Are the air traffic controller cuts BS. ?

[Joe]

Just heard a Pilot call into Levin's show. He pretty much said that the 'controller' cuts are BS.. Did a 2% cut in their increase really cause all these controllers to be furloughed???? And if it did, was public safety put at risk? I dunno.....looking for some 'non-partisan' discussion...if there is such a thing anymore.

 

[Mick West]

Just heard a Pilot call into Levin's show. He pretty much said that the 'controller' cuts are BS.. Did a 2% cut in their increase really cause all these controllers to be furloughed???? And if it did, was public safety put at risk? I dunno.....looking for some 'non-partisan' discussion...if there is such a thing anymore.

2% cut in their increase? I thought they had to cut $673 Million. Where is that going to come from?

 

[Joe]

Thats what I heard http://www.dot.gov/sites/dot.dev/files/docs/faa_%20fy_%202013_budget_estimate.pdf there was a few pilots that called into his show and said that they were being delayed becaus of fog coming into LA . Which they said wasn't a problem . I ask a customer and a friend today who is a pilot for United and he said that a lot of the pilots are saying the same thing . I was curious if its true ? Also was a person who works a national park that said the higher ups are saying they will close a park near San francisco for a day as a furlough and to tell tourist its about the sequester when he says budget wise there is no problem . Are they playing politics with peoples lives ? http://www.generalaviationnews.com/2013/03/some-question-faas-selection-of-sequestration-cuts/

 

[Joe]

more on the FAA and sequester Mark Levin: Obama has unleashed his wrath in the form of unnecessary furloughs of air traffic controllers http://www.therightscoop.com/mark-l...cessary-furloughs-of-air-traffic-controllers/

 

[Mick West]

Are they playing politics with peoples lives ? /

It seems a tad more likely to me that the conservative media might be playing politics with their interpretation of the unavoidable effects of sweeping cuts. $673 Million is a lot of money. It's possible they could have avoided delays somehow, but I don't know how they are constrained by law in how the cuts are implemented, or even what the options are.

 

[Joe]

Flying the Government Skies

The 4% FAA spending cut that somehow delays 40% of flights.

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The 4% FAA spending cut that somehow delays 40% of flights.

Airline passengers at San Francisco International Airport on Monday

Reuters

As travellers nationwide are learning, the White House has decided to express its dislike of the sequester—otherwise known as modestly smaller government—by choosing to cut basic air traffic control services. We wrote about this human- rights violation on Tuesday in "Flight Delays as Political Strategy," but the story gets worse the closer we look.
Start with the Federal Aviation Administration, better known as the Postal Service without the modern technology. Flyers directly fund two-thirds of the FAA's budget through 17 airline taxes and fees—about 20% of the cost of a $300 domestic ticket, up from 7% in the 1970s. Yet now the White House wants to make this agency that can't deliver what passengers are supposedly paying for even more dysfunctional.

 

[Joe]

It seems a tad more likely to me that the conservative media might be playing politics with their interpretation of the unavoidable effects of sweeping cuts. $673 Million is a lot of money. It's possible they could have avoided delays somehow, but I don't know how they are constrained by law in how the cuts are implemented, or even what the options are.

Is possible it political . On both sides . Ill try to find something thats not bias if possible . Thats why we need to hear from a pilots perspective as I heard today . The pilot friend that came in today is Norwegian so I avoid political discussions with him . I think he is more to the left then Me . Even though Im not sure ?

 

[Mick West]

Sorry Joe, please don't post long articles from news wires. Articles should almost always be excerpted for fair use copyright reasons. Post the important portion, and a link.

And I can understand 4% cuts having more than 4% delay effect in a system that is already strained to the limit. There's a knock-on effect to delays when all gates are in use, a delay in one plane delays the other planes.

 

[Joe]

Sorry Joe, please don't post long articles from news wires. Articles should almost always be excerpted for fair use copyright reasons. Post the important portion, and a link.

And I can understand 4% cuts having more than 4% delay effect in a system that is already strained to the limit. There's a knock-on effect to delays when all gates are in use, a delay in one plane delays the other planes.

My bad Flyers make up for 2/3 of the FAA s Budget ? I bet they have 1/3 of waste and pork ?

 

[justanairlinepilot]

So far, from what I've hear and experienced, it's a bunch of bullshit.

 

[justanairlinepilot]

I flew from BIS-MSP today and I heard a Center controller deny a direct flight request as a result of cutbacks...my First Officer and I looked at each other and asked WTF? They are full of shit...

Remember Regan?? That's all I have to say about this debackle.

 

[Joe]

I flew from BIS-MSP today and I heard a Center controller deny a direct flight request as a result of cutbacks...my First Officer and I looked at each other and asked WTF? They are full of shit...

Remember Regan?? That's all I have to say about this debackle.

Thank you . I thought so .

 

[Mick West]

How does it work though, are the controllers just doing some kind of "work to rule" or slowdown as a protest or covert industrial action? Or is it a result of furloughs? Both? Something else?

 

[justanairlinepilot]

Thank you . I thought so .

I'd like to add that our company had added to our dispatch release what we should say if we experience delays as a result of these cutbacks. They actually tell us what to say on the PA. Well, I'm a company man, and I will say what I am suppose to say; but I will only say it if it is warranted. Rest assured, as a captain of a commercial airline flight, I will divulge the truth to what is going on during my flight to my paying passengers. So far, I haven't experienced any delays as a result of government cutbacks.

 

[justanairlinepilot]

How does it work though, are the controllers just doing some kind of "work to rule" or slowdown as a protest or covert industrial action? Or is it a result of furloughs? Both? Something else?

Mick, we don't know yet, time will tell, honestly. These are literally Regan years happening all over again. I must admit, it's weird. However, it's a different bunch of individuals.

 

[Joe]

How does it work though, are the controllers just doing some kind of "work to rule" or slowdown as a protest or covert industrial action? Or is it a result of furloughs? Both? Something else?

from what I heard not just the controllers but many are being told to make the sequester hurt . Never let a crisis go to waste . But thats from my right wing sources

 

[justanairlinepilot]

I say give it some time...Like a couple of weeks or a month. After that, let's assess it, legitimately,

 

[justanairlinepilot]

I'd be more that happy to say what is going on.

 

[Cairenn]

What about the shutting down of towers at smaller airports?

 

[justanairlinepilot]

That will take time.

 

[Mick West]

Shutting down the smaller airport towers will not affect commercial traffic. Just general aviation. It's not going to result in any airline delays, just makes those airports a little less safe for the smaller planes that use them.

 

[justanairlinepilot]

Mick, we have a list of airports. I'll report it too as I can.

 

[justanairlinepilot]

KCWA, Central Wisconsin Airport, KLSE, La Crosse, WI, both are towered airports via contract personel, neither need a tower in my opinion. Air traffic is too low, and the few airline flights just broadcast on unicom and pay close attention to traffic in the area, it's as simple as that.

 

[captfitch]

We're seeing some effects on our side (corporate aircraft training) but we are in contact with Feds on a daily basis so if they have to take days off we instantly notice it. The end result is ours just work harder on the day we see them. Spring time on the east coast will be rough I predict.

 

[MikeC]

According to hte Huff Post a quick and unexpected session of congress has done a deal to roll back the furloughs -

In a quick and unanticipated session on Thursday night, the U.S. Senate approved a resolution that would allow the Federal Aviation Administration budget flexibility to stop furloughing air traffic controllers.

The measure, approved by unanimous consent, came just days after forced unpaid leaves for controllers began, delaying thousands of flights -- 876 flights were delayed on Wednesday alone, the FAA said. Titled the "Reducing Flight Delays Act of 2013," the resolution provides the Secretary of Transportation the power to transfer up to $253 million in pre-existing funds to "prevent reduced operations and staffing" at the FAA.

It seems it allows the FAA to shift money around a bit more flexibly that it was allowed to previously

A quick look at the PPrune "Profesional Pilots Forum" ATC page shows no discussion about teh furloughs at all that I could see! Tehre was 1 short thread on the Nth American page about the closure of 149 towers, but that was mostly just ranting - no serious discussion of the finances at all.

 

[Joe]

Hope isn't a negotiating strategy, however. And for two months, the Obama administration had been banking on public angst about gridlock in the skies to get Republicans back to the table on the across-the-board cuts that took effect March 1.

Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2013/...rst-on-aviation-cuts-90653.html#ixzz2RXK1Iuu5 political stunt is all this is

 

[F4Jock]

Apparently the Senate has passed a bill that allows money to be shifted around a bit. It CAN go to the House today. Will the President sign it? Stay tuned.

Hard to believe that someone in Center would be that unprofessional.

 

[F4Jock]

Congress just passed bill allowing redirection of funds to maintain ATC staffing. Let's see if our President signs it!

 

[justanairlinepilot]

We're seeing some effects on our side (corporate aircraft training) but we are in contact with Feds on a daily basis so if they have to take days off we instantly notice it. The end result is ours just work harder on the day we see them. Spring time on the east coast will be rough I predict.

Are the FSDO's facing cuts too? That's never in the news.

 

[F4Jock]

Are the FSDO's facing cuts too? That's never in the news.

Dunno. No mention.