Claim: Time-Travelling Humans are Causing Close Encounter Experiences

[SkepticSteve]

Can you provide a link to this study?
Because in this ce3 list I posted earlier, 62 of the 107 cases were outside the US:
https://www.nicap.org/occupants_hall.htm

Add to that the near certainty that not all foreign cases will reach researchers in the US, especially those in foreign languages.

This seems to be it:
https://www.researchgate.net/public...nomena/link/60a619aa92851c43da034d41/download

Unfortunately, I don't have much more time to go through it.

 

[Itsme]

Hmm... I recall having heard recently that within the Dr. Edgar Mitchell FREE study, which also forms the basis of Dr. Master's hypothesis, it is stated that a majority of CE experiences involving "humanoid aliens" /"grey-alien archetype" were only reported within North American / Anglo-Saxon countries... Certainly, also rather speaks for a cultural explanation rather than "actual future humans".

Thanks for the link to that study. It was based on the results of an online MUFON survey in English: https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/NQBXTBJ
No wonder that the majority of respondents were from English speaking countries. But there were respondents from other countries as well and the data seems to be consistent over the various countries.

 

[JMartJr]

Anyway less well developed communication was a feature of our ancestors all the way back to having no communication.

Arguably it is having a resurgence. Both in the world at large and specifically in my now-uneditable post #79.

Apologies for the poor communication skills there, typed while more than a little jet-lagged. Should read "What if crows want to move something bigger than they can carry in flight?" and "Not human speech."

 

[NorCal Dave]

Thanks for the link to that study. It was based on the results of an online MUFON survey in English: https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/NQBXTBJ
No wonder that the majority of respondents were from English speaking countries. But there were respondents from other countries as well and the data seems to be consistent over the various countries.

That's quite the survey. There are 118 questions so the respondents are going to be likely limited to serious believers I would think. As for any information that can be gleaned regarding the frequency of "Greys" in these encounters, the survey itself is front loaded with the notion that Greys are one of the aliens someone is going to see. Question 57 lists Greys as the first choice for ET's working with the military:



Of course there's also the MiB and Black Helicopters. Later in question 105, the respondent gets to check a box about the alien they encountered. The survey has already primed the respondents that Greys might exist and work with the military and now the first 3 choices are Greys:


https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/NQBXTBJ

If this was then used to make some sort of "report", I would imagine that it's not much better than the meaningless NICAP "report" I covered in post #33.

So, if Masters is basing his theory that Greys are future humans on some MUFON and NICAP "reports" along with a number of very questionable case studies, it seems to have very shaky primary source material.

 

[Itsme]

So, if Masters is basing his theory that Greys are future humans on some MUFON and NICAP "reports" along with a number of very questionable case studies, it seems to have very shaky primary source material.

Well, it seems difficult to claim they are humans based on answers to the question "Did the non-humans you observed fit into any of the following categories"

If this was then used to make some sort of "report", I would imagine that it's not much better than the meaningless NICAP "report" I covered in post #33.

The NICAP file was not a report, just a catalogue. I'm glad that some people took the time to build these catalogues (often in their spare time), since at least they give some data to validate all kinds of speculations.

 

[Itsme]

Water-dwellers, for example, could never discover the control of fire, which cuts them off from ceramics and metallurgy, which means that manufactured machinery is beyond their grasp.

That is a very interesting observation. Fire needs at least 12% oxygen in our atmosphere (and this number varies a bit with pressure), so this may promote successful evolution of technological beings (I won't call them 'intelligent' anymore) in oxygen-rich atmospheres. I wonder if there is an upper limit to the amount of oxygen as well.
Note: this relates to the accidental discovery of fire via lightning or via friction.

 

[Itsme]

I've found an interesting article written by prof Simon Conway Morris in 2005.
Title: Aliens like us?
Abstract:

So, what are they going to be like, those long-expected extraterrestrials? Hideous hydrocarbon arachnoids, waving laser cannons as they chase screaming humans, repulsively surveying the scene through empathy-free compound eyes? Or maybe laughing bipeds, chatting away, holding a glass of wine, a bit like us?

Content from External Source

The content is a bit more serious and pretty interesting, though a similar tongue-in-cheek provocative statement can be found here and there.
https://articles.adsabs.harvard.edu//full/2005A&G....46d..24M/D000024.000.html

 

[Eburacum]

I wonder if there is an upper limit to the amount of oxygen as well.

On an Earth-like planet with forests on the surface, too much oxygen would increase the risk of fire considerably, reducing the production of oxygen by photosynthesis. So there may be an upper limit on the amount of oxygen that can persist on worlds similar to ours. The maximum level of oxygen in our atmosphere seems to have happened in the Carboniferous, when it was about 31-35%.

But this upper level might not be significant on a world with a different kind of biosphere that we are not familiar with, and there may be oxygen-rich worlds in various systems that have no life at all. Oxygen can be produced on a life-less world by photolysis of water, for example.

 

[Scaramanga]

It's of course a bit of a stretch to debunk one "unknown" which has been made up to explain another "unknown", but I felt that the argument has reached a level of sophistication that it needs closer scrutiny before it expands into another conspiracy theory or is used to substantiate new ones.



Dr. Michael P. Masters is a biological anthropologist and professor at Montana Tech who has written about his theories on the nature of UFO sightings in his books "Identified Flying Objects: A Multidisciplinary Scientific Approach to the UFO Phenomenon" and "The Extraterrestrial Model".




In his work, Dr. Masters argues that many UFO sightings can be explained by a time-travel hypothesis. He suggests that the UFOs may actually be advanced time-traveling vehicles that have been built by future humans, and that the sightings of these craft are being misinterpreted as extraterrestrial in origin. Dr. Masters also draws on his expertise in biological anthropology to support his hypothesis. He argues that if humans were to continue to evolve over thousands or millions of years, they would likely develop physical features that resemble the classic "grey alien" archetype commonly associated with UFO sightings.

Further arguments and evidence he brings forward in favor of a "time-travelling human hypothesis" are:

• Experiencers reporting containment procedures during their encounters
• Missing time being caused by the propulsion method of UAPs distorting spacetime
• Frequently reported UFO silence being caused by an infrasound shift due to distortion of spacetime
• Interspecies breeding compatibility i.e. "hybrid babies" being only possible if both species being related
• The commonly reported "flying saucer" being alledgly an optimal shape for a time-travel vehicle
• The bipedal template not succeeding in simulation studies under gravitational forces resembling those of the more common "super earths"
• Aliens / ETs having a couple of times a slip of a tongue and telling abductees straightforward they are just humans from the future
• ...

There is certainly a lot to unpack here. However, I think it could interesting to consider whether or not Michael Masters has been cherry-picking information. E.g. distorting CE cases such that they fit his hypothesis, misinterpreting and misunderstanding scientific work and concepts he cites to validate his ideas, etc. I also highly question whether his concept of time-travel considers that planets and star systems actually move through space and not just stay fixed...

Frankly I think one can instantly dismiss backwards time travel because it leads to absurd paradoxes. Being able to shoot one's grandfather and thus prevent oneself ever being born being not the least of them.

And why postulate time travelling anyway, or extraterrestrials for that matter, when the many worlds theorem argues for a gazillion parallel worlds where the dinosaurs could still be around or Mr Bean is president of the USA. It's not hard to postulate an alternate such world in which the dinosaurs never died out and went on to evolve into little grey 'aliens'....who discovered how to switch between dimensions or realities.

One can postulate endlessly. But the crux of the entire matter is....what is the actual evidence that anything is going on. Never mind where 'they' are from....I still see no definitive evidence that 'they' even exist.