Whats that thing in the.. sea?

jarlrmai

Active Member
UPDATE
UPDATE: Recreating the scene in Google Earth, the "UFO" is a cargo ship, about 1000 feet long, and about 15 miles off the coast.




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Another Reddit UFO find that presents a fun challenge.

This youtube video of a fire in California near Westlake shows several firefighting aircraft tackling a blaze on a mountain ridge

Source: http://youtube.com/watch?v=fwMQL6ShzjQ


At 7 seconds a long oblong shape emerges from the clouds travelling right to left. The original claim is that this is a UFO but some people on the Reddit forum are claiming it's just a boat, the location is ocean side and the camera is high and looking down and towards the ocean. However the object seems to be moving quite fast, but the claims are that this is due to parallax and other effects.

So is it a boat on the ocean or something else?
 
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deirdre

Senior Member.
Edit add: its the Woolsey fire flare up near Lake Sherwood November 13, 2018. lots of footage online of it, but that isn't helping me orient the mountains in the OP footage :)



Another Reddit UFO find that presents a fun challenge.
well if it's a Reddit thread then surely someone pinpointed the location already. care to share? since you didn't link the thread?

heres the 'object'
1590792346491.png

all these mountain bumps look the same to me.
1590792435542.png

the date would probably be helpful too
1590792802586.png
 
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deirdre

Senior Member.
I think this is the scene. One fire vid mentioned boney mountain, which is the red tag way in the back you might not be able to see. anyway, I cant line it up exactly because I suck at Google Earth movement.

trying to figure out how much ocean we can see etc.
1590800278120.png

I stuck a pin in that pointy part (although how close it is to the actual part I don't know so you may have to play around a bit with moving)
says lat 34° 7'35.46"N
long 118°54'59.66"W
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
i see no way it could be the island. the craggy peak I point to above doesn't move in angle at all. the YouTube guy says the station who filmed say it is a cargo boat, but he claims the boat is moving too fast.

anyway here is the original video (2 hours) our scene is at 5 min mark. unfortunately right after the smoke takes over so you cant see anything out there after that.
Source: https://www.facebook.com/ktla5/videos/2223699561246692
 

Mendel

Senior Member.
the craggy peak I point to above doesn't move in angle at all.
Your excellent identification in post #5 shows that the camera is even further away than your Google Earth viewpoint is, because the peak in the background appears larger in the video: this perspective change indicates a greater distance with more lens magnification.
The great distance means that "sideways" movement of the observer wouldn't change the angle of the scenery much, but you'd still get a parallax effect, and that is very much evident in the footage as the two ridge lines shift position with respect to each other:
image.jpeg
image.jpeg
As you can see, the island is approximately in line with my left guide line.
 
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deirdre

Senior Member.
As you can see, the island is approximately in line with my left guide line.
yea but in the middle of the blob movement, it seems the helicopter is stationary (the two ridges stay the same) but the blob ufo keeps moving. I have wicked spatial cognition issues, but I have to move my helicopter to the left to get my island to move. in the clip it seems the helicopter is moving to the right. ??

unfortunately if it is a parallax of the island, someone ( like @Mick West ) who knows how to work Google Earth better than i do, would have to make a little video or something for people like me (or UFO believers) to understand the concept.

ps. in the Facebook long version he says they are at about 6000 feet altitude. so i do have to move back in Google Earth very far...and then i cant see my ridges good enough :)
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Was able to quickly come up with this which approximates the camera from the helicopters view, it's hard to get it accurate without knowing the helicopters location, altitude and camera fov.
Yeah, I looked into it a bit yesterday. I have FlightRadar24 access on that date, plus I used to live in Westlake Village, so I thought it would be relatively straightforward.

Unfortunately the KTLA5 Chopper does not seem to show up.

Also, this matching curve here:


Is a bit an illusion as it's the division between 3D and 2.5D mapped regions. To remove that, turn off the 3D Buildings.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
One things I did was download the MODIS satellite image of the smoke for that day (you can just download a .KMZ)
Metabunk 2020-05-31 06-26-52.jpg

Then made a rough transparent volume for where the smoke was:
Metabunk 2020-05-31 06-28-33.jpg

And turned off the overlay
Metabunk 2020-05-31 06-29-21.jpg
 

Attachments

jarlrmai

Active Member
Yeah I noticed is the terrain looks different if you remove the 3d buildings layer in Google Earth, the smoke line is different to the terrain line and it can be a bit misleading.

I found this establishing shot in the full feed.

view2.jpg

and I added markers on some roads and features that show up on Google Earth to help line it up in Google Earth Pro but its almost impossible work backwards for a chopper position because you can't easily adjust the camera position while messing with the FOV etc to make it line up. Unless you know some tricks Mick? Then we could place some markers to work out what the exact peaks etc were for the more zoomed shot where the object appears.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
However, that may well be wrong, as it's not really close to Westlake Village. It's possible that there's misreporting, like that's the Helicopter location, not fire location. But there WAS fire around Westlake village. Just not in the MODIS image.

... and based on this:
Metabunk 2020-05-31 06-47-40.jpg

The chopper is over Moorpark.
Metabunk 2020-05-31 06-51-02.jpg
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
That fake curve is interesting, as when you turn on the 3D buildings, the right side becomes better, but the left side is smooth:

Metabunk 2020-05-31 07-21-26.jpg

The actual ridge is more like:Metabunk 2020-05-31 07-21-26.jpg
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
If you look at the 6:30 mark, I think you briefly see it again, right up at the top of the video
Nice! I snagged it
630.png

still cant wrap my head around the parallax, but this proves (to me at least) the object didn't fly off the screen fast in the OP video. Thanks!
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
And here's the parallax effect. This was a little fiddle, but you can rotate around a point in GE by shift-clicking and dragging. I used "Mouse Keys" to restrict it to just X, which is why this is a bit choppy.

My Full GE folder is attached, with the ship and the 5:05 view.

 

Attachments

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Here's a rough match of my animation to a stabilized version of the video


Pay attention to the relative positions of the near peak, and the dip that starts out above it:
Metabunk 2020-05-31 08-57-01.jpg
 

Attachments

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
The second time you see it appears to be a different cargo ship. The helicopter has continued left a significant amount, and so the first ship has long gone, and another comes into view. All from parallax.
Metabunk 2020-05-31 09-26-03.jpg

Metabunk 2020-05-31 09-27-27.jpg

That position (about 15 miles off the coast) is exactly where you'd expect to see several ships going in both directions. This is from today, but shows three large cargo ships going along that route. Two North, one South.
https://www.marinetraffic.com/en/ais/home/shipid:5651989/zoom:10
Metabunk 2020-05-31 09-21-29.jpg
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Yeah I noticed is the terrain looks different if you remove the 3d buildings layer in Google Earth, the smoke line is different to the terrain line and it can be a bit misleading.

I found this establishing shot in the full feed.

View attachment 40990

and I added markers on some roads and features that show up on Google Earth to help line it up in Google Earth Pro but its almost impossible work backwards for a chopper position because you can't easily adjust the camera position while messing with the FOV etc to make it line up. Unless you know some tricks Mick? Then we could place some markers to work out what the exact peaks etc were for the more zoomed shot where the object appears.
I use the "transparent Photo overlay" trick to zoom in. The earlier wider show had established the camera was over Moorpark, giving a rough distance. The yellow valley at the base of the mountains gave a great point fo reference.

FOV is not TOO important, as changing FOV does not change the relative positions of anything. Metabunk 2020-05-31 13-23-40.jpg

I added a transparent polygon behind the first ridge which allows you to see the outline easier, like with the smoke.

Then it's just a case of moving the camera position until the peaks line up as they do in the picture. In the "Get Info - > photo" mode for the transparent photo view, I shift clicked on the ridge and dragged around to get a rough layout. A little fine-tuning with adjusting the altitude.
 

jarlrmai

Active Member
Yeah that's where I place it.
I use the "transparent Photo overlay" trick to zoom in. The earlier wider show had established the camera was over Moorpark, giving a rough distance. The yellow valley at the base of the mountains gave a great point fo reference.

FOV is not TOO important, as changing FOV does not change the relative positions of anything. View attachment 41011

I added a transparent polygon behind the first ridge which allows you to see the outline easier, like with the smoke.

Then it's just a case of moving the camera position until the peaks line up as they do in the picture. In the "Get Info - > photo" mode for the transparent photo view, I shift clicked on the ridge and dragged around to get a rough layout. A little fine-tuning with adjusting the altitude.
Right thanks for the tips, this kind of technique seems to be really useful for a lot of investigations
 
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