Ravenna Window Ghost

[Scaramanga]

About 14 years ago I came across a superb case of a 'ghost boy'...photographed in Ravenna, Ohio...that to me was clearly a case of pareidolia. I spent hours arguing about it on a forum full of believers. What looks like the ghost of a boy in a blue shirt...well, the 'shirt' is clearly something on the window sill itself. And the 'face' seems to me to be nothing more than the doorway to another room, with the 'nose' and lower jaw being a table lamp on a circular table, and the eyebrows ( I mean, what 'boy' has white eyebrows ? And square eyes, when you look in more detail ) being blinds and the eyes are windows or wall paintings in that other room. Look at the photo several times and the pareidolia disappears and it is clear one is looking through a doorway into another room. This is even more clear if you save the pic and magnify it a bit.




My point being that pareidolia can create extremely life-like faces until you look in more detail...

https://richardwiseman.wordpress.com/2011/03/02/another-creepy-ghost-photo/

 

[Ann K]

My point being that pareidolia can create extremely life-like faces until you look in more detail...

What a pity that people don't notice this until much later ...or they could just shift a couple of feet to the left and take another photo. But it seems to be axiomatic that the ghost-proponent viewers never notice anything at the time! I'd have been tempted to go down to Ravenna (just a few miles from me) and take another pic. But the fact that you "spent hours arguing" is indicative of so many people who would rather have a good story than a debunk.

 

[Scaramanga]

What a pity that people don't notice this until much later ...or they could just shift a couple of feet to the left and take another photo. But it seems to be axiomatic that the ghost-proponent viewers never notice anything at the time! I'd have been tempted to go down to Ravenna (just a few miles from me) and take another pic. But the fact that you "spent hours arguing" is indicative of so many people who would rather have a good story than a debunk.

After much arguing, I did finally get the taker of that photo to admit that the 'ghost' was in the same position as the doorway to their 'library'. Case solved. I think this case is also pareidolia. There is something nobody has mentioned....

It is assumed by most that the girl's hair is blowing in the wind. But I don't think so. I think the hair is sticking out ( and the girl's head leaning to that same side ) because the car is swerving...maybe a sudden lane change. And she captures the exact moment when a load of shopping bags perched on the back seat ( the two 'fingers' being sticks of bread ) all fall over to the right side of the back seat. I agree with the idea posted above that the 'hair' of the alleged person in the back seat is actually the handle straps of the carrier bags.

That would all make this one of the best ever cases of pareidolia.

 

[JMartJr]

( I mean, what 'boy' has white eyebrows ?

A ghost one?

But joking aside,

After much arguing, I did finally get the taker of that photo to admit that the 'ghost' was in the same position as the doorway to their 'library'.

Yeah, that would be conclusive. But it is fascinating how a fuzzy set of not-quite-clear-enough-to-even-call-them-details can fool you. (Well, fool, ME, I am not confessing on behalf of anybody else.) On looking at the pic initially, I did notice the blue thing is actually on the windowsill, but then went astray. But looking at this circled bit

that looked to me enough like writing to conclude the face was in fact a face, but on a TV screen, with the show title partially obscured by the window grilles. Which is wrong, unless the person has a BIG TV in the library!

 

[AmberRobot]

A ghost one?

But joking aside,

Yeah, that would be conclusive. But it is fascinating how a fuzzy set of not-quite-clear-enough-to-even-call-them-details can fool you. (Well, fool, ME, I am not confessing on behalf of anybody else.) On looking at the pic initially, I did notice the blue thing is actually on the windowsill, but then went astray. But looking at this circled bit

that looked to me enough like writing to conclude the face was in fact a face, but on a TV screen, with the show title partially obscured by the window grilles. Which is wrong, unless the person has a BIG TV in the library!

In this photo it looks part of the face is in front of the curtains, which would seem to make it more likely a reflection off the window pane.

 

[deirdre]

In this photo it looks part of the face is in front of the curtains, which would seem to make it more likely a reflection off the window pane.

it's a sheer curtain with a lacey overlay. look at the full house photo.

I think the hair is sticking out ( and the girl's head leaning to that same side ) because the car is swerving...maybe a sudden lane change.

that sounds like a stretch.

 

[Mendel]

In this photo it looks part of the face is in front of the curtains, which would seem to make it more likely a reflection off the window pane.

Because the curtains are translucent.

By the same token, some Flat Earthers believe the sun passes in front of clouds sometimes.

 

[Scaramanga]

A ghost one?

But joking aside,

Yeah, that would be conclusive. But it is fascinating how a fuzzy set of not-quite-clear-enough-to-even-call-them-details can fool you. (Well, fool, ME, I am not confessing on behalf of anybody else.) On looking at the pic initially, I did notice the blue thing is actually on the windowsill, but then went astray. But looking at this circled bit

that looked to me enough like writing to conclude the face was in fact a face, but on a TV screen, with the show title partially obscured by the window grilles. Which is wrong, unless the person has a BIG TV in the library!

I finally realised exactly what one is seeing....it is SO obvious once one is given a single bit of info. A definitive answer.....

The face is a reflection off either the window or a mirror inside. It is a reflection of the house on the other side of the road. The 'eyes' are the windows of the house. Notice how above the 'eyes' the skin of the ghost turns to grey....that is the roof of the house. That is why the colour changes. The seemingly white 'eyebrows' are the white guttering of the house.

But here is the absolute clincher. The thing which, once spotted, cannot be unseen. Just to the right of the top of the candle is....the reflection of a car ! With the front of the car facing generally towards you. A white car with a black grille to it....and you can see the entire bonnet and front window and roof. The 'mouth' of the ghost is actually the darkened car windscreen. Once your mind grasps it as a car it is so obvious that that's exactly what it is.

Once you've been told that's a car, the pareidolia just disappears....and it is obvious the 'ghost' is a reflection off the window, probably showing the owner's own car and the house opposite.

 

[deirdre]

The 'mouth' of the ghost is actually the darkened car windscreen. Once your mind grasps it as a car it is so obvious that that's exactly what it is.

im kinda seeing the side of a white pick up truck parked ont he road. (assuming the house across the way was beige with white shutters at time of photo. although both google maps and the Cleveland News 5 report on FB says 2013.




not sure about angles, the neighbor does have a white pick up.
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.156...4!1s0ivJYE_Quk88IeHo84SRLQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

 

[Ann K]

The face is a reflection off either the window or a mirror inside. It is a reflection of the house on the other side of the road.

Wouldn't that require the glass of the window to be significantly at a strange angle, in order to get that amount of tilt to the face? That's true for any reflection from either the inside or the outside.

 

[deirdre]

Wouldn't that require the glass of the window to be significantly at a strange angle, in order to get that amount of tilt to the face? That's true for any reflection from either the inside or the outside.

the house is not directly across the street. both the brown house (with windows that could match the white eyebrows) or the white house, are at angles to the window.

 

[Ann K]

the house is not directly across the street. both the brown house (with windows that could match the white eyebrows) or the white house, are at angles to the window.

That might give it some amount of perspective (i.e. one end of a reflection would appear smaller than the other), but not the tilt of the "face".

 

[deirdre]

but not the tilt of the "face".

by tilt you mean because one 'eyebrow' is higher than the other?

 

[deirdre]

it might be too small too.. heres the white house across the street reflecting the white house next to the ghost house. the reflected house is big

 

[Scaramanga]

im kinda seeing the side of a white pick up truck parked ont he road. (assuming the house across the way was beige with white shutters at time of photo. although both google maps and the Cleveland News 5 report on FB says 2013.




not sure about angles, the neighbor does have a white pick up.
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.156...4!1s0ivJYE_Quk88IeHo84SRLQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

To me the red circled object below is very obviously a car....but yes, you got the white above the 'eyes' and even the 'nose' in your example. The 'tilt' of the alleged eyebrows could be explained if the house being seen is itself at a slight angle, with one window actually being closer.

Don't forget also that the reflection would be back to front....which ties up with the car being in the driveway of the house, which from the road is on the left hand side but in the reflection would be on the right hand side. It all ties up pretty well with a reflection of the house across the road..and a car in its driveway. In fact if you look really closely you can even see that the rightmost 'eye' is partitioned into 4 segments with white lines....just like the windows of the house.

The story was much earlier than 2013....as there is a lengthy discussion between me and various believers on a forum as far back as 2009.

 

[Ann K]

by tilt you mean because one 'eyebrow' is higher than the other?

Eyes, mouth, eyebrows, nose ...the whole face is tilted to its right.

 

[deirdre]

The story was much earlier than 2013....as there is a lengthy discussion between me and various believers on a forum as far back as 2009.

do you have a dated source for that? i ask because this "Ghost Detector" app ghost girl looks remarkably similar with her crooked mouth and plumped out cheek
https://www.amazon.com/Eduxdream-Ghost-Detector/dp/B008NPC5G6

its a free download, if you put such things on your phone and want to play with it. i dont trust such apps so i can't try it.

 

[Scaramanga]

do you have a dated source for that? i ask because this "Ghost Detector" app ghost girl looks remarkably similar with her crooked mouth and plumped out cheek
https://www.amazon.com/Eduxdream-Ghost-Detector/dp/B008NPC5G6

its a free download, if you put such things on your phone and want to play with it. i dont trust such apps so i can't try it.

Yes, I have the original posting of the photo from April 4th 2009 ( which would appear to be a year after the photo was taken )....and note that the commentator 'Peter' on this ghosts forum is actually me, debunking the photo with pretty much the same debunk put forward here....all the way back in 2009. In fact the responses to my 36 replies show the believer frame of mind very well indeed. Even when presented with the square eyes and other oddities, the believers cannot bring themselves to question it...

https://scienceofghosts.wordpress.com/2009/04/04/ghost-in-the-house/

 

[Scaramanga]

Eyes, mouth, eyebrows, nose ...the whole face is tilted to its right.

The 'face' is tilted, but curiously the lines of pixels that make up that face are not....when you zoom in. For example the white eyebrows on the right, and the bottom of the eye on the right, both make a straight line that is level and not tilted. This would not happen if it was a genuine tilted face. So in fact there really is no 'tilt' at all....it is simply that the rightmost 'eye' appears higher up than the leftmost one.

Note that the top of the head exactly matches the outline of the archway that is there. If you look at the picture showing the entire house, you can see there is an identical archway in the room on the other side of the house.

 

[Ann K]

The 'face' is tilted, but curiously the lines of pixels that make up that face are not....when you zoom in. For example the white eyebrows on the right, and the bottom of the eye on the right, both make a straight line that is level and not tilted. This would not happen if it was a genuine tilted face.

I disagree. The position of pixels in an image is determined by the camera, and lines of pixels are ALWAYS going to be on a straight grid regardless of the shape of the object being photographed. There's nothing curious about that. Here are the flowers in front of the window:And here is the face, with the straight lines of pixels "stepping down" across the brow from eye to eye:

 

[deirdre]

https://scienceofghosts.wordpress.com/2009/04/04/ghost-in-the-house/

that link was helpful.
and reminded me of the levelor looking slots on the window.

we are absolutely seeing the WHITE house across the street reflected. the levelor looking slots acrss the entire windows is the clapboard and the blue hting could well be this chair.


they even have a little cowboy sculpture on the porch [red arrow] ...which no i dont think is the ghost.. i still think the boy was scamming his mom with an app just because of the lighting of the so called face.

 

[Scaramanga]

I disagree. The position of pixels in an image is determined by the camera, and lines of pixels are ALWAYS going to be on a straight grid regardless of the shape of the object being photographed. There's nothing curious about that. Here are the flowers in front of the window:And here is the face, with the straight lines of pixels "stepping down" across the brow from eye to eye:

I have to disagree. Sure, the pixels of any object will by definition be in a straight line. However the issue here is not simply that they are in a straight line but the number of pixels of similar or equal 'strength' that are all in a straight line. When I look at your flower example, there are pixels of similar strength crossing 3 or 4 different lines. Whereas with the 'eyebrow' it shows very little, if any, deviation in strength across a width of 12 pixels and the center line of pixels is remarkably consistent. This suggests a genuine horizontal straight line, as if there was any actual tilt you would see much more of a bleed into the lines above and below the center line. Same applies to the edge and bottom of the rightmost 'eye'...which to me is clearly a square object as if it was genuinely round I'd expect to see more bleed into surrounding pixels.

 

[Scaramanga]

I have to disagree. Sure, the pixels of any object will by definition be in a straight line. However the issue here is not simply that they are in a straight line but the number of pixels of similar or equal 'strength' that are all in a straight line. When I look at your flower example, there are pixels of similar strength crossing 3 or 4 different lines. Whereas with the 'eyebrow' it shows very little, if any, deviation in strength across a width of 12 pixels and the center line of pixels is remarkably consistent. This suggests a genuine horizontal straight line, as if there was any actual tilt you would see much more of a bleed into the lines above and below the center line. Same applies to the edge and bottom of the rightmost 'eye'...which to me is clearly a square object as if it was genuinely round I'd expect to see more bleed into surrounding pixels.

Here's what happens if I rotate the picture 10 degrees, to make the 'eyes' level. I think this makes my point that the 'eyebrow' has to be a genuine horizontal straight line...as I would otherwise expect significant bleed across 3 or 4 lines if it was actually crossing those 3 or 4 lines....

 

[Ann K]

However the issue here is not simply that they are in a straight line but the number of pixels of similar or equal 'strength' that are all in a straight line. When I look at your flower example, there are pixels of similar strength crossing 3 or 4 different lines. Whereas with the 'eyebrow' it shows very little, if any, deviation in strength across a width of 12 pixels and the center line of pixels is remarkably consistent

I don't see that. Here is one eye (our left, the "face's" right) with the contrast boosted a little bit to make it more distinct. There's a definite gradient of values across the eyebrow. Nevertheless, your tilted picture looks more than ever like a window reflection, not an eye.

 

[JMartJr]

Should the Ravenna window-ghost be moved into its own thread? ZThere seems to be enough to say about it, and whatever it is it is a different phenoomenon than the original back seat "ghost" that started this thread (unless they are both actually ghosts, I guess.)

 

[Z.W. Wolf]

that link was helpful.
and reminded me of the levelor looking slots on the window.

we are absolutely seeing the WHITE house across the street reflected. the levelor looking slots acrss the entire windows is the clapboard and the blue hting could well be this chair.


they even have a little cowboy sculpture on the porch [red arrow] ...which no i dont think is the ghost.. i still think the boy was scamming his mom with an app just because of the lighting of the so called face.

Can you give a link to the street view?

 

[deirdre]

Can you give a link to the street view?

it's up in post #9
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.156...4!1s0ivJYE_Quk88IeHo84SRLQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656