Gun Grabbing Justice Department Ends Due Process

[BlueCollarCritic]

OK debunkers its time to go to work and figure out how to debunk this so that its not an indication that the government is pushing forward with a police state takeover. This time the DOJ is empowering one of its agencies with new power to not only take property of persons not accused of a crime but also from persons who are unknowingly associated with a person or entity that has not been charged with a crime. As the Washington Post article points out this is a handy way to get around those pesky constitutional rights that have been a sore for power grabbing bureaucrats.


http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/sep/6/atfs-latest-gun-grab/

 

[Mick West]

That seems like a pretty subjective interpretation - it's just an extension of asset forfeiture. Seems like it was an existing thing the Justice Department could do anyway (11,355 guns last year) and now it's just being extended to the ATF. The article is not really clear. Do you know what the actual ruling is?

 

[cheeple]

OK debunkers its time to go to work and figure out how to debunk this so that its not an indication that the government is pushing forward with a police state takeover. This time the DOJ is empowering one of its agencies with new power to not only take property of persons not accused of a crime but also from persons who are unknowingly associated with a person or entity that has not been charged with a crime. As the Washington Post article points out this is a handy way to get around those pesky constitutional rights that have been a sore for power grabbing bureaucrats.


http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/sep/6/atfs-latest-gun-grab/

Thanks bluecollar, yeah it's very clear your property will be seized as they ATFE now decides you are guilty until proven innocent.

 

[scombrid]

The article is not really clear.

Not suprising with the Washington Times as the source. That paper hates Democrats and loves Republicans and will torture facts in order to smear Democrats while ignoring anything bad about Republicans.

a final rule published last week, the Justice Department granted the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) authority to “seize and administratively forfeit property involved in controlled-substance abuses.”

​

​

Why don't any of those links lead to the actual final rule or provide the history of the forfeiture rules.

Do you know what the actual ruling is?

We won't know that from the Washington Times. Has the opening poster researched any of this information yet since the Washington Times was very light on facts in its reporting?

I'm all for removing the profit motive in law enforcement and incarceration but this article from the Moonies doesn't do anything but beat the "Obama Hates Guns so Vote GOP" drum (yes, that really is pretty much the point of the article as is in evidence from the lack of detail and the opening sentence).

 

[scombrid]

As the Washington Post article points out
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/sep/6/atfs-latest-gun-grab/

What Washington Post article?

 

[solrey]

Basically all they've done is to temporarily include the ATF in existing forfeiture laws that were previously under the authority of the DEA. No gun grab and no end to due process is implied anywhere in the new ruling.

Authorization To Seize Property Involved in Drug Offenses for Administrative Forfeiture (2012R-9P)

Attorney General has delegated to ATF the authority to investigate, seize, and forfeit property involved in a violation or attempted violation within its investigative jurisdiction. See 28 CFR 0.130(b). ATF investigations focusing on violent crime frequently involve complex criminal organizations with multiple criminal enterprises and uncover drug-related offenses in addition to offenses within ATF's primary jurisdiction, such as violations of the Gun Control Act, 18 U.S.C. Chapter 44, or the Contraband Cigarette Trafficking Act, 18 U.S.C. Chapter 114. In such investigations, ATF does not currently have authority under 21 U.S.C. Chapter 13 to seize for administrative forfeiture property involved in controlled substance offenses. Instead, ATF generally refers such property to the Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA), which is primarily responsible for investigating violations of drug laws contained in title 21 of the United States Code. DEA then initiates, processes, and concludes all necessary forfeiture actions for the controlled-substance-related property.

ATF joined the Department of Justice in January 2003 pursuant to the Homeland Security Act of 2002 (Pub. L. 107-296). One of the primary missions of the ATF is to combat firearm-related violent crime. The nexus between drug trafficking and firearm violence is well established. The Attorney General, however, has not previously delegated to ATF title 21 seizure and forfeiture authority. On review of the current role and mission of ATF within the Department of Justice, the Attorney General has decided to authorize a temporary delegation of title 21 seizure and forfeiture authority to determine whether such authority can enhance the effectiveness of ATF in the investigation of violent crimes involving firearms. Consequently, by this final rule the Attorney General is delegating administrative seizure and forfeiture authority under 21 U.S.C. 881 to the ATF for a trial period of one year. The language in this rule delegating administrative forfeiture authority to ATF is modeled after the language in the FBI authorization. ATF may continue to exercise this delegated authority for all property in its possession on or before the end of the one-year period, even if this delegation is not otherwise extended.

Yeah, the Washington Times is biased for sure, which makes debunking them quite easy.

cheers

 

[Charlie Primero]

...this is a handy way to get around those pesky constitutional rights that have been a sore for power grabbing bureaucrats.

I'm with Mick. This is merely an extension of an existing totalitarian state power.

All the State power ratcheting over the next one hundred years is merely clean-up operations. The precedent that humans do not own their own bodies was set one hundred years ago. It's a done deal.