NASA photo captures strange bright light seemingly coming out of Mars

[Balance]

From http://www.chron.com/news/strange-w...tures-strange-bright-light-coming-5382677.php


My spidey senses are tingling on this one. (Must have been a misfire) A google image search found a link to http://paranormal-news.ru/news/stolb_sveta_nochju_na_marse/2014-04-07-8815 a UFO/Alien orientated russian site AFAICT. I certainly didn't find a nasa link, as the original article claims it came from.

I also suspect a photo-shop of an original landscape photo but am not experienced enough to find it

 

[Trailspotter]

A google image search found a link to http://paranormal-news.ru/news/stolb_sveta_nochju_na_marse/2014-04-07-8815 a UFO/Alien orientated russian site AFAICT. I certainly didn't find a nasa link, as the original article claims it came from.

I also suspect a photo-shop of an original landscape photo but am not experienced enough to find it

There is a link to the image at the NASA site in the youtube video linked from this russian site. It does contain a bright vertical dash. I do not think that it is coming from the martian surface, more likely it is a kind of imaging artefact.

 

[Pete Tar]

I've been reading the thread on ATS about it - most likely it is a cosmic ray hitting the sensor. This is one half of a stereo set-up, the flash does not appear in the other which would have been taken at the same time.

(not sure on policy of posting material from other forums, but here's the main points anyway)

Credit to ATS user Ananake for this gif.

Credit to ATS user zetnom for this set comparing a known cosmic ray strike to the mars photo.



The cosmic ray theory is facing some baffling resistance from the thread poster however.
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread1006540/pg7&mem=

 

[Trailspotter]

This is one half of a stereo set-up, the flash does not appear in the other which would have been taken at the same time.

I've made a stereo image from the two halves; the base of the "flash" sits at the elevated ground (edge of a crater?) that seems to be not far away from the camera, as one may assume by looking at a single 2D image. In principle, it would be possible to calculate the distance to the "flash" from the distance between the left and right navigation cameras of "Curiosity". Where could one find these measurements?

 

[Mick West]

From the raw image enlarged without filtering.


The vertical row and symmetrical nature of the "flash" make some kind of sensor glitch seem likely. It seems more like a single pixel that has overflowed.

Some kind of meteorite impact would be pretty cool though.

 

[Mick West]

NASA's detailed theories about the flash:
http://www.nbcnews.com/science/space/nasa-explains-martian-flash-its-not-what-you-think-n74931

 

[WeedWhacker]

NASA's detailed theories about the flash...

Well....it's dashed my hopes that it was "John Carter of Mars" flashing his toothy grin, and sunlight reflecting off it!!

 

[Pete Tar]

Well I guess that does actually make a cosmic ray unlikely, being the same effect was seen the day before in a very similar position.

 

[Pete Tar]

A useful gif from ATS user Blue Shift.

It may turn out the OP of that thread was right to deny the cosmic ray theory, but certainly not in the way they reasoned against it.
eg...

There still hasn't been one response as to why the operator of the Rover decided to take a HUGE exposure time to take that picture. There is absolutely NO reason for the NAV-Cams to take such long exposure times, and normally the shutter speed of both are between .25 seconds-30 seconds. Neither of which would allow for the capture of ANY cosmic ray.
...
Once you factor in that these cameras have a 99% Quantum Efficiency (the ability to convert Protons into Electrons such as these CCD cameras do)....there is NO WAY enough electrons were corrupted in that photograph to be able to manipulate all of the pixels that are showing light. Especially in conjunction with the ICER program which scrubs corrupted data packets before sending them through space, and with the THREE BANDPASS filters on each lense to STOP the cams from capturing cosmic ray light.

Do those of you who still foster the cosmic ray theory think that NASA is stupid enough to just send run of the mill digital cameras to MARS?? Did they just code ICER for the fun of it knowing it wouldn't work? Did the scientists decide to use 3 bandpass filters on each camera just because it sounds cool? NO. They used these safe-gaurds explicitly because the NAV-CAMS are the first line of defense against the Rover hitting anything. Dead pixels, blooming, cosmic rays, anything that corrupts data is so detrimental that they included those extras to WORK ALL THE TIME...not just once in awhile.

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Curiosity Mastcam raw image showing the Earth in the Martian twilight sky on Jan. 31, 2014 amidst numerous cosmic ray strikes. . Credit: NASA/JPL-Caltech/MSSS
http://www.universetoday.com/109095...tys-1st-photo-of-home-planet-earth-from-mars/

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Although mastcam is a different camera from the stereo navigation cameras, I doubt the stereo nav cams have some technology that makes them immune to cosmic ray strikes that mastcam doesn't.

 

[Soulfly]

Here it is from the JPL site.
http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.php?release=2014-108

 

[deirdre]

this guy found another glint from the cam, but im not really sure what it means ; ) http://www.unmannedspaceflight.com/index.php?showtopic=7825&view=findpost&p=208735

 

[Jason]

Here it is from the JPL site.
http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news.php?release=2014-108

I think the team leader from JPL says it best;

"In the thousands of images we've received from Curiosity, we see ones with bright spots nearly every week," said Justin Maki of NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif., leader of the team that built and operates the Navigation Camera. "These can be caused by cosmic-ray hits or sunlight glinting from rock surfaces, as the most likely explanations."

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and I also think its just sun light reflecting off of a rock.

 

[cosmic]

Over the last decade, I've been repeatedly disheartened by the fact that "ordinary" pictures sent back from Mars apparently aren't interesting enough.

 

[Jason]

this guy found another glint from the cam, but im not really sure what it means ; ) http://www.unmannedspaceflight.com/index.php?showtopic=7825&view=findpost&p=208735

I think it means, as also noted by a team leader associated with the mission, that these "glints" aren't all that uncommon on the surface of mars due to reflections or cosmic rays. I don't understand the Cosmic Ray "theory" because they probably wouldn't be detectable from a camera like the ones being used for these photos. The cosmic ray would appear on the lens, not in the distance. Cosmic says it best,

Over the last decade, I've been repeatedly disheartened by the fact that "ordinary" pictures sent back from Mars apparently aren't interesting enough.

 

[cosmic]

I don't understand the Cosmic Ray "theory" because they probably wouldn't be detectable from a camera like the ones being used for these photos. The cosmic ray would appear on the lens, not in the distance.

A "cosmic ray hit" describes a portion of the camera's CCD sensor taking a direct impact from a subatomic particle, rather than a distant astronomical event being captured in the instrument's field of view.

 

[Pete Tar]

I don't understand the Cosmic Ray "theory" because they probably wouldn't be detectable from a camera like the ones being used for these photos. The cosmic ray would appear on the lens, not in the distance.

Think about that - what difference is there between something appearing on the lens and appearing to be in the distance? In either case it's a blip on the picture. There's nothing to indicate a 3rd dimension.The idea this is in the distance is maybe due to a simple optical illusion. Try seeing it as being on the lens. (That is a bit misleading though as it's not on the lens, it's actually hitting the internal sensor.)
It's been stated that they see cosmic ray hits every week and are well used to them.
Look at this picture at ground level, apparently that is cosmic rays. They show up easier at night because of longer exposures, and they have different directions and intensities. The one in the picture in question would have just been a particularly bright one.

This is what a storm of them look like on the solar cameras.

 

[Pete Tar]

I'm pretty sure this ifls article is getting some details wrong in the explanation.

even though these images were each taken one second after the ones on the right:
...
The most logical explanation is that cosmic rays passed through a leak in the camera’s vent, causing the light to appear on the image.
http://www.iflscience.com/space/image-curiosity-rover-reveals-mysterious-light

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That kind of merges the two theories with each other. The camera vent isn't an issue for the cosmic ray which can pass through the rover easily (?), but it would apply if it were an actual ray of light from the sun hitting the lens.
Can't find a reference for the navcam photo synch time, but I thought it was fractions of second, virtually in unison.

 

[deirdre]

I'm pretty sure this ifls article is getting some details wrong in the explanation.
Can't find a reference for the navcam photo synch time, but I thought it was fractions of second, virtually in unison.

if you mean do the right and left snap pics at the same time, it seems it varies. I only checked out 2 instances (by comparing time stamps). I assume the stamps are when th e pics are taken and not when they are uploaded?

sol 593
Navcam: Left B
2014-04-07 13:30:07 UTC
Navcam: Right B
2014-04-07 13:29:36 UTC

sol 591
Navcam: Left B
2014-04-05 09:58:01 UTC
Navcam: Right B
2014-04-05 09:58:01 UTC
http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/msl/multimedia/raw/

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[Pete Tar]

Well that's a simple answer - if the timestamp represents the moment pictures are taken then they are the same for the april 3rd ones.
Nav Right B 10.00.03

Nav Left B 10.00.03
http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/msl/multimedia/raw/?rawid=NLB_449790582EDR_F0310000NCAM00262M_&s=589
(I can't hyperlink two consecutive links, a new bug?)

But somewhat annoyingly, the quote from Maki says

but not in images taken within a second of each of those

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which implies it's not simultaneous, but it's certainly different from 'one second after' as ifls said.

 

[jonnyH]

A useful gif from ATS user Blue Shift.

It may turn out the OP of that thread was right to deny the cosmic ray theory, but certainly not in the way they reasoned against it.
eg...

There still hasn't been one response as to why the operator of the Rover decided to take a HUGE exposure time to take that picture. There is absolutely NO reason for the NAV-Cams to take such long exposure times, and normally the shutter speed of both are between .25 seconds-30 seconds. Neither of which would allow for the capture of ANY cosmic ray.
...
Once you factor in that these cameras have a 99% Quantum Efficiency (the ability to convert Protons into Electrons such as these CCD cameras do)....there is NO WAY enough electrons were corrupted in that photograph to be able to manipulate all of the pixels that are showing light. Especially in conjunction with the ICER program which scrubs corrupted data packets before sending them through space, and with the THREE BANDPASS filters on each lense to STOP the cams from capturing cosmic ray light.

Do those of you who still foster the cosmic ray theory think that NASA is stupid enough to just send run of the mill digital cameras to MARS?? Did they just code ICER for the fun of it knowing it wouldn't work? Did the scientists decide to use 3 bandpass filters on each camera just because it sounds cool? NO. They used these safe-gaurds explicitly because the NAV-CAMS are the first line of defense against the Rover hitting anything. Dead pixels, blooming, cosmic rays, anything that corrupts data is so detrimental that they included those extras to WORK ALL THE TIME...not just once in awhile.

Content from external source

Curiosity Mastcam raw image showing the Earth in the Martian twilight sky on Jan. 31, 2014 amidst numerous cosmic ray strikes. . Credit: NASA/JPL-Caltech/MSSS
http://www.universetoday.com/109095...tys-1st-photo-of-home-planet-earth-from-mars/

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Although mastcam is a different camera from the stereo navigation cameras, I doubt the stereo nav cams have some technology that makes them immune to cosmic ray strikes that mastcam doesn't.

Is that a contrail in the second image of the gif? on Mars?

The mountain range in the background on both images appears remarkably similar despite the different positions of the rover compared to say the variation in the mountain range seen in the gif in post 3 which is only switching between left and right navcams.

 

[WeedWhacker]

The mountain range in the background on both images appears remarkably similar despite the different positions of the rover compared to say the variation in the mountain range seen in the gif in post 3 which is only switching between left and right navcams.

For different reason. Switching between two cameras located near each other (with slightly different "aiming" orientations), versus the parallax difference from simply moving laterally a slight distance.

 

[Jason]

Think about that - what difference is there between something appearing on the lens and appearing to be in the distance? In either case it's a blip on the picture. There's nothing to indicate a 3rd dimension.The idea this is in the distance is maybe due to a simple optical illusion. Try seeing it as being on the lens. (That is a bit misleading though as it's not on the lens, it's actually hitting the internal sensor.)
It's been stated that they see cosmic ray hits every week and are well used to them.
Look at this picture at ground level, apparently that is cosmic rays. They show up easier at night because of longer exposures, and they have different directions and intensities. The one in the picture in question would have just been a particularly bright one.

This is what a storm of them look like on the solar cameras.

I get that Pete and Cosmic, but do you realize what astrophysicist have to go through to catch a cosmic ray in action. Cosmic Rays move at "almost" the speed of light, like .999999999999 times the speed of light. If you were to slow a cosmic ray down so you could collect it, which is impossible, it would like like the matter that makes up you, me and our planet.

http://helios.gsfc.nasa.gov/qa_cr.html

1. Light From Cosmic Rays?
   Several frames from different space-based cameras have shown thin, colored streaks of light. Was this due to cosmic rays?
   You cannot see cosmic rays this way. A cosmic ray particle - most of which are protons - can only produce light by colliding with molecules in the atmosphere and exciting them. Such a collision would produce much too weak a signal to be seen like this. Very sensitive photodetectors (called photomultipliers) are used to measure these type of light levels from cosmic rays, and they need large area mirrors to focus the light onto them.
   
   You can see cosmic ray particles if you use a very thick, sensitive type of film (which we call an emulsion). However, in this case, you do not record a streak of light. The particles you detect are the ones that penetrate through the emulsion causing chemical reactions. These are seen as dark tracks when the emulsions are developed.
   
   I have also read that different astronauts have claimed to have seen what they believe are cosmic rays when they closed their eyes. These were as brief bursts of light. Is this true?
   
   The light astronauts may see when they close their eyes is caused by cosmic rays - but it's produced via a mechanism known as Cherenkov radiation. The particles actually produce the light inside the eyeball.
   
   Dr. Louis Barbier

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In order for us to detect a Cosmic Ray or see one we need to build specific experiments designed to do so. Like Muon Flux, Cloud Chambers, Spark Chamber, and particle accelorators like CERN.

 

[Pete Tar]

Well in essence it's not a visual of the cosmic ray, but the reaction from it hitting the camera's CCD which cause it to register a light spot or streak.
So that information though correct is misleading in this case as he's talking about seeing them directly on Earth, this is an effect of their interaction on Mars. Its lower magnetic field has less effect on them, ours stops more.
(I could be wrong as I'm learning as I go, but that's what I gather)

 

[Jason]

Well in essence it's not a visual of the cosmic ray, but the reaction from it hitting the camera's CCD which cause it to register a light spot or streak.
So that information though correct is misleading in this case as he's talking about seeing them directly on Earth, this is an effect of their interaction on Mars. Its lower magnetic field has less effect on them, ours stops more.
(I could be wrong as I'm learning as I go, but that's what I gather)

But how does one catch a cosmic ray on the camera's CCD? And I'm not trying to be misleading by any means, just trying to get to the bottom of this. I honestly think its a reflections from the sun, but I could be wrong and I'm not an astrophysicist. LOL. In the article from NASA it discussed the components needed to catch a cosmic ray's flash, and I just have an issue with a camera's CCD being able to see this, and on the ground.

 

[Soulfly]

OT but.
Astronauts can see cosmic rays.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_ray_visual_phenomena

Cosmic ray visual phenomena, also referred to as phosphenes or "light flashes", are spontaneous flashes of light visually perceived byastronauts outside the magnetosphere of the Earth, such as during the Apollo program. Researchers believe that cosmic rays are responsible for these flashes of light, though the exact mechanism is unknown. Hypotheses include one or all of: Cherenkov radiation created as the cosmic ray particles pass through the vitreous humor of the astronauts' eyes, direct interaction with the optic nerve, or direct interaction with visual centres in the brain.[1]

Astronauts almost always reported that the flashes were white, with one exception in which the astronaut observed "blue with a white cast, like a blue diamond." There were a few different types of flashes: "spots" and "stars" were observed 66% of the time, "streaks" were observed 25% of the time, and "clouds" were observed 8% of the time.

Once their eyes became adapted to the dark, Apollo astronauts reported seeing this phenomenon once every 2.9 minutes on average. They also reported that they observed the phenomenon more frequently during the transit to the Moon than during the return transit to Earth.

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[Pete Tar]

And I'm not trying to be misleading by any means,

Didn't think so at all, the subject is kind of confusing.

But how does one catch a cosmic ray on the camera's CCD?

Deliberately, one would make a long exposure at night time. Randomly, it just happens to pass through it every now and then at the same time a picture is taken.

 

[WeedWhacker]

Randomly, it just happens to pass through it every now and then at the same time a picture is taken.

Specifically, as I understand it, in one pixel sensor of the CCD or CMOS and yes, by pure coincidence.

Here's something interesting:

DIY: Building a Cloud Chamber (Cosmic Ray Detector)

 

[Soulfly]

Specifically, as I understand it, in one pixel sensor of the CCD or CMOS and yes, by pure coincidence.

Here's something interesting:

DIY: Building a Cloud Chamber (Cosmic Ray Detector)

Looks really cool if you put uranium in the chamber. Though not cosmic rays.

 

[cosmic]

I get that Pete and Cosmic, but do you realize what astrophysicist have to go through to catch a cosmic ray in action.

The FAQ answer you linked is pointing out that the "streaks of light" seen in imagery are not the cosmic rays themselves giving off visible light, but it's neglecting to point out that CCD image artifacts are frequently caused by them. A bit of clarity on the author's part would have helped avoid confusion.

 

[WeedWhacker]

Looks really cool if you put uranium in the chamber.

Yeah, reminds me I'm running low on U238​. Gonna have to stop by "Uranium 'Я Us", can I pick some up for you?

 

[Pete Tar]

Is that a contrail in the second image of the gif? on Mars?

I thought it was a sun flare line but it's just from the cut and paste they did to align the two. That would be awesome though. Would there even be enough atmosphere to support a plane, if it were modified?

 

[WeedWhacker]

Would there even be enough atmosphere to support a plane, if it were modified?

Would be fun, but the atmosphere is so thin compared to Earth's, would be quite an engineering challenge. Of course, no contrails in the traditional usage, since there is virtually no water vapor to speak of.

Average (mean SL equivalent) atmospheric pressure on Mars is only about 6 millibars, compared to 1013.2mb at Sea Level, on Earth.

 

[Pete Tar]

A slightly better explanation of the situation.

Cosmic Rays

It turns out that both cosmic rays and glinting rocks are pretty common on Mars. They've been spotted before. Such rocks have been seen in images sent by several of NASA's Mars rovers, and cosmic rays appear in images that Curiosity sends to Earth each week.

Maki said that one percent of those hundreds of weekly images might include cosmic ray-induced bright spots. But the junked-up pixels normally don't cause much of a stir.

"You'll see cosmic rays every two or three days. Certainly at least once a week," Maki said. "The reason we see so many is because Mars's atmosphere is thinner: It doesn't block as much cosmic radiation as Earth's does."

Cosmic rays are charged particles that fly through the universe in every direction all the time. Every so often they'll collide with something like a camera. One sign of a cosmic ray hit, Maki said, is the appearance of the ray in images taken by one of Curiosity's eyes but not the other.

Glinting rocks, on the other hand, could easily reflect Martian sunlight. But it's not clear why the glimmer would appear just in the right-eye images, Maki said. He notes that one of the left-eye images is obscured, and he says it's not impossible for a glimmer to show up on only one side.

"I'd probably lean toward cosmic rays," Maki said. "But I'd like to keep an open mind."
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/...y-lights-pictures-photos-aliens-space-science

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but the atmosphere is so thin compared to Earth's, would be quite an engineering challenge.

I guess flight on Mars would be heavily hover-based with downward thrust rockets of some kind.

 

[Soulfly]

Yeah, reminds me I'm running low on U238​. Gonna have to stop by "Uranium 'Я Us", can I pick some up for you?

You can just order from the comfort of your easy chair!
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trk...0.H0.Xura&_nkw=uranium+ore&_sacat=0&_from=R40

 

[WeedWhacker]

You can just order from the comfort of your easy chair!

Egads!!! That's "Rad", man!

 

[deirdre]

You can just order from the comfort of your easy chair!
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1311.R7.TR12.TRC2.A0.H0.Xura&_nkw=uranium ore&_sacat=0&_from=R40

so if I click that link will homeland security come visit? ; )

 

[Soulfly]

so if I click that link will homeland security come visit? ; )

You can always go find some in the wild.

 

[Trigger Hippie]

Egads!!! That's "Rad", man!

Are you fission for a compliment?

 

[WeedWhacker]

Nope, I'm pretty much depleted.

 

[Trigger Hippie]

Perhaps you should have a doctor examine your anium?