ug/l.
 
I'm not sure what to think about Max, except that it would be fun to debate him.

This is what he is currently saying at his website:

Excessively high, the normal amount of alu in the air in a built up city is 0.08ug/l.
Content from External Source

Air, or rainwater?? Should you bother to take the time out to explain the difference to him?? ;)
 
I have commented on his videos in a fact-oriented fashion. At least he is not deleting sceptical comments or blocking commenters immediately.

His responses point to a somewhat 'evangelistic' approach. He just knows he is dealing with government agents and tries to encourage them to convert/repent/see the light.

Anyway, I think the comment areas of his videos are probably a good place to post factual information and reach lots of chemtrailers - if you manage to stay cool.
 
One CT guy was recently alarmed (Chemtrails Awareness FB page) that alumina levels were "off the leash" at 0.156ppm against a US EPA reportable level of 0.6ppm. Maths is my training, so I first noticed that this is about one-quarter of the reportable level - well and truly still "on the leash".

I'm no chemist but within 3 minutes looking at Wikipedia and the US EPA documentation on reportable substances it turned out that aluminium oxide (alumina) is not on the reportable substances register, and it is the nice and inert abrasive in toothpaste. I did point this out and ask why CTers were also afraid of toothpaste as well as coulds and water, and got blocked for questioning their personal hygiene. I'm very new to this chemtrail stuff but it seems the best argument they have is "Look up at the sky, maaaan!!!!!!!"
 
Greenpeace UK
From: info UK
Sent: 08/03/12 05:39 PM
To: Max Bliss
Which job? Information officer at Greenpeace, or propaganda officer for MI6?
I will not be looking at any more ‘evidence’ for chemtrails, or discussing chemtrails, as I’ve already wasted far more time than necessary doing so, both with you and with all the other chemtrail conspiracy theorists who have emailed us, all of whom had no evidence whatsoever, apart from pictures of contrails which they insisted on showing me, despite my explaining to them, in advance, that pictures of contrails are not evidence of chemtrails.
I will not be redeeming myself, I’m afraid.
Regards,
Graham Thompson
Supporter Services


Reminds me of this:



Not comparing Max to Oswald of course, but there often comes a point when you have to recognize that future communication is not leading anywhere productive unless the fundamental disagreements can actually be addressed.
 
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One CT guy was recently alarmed (Chemtrails Awareness FB page) that alumina levels were "off the leash" at 0.156ppm against a US EPA reportable level of 0.6ppm. Maths is my training, so I first noticed that this is about one-quarter of the reportable level - well and truly still "on the leash".

Even aside from the glaring math error, that 0.6 ppm is not even an EPA reporting limit, at least as far as I can find. Aluminum falls under EPA's "Secondary Standards", voluntary recommended limits for contaminants in drinking water that may cause aesthetic or taste issues:
EPA does not enforce these "secondary maximum contaminant levels" or "SMCLs." They are established only as guidelines to assist public water systems in managing their drinking water for aesthetic considerations, such as taste, color and odor. These contaminants are not considered to present a risk to human health at the SMCL.
Content from External Source
Contaminant Secondary MCLNoticeable Effects above the Secondary MCL
Aluminum0.05 to 0.2 mg/L*colored water

Edited to add: Sorry, I see now in your post that you already saw it wasn't on the reportable list.
 
Even aside from the glaring math error, that 0.6 ppm is not even an EPA reporting limit, at least as far as I can find. Aluminum falls under EPA's "Secondary Standards", voluntary recommended limits for contaminants in drinking water that may cause aesthetic or taste issues:
EPA does not enforce these "secondary maximum contaminant levels" or "SMCLs." They are established only as guidelines to assist public water systems in managing their drinking water for aesthetic considerations, such as taste, color and odor. These contaminants are not considered to present a risk to human health at the SMCL.
Content from External Source
Contaminant
Secondary MCL
Noticeable Effects above the Secondary MCL
Aluminum
0.05 to 0.2 mg/L*
colored water

This is something I find all the time, just a basic lack of understanding on limits etc. Even more frustrating is when I get in a debate and suddenly I am quoted levels that have no resembelence to anything I have seen. When asked for a link it us usually for a different country and a different medium.
 
Add in to that the folks that don't seem to understand 'that the dose makes the poison". A hard to measure amount is just as bad to them as a ton of it would be.
 
I've seen a documentary on poisons where they stated that in toxicology, the time/duration of exposure is more important than the toxicity itself, tobacco for instance
 
If it builds up in the tissues, that is true, if it does not allow the body to heal itself that is also true.
 
I've seen a documentary on poisons where they stated that in toxicology, the time/duration of exposure is more important than the toxicity itself, tobacco for instance
I have not got the figures to hand but in occupational health and safety they often have quantity over a fixed period. I know that air particulate Al is usually given as x ug/m3 for an 8 hour period. Anything over x is deemed hazardous.
 
I have not got the figures to hand but in occupational health and safety they often have quantity over a fixed period. I know that air particulate Al is usually given as x ug/m3 for an 8 hour period. Anything over x is deemed hazardous.

I haven't seen any limits, but this CDC report (5mb pdf) notes some fatalitites and damage to lungs from 615– 685 mg Al/m3, and respirable dust was 51 mg Al/m3 (not sure what the difference between "total" and "respireable" is)
, and

....no deaths were reported following an acute 4-hour exposure to up to 1,000 mg Al/m3 as aluminum oxide in groups of 12–18 male Fischer 344 rats (Thomson et al. 1986) or following chronic exposure to 2.18–2.45 mg Al/m3 as refractory alumina fiber for 86 weeks in groups of 50 male and female Wistar rats (Pigott et al. 1981).
Content from External Source
Edit: Found some limits:

EXPOSURE LIMITS

* OSHA PEL

The current Occupational Safety and Health Administration (OSHA) permissible exposure limit (PEL) for aluminum is 15 milligrams per cubic meter (mg/m(3)) of air for total dust, and 5 mg/m(3) for the respirable fraction, as an 8-hour time-weighted average (TWA) concentration [29 CFR 1910.1000, Table Z-1].

* NIOSH REL

The National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health (NIOSH) has established a recommended exposure limit (REL) for aluminum of 10 mg/m(3) for total dust, and 5 mg/m(3) for the respirable fraction, as a TWA for up to a 10-hour workday and a 40-hour workweek [NIOSH 1992].

* ACGIH TLV

The American Conference of Governmental Industrial Hygienists (ACGIH) has assigned aluminum a threshold limit value (TLV) of 10 mg/m(3) for metal dust, as a TWA for a normal 8-hour workday and a 40-hour workweek [ACGIH 1994, p. 12].

* Rationale for Limits

The NIOSH limit is based on the risk of lung changes that may lead to pulmonary fibrosis [NIOSH 1992]. The ACGIH limit is based on the no adverse effect level of 2 mg/m(3) and studies involving exposures to aluminum at much higher concentrations [ACGIH 1991, p. 46].
Content from External Source
 
On Greenpeace's website's blog section is an piece that addresses the chemmies claims:


Greenpeace’s view on ‘Chemtrails’
Posted by G.Thompson — 13 March 2015 at 3:30pm - 14 Comments


All rights reserved. Credit: greenpeace
On balance, we think probably not.
The Oxford English Dictionary defines a ‘chemtrail’ as –
A visible trail left in the sky by an aircraft and believed by some to consist of chemical or biological agents released as part of a covert operation, rather than the condensed water of a vapour trail.

Wikipedia says –
According to the chemtrail conspiracy theory, long-lasting trails left in the sky by high-flying aircraft are chemical or biological agents deliberately sprayed for sinister purposes undisclosed to the general public.

Greenpeace have not seen sufficient evidence to justify further investigation into whether this is a real problem. As far as we are concerned, chemtrails are an urban myth - a conspiracy theory with no conspiracy.

We are aware of various vaguely similar but confirmed phenomena:

Carbon emissions – aviation is the fastest growing source of carbon emissions, and the fact these emissions are produced at altitude increases their impact upon the climate. For this reason we believe aviation growth needs to be constrained to keep us within ‘safe’ emission limits. This is a particular problem in the UK, where we fly more than any other country in the world, and yet are still told that we urgently need more runways. CO2 is invisible, and emitted as an unavoidable side-effect of burning kerosene.

Cloud seeding – emitting silver iodide or other chemicals into clouds causes the water vapour held in those clouds to condense around the silver iodide into rain, and fall to the ground. This can be used to encourage rain, by seeding the clouds over a site which needs more water, or to discourage rain by seeding clouds before they reach a site where people want dry weather. The most famous example of cloud seeding was during the Beijing Olympics, where it was used to prevent rain over the Olympic sites. This process would be carried out by rockets, as in Beijing, or light aircraft, not by passenger jets, and it is not particularly common.

Geoengineering – Geoengineering is the science of deliberately altering the global climate and is currently almost entirely theoretical. All geoengineering techniques are regarded as potentially hazardous, as they can only work by having very large impacts on how our atmosphere functions, with the possible risks being equally large. There are many different techniques proposed, some of which could include aircraft emitting substances to block sunlight from reaching the earth. The very few techniques which have had some limited, localised testing do not utilise aircraft. If the chemtrail conspiracy is real, then it is not a geoengineering project, as it has had no discernible impact on the climate.

HAARP – the High-frequency Active Auroral Research Program was an ionospheric research programme conducted by various dodgy outfits connected to the US and UK military. God knows what it was intended to do, but it closed last year. It may have been something worth worrying about, but it doesn’t seem to have utilised large numbers of aircraft, and did not receive the level of funding that would be required to do so on the scale of the alleged chemtrail conspiracy.

None of these phenomena explain visible vapour trails from commercial passenger jets. Fortunately, there is an explanation. The visible trails are contrails (short for ‘condensation trails’) and they consist of water vapour condensed due to the temperature differential created by the pressure differential between the upper and lower surfaces of the wings, the wing tips, or engines.

If you would like to communicate with Greenpeace about one or more of the confirmed phenomena described above, please avoid using the term ‘chemtrails’ as it may cause confusion.

Evidence Greenpeace has been sent an enormous number of pictures and videos of vapour trails, all of which look like normal contrails behaving exactly like normal contrails - to us, at least. We have also been sent lots of links to websites and blogs claiming to expose the chemtrail conspiracy. The evidence on these blogs tends to consist of pictures and videos of vapour trails, all of which look exactly like normal contrails etc.

What we would require, in order to consider researching this alleged conspiracy, would be one of two things. Either clear statements from appropriate experts such as professors of atmospheric physics, fluid dynamics or aeronautical engineering, explaining how they determined that these apparent contrails are not in fact contrails but chemtrails, or, alternatively, clear statements from aviation workers detailing their experiences fitting, refilling and operating the systems used to disperse the chemicals from the planes. As there are literally millions of people working in the aviation industry around the world, many of whom are fairly low-paid, the chances of them keeping something like this quiet are fairly minimal, if it’s really happening.

If you would like to communicate with Greenpeace about chemtrails, as described in the OED or Wikipedia, please wait until you have what we would regard as evidence – statements from either properly qualified academics or appropriately experienced aviation workers supporting your concerns.

Please do not assume that a YouTube video or blog which convinced you will convince us. We’ve already seen them, and we weren’t convinced. Please do not think that accusing us of being part of the ‘chemtrail conspiracy’ will change our minds. We’re constantly accused by governments and security services of being in the pay of other governments and security services. It hasn’t changed the way we work and is unlikely to do so in the future.

Greenpeace require a reliable evidence base before campaigning on any issue. So far, we haven’t seen any evidence supporting the chemtrails hypothesis.

Content from External Source
 
Fortunately, there is an explanation. The visible trails are contrails (short for ‘condensation trails’) and they consist of water vapour condensed due to the temperature differential created by the pressure differential between the upper and lower surfaces of the wings, the wing tips, or engines.
Content from External Source
Unfortunately that explanation is not entirely correct; they might inform themselves on Metabunk. But besides that I'm glad that they are on the ground with both feet.
 
First, apologies for being so late to the game... (I hadn't even heard of Metabunk in April 2013, never mind 2012)

And 30 minutes ago I had no idea who Graham Thompson was (evidently he's still with Greenpeace in 2015)
but I found his frankness and tone refreshing...he was willing to call a spade a spade, and a hoax a hoax,
long before many of us had heard of Max Bliss (is that a made-up name, btw?)

I understand why some wouldn't think Mr. Thompson quite polite enough...
but the highlighted portion--in the correspondence below--has started my Tuesday off with a big smile. :D

Screen Shot 2015-03-17 at 9.00.29 AM.png
 
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The use of the word "climate change hoax" in the original letter was unfortunate, and diverted attention from your claim about chemtrails. Climate change is not a hoax. If you had just asked them about chemtrails, you might have generated some interest.
 
Reminds me of this:



Not comparing Max to Oswald of course, but there often comes a point when you have to recognize that future communication is not leading anywhere productive unless the fundamental disagreements can actually be addressed.
Second, apologies for being so late to the game...again. I know it's wrong, but I've just got to type:

:p "Thank 'God' for Bertrand Russell!!" :p
 
The use of the word "climate change hoax" in the original letter was unfortunate, and diverted attention from your claim about chemtrails. Climate change is not a hoax. If you had just asked them about chemtrails, you might have generated some interest.
Not really "unfortunate". The idea that climate change is a hoax seems to be central to Max Bliss's views. But really, whether or not you believe that anthropogenic global warming is a genuine concern doesn't make any difference to the matter of "chemtrails".
 
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