I was in northwestern CT looking to capture meteors. When I downloaded my pictures the other day I found this image taken facing NE around midnight. Very curious if anyone can identify what would move in this peculiar manner (loop, jagged movements and sharp redirect). Maybe F-35s are this nimble?
Night sky long exposure light trail
- Thread starter Pendleton
- Start date
Photo is from Nov 12, 2023 at 11:55pm. [Mod: time was originally given as 10/12]
76.2s exposure.
Location: https://www.google.com/maps/@41.8330889,-73.4296507,15.55z?entry=ttu
76.2s exposure.
Location: https://www.google.com/maps/@41.8330889,-73.4296507,15.55z?entry=ttu
Last edited by a moderator:
FatPhil
Senior Member.
Am I suffering astral pareidolia, or do I detect a Plough (Big Dipper) just above the horizon, with its pan handle pointing down and to the left quite close to that whispy leftmost whispy tree and with the Polaris direction being towards the unidentified streak? There seems to be a double-dot of Mizar/Alcor just at the right place along the handle. For late night in CT, that would be a view to the NE, certainly.
It's an odd trail, the way it starts so smooth like a spline and eventually "fizzles out" with some jittery movement is weird - not very organic. A cheap poorly-made firework veering off course, sputtering and tumbling?
It's an odd trail, the way it starts so smooth like a spline and eventually "fizzles out" with some jittery movement is weird - not very organic. A cheap poorly-made firework veering off course, sputtering and tumbling?
| Date and Time (digitized) | 2023:11:13 00:55:29 |
| Date and Time (original) | 2023:11:13 00:55:29 |
| Exif Version | 2.31 |
| Exposure Bias | 0 EV |
| Exposure Mode | Auto |
| Exposure Program | (9) |
| Exposure Time | 76.2 s |
| Flash | No, compulsory |
| FlashPix Version | 1.00 |
| FNumber | F2.8 |
| Focal Length | 16.0 mm |
76.2 second exposure, 16 mm, full frame.
Seems unlikely it would be a full-size aircraft, with what looks like very tight maneuvers.
It's also solid white, not blinking (at least not much, there are some variations), but also smoothly varying in brightness.
Since we can't see the ends of the trail, we don't know how long it took, so have to include the possibility of a brief event, like a spark, or the camera being moved at the start or end of the exposure.
Attachments
Mendel
Senior Member.
I'd expect the small deviations to be camera shake, and it doesn't show up in the rest of the picture because the stars are much darker.
Then, we're looking at a 3D path in 2D, so a "sharp corner" can actually be a wide curve if the object is moving towards the viewer for much of it. If this was a video and not a long exposure, you'd see the object appear to slow down; the increased brightness in the long exposure is a clue to the same effect.
Then, we're looking at a 3D path in 2D, so a "sharp corner" can actually be a wide curve if the object is moving towards the viewer for much of it. If this was a video and not a long exposure, you'd see the object appear to slow down; the increased brightness in the long exposure is a clue to the same effect.
nmarsollier
Member
At 16 mm, in full frame, f 2.8 the hyperfocal distance in 3.15m So the object must be at least beyond that distance.
I would ask if the only source of light is the one behind the trees (moon maybe)? Or they might be some extra light in the ground?
I'm thinking the possibility that a bug was spotted in movement and some light captured the morion.
I would ask if the only source of light is the one behind the trees (moon maybe)? Or they might be some extra light in the ground?
I'm thinking the possibility that a bug was spotted in movement and some light captured the morion.
Last edited:
Thanks for these great observations!
Mick, I agree that the light trail is missing telltale staccato light patterns of a plane. And thanks for extracting the metadata and zooms. I did check the camera time and it is 1 hour and 5 minutes ahead. Photo was actually taken at 11:50pm.
Mendel, 2D to 3D insight is entirely plausible here. As for camera shake, it could be related to the shutter motion, but that would also mean that the entire trail on the right would be related to a few seconds of shake (assuming it was a singular event).
Nmars, it was quite cold (25F) and also a moonless night. The low lights are nearby light pollution. Also there were no real bugs to speak of considering the freezing temperatures.
I have other photos (most likely close to 360 degrees from the same location if that’s helpful. Meteor photos I took a few weeks ago during the Orionids have an uncanny resemblance to this light trail in terms of the light quality and gradient (just a curious observation).
Mick, I agree that the light trail is missing telltale staccato light patterns of a plane. And thanks for extracting the metadata and zooms. I did check the camera time and it is 1 hour and 5 minutes ahead. Photo was actually taken at 11:50pm.
Mendel, 2D to 3D insight is entirely plausible here. As for camera shake, it could be related to the shutter motion, but that would also mean that the entire trail on the right would be related to a few seconds of shake (assuming it was a singular event).
Nmars, it was quite cold (25F) and also a moonless night. The low lights are nearby light pollution. Also there were no real bugs to speak of considering the freezing temperatures.
I have other photos (most likely close to 360 degrees from the same location if that’s helpful. Meteor photos I took a few weeks ago during the Orionids have an uncanny resemblance to this light trail in terms of the light quality and gradient (just a curious observation).
Last edited:
Mendel
Senior Member.
Someone walking near the tripod would be my guess; or wind?
It should be reproducible, but how?
Last edited:
Mendel
Senior Member.
That's only the strobe.
If there's an airport in the vicinity, it could be landing lights, which are continuous.
Or a helicopter with a searchlight, etc.
Or it could not be an aircraft, of course. (Maybe a drone?)
jarlrmai
Senior Member.
This is my thought a head torch or something used at the start or end of the exposure caught an insect in flight, or a mote of dust with camera movement.
Dave51c
Member
I find it interesting that the intensity of the trace is not even throughout the path. Given the 76.2s exposure, might it mean that either the point source (if it was one) had a variable angle to the camera and/or that its reflectivity was changing due to angular movement, or that the source had a constant area of illumination but its amplitude changed?
Curious also that the most top left to bottom right part of the path seems smooth but the reverse has perturbations. Almost like an object is under power but the perturbation side has less energy - in my mind I'm thinking of an aircraft descending and manouvering, then applying power and climbing away (w.r.t. 3D => 2D transformation)
Curious also that the most top left to bottom right part of the path seems smooth but the reverse has perturbations. Almost like an object is under power but the perturbation side has less energy - in my mind I'm thinking of an aircraft descending and manouvering, then applying power and climbing away (w.r.t. 3D => 2D transformation)
Mendel
Senior Member.
or its velocity was not even
you don't think the perturbations are camera shake? What do you make of the loop in the path?
nmarsollier
Member
What do you think could be this beyond the trees ?
Mendel
Senior Member.
Are you sure these tiny white dots are beyond and not in front?What do you think could be this beyond the trees ?
Or are you referring to the white/red line?
Dave51c
Member
Uneven velocity over time during the exposure is a variable I didn't think to include. Yes, camera shake is a possibility - would comparing the star field in this exposure to another one taken before/after give us more information? Would it also help to know information about the tripod/camera setup in terms of any stabilisation/motion tracking involved?
I really don't what the loop is. Unfortunately, the loop is giving me bias towards a manoeuvring aircraft (not asserting anything btw) - vertical/horizontal loop, descending/ascending turn etc. I can't see past that just yet!
Mendel
Senior Member.
that's information we don't have, i.e. what type of ground the camera was set up on, and what could have caused it to shake. My glassware cupboard rattles when I walk past it.
It's evidence for camera shake.
There's no reason for an aircraft to do a loop in 1-2 seconds.
nmarsollier
Member
Increasing brightness, there is a dark border around the light path.
That can be caused by something that does not emit light.
Also it has some lateral chromatic aberrations in the places that the light burned the sensor, I guess consistent with the places where the border is shown, so I guess that parts are the parts where the object was moving slower.
If I darken a little bit the picture, I see traces of geen, blue, white light, consistent with the supposed speed.
[Slower speed, small path in the different colors]
[Object moving fater, so long trails of different colors]
PSS: Lovely camera and lens, congrats =)
That can be caused by something that does not emit light.
Also it has some lateral chromatic aberrations in the places that the light burned the sensor, I guess consistent with the places where the border is shown, so I guess that parts are the parts where the object was moving slower.
If I darken a little bit the picture, I see traces of geen, blue, white light, consistent with the supposed speed.
[Slower speed, small path in the different colors]
[Object moving fater, so long trails of different colors]
PSS: Lovely camera and lens, congrats =)
Dave51c
Member
How did you derive that time?
No denying that.It's evidence for camera shake.
nmarsollier
Member
I don't really know, Canon cameras are well known by the minimum or none image process in raw mode, it only applies some settings, but we can remove those presets, because are post processing over the raw, which I did. But maybe you are right.
jarlrmai
Senior Member.
You enhanced the image so you are already out of the raw data only stage.
Easy Muffin
Senior Member
Looks like the streak in the bottom right is just an ordinary plane, DLH4C enroute Chicago to Munich.
Just visible from OP's location.
If it helps, this is the complete EXIF (note the camera is still set to daylight savings hence the 1-hour difference)
Just visible from OP's location.
If it helps, this is the complete EXIF (note the camera is still set to daylight savings hence the 1-hour difference)
Code:
ExifTool Version Number : 12.60
File Name : AX4A2070.CR2
Directory : .
File Size : 33 MB
File Modification Date/Time : 2023:11:13 00:55:30+01:00
File Access Date/Time : 2023:11:13 00:55:30+01:00
File Inode Change Date/Time : 2023:11:16 14:09:49+01:00
File Permissions : -rw-------
File Type : CR2
File Type Extension : cr2
MIME Type : image/x-canon-cr2
Exif Byte Order : Little-endian (Intel, II)
Image Width : 6720
Image Height : 4480
Bits Per Sample : 8 8 8
Compression : JPEG (old-style)
Make : Canon
Camera Model Name : Canon EOS 5D Mark IV
Preview Image Start : 60840
Orientation : Horizontal (normal)
Preview Image Length : 1933053
X Resolution : 72
Y Resolution : 72
Resolution Unit : inches
Modify Date : 2023:11:13 00:55:29
Artist : PENDLETON IMAGES
Rating : 0
Copyright : PENDLETON IMAGES
Exposure Time : 76.2
F Number : 2.8
Exposure Program : Bulb
ISO : 800
Sensitivity Type : Recommended Exposure Index
Recommended Exposure Index : 800
Exif Version : 0231
Date/Time Original : 2023:11:13 00:55:29
Create Date : 2023:11:13 00:55:29
Offset Time : -04:00
Offset Time Original : -04:00
Offset Time Digitized : -04:00
Components Configuration : Y, Cb, Cr, -
Shutter Speed Value : 0
Aperture Value : 2.8
Flash : Off, Did not fire
Focal Length : 16.0 mm
Macro Mode : Normal
Self Timer : Off
Quality : RAW
Canon Flash Mode : Off
Continuous Drive : Single
Focus Mode : Manual Focus (3)
Record Mode : CR2+JPEG
Canon Image Size : Large
Easy Mode : Manual
Digital Zoom : None
Contrast : Normal
Saturation : Normal
Metering Mode : Evaluative
Focus Range : Not Known
Canon Exposure Mode : Bulb
Lens Type : Canon EF 16-35mm f/2.8L III USM
Max Focal Length : 35 mm
Min Focal Length : 16 mm
Focal Units : 1/mm
Max Aperture : 2.8
Min Aperture : 23
Flash Activity : 0
Flash Bits : (none)
Zoom Source Width : 0
Zoom Target Width : 0
Manual Flash Output : n/a
Color Tone : Normal
SRAW Quality : n/a
Auto ISO : 100
Base ISO : 800
Measured EV : -1.62
Target Aperture : 2.8
Target Exposure Time : 1
Exposure Compensation : 0
White Balance : Manual Temperature (Kelvin)
Slow Shutter : None
Shot Number In Continuous Burst : 0
Optical Zoom Code : n/a
Camera Temperature : 12 C
Flash Guide Number : 0
Flash Exposure Compensation : 0
Auto Exposure Bracketing : Off
AEB Bracket Value : 0
Control Mode : Camera Local Control
Measured EV 2 : -1.5
Bulb Duration : 76.2
Camera Type : EOS High-end
ND Filter : n/a
Canon Image Type : Canon EOS 5D Mark IV
Canon Firmware Version : Firmware Version 1.3.4
Canon Model ID : EOS 5D Mark IV
Thumbnail Image Valid Area : 0 159 7 112
AF Area Mode : Off (Manual Focus)
Num AF Points : 63
Valid AF Points : 61
Canon Image Width : 6720
Canon Image Height : 4480
AF Image Width : 6720
AF Image Height : 4480
AF Area Widths : 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 0 0
AF Area Heights : 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 218 0 0
AF Area X Positions : -336 -746 -1101 -1437 -1772 336 0 -336 -1437 -1772 1772 1437 1101 746 336 0 1437 1101 746 336 0 -336 -746 -1101 336 0 -336 -746 -1101 -1437 -1772 1772 -746 -1101 -1437 -1772 1772 1437 1101 746 -1772 1772 1437 1101 746 336 0 -336 1101 746 336 0 -336 -746 -1101 -1437 336 0 -336 1772 1437 0 0
AF Area Y Positions : 547 625 625 625 625 821 821 821 308 308 625 625 625 625 547 547 308 308 308 274 274 274 308 308 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 308 -308 -308 -308 -308 0 0 0 0 -625 -308 -308 -308 -308 -274 -274 -274 -625 -625 -547 -547 -547 -625 -625 -625 -821 -821 -821 -625 -625 0 0
AF Points In Focus : (none)
AF Points Selected : 25
Time Zone : -04:00
Time Zone City : New York
Daylight Savings : On
Battery Type : LP-E6NH
Bracket Mode : Off
Bracket Value : 0
Bracket Shot Number : 0
Raw Jpg Size : Large
WB Bracket Mode : Off
WB Bracket Value AB : 0
WB Bracket Value GM : 0
Live View Shooting : Off
Focus Distance Upper : inf
Focus Distance Lower : 81.91 m
Shutter Mode : Mechanical
Flash Exposure Lock : Off
Internal Serial Number :
Dust Removal Data : (Binary data 1024 bytes, use -b option to extract)
Crop Left Margin : 0
Crop Right Margin : 0
Crop Top Margin : 0
Crop Bottom Margin : 0
Exposure Level Increments : 1/3 Stop
ISO Speed Increments : 1/3 Stop
AEB Auto Cancel : On
AEB Sequence : 0,-,+
AEB Shot Count : 3 shots
Safety Shift : Disable
Same Exposure For New Aperture : Disable
Shutter Speed Range : Disable; Hi 1/8192; Lo 32
Aperture Range : Disable; Closed 91; Open 1
Viewfinder Warnings : Monochrome, WB corrected, One-touch image quality, Noise reduction, HDR
LV Shooting Area Display : Masked
Custom Controls : 0 0 0 0 2 0 2 0 2 0 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 254 255 0 3 112 48 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 20 80 0 0 0 0 7 3 0 255 255 255 0 255 255 255
Dial Direction Tv Av : Normal
Add Aspect Ratio Info : Off
Default Erase Option : Cancel selected
Retract Lens On Power Off : Enable
Add IPTC Information : Disable
Aspect Ratio : 3:2
Cropped Image Width : 6720
Cropped Image Height : 4480
Cropped Image Left : 0
Cropped Image Top : 0
Tone Curve : Standard
Sharpness : 3
Sharpness Frequency : n/a
Sensor Red Level : 0
Sensor Blue Level : 0
White Balance Red : 0
White Balance Blue : 0
Color Temperature : 3700
Picture Style : Standard
Digital Gain : 0
WB Shift AB : 0
WB Shift GM : 0
Measured RGGB : 562 1024 1024 688
VRD Offset : 0
Sensor Width : 6880
Sensor Height : 4544
Sensor Left Border : 148
Sensor Top Border : 54
Sensor Right Border : 6867
Sensor Bottom Border : 4533
Black Mask Left Border : 0
Black Mask Top Border : 0
Black Mask Right Border : 0
Black Mask Bottom Border : 0
Color Data Version : 13 (80D/5DmkIV)
WB RGGB Levels As Shot : 1636 1024 1024 1836
Color Temp As Shot : 3699
WB RGGB Levels Auto : 1862 1024 1024 1567
Color Temp Auto : 4572
WB RGGB Levels Measured : 1862 1024 1024 1567
Color Temp Measured : 4572
WB RGGB Levels Daylight : 2032 1024 1024 1464
Color Temp Daylight : 5200
WB RGGB Levels Shade : 2325 1024 1024 1268
Color Temp Shade : 7000
WB RGGB Levels Cloudy : 2175 1024 1024 1360
Color Temp Cloudy : 6000
WB RGGB Levels Tungsten : 1454 1024 1024 2060
Color Temp Tungsten : 3200
WB RGGB Levels Fluorescent : 1719 1024 1024 1990
Color Temp Fluorescent : 3634
WB RGGB Levels Kelvin : 1636 1024 1024 1836
Color Temp Kelvin : 3699
WB RGGB Levels Flash : 2222 1024 1024 1357
Color Temp Flash : 6137
Average Black Level : 2048 2048 2048 2048
Per Channel Black Level : 2048 2048 2048 2049
Normal White Level : 13135
Specular White Level : 14448
Linearity Upper Margin : 10273
Picture Style User Def : Standard; Standard; Standard
Picture Style PC : None; None; None
Custom Picture Style File Name :
AF Micro Adj Mode : Disable
AF Micro Adj Value : 0
Vignetting Corr Version : 16
Peripheral Lighting Setting : On
Chromatic Aberration Setting : On
Distortion Correction Setting : Off
Digital Lens Optimizer Setting : Off
Peripheral Illumination Corr : Off
Auto Lighting Optimizer : Off
Highlight Tone Priority : Off
Long Exposure Noise Reduction : Off
High ISO Noise Reduction : Standard
Digital Lens Optimizer : Off
Multi Exposure : Off
Multi Exposure Control : Additive
Multi Exposure Shots : 0
HDR : Off
HDR Effect : Natural
AF Config Tool : Case 1
AF Tracking Sensitivity : 0
AF Accel/Decel Tracking : 0
AF Point Switching : 0
AI Servo First Image : Equal Priority
AI Servo Second Image : Equal Priority
USM Lens Electronic MF : Enable After AF
AF Assist Beam : Enable
One Shot AF Release : Focus Priority
Lens Drive When AF Impossible : Continue Focus Search
Select AF Area Selection Mode : Single-point AF, Auto, Zone AF, AF Point Expansion (4 point), Spot AF, AF Point Expansion (8 point), [6], [8], [9], [10], [11], [12], [13], [14]
AF Area Selection Method : M-Fn Button
Orientation Linked AF : Same for Vert/Horiz Points
Manual AF Point Sel Pattern : Stops at AF Area Edges
AF Point Display During Focus : Selected (constant)
VF Display Illumination : Auto
User Comment :
Sub Sec Time : 00
Sub Sec Time Original : 00
Sub Sec Time Digitized : 00
Flashpix Version : 0100
Color Space : sRGB
Exif Image Width : 6720
Exif Image Height : 4480
Interoperability Index : R98 - DCF basic file (sRGB)
Interoperability Version : 0100
Focal Plane X Resolution : 5719.148936
Focal Plane Y Resolution : 5728.900256
Focal Plane Resolution Unit : inches
Custom Rendered : Normal
Exposure Mode : Auto
Scene Capture Type : Standard
Owner Name :
Serial Number :
Lens Info : 16-35mm f/0
Lens Model : EF16-35mm f/2.8L III USM
Lens Serial Number :
GPS Version ID : 2.3.0.0
Thumbnail Offset : 54880
Thumbnail Length : 5959
Photometric Interpretation : RGB
Samples Per Pixel : 3
Rows Per Strip : 284
Planar Configuration : Chunky
Strip Offsets : 2726616
Strip Byte Counts : 29947572
CR2 CFA Pattern : [Red,Green][Green,Blue]
Raw Image Segmentation : 1 3440 3440
SRaw Type : 1
Drive Mode : Single-frame Shooting
Lens : 16.0 - 35.0 mm
Shooting Mode : Bulb
WB RGGB Levels : 1636 1024 1024 1836
Aperture : 2.8
Blue Balance : 1.792969
Image Size : 6720x4480
Lens ID : Canon EF 16-35mm f/2.8L III USM
Megapixels : 30.1
Preview Image : (Binary data 1933053 bytes, use -b option to extract)
Red Balance : 1.597656
Scale Factor To 35 mm Equivalent: 1.2
Shutter Speed : 76.2
Create Date : 2023:11:13 00:55:29.00-04:00
Date/Time Original : 2023:11:13 00:55:29.00-04:00
Modify Date : 2023:11:13 00:55:29.00-04:00
Thumbnail Image : (Binary data 5959 bytes, use -b option to extract)
Lens : 16.0 - 35.0 mm (35 mm equivalent: 19.3 - 42.2 mm)
Circle Of Confusion : 0.025 mm
Depth Of Field : inf (3.64 m - inf)
Field Of View : 86.0 deg
Focal Length : 16.0 mm (35 mm equivalent: 19.3 mm)
Hyperfocal Distance : 3.67 m
Light Value : -6.3nmarsollier
Member
Sorry but consider a little bit my guess, if it is a post processing artifact I would expect to see the same post processing artifact in other parts of the picture, but I see clearly that the dark band is in that place only.
Z.W. Wolf
Senior Member.
I haven't had time to work out anything. But my immediate impression, based on experience, is flashlight. But considering how dim it is, and how thin the line is... maybe a small light on a phone or some other small light source is a better fit. The overall path and the little squiggles in the path say handheld light source to me.
How many people were around?
How many people were around?
Last edited:
Mendel
Senior Member.
There is nothing that emits darkness. Anything attached to the white dot can only obscure the background for a very short time and would not noticeably darken it.
Mendel
Senior Member.
The full trace corresponds to less than the 76.2 seconds of exposure.
I eyeballed the length of the loop to be less than 1/40 of that, and the loop isn't particularly bright, so the dot probably didn't slow down there.
The above consideration is for the dot maneuvering the loop (which I find unlikely/impossible). As camera shake, the time would be much shorter, and the whole track could take much less than 76 seconds. So my 1-2 seconds are an upper bound, to show that it couldn't be an aircraft.
Thanks for asking.
Last edited:
Easy Muffin
Senior Member
These are bugs
Looks kinda similar? I don't see any nearby lights in Streetview though - https://maps.app.goo.gl/RB8itiiNBcYDrxuv7
Looks kinda similar? I don't see any nearby lights in Streetview though - https://maps.app.goo.gl/RB8itiiNBcYDrxuv7
jarlrmai
Senior Member.
Someone with a head torch or similar could illuminate a bug.These are bugs
Looks kinda similar? I don't see any nearby lights in Streetview though - https://maps.app.goo.gl/RB8itiiNBcYDrxuv7
Or could it be a firefly/glowbug?
jarlrmai
Senior Member.
They tend to be warmer/different colours and are fairly dull so I don't think they would create an effect like this over the given exposure time.
Ann K
Senior Member.
@Pendleton says it was 25° F, so insects are not very likely. But a similar effect might be had from a floating bit of dust, hair, or vegetation that could be seen in local illumination up close to the camera. The twists in the trail could be caused by slight air turbulence.
Ann K
Senior Member.
Here's another thought. I see that the anomaly comes from the top edge of the image. Is it possible that you or someone with you has long hair, and might this be a single flyaway strand dangling down?
I use a red light head torch to maintain my night vision.
It was just myself. I can never convince anyone to join me in standing in the cold at midnight.
I use a carbon fiber tripod and it was seated on grass.that's information we don't have, i.e. what type of ground the camera was set up on, and what could have caused it to shake. My glassware cupboard rattles when I walk past it.
It's evidence for camera shake.
There's no reason for an aircraft to do a loop in 1-2 seconds.
I’m a short haired guy and didn’t walk in front of the camera or lean over it while shooting. I use a remote shutter.
Mendel
Senior Member.
So, a light setup, on ground that can "shake". Thank you for following up with all of this information!
I don't really know how to recreate the phenomenon. If the camera takes unstabilized video, maybe the "shake" would be visible if you mounted it in the same way and walked past it?
