Please tell me these are contrails.

Gary Cook

Active Member
Hi guys.

I need some reassurance please.

I was suffering from depression in winter because I wanted it to be sunny and now it is sunny I feel ill even looking at these.

It is a bad place to be.

I am not trying to convince anybody. I am beyond that. I actually want this just to be contrails but they look even 'worse' with the naked eye. :(


 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
It looks largely like natural clouds, and not contrails. It's hard to say though, as contrails can trigger the growth of sheets of cirrus clouds.

I see one small contrail on the right, and possibly some contrail tracks through the cloud layer. However it's entirely possible for a scene just like this to have formed before planes were invented. Compare with old books on clouds, look at photos of cirrus clouds and cirrostratus. See these from 1905:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/metabunk/sets/72157644761523016/
 
J

Joe

Guest
Hi guys.

I need some reassurance please.

I was suffering from depression in winter because I wanted it to be sunny and now it is sunny I feel ill even looking at these.

It is a bad place to be.

I am not trying to convince anybody. I am beyond that. I actually want this just to be contrails but they look even 'worse' with the naked eye. :(


Looks like 1 Cloud and upper level contrail cirrus clouds as they are called now . ( contrails that have lingered and spread out over time ) Nothing that will bother you other then a ugly haze .
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
You also have to look at the bigger picture.
https://earthdata.nasa.gov/labs/wor...-07&map=-10.561035,47.39209,5.320801,56.67334



You are in the South of England. The above photo is from today, look like you've got a wide variety of cloud types in the sky. But look at the scale of the weather systems. These seem to be natural clouds.

If you want to feel better about it, I'd recommend taking up cloudspotting - trying to spot all the varieties of clouds (which includes contrails now). There's even an app for that:
http://cloudspotterapp.com/
 

Gary Cook

Active Member
Thanks guys. They seemed to be seeded by the trails of the planes as i have watched them over the day. maybe I should time lapse that sometimes to check.

I feel sorry for people that feel like me about them but dont have you folk to turn to for rationality.

I really felt bad. I only went to the shop for a pint of milk and came back feeling really anxious and depressed.

This should be a good time for me. It is summer and I just got a new job but I feel really paranoid of this phenomenon, if it can be called that.
 
J

Joe

Guest
Thanks guys. They seemed to be seeded by the trails of the planes as i have watched them over the day. maybe I should time lapse that sometimes to check.

I feel sorry for people that feel like me about them but dont have you folk to turn to for rationality.

I really felt bad. I only went to the shop for a pint of milk and came back feeling really anxious and depressed.
Im kind of the conspiracy the when its comes to the Contrail thing . But Im telling you there is nothing to worry about . Enjoy your day .
 

Gary Cook

Active Member
Im kind of the conspiracy the when its comes to the Contrail thing . But Im telling you there is nothing to worry about . Enjoy your day .

Its the way they look that freaks me out. Dry and opaque. Almost dusty. Although maybe at least part of that is my imagination.

Anyway I wont go on about it. I genuinely needed the support today. Thanks.
 
Last edited:

Balance

Senior Member.
We (UK) are currently having high pressure with fairly strong winds with rain and thunder mixed in so there's a lot of high cirrus being sheared all around. I quite liked seeing them yesterday all around and almost took some photo's but was kinda busy really.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
The high level clouds are essentially made of a fine "dust" of ice. Pretty much pure water. They are about 6-8 miles above you.
 

JFDee

Senior Member.
Gary, you could also try change your perspective and see beauty in these clouds - or at least interesting structures and patterns.

Imagine a month or a year with a blue, spotless sky for every single day. Wouldn't that be boring after a while?

I personally like the stretches most where the weather is constantly changing the appearance of the sky. A uniformly blue sky is as dull as a uniform cloud layer to me.

Edit: And even contrails can add to the richness of structure and be interesting.
 
Last edited:

David Fraser

Senior Member.
Thanks guys. They seemed to be seeded by the trails of the planes as i have watched them over the day. maybe I should time lapse that sometimes to check.

I feel sorry for people that feel like me about them but dont have you folk to turn to for rationality.

I really felt bad. I only went to the shop for a pint of milk and came back feeling really anxious and depressed.

This should be a good time for me. It is summer and I just got a new job but I feel really paranoid of this phenomenon, if it can be called that.
If you have been or are feeling depressed I would advise a visit to your GP.
 

TWCobra

Senior Member.
I fly in them all the time Gary. If anyone was going to get ill from them it would be people like me.

This was shot two weeks ago.


P.S. I would be happy to fly inside one of these. The reason why we were offset was due to the turbulence you can get behind a 747. As you can see the spiral from the crow instability descends the fastest and we would have been flying inside that at the distance we were behind the 747.
 

Gary Cook

Active Member
I still stand by that that these were virtually non-existent when I was younger. For example, they have only just started appearing frequently in cartoons and video games. Maybe it was partly just a design thing but clouds like these were rarely in any media like that and now they seem very common.

Not making any claims. Just giving my experience.

I appreciate the rationality as nobody should feel how I felt and I am quite a rational person myself so gawd knows how some other people cope.
 

David Fraser

Senior Member.
I still stand by that that these were virtually non-existent when I was younger. For example, they have only just started appearing frequently in cartoons and video games. Maybe it was partly just a design thing but clouds like these were rarely in any media like that and now they seem very common.

Not making any claims. Just giving my experience.

I appreciate the rationality as nobody should feel how I felt and I am quite a rational person myself so gawd knows how some other people cope.

If you was rational you would have seen a GP.
See a GP
 

MikeC

Closed Account
I still stand by that that these were virtually non-existent when I was younger. For example, they have only just started appearing frequently in cartoons and video games. Maybe it was partly just a design thing but clouds like these were rarely in any media like that and now they seem very common.

Not making any claims. Just giving my experience.

There is no doubt they were rarer years ago.

that doesn't make them anything different now except more common.
 

Belfrey

Senior Member.
Maybe like 10 years ago. Anyway It was just annecdotal. If I thought they were just clouds I wouldnt of been scared of them would I.
Exactly right - and as of 10 years ago, the "chemtrails" conspiracy theory had already been bouncing around the internet for several years.
 

WeedWhacker

Senior Member
I still stand by that that these were virtually non-existent when I was younger. For example, they have only just started appearing frequently in cartoons and video games. Maybe it was partly just a design thing but clouds like these were rarely in any media like that and now they seem very common.

Not making any claims. Just giving my experience.

I appreciate the rationality as nobody should feel how I felt and I am quite a rational person myself so gawd knows how some other people cope.

Sorry, Gary, but your recollection of younger ages is flawed....it is called "selective memory" and has been extensively studied.

Also, the idea of clouds "appearing" suddenly, as if by some evil intent, in social media is another false notion.


Perhaps if you perused the Internet using those (and similar) terms, it would help to alleviate your anxiety, and some misconceptions?
 

SR1419

Senior Member.
I still stand by that that these were virtually non-existent when I was younger. For example, they have only just started appearing frequently in cartoons and video games. Maybe it was partly just a design thing but clouds like these were rarely in any media like that and now they seem very common.

Are you referring to clouds similar to that which you posted or persistent linear contrails?

Can you show an example of clouds like the ones in your picture in media today?

Both persistent contrails and clouds like you photographed existed when you were younger.

Contrails likely appeared in media in correlation with the amount they appeared in the sky- but they did appear.

http://contrailscience.com/twilight-zone-contrails/

Mick already posted these pictures of clouds almost identical to the ones you posted from over 100 years ago.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/metabunk/sets/72157644761523016/
 

savvo

New Member
Maybe like 10 years ago. Anyway It was just annecdotal. If I thought they were just clouds I wouldnt of been scared of them would I.

If you want some more anecdotes, 40+ years ago when I was a plane-obsessed kid I would see contrails whenever the clouds allowed. If there are more today it's only because there are far more flights than there were back then.

I can see Newcastle International Airport from my bedroom window; the sky here is clear and blue today.
 

Pete Tar

Senior Member.
What is your opinion on chemtrails Gary? You seem to give the idea a lot of credit if your reaction to the sky shown here is any indication, but I previously had the impression you had decided against their likelihood because of what you read on the basics of contrails and some of the arguments against the logistics involved here.
But you seem to have regressed?
And the talk of contrails in pop culture and whether they are more common now misses the point that those were actually just clouds.
As was suggested before, if you change your understanding of the forces involved (ie, absorb some simple meteorology) you can change your reaction to one of appreciation and not dread. High clouds made of fine ice particles are really beautiful and often have the most interesting forms.
That you expereinced a negative reaction to something so natural is wrong, and makes me sad (by wrong I mean, whoever implanted the suggestion that these are poisoning you is really awful and is not contributing to the enrichment of society at all - what was done to you (and others) to make you feel that way is just really wrong ).
 

Gary Cook

Active Member
Sorry, Gary, but your recollection of younger ages is flawed....it is called "selective memory" and has been extensively studied.

Also, the idea of clouds "appearing" suddenly, as if by some evil intent, in social media is another false notion.


Perhaps if you perused the Internet using those (and similar) terms, it would help to alleviate your anxiety, and some misconceptions?

Why because you said so and your words are magic?
 

Gary Cook

Active Member
What is your opinion on chemtrails Gary? You seem to give the idea a lot of credit if your reaction to the sky shown here is any indication, but I previously had the impression you had decided against their likelihood because of what you read on the basics of contrails and some of the arguments against the logistics involved here.
But you seem to have regressed?
And the talk of contrails in pop culture and whether they are more common now misses the point that those were actually just clouds.
As was suggested before, if you change your understanding of the forces involved (ie, absorb some simple meteorology) you can change your reaction to one of appreciation and not dread. High clouds made of fine ice particles are really beautiful and often have the most interesting forms.
That you expereinced a negative reaction to something so natural is wrong, and makes me sad (by wrong I mean, whoever implanted the suggestion that these are poisoning you is really awful and is not contributing to the enrichment of society at all - what was done to you (and others) to make you feel that way is just really wrong ).

Thanks for the concern man. This forum and it's members has helped me put it and other things in to perspective.

As long as I dont look at them I am fine.
 

Pete Tar

Senior Member.
As long as I dont look at them I am fine.
But that's not a solution, you should be taking joy in the world around you, not blocking it out. You should get to the root of the problem and yank it out of your life!
Just my opinion though, do whatever gets you by, don't mean to be preachy.
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
But that's not a solution, you should be taking joy in the world around you, not blocking it out. You should get to the root of the problem and yank it out of your life!
Just my opinion though, do whatever gets you by, don't mean to be preachy.
it is a beautiful picture.
 

Efftup

Senior Member.
no, it is very true they do not look quite the same as they used to. (well they do but bear with me on this one)
BUT, and it's a big but. (as opposed to a big butt which I like and I cannot lie) if you saw the posts on Contrail science or elsewhere round the internet if you did some research in the right places, you can see just how much the air traffic has increased over the last 30 years.

When I was a kid, I used to look at the skies and the clouds. I do remember thinking as I watched the clouds move overhead that this was because of the rotation of the Earth. I completely didn't take WIND into account, showing just how easy it is to get entirely the wrong end of the stick on something. I do remember contrails that persisted for a long time. I therefore have a first hand account of this from approx 35 years ago.

I think the difference today, is not that contrails persist, because it is clear they always have done, but because there are so many more of them that they make patterns and when the wind blows them about, it makes the big haze that seems to disturb and upset so many people today. This is clearly a concern that needs looking at. How much difference is this extra pollution to the planet doing to the climate and the ecosystem? it does need studying, and it is being.

Jumping to the conclusion there s some kind of spraying program going on with no evidence other than the trails themselves, which individually don't look any different to the way they did seems ridiculous to me, but I know how the lawyer type arguments work from those who PROMOTE these conspiracies.

I always think that if the rich super Elite (assuming they ARE human) wanted some kind of mind control/depopulation program, and bearing in mind they won't waste money un-necessarily, why would they embark on a highly visible program from such a height as to make the whole program hopelessly inefficient and wasteful, when they could just put something in the water? (all the rich guys drink bottled water after all)
 

Efftup

Senior Member.
I am not trying to promote any kind of water based conspiracy either, but by applying some common sense to the ideas put forward by conspiracy theory and putting yourself in the position of those who supposedly are in them can often be very interesting and highly enlightening.
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
I think the difference today, is not that contrails persist, because it is clear they always have done, but because there are so many more of them that they make patterns and when the wind blows them about, it makes the big haze that seems to disturb and upset so many people today. This is clearly a concern that needs looking at. How much difference is this extra pollution to the planet doing to the climate and the ecosystem? it does need studying, and it is being
"the big haze" is only in a few locations though. Most places on earth don't have the patchwork of contrails the chemtrail crowd keeps reposting as if it's happening everywhere.

Garys wispy feathered clouds (which are gorgeous) are not contrail haze. You can see they are ABOVE the teeny tiny little contrail in the upper right corner. It's not even remotely possible the feathered clouds are from contrails. I'm only pointing this out so you don't freak Gary out more with what you're saying.

plane exhaust accounts for 4-5% of pollution (as is documented somewhere on this site). If Gary really wants to be freaked out by pollution he should see the "coal burning plant" maps in UK ; / Planes are such a minor part of the world's pollution problems.
 

Efftup

Senior Member.
Absolutely. If you want to worry about pollution, look at a coal fired power station or the exhaust from cars which are much closer and you actually WILL be breathing in on the ground.
 

JesseCuster

Active Member
For example, they have only just started appearing frequently in cartoons and video games.
Are you seriously suggesting that the appearances of particular types of cloud formations in cartoons and video games over time has any relevance to the prevalence of those clouds in reality?

When I was a kid there were no realistic looking clouds at all in video games. Games like Super Mario had big puffy looking pixellated cumulus clouds and no other types of cloud. Should we gauge that as an indication that clouds in 1985 were bigger and more pixellated and whiter and more puffy than in 2014?

On a more serious note (and it's hard to take seriously the idea that one person's vague opinion about the types of clouds in video games over time means anything) , if you don't actively make note of something like the skies, it's easy to be convinced that it has changed. Look at all the idiots on the Internet who have been convinced that the sun is setting in the wrong place these days. Are they right because they don't remember the sun setting so far north or south or whatever when they were kids? Or are they just clueless and never paid any attention in the first place to the natural cycle of where the sun rises and sets over the course of a year in their locality?
 

WeedWhacker

Senior Member
.....if you don't actively make note of something like the skies, it's easy to be convinced that it has changed.

THAT (^^^) is an excellent point, and one that I sometimes offer as a suggestion to people.

It isn't easy, but I suggest people who "worry" that the skies have "changed" keep a log...or diary...or some such record.

Because, it usually (as previously pointed out, up-thread) comes down to a "memory bias" effect. We all do that, it is Human nature, and is part of the 'burden' we bear, in modern society, since we evolved on the savanna, and thus have some certain "hard-wired" connections IN our brains.
 

cloudspotter

Senior Member.

deirdre

Senior Member.
Not really. It doesn't have much of the regular pattern associated with that kind of sky
yea the altitude in the article didnt seem right. so they would need to be clumpier to be mackeral skies...only wondering cause i like weather ditties.
 
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