1. Leifer

    Leifer Senior Member

    Often, close family members will reveal one or another closely held ideas.....that somehow fall into the category of "un-substanciated" claims....or other types of "suspicious beliefs".
    No one is speaking of religion claims, but those that are often conversational claims of medical cures and ideals which are largely unproven in the scientific community.

    I don't know if this happens within your family gatherings.....but it does within mine......to a small but significant amount.
     
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  2. Jason

    Jason Senior Member

    It happens more often than people would think, including my family, and more specifically "ME". I was the one, prior to 12-21-2012 that thought the world was coming to end. For me though, and at first at least, I kept it solely to myself. I don't know if I did that because I was embarrassed, ashamed, or didn't want to freak out my kids. Mostly the ladder. When I finally started to reveal my stresses, my family initially laughed at me or didn't take me seriously. They didn't do it because they thought I was ignorant, they did it because they didn't believe a guy like me would fall for that crap. Once they realized I was being serious, I think they were somewhat taken back and honestly didn't know how to deal with it. In the end family didn't help me through my CT troubles, it only made it worse at times and many arguments ensued.
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2014
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  3. WeedWhacker

    WeedWhacker Senior Member

    Depends on the definition of "bunk". There is a broad spectrum.
     
  4. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    Be polite :)

    Don't focus on the disputed facts at first, focus on establishing common ground on the topic. Then try to find the smallest thing where you differ.
     
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  5. WeedWhacker

    WeedWhacker Senior Member

    In a family setting, this can occasionally be difficult.

    Often, it involves just 'shutting up', and waiting for the others to die down their conversation. It is about listening, and contributing salient points. At the appropriate moments.
     
  6. Leifer

    Leifer Senior Member

    With my family (mostly similar aged cousins, or older aunts and uncles)...there was a surprising amount of discussion on what some would call..."new age cures" and "alternative treatments to surgery".
    The ages were above 40....when possible joint pain issues begin.
    Several conversations were had on homeopathy, and prolotherapy......promoting both.
    I saw no one politely disputing the methods (including myself)....but there was mostly agreement, that in certain situations these methods do indeed work.
     
  7. Leifer

    Leifer Senior Member

    (Deleted, re-post)
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2014
  8. Leifer

    Leifer Senior Member

    To re-describe....my mother died.
    We held a self-organized service and reception.
    My father wanted (and got) a very light Jewish service, my brother decided to add his mystical American Indian prayers.....and I added my atheistic thoughts.
    All these views were expressed....and I didn't have a problem with any of them. I allowed each immediate family member to eulogize how ever they wished.

    It wasn't until the reception (gathering) following the service, that I noticed how many family members believed in alternative medicine....and practiced it.
    Perhaps my family is not typical.
     
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  9. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    I don't think they are atypical. I think pretty much every family I know has some people (sometime a majority) who believe in some kind of alternative science or medicine.

    Homeopathy is often a good place to start. Do they actually know what it is? Most people think it's a type of herbal medicine.
     
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  10. Leifer

    Leifer Senior Member

    It is very possible that they do not realize the absurdity of a homeopathic reduction......even though they are intelligent and successful people.
    Strange as it may sound.....i wonder if rumor and "friendly coaching" from friends..... lead people to never seek an alternative viewpoint....or contradictory viewpoints.
    Why would they ?....especially if peers claim to have had success, albeit temporary success.
    It's very popular to claim to have found a "simple and non-invasive" cure.....and in turn.. inform close family members of such a "I dont need these meds or surgery", type mentality.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2014
  11. Hevach

    Hevach Senior Member

    I've said this a lot, but critical thinking skills and intelligence aren't a packaged set. Critical thinking is protection from bunk, intelligence without it can actually be a trap.


    It sucks,a but... All I can say is suffer in silence. Many people have to suffer in silence around family anyway, be it bad blood or past abuse or money or politics or religion. Some of those go both ways, so the other party is also suffering in silence, which makes it easier, but this one falls into the abuse/religion/politics category in that the other person will probably never shut up about it.

    Family has a way of being an awful thing because you don't get to pick yours. The suffering comes in because people think family is supposed to be a good thing, and keep wanting to stay closer to theirs, never remembering why they haven't called their brother in nine years until he's sitting in your living room with his feet on your coffee table bellowing about black people. Blood is thicker than water and all that (there used to be a second part to that saying, though: Blood of the battlefield is thicker than the water of the womb. That is, friends and comrades are closer than family).


    Just... whatever you do, don't do what I did to my brother-in-law. He was obsessed with the prospect that Al Qaeda was preparing a massive EMP attack that would destroy the internet, and he was afraid of it damaging his computer. Despite my best efforts to explain why that was a stupid idea, the whole discussion ended with me building and selling him a faraday cage just to shut him up.

    My wife still hasn't forgiven me for that one, particularly after I told her that if an EMP attack actually happens, it probably won't work anyway.
     
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  12. Larrydalooza

    Larrydalooza New Member

    My sister has magnetically attached herself to every government "they" CT of the last few years. Chemtrails (geo-engineering now... moving target), GMO, Aluminum, Flouride. I am concerned for her... but I am more concerned for my children and have instructed them to stay away from their Aunt. I told them that many families have a "crazy Aunt" and that is ours. She scares me and I am afraid she will do something dramatic some day. Her children have physical and social issues because of her. I wonder if people like her have a disease and simply do not possess the ability to change their reasoning.
     
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  13. Thomas

    Thomas Member

    In my case, cut all ties.

    I have astma since I was 7 years old, and my parents took me to homeopaths and spirit healers and such. I was 14 when I had seen a real doctor for the first time in my life. I remember being told asthma was my fault, a result of wrongdoing in a past life, I've had makrobiotic diets, antroposofic quakery like laying on my back for hours with a lotus root extract and damping hot towels on my chest while having an attack (wanting to sit up gasping for air)...I had a horrible time. One treatment did not help? On to the next quack with a new treatment and/or diet that did not help at all.

    When I was at a friend having a serious attack his parents took me to a real doctor, got ventolin and becotide and when my parents found out that I had gone to a regular doctor behind their backs, I was in a lot of trouble. Ended up in a boarding school, did not fit in the antroposofic way of life. When I was out of home I finally could live without thinking of illness all the time, why me and what I might have done wrong to deserve asthma. when having evaluation with boarding school and my parents, and when I told them I finally felt better due to Ventolin, the only thing they said is that it is not treating me as a whole person and that I will never be really cured that way. Took me a long time to get over that, as I got more anger the more I realized what had happened, what quackery like homeopathy and spirit healing really is, and how much damage was done to my lungs by untreated infections.

    I do not talk with them anymore, tried a few times, judged me for doing the other thing. Hopeless situation.

    Edit: this topic and my post keeps me thinking...it just shows my bias, in no way I think cutting ties is a solution, having a good relationship with my wife's family, I feel family is important and dear to me.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2014
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  14. Leifer

    Leifer Senior Member

    In my case......I could easily avoid the subject if need be.
    Once a morning, and the homeopathic drops from a tiny vial enter my uncle's coffee, my uncle's ritual is over.......he becomes quite the normal person with a very sound sense of logic.
    Such beliefs (homeopathy) hardly affect his daily life or those around him, and may simply make him "feel better" for the action taken.
    Other than a passing comment or light discussion..... I would not want to disturb his harmless ritual.
     
  15. deirdre

    deirdre Moderator Staff Member

    yea, you never said which 'therapies' your family believes in. If they are harmless, I would just let hem talk and save the hardcore debunking for the dangerous stuff.
     
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  16. Leifer

    Leifer Senior Member

    I agree......my family may quite normal for only having a few quirky beliefs......other families -- not so typical.

    Family gatherings in a funeral reception/memorial, tend to arouse discussions of extreme beliefs....they seem to become a topic then, where these beliefs can be discussed quite freely.
    Speaking of death also spurs speaking of life....it kinda open the doors of opinions and beliefs, not usually mentioned openly -- otherwise.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2014
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  17. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    Yes, you have to weigh the pros and cons. Is there harm being done? Will raising the issue create a different type of harm?

    For alternative medicine, when discussing with relatives, I stick with two things:
    • "There is no real evidence it works"
    • A description of what the practice actually is:
    There are several practices (Homeopathy, detox foot baths, ear candling) where just a tiny bit of thought in the direction of the science can give some useful perspective. You can note that detox foot baths will turn that dirty rusty color regardless of if you put your feet in them, so obviously that's not toxins from your feet. Maybe it's just a nice relaxing foot bath?
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2014
  18. deirdre

    deirdre Moderator Staff Member

    after nodding and saying 'huh. interesting'..
    one thing I always say to people is "just make sure you tell your real doctors about all this stuff, they can adversely effect real medications or cause symptoms your doctor may need to rule out".

    it's amazing how many people don't know this.
     
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  19. NoParty

    NoParty Senior Member

    She had me at "You don't need to become the belly button of the world."

    I'm not entirely sure what that means, as I was playing the "Pisces/12th House" drinkin' game
    in which you take a shot every time she says
    "...you know..."
     
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  20. Will

    Will Member

    My older brother lived with me for a while (after a few years of not speaking, but he had nowhere else to go).
    I already knew that he believed in almost every conspiracy going, from what I'd seen on his Facebook page. And really too - chemtrails, Sandy Hook being a false flag, 9/11 being an inside job, AIDS/HIV denialism, he was also an anti vaxer, the list goes on...

    I tried to avoid conversation with him about it. But unfortunately, he'd try to bring it up all too often. A long time before he came to live with me and since he last saw me, I'd become a sceptic ("sceptic" looks strange in English, as you see that word written in American-English most of the time) and got into debunking, after reading Carl Sagan's The Demon Haunted World. Superb book. That's what got me started anyway...

    Like I say, I'd avoid the subject, or give a little hint that I didn't buy into whichever one he was talking about and give a few reasons - UFO's being covered up by the government if I recall right on one occasion. Then, a week or so later, I recall he walked in the room I was in, whilst I was on my desktop. I was on a page about chemtrails. I turned it off, but too late. He'd already seen. I can't exactly recall how the convo went, but I remember him saying "What, you don't believe in them?" - I replied "No, of course not. There's no evidence for them is there?"
    He then told me "You have a very narrow worldview." This instantly irritated me, as it was a personal put-down, rather than staying on topic. I asked him to leave me alone. Perhaps not the greatest response, but still...

    It wasn't long before he brought up another conspiracy theory - Sandy Hook. He showed me the video of Robbie Parker, I'm sure you know the one. I told him that people react differently in all kinds of situations. It's not evidence of the claims he was making. He went on to show me other things too, but when I answered (I recall even linking him to Metabunk regarding the Sandy Hook stuff), he passed me off as if i were an idiot.

    Again and again he'd bring up different conspiracy theories. One day he wasn't very happy because I wouldn't take a video seriously (which was obviously CGI) of "alien cities on the moon". After suffering ten min, I said "Come on, this is silly." He really appeared to believe that stuff, and his irritation was very apparent.
    I also remember a day when he showed me what he believed to be UFO's, apparently repairing the sun, or some such nonsense. I explained it was nothing other than pareidolia on his part. A few times I'd debunk stuff he came out with or showed me. At one point, after showing me a photo of a supposed alien on mars on his friends facebook page, I told him that his friend was wrong, and I'd be prepared to have it out with him (he seemed to worship this guy). "He will annihilate you," my brother told me. However, I didn't contact his friend, but I did show my brother that his friend was lying to him, it was absolutely undeniable that he was doing so too.
    I can't remember the details now, though, the convo would still be in my inbox (we communicated sometimes in the same house in different rooms on different computers).
    My brothers response? "He's had a hard time. His wife left him."
    Okay, so that was the excuse of my brothers for him being lied too by his super-duper friend. Right...

    My brother even tried to tell me that the moon is a hologram. After trying to get him to see a little sense on subjects (as well as showing him a video that should've set straight his moon landing hoax beliefs, which made no difference to him at all). I asked him "Why do you believe in all this crazy stuff? Why do you chose to?" No answer came. He had the facts, and that was that.
    I also recall at one point, him saying to our mum "Why do you go to the doctors and let them poison you?" and trying to talk her out of getting a jab. Luckily, she's not daft. And ignored him.

    When the ISIS beheading videos came out, of course, he went into overdrive with it all. "It's fake, it's staged." Oh, he knew that for certain. He knew everything for certain.
    9/11? Apparently I was in the minority for not buying into the conspiracy theory, not that that's the case, and nor that it would even matter. And sure, I'd point him in the right direction in response, I'd try to get him to see things in a rational way, but to no avail. Incoming facts did nothing but ricochet right off his tinfoil hat.

    Over time, the more he brought it up, the more I'd reply with what I thought. Avoiding it made little difference. I'd tried every which way...

    On the last day we spoke, he brought it up again, trying to show me videos on his laptop. After ten min, I said "But this is all a bit ghoulish isn't it? It all points towards the same thing, and well, the 9/11 and Sandy hook conspiracy theorists got it wrong didn't they?"
    He got annoyed. "Why must you argue about everything?" I replied "Would you rather I didn't have an opinion of my own? And just go along with everything you say?" (on some occasions, he had a habit of saying "You're right" either really dismissively, or in a really narky way, despite that I tried as much as I could not to make it a personal matter and just stay on topic).
    "Show me evidence of the plane hitting the pentagon then," he demanded.
    So I did - I didn't get time to show him the pentagon report, but I did show him the video "911 Case Study: Pentagon Flight 77"
    He got more irate and frustrated when he saw it. "No, that's not a plane, look - that's a tree" (referring to the tail).
    I said "If that's a tree, why isn't it there in the next frame?"
    "No," he fumed, "that's not a plane. You have no evidence."
    I asked him "What knocked down the lampposts then? What sort of missile does that?" (and I laughed) "You're in denial" I said. His irritation was, however, rubbing off on me.
    Okay, maybe not the best reaction again, to laugh at him, but I'd got sick of how he'd been acting. It gets to you after a while.

    His mood didn't improve, in fact he got worse. "Intelligent people can see the truth" he said, and "Only idiots still believe 9/11 wasn't an inside job."
    Nice.
    I answered "You think cannabis cures everything, it doesn't. You're also an anti-vaxxer -"
    He shouted "What about Mercury then?" I just shook my head at him. It'd got to that point, and carried on "It's not just one conspiracy theory you buy into but the whole lot. You surround yourself with loonies on Facebook too. Have you ever read up on the psychology of people like yourself? A hatred for the police and any kind of authority, conspiracy theories giving you a sense of control in your life when all else has gone wrong. you completely fit the bill."

    His response? "Let's take it outside ey?"

    I've not spoken to him since, and I don't intend to. For various reasons, I didn't like who he'd become. Or maybe in my older age I'd seen him for who he really was. He always had issues. I used to look up to the guy once - him being 13 years older than me. How things change.



    Mick - I know this forum isn't about calling conspiracy theorists "loonies" or whatever, yet it was part of the story, what I said about the people he'd found on Facebook. I just wanted to share what I went through, and, even my own mistakes in the end, how frustrated I'd become after putting up with it so long.
    I hope that's okay with you.
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2014
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  21. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    Thanks Will, that's a very compelling and informative account.

    It seems like your brother is a "True Believer". Someone who cannot be swayed by argument or evidence. Ultimately his reason for believing is not evidence, but a particular mindset, a particular dogmatic view of the world.

    I don't like to bring up mental illness, but it's undeniable that conspiracy culture does attract people who have some kinds of mental problems - in particular people with paranoid delusions. But I think the broad cross-section of the population involved in conspiracy culture is not gong to be that different to a set of bell-curves to the general population.

    With your brother, it seems like he feels like he "has all the cards, and every card is an ace". Even if you make a few cards vanish, he's still got a load left, and he's seen a bunch more on the internet he can get. You've just got (in his mind) a couple of jokers - in your blind trust in science and the government.

    My advice always includes trying to establish common ground. It's a bit late now, but was there any common ground? was there a conceivable path upwards from that common ground?
     
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  22. E**

    E** Member

    That's for sharing this Will, it reminds me a lot of my own situation. I have a very close loved one who has gradually become a "true believer" to the point where I am scared for their well being. It is hard to watch someone day by day swallow this tripe, slowly devolving; almost like flowers for algernon.

    I'm not sure what the solution can be if any. It's extremely hard to stay cool and collected as it is, even more so when it's someone you are close to. I honestly think it stems from psychological and emotional problems more than anything else so facts and evidence aren't going to work.
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2014
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  23. Will

    Will Member

    Not really Mick. There were other issues too, his self-centeredness and how he treated people in general.
    He once took notice when I threw him a Rationalwiki link about Before it's News. http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Before_It's_News
    I knew this as I later saw him in my newsfeed warning another person that it wasn't a trustworthy site. But that was about it.
    I'd try to find common ground, even simple things - asking if he'd like to watch a film, but he "didn't watch films". Nor did he have interest in reading books. Often he'd pull the conversation back to his conspiracy theories, for example, I was considering buying a Celestron Nexstar 8 SE telescope. I spoke to him about it, and he said "The planets aren't there anyway."
    Weird.
    Another time, whilst I was on my desktop reading something about some damage to Rover on Mars, he said "All they have to do is go back to the Australian outback and repair it."

    That's pretty much summed it up, and I don't think it's something that'll change any time soon, if ever unfortunately. And listening to it brings me down. It's hard to laugh it off when it's that close to home.
    I've read up a little on conspiracy theorist psychology. but it doesn't appear that it's been looked into enough, especially as it's a way of thinking which seems to be on the rise. What I did read seemed to hit the nail on the head though. Despite that, I still find it hard to comprehend that anyone could be that gullible. I mean, the moon is a hologram? It's absurd.
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2014
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  24. Will

    Will Member

    It is difficult, and I'd say you're right about it being psychological and emotional problems more than anything else. Facts/evidence don't matter to the conspiracy theorist. All that matters are their beliefs - they want to place the blame elsewhere (the government) rather than themselves. And this special knowledge and insight they believe they have that us "sheeple" don't, makes them superior in their own minds. I'm of the view, and from what I've read, that it stems from low self-esteem.

    One conclusion I came to - when a conspiracy theorist asks a question, and you give the answer, if that answer doesn't fit their beliefs they'll most likely tell you you're wrong (or something similar) and they'll ask another question. I think that's a power game in the mind of the conspiracy theorist. They get off on it somehow.

    Aside from the beliefs, are you seeing a similar attitude/behaviour towards others from your relation?
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2014
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  25. derwoodii

    derwoodii Senior Member

    you may avoid the family dispute & personalizes argument by asking them to sign up here at Metabunk or other similar sites post & debate their beliefs with site members and not you.
     
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  26. E**

    E** Member

    Yes a lot of that applies to me, there is an element of having special knowledge but I believe they are more into it for the "peace of mind" it offers, it's more comforting to think one group is behind everything evil in the world than to believe bad things happen at random and are just human nature.

    At least in my situation I don't believe it's a power game but cognitive dissonance: http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Cognitive_dissonance They quickly have learned to avoid any arguments with me as I can run circles around them with what I've learned here and snopes, etc. Of course they just chalk it up to me being "brainwashed" and not "awake"

    I honestly feel like my loved one has joined a cult.
     
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  27. Will

    Will Member

    I remember thinking exactly the same thing. If it's not too nosy to ask, has the person you know always had obvious psychological or emotional issues?

    I'm quite interested in why conspiracy theorists/"truthers" buy into the nonsense they do.
     
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  28. Will

    Will Member

    I tried that. Obviously Metabunk isn't exciting enough - there's no creepy emotive music running in the background.
     
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  29. E**

    E** Member

    I'll share but I'm being purposely vague since this person shares a computer with me and there is a possibility they might read this. No past psychological or emotional issues that I know of, but they have always been a "seeker" type, with a deep distrust of authority. I think what lead to it was experiencing a set of very difficult life situations over the past few years many involving authority and professionals. They started off with watching one of those 9/11 is an inside job videos from a link and that opened up the flood gates.

    Really if I didn't know how to think critically I could see myself going down the same path.

    My situation might also be different from yours since my family member doesn't buy into the alien stuff because "it's too ridiculous" (saying this while they believe global warming is a scam set up by the NWO and Obama who use HARRP to control the weather)


    Oh boy your head just about explodes when their response after looking over this site is "what do those nerds know, it's mostly just one guy anyways" (if you can't tell they are followers of Alex Jones...)

    Ha, sorry to unload all this. To get back on topic I did have some success at the beginning by following Micks guide to debunking. But then the MH17 airplane crash happened and that supposedly confirmed everything for them, of course any explanations of how cold reading and predictions work is met with "I don't believe in coincidences"

    There is a point before they fall into all of this that you can reason with them, but unfortunately at that point it feels like being intrusive if you butt in. In my naivety I genuinely thought they where looking at these videos to make fun of them because that is the only way I could picture anyone tolerating this stuff.

    It's just almost impossible to plant the seeds of logic in someone when you are that close to them. I've slowly devolved into calling their beliefs mentally ill which I realize is very counterproductive. You just want to grab them by the shoulders and shake them till they "wake up" from being "awake"
     
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  30. BombDr

    BombDr Senior Member

    I find they usually move on to something else with a sentence starting with 'What about....?', completely abandoning their initial claim and seamlessly moving onto the next without acknowledging any problem with the first...

    What I also find interesting is that the prolific posters on Youtube never seem to take down their posts that are a few years old, yet have been completely debunked by the course of time. AMTV's Christopher Greene has videos going back an couple of years predicting war with Iran, Russia, China, everything in the world is a false-flag, and Obama is behind them all. The Economy was always on the brink of collapse and the London Olympics was supposed to be an Illuminati false-flag terror event, martial law, gin control, foreign troops in America.... The US Air Force in apparently importing heroin from Afghanistan into the US in C17s. His big thing at the moment is Ebola, which is also somehow Obama's fault...

    Even unrelated things were not safe - Robin Williams suicide was to distract us from...something, Beyonce is plotting something, Batman and Red Dawn are especially commissioned movies to 'condition' Americans, Chris Kyle and Patraeus' affair were false flags... etc etc...

    Even though none of these happen, he keeps the videos up...

    But, when I pour scorn in the comments section, his disciples hit back with the usual swerving of the facts, and escalate immediately to 'Shill!, Sheep!, Brainwashed! Thats what they want you to think!' or move straight on to the next claim, ignoring the one that has just been debunked...
     
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  31. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    I think it can sometimes be helpful to try to make them focus on that first claim a bit longer. Ask them if they actually admit they were wrong there, and if there are any implications. At least try to get some kind of comment on it.
     
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  32. BombDr

    BombDr Senior Member

    I agree, and have tried that, but in a way I already know I'm on a hiding to nothing but it's interesting to me how they can argue the impossible, or at least the parts that are untestable such as Obama being the anti-Christ - a bit tricky to debunk and the best I can do is ask for a definition of a common or garden anti-Christ...

    Just to bring myself back on topic, like Thomas I had a childhood ailment except mine was eczema, and my Mother believed any nonsense that anyone told her that might help. I was taken to a variety of quacks and given all sorts of nonsense to smear on my skin. She read somewhere that cows milk was bad for it, so she got some goats milk which I detested and tried all sorts of subterfuge like decanting it into a cows milk bottle to trick me into drinking it. The odd thing was, the weirder the remedy, the more likely she was to go with it...

    In the end, it just went away in my early teens...
     
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  33. Brainiachick

    Brainiachick Active Member


    Oh dear, I'm so sorry you were subjected to such horrible treatment! What were they thinking? You were just a child, how could you possibly be responsible for your asthma? I'm glad you've got a nicer family in your in-laws.

    (((Hugs))).
     
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  34. Brainiachick

    Brainiachick Active Member

    I do know for a fact that infantile and childhood eczema could be aggravated by dairy (mostly cow's milk) in cases where there is concurrent dairy allergy. Sadly, eczema tends to go hand in hand with allergies, so your mother may have been on to something you weren't aware of by giving you goat milk which is generally more tolerated by eczema and allergy sufferers. It is possible your paediatrician ran a RAST or allergy test to that effect? So your mother may not have acted completely un-medical in the goat milk regard - poor you!

    Luckily, I don't have family members who believe in or spread bunk - they just can't be bothered. But if I did, and they did my head in, I'll just avoid them like I do Jehovah's Witnesses. No offence.
     
  35. BombDr

    BombDr Senior Member

    Well presumably an allergy stays with one for life...? I drink cows milk by the pint, and no harm done at all... But I am 41 years old now, and despite commanding men in battle, my Mum still thinks she knows best....
     
  36. Brainiachick

    Brainiachick Active Member


    Lol...mothers know best...always. Mine is dead, bless her.

    As for allergies, they do not always stay with you for life, it completely depends on the type of allergy. From the top of my head, nuts allergy is the one that stays with you for life. Most others come and go in the course of a lifetime and yet some people never suffer any allergies at all. In paediatrics, once you see eczema, cow's milk and other allergies often follow in tow and if the child is unlucky, childhood asthma could be implicated as well which can make the child's life a real pain if not properly managed. Some childhood onset asthma go away with age but some others remain. There are sadly no known scientific reasons behind the aetiology besides the elucidation of predisposing factors, and there are also no scientific reasons for the differing prognoses.
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2014
  37. E**

    E** Member

    I don't think I've ever seen a conspiracy theorists anywhere admit they are wrong about anything.
     
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  38. Brainiachick

    Brainiachick Active Member

    Pure conjecture here, but I think there are a variety of reasons why they keep these videos on even after they've been debunked:

    1. They'll be admitting they were wrong which is the reasonable thing to do, but which most are incapable of.

    2. Such admittance would be a clear indication of willingness to apply balance, which again, sadly I find many incapable of.

    3. Perhaps most poignant is the saying in the advertising industry that 'a lie repeated often enough soon starts to sound like the truth' - this appears to largely apply to the spreading of bunk and false information. So there's no scruple to the amount of manipulation of the truth that goes into their efforts to keep spreading bunk that has been debunked.

    4. There is always the motivation to attract new and unsuspecting recruits who would see the videos but may be completely unaware that they have been debunked.

    Something similar happened a few days ago, when I received from the President of a Children's charity, a publication from a German government department (written in German) which had been twisted by some conspiracy theorists to state that the German government was legalising paedophilia and in some quarters they tried to link it with the NWO, Illuminati etc etc, despite this having been translated and debunked repeatedly by native speakers of the German language who are anti-paedophilia practitioners and activists. The fact that this charity professional who should verify before circulating documents failed to do so and seems to be completely oblivious to the fact that nothing effaces credibility faster than spreading or believing in bunk within the Justice system was very disappointing. In a nutshell, even if the publication was advocating legalising paedophilia in Germany, and it wasn't, it has no bearing on the fight against child abuse in Britain so it was pointless, but yet they spread bunk. The amount of calls and enquiries that began to flood in following this bunk was unbelievable - sometimes it is so clear that human nature is so pliable and easy to manipulate!

    5. I'm sure there are host of other reasons they retain these debunked bunks and keep them 'alive' online.
     
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  39. Brainiachick

    Brainiachick Active Member

    That has been my experience too!
     
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  40. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

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