Using comedy to reverse, or promote bunk

[Leifer]

Without getting into a large discussion of the definition and structure of comedy, a simple description might be:
"....to reveal an ironic revelation of commonly held beliefs, in a witty satirical tone" (my def.)

Wikipedia's definition of Satire is:

Satire is a genre of literature, and sometimes graphic and performing arts, in which vices, follies, abuses, and shortcomings are held up to ridicule, ideally with the intent of shaming individuals, corporations, government or society itself, into improvement.
Although satire is usually meant to be humorous, its greater purpose is often constructive social criticism, using wit to draw attention to both particular and wider issues in society.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satire

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Although a lot can be remarked here about the 'history of comedy', I am no scholar, and neither are most people.....so let's focus on recent history. This is not a retrospective of all comedy. Briefly though....the early medium of television (and radio) took comedy into the home, from where it had previously existed.....in publications, on stage, in clubs, on the street, from traveling shows, etc.
Early political satire, in the form of drawn cartoons........


Publications, Television, and Radio media have often had their viewpoint or stance expressed in terms of comedy.....sometimes the ideas are cross-barrier, sometimes they are rigidly one-sided.
And let's not forget, that comedy can make a (any) topic....enjoyable. In the 20th century, comedy had become a premiere method of expressing difficult subjects, to ordinary people.


When does comedy reveal "bunk" ??
When does comedy support "bunk" ?

George Carlin seemed not afraid to....both enhance a conspiracy, as well as bust them.......

Bill Maher speaks sense to his audience, but then has unique ideas on certain subjects like vaccines and ???.
Jon Stewart's "The Daily Show" and the Steven Colbert spinoff (both are "info-comedy" shows) show a good percentage of people "believe" what they say..........according Pew Research.....

Pew Research Center’s recent report on Americans’ media habits finds that a portion of online adults get their news from two Comedy Central staples, The Daily Show and The Colbert Report. And other studies have shown that people do, in fact, learn from these programs while they laugh.
http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tan...report-is-a-trusted-source-of-political-news/

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John Oliver's HBO show "Last week with John Oliver" does do a decent job at exposing ironic truths for laughter......


Fox news recently debuted Greg Gutfeld as their new politi-comedian.

England's "hard-to-understand-if-you-weren't-british-born" Russel Brand..... is all over the place. I won't burden you with an example.

 

[Pete Tar]

England's "hard-to-understand-if-you-weren't-british-born" Russel Brand..... is all over the place. I won't burden you with an example.

And thanks for that.

When does comedy reveal "bunk" ??
When does comedy support "bunk" ?

When it acts out a premise to an absurd extreme, exposing it's poor logical foundation.
It supports bunk when it promotes s straw-man version of the idea being parodied.
So I guess it's just a matter of accuracy in execution.
But accuracy isn't as funny as exaggeration, so sometimes the laugh takes precedent over fair portrayal.

 

[deirdre]

Steven Colbert spinoff (both are "info-comedy" shows) show a good percentage of people "believe" what they say

how are you defining a good percentage? according to your link its really only a small percentage of consistent liberal men between the ages of 18 and 29.



so.. forgive my bad math skills. thats 1.5% of mostly men who watch the show, believe it. just saying. The colbert report is funny though sometimes.

 

[Pete Tar]

National Report is a good example of maybe promoting bunk by not taking things to enough of an extreme to make the satire obvious. It just invents credible stories based on similar trends in real headlines, but doesn't take it so far that it's obviously not true. They're often pretty believable, and there's not always an obvious comedic value to them.
Maybe the comedy value is in just trolling people, if you're into that sort of thing.

Hoax National Report stories reported as fact by media outlets include:

• A report that Arizona governor Jan Brewer intended to introduce mandatory gay-to-straight conversion courses into the state's public school system. A spokesman for the governor called the fake article 'vile' and said 'its authors should be ashamed.' Brewer has been a target of gay rights activists because of her efforts to strip same-sex partners of government benefits, and for her stance on making it harder for gay couples to adopt children.[16][17][18]
• A report that fooled researchers at Fox News Channel, in which the President was purported to have announced his intention to spend his own money to keep a Muslim museum open during a government shutdown.[13] The mistake was featured in a comedy sketch on Jimmy Kimmel Live!.[19]
• A report that that a man in Hanna, Wyoming was the first recipient of a RFID chip which, the report claimed, was part of an Obamacare pilot program.[20]
• A report published on November 2, 2013 claiming a fictitious Assam Rape Festival created a furor in Indian national and local media. Several newspapers and blogs reported the same.[21][22][23] A police probe in India showed the story originated from Uganda.[24]
• A report that an invasion of illegal immigrants forcibly took control of the small town of Sarita, Texas.[25]
• A report published July 15, 2014 claiming that Canadian pop star Justin Bieber would feature on a song on British rock band Radiohead's next album.[26]
• A report published July 19, 2014 claiming a secret service agent was ordered by Obama to spend $4,000 at aDenver, Colorado marijuana dispensary.[27]
• A report published August 7, 2014 reporting that a New York City police officer accidentally killed a baby while arresting the nursing mother for breast feeding in public.[28]
• A report published August 18, 2014 reported that Facebook has created a drug task force that will be working with DEA and local law enforcement to arrest those who discuss using or selling drugs while using the social network. A Facebook spokesperson called the article "spectacularly false," pointing out the Facebook Drug Task Force hotline number listed in the report connects to the extremist Westboro Baptist Church.[29]
• A report published August 25, 2014 reported that Breaking Bad was coming out with a season 6.[30]
• A report published August 30, 2014 reported that a 15 year old male had been sentenced to 25 years to life forswatting.[31]
• A report published September 17, 2014 reported that Dennis Rodman is leaving the United States to talk with leaders of ISIS. Rodman's representative dismissed the claims, saying the retired basketball player is in Hong Kong for business meetings.[32][33][34][35]
• A report publishing October 20, 2014 claiming that British graffiti artist Banksy was arrested and his identity revealed as National Report's trademark moniker Paul Horner.[36]

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[Auldy]

This nifty video explains how humour comes from the unexpected. We laugh when the logical conclusion of something is upended and made unexpected.


What surprises the brains makes us smile, and when learn what surprises us, which is why jokes become less funny the more you hear them.

Assuming the science is right, maybe when satire supports/reveal bunk, people laugh and learn, and more anti or pro opinions are formed.

 

[Mick West]

Jon Stewart's "The Daily Show" and the Steven Colbert spinoff (both are "info-comedy" shows) show a good percentage of people "believe" what they say..........according Pew Research.....

They (the regular audiences for those shows) don't believe the satire though, they believe the underlying message of the satire. I think this is because the audience, and the show writers and hosts, are largely youngish liberals. I'm a fan of both shows.

Unfortunately though, joking about a topic sometimes backfires:


I've generally dissuaded the use of comedy, as it comes across as mocking. I've had to delete a few cartoons from the "debunking humor" thread and elsewhere.

Do Fox News viewers become more critical of their station's misrepresentations after watching the Daily Show? I think the answer is obvious - Fox News viewers don't watch the Daily show, and if they happen to see it they would simply think it's biased "liberal media". The Daily Show is largely preaching to the choir as entertainment. Sure it "informs" us what the top topics are in the news, it sometimes brings awareness to issues for the liberal community, but does it change minds? Does it correct bunk?

 

[vitorino]

I've generally dissuaded the use of comedy, as it comes across as mocking. I've had to delete a few cartoons from the "debunking humor" thread and elsewhere.

I would argue we shouldn't be too strict on this. Comedy does help to make a point, as we agree from the examples above. Is someone "mocking" another because he satirized his post/words/actions? I think it depends where one is coming from: trying to make a point or just trying to humiliate. In the end it doesn't really hurt, so leniency is requested.

The Daily Show is largely preaching to the choir as entertainment. Sure it "informs" us what the top topics are in the news, it sometimes brings awareness to issues for the liberal community, but does it change minds? Does it correct bunk?

Does debunking change minds? I'd say some. It ends up reaching other people than its regular viewers. Kind of like a TV Show; I give comedy at least that power. In fact, ancient scholars already were aware of its power in making truths obvious, and therefore dangerous for a state/class system.

 

[Santa's sidekick]

Is someone "mocking" another because he satirized his post/words/actions? I think it depends where one is coming from: trying to make a point or just trying to humiliate.

The fellow doing the mocking often feels he/she is making a point, just 'having a laugh', or even doing it in a spirit of friendliness, but it often comes across very differently to the target. I learned this the hard way, as I suspect most people here have.

Does debunking change minds? I'd say some. It ends up reaching other people than its regular viewers. Kind of like a TV Show; I give comedy at least that power. In fact, ancient scholars already were aware of its power in making truths obvious, and therefore dangerous for a state/class system.

That's true, and comedy can also make your point more memorable. It's kind of like a scalpel - use it carefully and you've done a great job, but be a little too enthusiastic and you've killed your patient.

 

[Santa's sidekick]

Another problem with the use of satire is that it can only be used to impart blunt, nuance-less messages, and is therefore inimical to intelligent discussion when overused.

 

[vitorino]

The fellow doing the mocking often feels he/she is making a point, just 'having a laugh', or even doing it in a spirit of friendliness; but it often comes across very differently to the target. I learned this the hard way, as I suspect most people here have.

That's true, and comedy can also make your point more memorable. It's kind of like a scalpel - use it carefully and you've done a great job, but be a little too enthusiastic and you've killed your patient.

Yes, it depends where you're coming from; use common sense

 

[Leifer]

Do Fox News viewers become more critical of their station's misrepresentations after watching the Daily Show? I think the answer is obvious - Fox News viewers don't watch the Daily show, and if they happen to see it they would simply think it's biased "liberal media".

I've played clips of the Colbert Show at work, during lunch break. My republican friends watched too, and we all laughed.
Oh yes, they certainly classify it as "liberal media" (it is).....and I doubt it changed their political beliefs, that was not my intent. They were able to laugh at the irony the show presented.
Comedy often examines an idea we hold, and presents it at a different and somewhat extreme perspective...that's the twist.
Comedy is attractive to a wide audience, and the subject matter can cross barriers not normally treaded in otherwise typical exchanges between people.
This doesn't always work though....a white comedian will have a difficult time using the word "nigger" to a black audience, where as black comedians can get away with it. That is a bit off subject, but the point is....people with a "closed-door" attitude will open it a bit, if it makes them laugh. Though, as you stated elsewhere..."mocking" is ineffective, and can actually tighten a closed door.

Would (do) my republican friends choose to watch Colbert on their own...other than seeing it because I played it at work? I doubt it, but I'll ask them.