Charlie Kirk Shooting

Even before this incident, there has been much criticism of the leadership of Thomas Fugate III, appointed by Trump to lead counterterrorism measures.

External Quote:

A 22-year-old college graduate with no previous government leadership or security experience appointed to a major posting at the Department of Homeland Security is now drawing further scrutiny from President Donald Trump's Democratic critics in the wake of military strikes against Iran and warnings from officials about the heightened risk of terror attacks at home.

Thomas Fugate, a former Heritage Foundation intern and self-described "Trumplican," joined DHS in a leadership role at the Center for Prevention Programs and Partnerships, known as CP3 in May. The CP3, which works to combat terrorism, school shootings and other hate-driven violence, oversees an $18 million grant program intended to help communities battle violent extremism.

The appointment of the recent University of San Antonio grad put counterterrorism experts and insiders on edge, ProPublica first reported in early June. "It sounds like putting the intern in charge," a counterterrorism researcher who has experience working with CP3 told the outlet.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...-prevention-thomas-fugate-trump-b2774791.html
 
This event comes soon after FBI agents in Utah were trimmed due to budget cuts. Notably, a chief FBI leader in the state was fired, and suspicion fell on the firing being due to her sex and her ethnicity rather than any deficiency in performance.
External Quote:

An unprecedented campaign by FBI leaders to force senior bureau officials out of their jobs has disproportionately hit women and people of color, according to public records and an unofficial tally by current and former FBI officials.

In the most recent example, FBI leaders last week forced the resignation of a decorated female Pakistani American counterterrorism agent who was appointed in February to run the Salt Lake City field office, one current and two former FBI officials tell MSNBC.
https://www.msnbc.com/opinion/analysis/fbi-women-minorities-job-losses-kash-patel-rcna222988
 
Even before this incident, there has been much criticism of the leadership of Thomas Fugate III, appointed by Trump to lead counterterrorism measures.

External Quote:

A 22-year-old college graduate with no previous government leadership or security experience appointed to a major posting at the Department of Homeland Security is now drawing further scrutiny from President Donald Trump's Democratic critics in the wake of military strikes against Iran and warnings from officials about the heightened risk of terror attacks at home.

Thomas Fugate, a former Heritage Foundation intern and self-described "Trumplican," joined DHS in a leadership role at the Center for Prevention Programs and Partnerships, known as CP3 in May. The CP3, which works to combat terrorism, school shootings and other hate-driven violence, oversees an $18 million grant program intended to help communities battle violent extremism.

The appointment of the recent University of San Antonio grad put counterterrorism experts and insiders on edge, ProPublica first reported in early June. "It sounds like putting the intern in charge," a counterterrorism researcher who has experience working with CP3 told the outlet.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...-prevention-thomas-fugate-trump-b2774791.html

you seriously reprimanded @Greene twice for posting videos with no claims that the videos showed the shooter and yet you post this? c'mon.
 
I agree that the white corner of the building about half way between those two points appears to be annoyingly in the way (at least from a google eye view). If the news service is inaccurate on distance as you've pointed out, they may be inaccurate on position as well. Maybe they had to rush the images out.

Anyway, I hope the images at least create a decent starting point as further evidence is released.
Image with another angle.
Screenshot_20250911_111607_Chrome.jpg
 
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image of guy just released: https://www.cnn.com/us/live-news/charlie-kirk-shot-utah-death-09-11-25#cmffjt85r000o3b6pszs5ga97

They were saying earlier they weren't releasing it because they were trying to identify him through "technology"-which CNN also reported was some sort of AI tool that scans photos posted in social media-I guess that technology wasn't too helpful here. Scary to think that maybe some people were questioned for it because the AI hallucinated a match or whatever-we give up our "right to privacy when we post our images on public forms
 
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The best course of action for the blob theory would be for someone to go that exact spot and to check the window for that dirtmark. I would appreciate the help if anyone is available at the location.
I do not know, but I suspect it will be some time before they are going to want amateur detectives poking about the scene.
 
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On the "pro" type talk, I'd offer one bit of advice. Anytime in the past 5-6ish years targeted political violence has been conducted, people immediately start calling them a "pro" or etc. In no case has this been true, at all. The closest it's come is random veterans who served in entirely conventional infantry roles, not SOF or anything like that.

What everyone in the public bases this sort of statement on is not actually realistic to what is discussed. Most people don't even know the shoot quals for basic SOF, let alone more DA or lethal action oriented teams. So, it's not actually based off the metrics that exist for the "pros" people try to align that reference too. It's instead usually aligned to TV & movie portrayals and pure assumptions.
 
https://www.wsj.com/livecoverage/ch...fascist-ideology-sources-pdymd1sXXMSlVRhpvR4b



This, in my opinion, is the worst possible outcome. I have little doubt that this will lead to more violence.

I'll add more sources via an edit here shortly.

Edit: For now I can only find the wall street journal and an alleged screenshot on reddit
My paywall bypass does not work for the wsj.
From the NYT:
A preliminary and unverified report circulated inside the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives found that ammunition recovered with the rifle used to kill Charlie Kirk appeared engraved with statements "expressing transgender and anti-fascist ideology."

A senior law enforcement official with direct knowledge of the investigation cautioned that the report had not been verified by A.T.F. analysts, did not match other summaries of the evidence and might turn out to have been misread or misinterpreted.

The phrase "transgender ideology" appears to be frought and mainly seems to be used by people of a certain political bent.
 
I've watched the videos of the shooting from lots of angles and what's curious is that his shirt moves before the bullet hits his neck.

Is it possible that he was wearing a bulletproof vest and that the bullet hit that first and then ricocheted into his neck?
 
I've watched the videos of the shooting from lots of angles and what's curious is that his shirt moves before the bullet hits his neck.

Is it possible that he was wearing a bulletproof vest and that the bullet hit that first and then ricocheted into his neck?
The bullet moves fast, so as there was one shot, ALL the impacts are going to be in the first frame of the video.

The blood that is seen (shortly after impact) appears to be low-velocity spurting arterial blood, not high-velocity blood from the impact (which would be like a red mist, probably invisible at this resolution).

He might have been wearing a vest, but it hardly seems relevant.
 
For now I can only find the wall street journal and an alleged screenshot on reddit

the bit i can see does have some new info about the gun and bullets.
Article:
Investigators found ammunition engraved with expressions of transgender and antifascist ideology inside the rifle that authorities believe was used in the fatal shooting of Charlie Kirk, according to an internal law-enforcement bulletin and a person familiar with the investigation.

The older-model .30 caliber hunting rifle was discovered in the woods near the scene of Wednesday's shooting at Utah Valley University, wrapped in a towel with a spent cartridge still in the chamber, the sources said. There were also three unspent rounds in the magazine, all with wording on them.
 
The phrase "transgender ideology" appears to be frought and mainly seems to be used by people of a certain political bent.

i dont think the NYTimes is "of a certain political bent". are they right wing now? <honest question, havent been reading them last year or so as they paywalled everything.
 
@Mauro fyi
Article:
"This entire smear campaign around Thomas Fugate is a smokescreen to bury the rampant grift and waste festering in the CP3 program under the Biden Administration's watch," DHS Assistant Secretary Tricia McLaughlin told Fox. "Fugate never held the director role at CP3, and to imply that he had operational control or exercised leadership over CP3 is simply untrue, as we have consistently told them."
 
I've watched the videos of the shooting from lots of angles and what's curious is that his shirt moves before the bullet hits his neck.

Is it possible that he was wearing a bulletproof vest and that the bullet hit that first and then ricocheted into his neck?
His shirt and his body move in the same frame after the bullet strikes him. I'm still trying to understand the physics behind the apparent movement of his ring changing from his ring finger to his pinky.
 
Assuming the person in the videos was the sniper:
Distance 430ft/130m, position about 50ft/15m higher, crowd standing very near to Kirk's tent, about 15ft/5m. Kirk sat on a chair, due to the nearby crowd the only available target was the head region, there was only a rather narrow slot between the rim of the tent and the heads of the crowd. In this scenario the shooter must have been either a professional or very experienced to take on such a task.
View attachment 83859View attachment 83860
No, we presume the shooter was probably skilled (or possibly just lucky) because he succeeded. "Taking on the task" just meant the shooter was motivated to try. He might have been someone like the shooter at the political rally in Butler, PA, who shot two civilians and only got the edge of Trump's ear.
 
i dont think the NYTimes is "of a certain political bent". are they right wing now? <honest question, havent been reading them last year or so as they paywalled everything.
I think that was meant in Reference to the original "leak" from Steven Crowder and reported by the WSJ, and since the NYT was referencing that leak the NYT used the same terminology.

JDOG quoted the comment and cited the newer NYT article but it seems his double quote doesn't show. I think he was saying Crowder is of a certain political bent, and possibly the WSJ (Bezos at Trump's election ceremony)

I apologize if I am speaking out of turn JDOG, but that's how I read it
 
Thanks. I've learned something new.
yea id never heard of hinge rings before..except the antique ones that you put your poison or cocaine in (i actually have one). but the ring itself isnt hinged, just the little cap.
 
He might have been wearing a vest, but it hardly seems relevant.
IF there is an observed anomaly (I have not watched the video so have no opinion on whether there is one) then knowing what might have caused it would seem relevant. If he was not wearing a vest then a vest could not have caused it. If he was, then it might have, and the next bit would be to figure out whether a vest could in fact cause such an effect. If there is no anomaly, then the vest or lack there-of is not relevant.
 
I think that was meant in Reference to the original "leak" from Steven Crowder and reported by the WSJ, and since the NYT was referencing that leak the NYT used the same terminology.

JDOG quoted the comment and cited the newer NYT article but it seems his double quote doesn't show. I think he was saying Crowder is of a certain political bent, and possibly the WSJ (Bezos at Trump's election ceremony)

I apologize if I am speaking out of turn JDOG, but that's how I read it
I started that post out trying to figure out what could possibly be written on a shell casing that might convey "transgender ideology," but the term seems to be used as loosely defined as "woke" about something someone dislikes.
 
The motivation for a person running on a roof is unknown. I shouldn't have to define the word "unknown", but at the moment it's neither "factual or non-factual"; it's just unknown.

No one asked you to define the world 'unknown'. That being said , I'm glad we seem to agree that nothing in the post you responeded to was 'non-factual'.
 
https://www.wsj.com/livecoverage/ch...fascist-ideology-sources-pdymd1sXXMSlVRhpvR4b



This, in my opinion, is the worst possible outcome. I have little doubt that this will lead to more violence.

I'll add more sources via an edit here shortly.

Edit: For now I can only find the wall street journal and an alleged screenshot on reddit
My paywall bypass does not work for the wsj.

I tend to agree. If the rumor turns out to be true it will not only serve to inflame the rhetoric of people on the right who have targeted trans-people as a threat but also add to the conspiracy theory I'm starting to see emerge on Reddit that this was a false flag initiated by someone on the right.
 
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The phrase "transgender ideology" appears to be frought and mainly seems to be used by people of a certain political bent.
yeah, it confused me, too, because I thought transgender ideology was what Kirk and others were spreading.

The news feels a little "too good to be true", because transgender shooters were the subject of discussion leading up to the shot, and I doubt the shooter was close enough to have heard it.

so I'd bet that this is going to turn out to be exaggerated
 
I started that post out trying to figure out what could possibly be written on a shell casing that might convey "transgender ideology," but the term seems to be used as loosely defined as "woke" about something someone dislikes.

Perhaps something as simple as a trans-symbol.

transgender-symbol-color.png
 
i dont think the NYTimes is "of a certain political bent". are they right wing now? <honest question, havent been reading them last year or so as they paywalled everything.
It's possible that "transgender and antifascist ideology" was the languaged used by the original source and merely reprinted by the NYT.
 
I can't speak to the situational stress that a psycho assassin experiences, but as far as the mechanics of the shot itself, this is very typical. Unless it was a very windy day, which I don't think it was. My dad and I always sited our guns in at 100 yds, just because it's a good nominal, average number. 140 yds is a typical shot with a hunting rifle. Granted, we don't know what gun was used.

I posted a little about the ramifications of zeroing at different distance & ballistics in general in one of the threads discussing the Trump shooting.

One thing I haven't seen mentioned thus far is that it wasn't a very good shot. The round struck Kirk on the right of his neck (from the shooter's POV). It's unlikely the shooter was trying to strike Kirk in the neck. Presumably his point of aim was center center mass of the chest or the head.

If the weapon was properly zeroed then hitting high and the right (chest POA) or low and to the right (head POA) to that degree would suggest an inexperienced shooter to some degree.
 
nothing comes up for me except ebay and other doinky sites that sell used clothes. but he could have found it in any thrift shop too.
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View attachment 83898
My speculation: If there are very few eBay sellers (or sales) of this item, the FBI could potentially subpoena these records, for leads on the identity of the suspect.
Also, the sellers of this shirt could search their sales records. Sort by state, Utah first? FBI is offering $100,000 for any information leading to the identification and arrest of the shooter.

https://www.fbi.gov/contact-us/fiel...rest-of-individuals-in-murder-of-charlie-kirk
 

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