Trump Shot at Rally

[Mick West]

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLybWj-ojck

Article:

JUST IN: Former President Donald Trump was rushed off stage after he fell to the ground at the start of a rally in Butler, Pennsylvania, Saturday night.
It was not immediately clear what caused Trump to fall. He raised a fist and yelled back to members of the crowd before he was rushed away.

Source: https://www.cnn.com/politics/live-news/election-biden-trump-07-13-24/index.html

Looks like he was actually shot with something. He raises up his hand to his ear before crouching/falling

 

[Mick West]

The audio and the results suggest a paintball gun. So lots of people are suggesting it was "staged"

Typical examples of hundreds

 

[Mick West]

From the C-Span video in the OP

00:13 First shot
00:15 Trump gets down
00:17 More rapid shots
00:28 A single possible shot, woman screams
00:54 "Shooter is down" is repeated several times

 

[JMartJr]

CNN reports the shooter and at least one spectator is dead another in critical condition, according to local law enforcement, also that the Trump campaign reports the former President is in a medical facility "and will be fine."

Be aware of source that early reporting during this sort of event is often coming directly onscreen without being vetted well, and may be in error. Early errors in reporting often lead to conspiracy theories later when early reporting needs to be corrected.

 

[Mick West]

A possible shooter location is being reported.

 

[Dan Burt]

Dang you are fast Mick! Well done.

 

[NoParty]

I rarely go conspiricist...but I must say, the way Trump was shaking his fist
looked like he was already in "Let's milk this!" mode.
The Manchurian Candidate came to mind immediately.
To be clear, I have no idea who was behind this...but DJT's actions make me wonder.

 

[NorCal Dave]

A possible shooter location is being reported.

View attachment 70124
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With 2 people dead and that distance, a paintball gun seems very unlikely. That's also a long way for handgun. I had a few friends that were exceptional with a handgun at a good distance, but not that far and that was in a quite setting with time to concentrate. It looks like a number of pickup trucks in the parking lot with F150s being around 18' give or take and I'm thinking around 30ish car lengths to the pin? So around 183 yards?

 

[Chacra]

With 2 people dead and that distance, a paintball gun seems very unlikely. That's also a long way for handgun. I had a few friends that were exceptional with a handgun at a good distance, but not that far and that was in a quite setting with time to concentrate. It looks like a number of pickup trucks in the parking lot with F150s being around 18' give or take and I'm thinking around 30ish car lengths to the pin? So around 183 yards?

I have to agree it's very unlikely that it was a paintball gun. The audio of the shots is not great quality but they would appear to be small calibre rifle.22lr being extremely common used for target shooting as well as hunting small animals like a squirrel. Effective to approximately 150 yards and might explain the limited damage to his ear.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/.22_Long_Rifle#performance

The .22LR is effective to 150 yd (140 m), though practical ranges tend to be less. After 150 yards, the ballistics of the round are such that it will be difficult to compensate for the large "drop".

Edited quote formatting

 

[Chacra]

From the C-Span video in the OP

00:13 First shot
00:15 Trump gets down
00:17 More rapid shots
00:28 A single possible shot, woman screams
00:54 "Shooter is down" is repeated several times

00:13 begins three consecutive shots I believe these would all be from the shooter. Close timing is consistent with a semi-auto rifle. Would be difficult to cycle a bolt action 3 times in that time period.
00:17 more rapid shots I believe are the police/secret service shooting at the would be assassin.

I think the shots at 00:17 sound distinct from the first three and would make sense as police and secret service would definitely be shooting larger calibers 5.56mm for the CQB rifle and .300 WinMag for the counter sniper team.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Secret_Service#weapons_and_equipment

The Counter Assault Team (CAT) and the Emergency Response Team (ERT) both use the 5.56mm Knight's Armament Company SR-16 CQB assault rifle in an 11.5" configuration. CAT also deploys 12 gauge Remington 870 MCS breaching shotguns. Uniform Division technicians assigned to the Counter Sniper (CS) team use custom built .300 Winchester Magnum-chambered bolt-action rifles. These rifles are built with Remington 700 long actions in Accuracy International stocks and use Schmidt & Bender optics.

Edited quote formatting

 

[LA85]

Isometric view of possible location of shooter and the stage Trump was on.

 

[Greene]

Google Street Views of the building the shooter/body was on....

From the West:

From the East:

 

[Mendel]

I rarely go conspiricist...but I must say, the way Trump was shaking his fist
looked like he was already in "Let's milk this!" mode.

To be fair, he's always in that mode in public.

I'd like to see information on how the bystanders got injured.

 

[Dan Burt]

To be fair, he's always in that mode in public.

I'd like to see information on how the bystanders got injured.

I read a theory that the shooter gets off his initial burst of shots, Secret Service sniper hits him, shooter after being shot lets go another burst of shots that go awry and strike bystanders in the bleachers.

 

[Greene]

I have to agree it's very unlikely that it was a paintball gun. The audio of the shots is not great quality but they would appear to be small calibre rifle.22lr being extremely common used for target shooting as well as hunting small animals like a squirrel. Effective to approximately 150 yards and might explain the limited damage to his ear.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/.22_Long_Rifle#performance

The .22LR is effective to 150 yd (140 m), though practical ranges tend to be less. After 150 yards, the ballistics of the round are such that it will be difficult to compensate for the large "drop".

Edited quote formatting

Honestly the initial 3 shots sound consistent with an intermediate cartridge (ie 5.56) to me. You hear the snap of the round (sonic boom) then the louder retort of the weapon discharge. Remember the weapon was more than 150 yards away from the camera.

Anyone know how far from the stage the media area was?

 

[Greene]

With 2 people dead and that distance, a paintball gun seems very unlikely. That's also a long way for handgun. I had a few friends that were exceptional with a handgun at a good distance, but not that far and that was in a quite setting with time to concentrate. It looks like a number of pickup trucks in the parking lot with F150s being around 18' give or take and I'm thinking around 30ish car lengths to the pin? So around 183 yards?

Going by Google Maps it's roughly 400 ft (123m).

 

[Chacra]

A video posted to Reddit - someone was filming the police/secret service snipers when the shooting started.

It looks to me like they are reacting and taking cover when the first shots are fired.

 

[Mick West]

A video posted to Reddit - someone was filming the police/secret service snipers when the shooting started.

It looks to me like they are reacting and taking cover when the first shots are fired.

I synced up the videos, the counter-sniper seems to react within less than a second of the first shot being fired.

 

[Greene]

Source: https://x.com/TieDyeIntel/status/1812358146829979927

The updated image has some useful info on locations. For example, the victim in the far bleachers.

 

[Matt33]

Is it confirmed that a bullet pierced his ear? I read some comments about flying debris from a teleprompter.

 

[Mick West]

Discussion of the "bullet" photo moved to:

Thread 'The Trump Bullet Photo'

Jul 13, 2024

Well one thing is likely, we will have more footage that the JFK assassination to study

Apparently this is a bullet captured

I assume one can work out if it comes from where the gunman was meant to be

EDIT: Seems the above photo is taken with 1/8000 shutter speed.
My personal take is it looks like the bullet is moving from left to right, though I'm no expert (so that jives with where the shooter was)

• captancourgette
• Replies: 24
• Forum: Trump Shooting

 

[Mick West]

Is it confirmed that a bullet pierced his ear? I read some comments about flying debris from a teleprompter.

Both teleprompters are still intact.

And his ear was facing the back of the stage. It seems like a bullet just clipped his ear.

 

[JMartJr]

I am seeing on social media claims that the shooter was a registered Republican, with no source or evidence to back such a claim. But I have seen enough claims that "all mass shooters are registered in the party I don't like" to assume this is just more of the same, and that a claim that he was a registered Democrat will be along shortly. I doubt that, at this point, anybody knows if he was registered to vote at all.

At some point somebody may come up with evidence on this point, if only in refutation of such speculative claims. If any of you see that and I miss it, I'd appreciate it being pointed out.

 

[Chacra]

Honestly the initial 3 shots sound consistent with an intermediate cartridge (ie 5.56) to me. You hear the snap of the round (sonic boom) then the louder retort of the weapon discharge. Remember the weapon was more than 150 yards away from the camera.

Anyone know how far from the stage the media area was?

I think you are correct.

 

[Alexandria Nick]

I grew up about 4 miles from where this happened. My literal next door neighbors were in the grandstand behind Trump. Going to the Farm Show was just something you did in August. The Honda Accord I used to own was bought across the street. This was practically my back yard.

I am just astonished that they did not have that roof secured. When I first heard that Trump had been shot at, I had two thoughts: either someone in the crowd or a sniper firing from the rooftop of the plant just to the south. There's no other site (other than the water tower) with line of sight to the Farm Show grounds. The whole area is a bit of a rise, probably why they built it there in the first place. You can't even really see into the grounds from the surrounding roads and that's the only real gap in the trees that also provide you with a shooting platform. It should have been immediately apparent in their security planning because it is hilariously obvious that it could be a shooter's position to an event at the Farm Show.

I am seeing on social media claims that the shooter was a registered Republican, with no source or evidence to back such a claim. But I have seen enough claims that "all mass shooters are registered in the party I don't like" to assume this is just more of the same, and that a claim that he was a registered Democrat will be along shortly. I doubt that, at this point, anybody knows if he was registered to vote at all.

In Pennsylvania, if you know someone's legal name, birthday, and zip code, you can pull their party affiliation from the public database. I don't see any reason to doubt it, because anyone can confirm it.

 

[Z.W. Wolf]

As far as the person responsible for the shooting, they have been identified as Thomas Matthew Crooks, born in September of 2003 from Bethel Park, Pennsylvania. We dug through the records. In Pennsylvania, they have a robust court system. We find no criminal history, no history of lawsuits.

We look at lawsuits to see if someone has an axe to grind against an individual or individuals. We can't see that. Registered, according to Pennsylvania records, as a registered Republican but did donate $15 to a pro-Democratic cause.

Right now, it is very unclear, in the words of one senior law enforcement official, what the motive might be here. For a 20-year-old male in America, this individual has a very small social media footprint. That will make it more difficult. I think we have to keep an open mind because that is what law enforcement is doing at this point as to what the motive might be.

 

[JWrightBrain]

In Pennsylvania, if you know someone's legal name, birthday, and zip code, you can pull their party affiliation from the public database. I don't see any reason to doubt it, because anyone can confirm it.

This will probably be deleted, because I cannot share the link, nor can I share personal information like address or birth date. BUT I did find the Voter Reg for Thomas Matthew Crooks. And in looking up the address I found a Matthew Crooks 53 and a Thomas Crooks 20 living at the address.

He was a registered Republican. What his current political beliefs are, we can not guess.

 

[Inti]

I am seeing on social media claims that the shooter was a registered Republican, with no source or evidence to back such a claim. But I have seen enough claims that "all mass shooters are registered in the party I don't like" to assume this is just more of the same, and that a claim that he was a registered Democrat will be along shortly. I doubt that, at this point, anybody knows if he was registered to vote at all.

At some point somebody may come up with evidence on this point, if only in refutation of such speculative claims. If any of you see that and I miss it, I'd appreciate it being pointed out.

On the question of the shooter's poliical affiliations, Ben Meiselas of the MeidasTouch Network on YouTube based on a report by Roger Sullenberg of New York Post displays the voter registration of the shooter named by the FBI, showing him to be a registered Republican. He also shows photos of the shooter was wearing a Bunker Brand teeshirt as advertised by a right wing group, Demolition Ranch, advocating unlimited gun ownership.

Edit: I have just noticed that the words
"Affiliation: REPUBLICAN,
Status: Active"
In the shooter's alleged voter registration document are obscured by the captions in my screenshot, which ironically subtitle the statement that he was registered as Republican! Sorry, I can't redo this right now, but they are shown at 1min 30 seconds in the video.


YouTube link

 

[Mendel]

It kinda makes sense.
Democrat sympathizers hope at this point that Biden wins the election, but neverTrump Republicans have no such hope.

 

[Greene]

Regarding any potential political affiliation. It's been reported that he also made a donation to ActBlue which earmarks money for Democrat candidates.

A resident of Bethel Park, about an hour away from where the shooting occurred, Crooks was a registered Republican who would have been eligible to cast his first presidential vote in the Nov. 5 election in which Trump is challenging President Joe Biden. Public records show his father is a registered Republican and mother a registered Democrat.

Federal Election Commission filings show Crooks appears to have made a small $15 donation several years ago to a political action committee called ActBlue that raises money for left-leaning and Democratic politicians. The donation was earmarked for the Progressive Turnout Project, a national group that rallies Democrats to vote. The groups did not immediately respond to a Reuters request for comment.

SOURCE

It's possible he registered as a Republican to help a weaker candidate win a primary in order to help a Democrat in the general election. It's also possible that became 'redpilled' and swung far to the right over the past few years.

People are complicated.

 

[Ann K]

It's possible he registered as a Republican to help a weaker candidate win a primary in order to help a Democrat in the general election. It's also possible that became 'redpilled' and swung far to the right over the past few years.

People are complicated.

It's possible that he was one of those who are criticizing Trump for not being right-wing enough. Trump has said a few things recently to try to distance himself from the more radical members of his party (probably for political reasons, not from any sincere feelings), and there are those who are upset that he might be abandoning their beloved "Project 2025".

As for the shooter, I note that no matter his registration, he never lived long enough to cast a vote.

 

[Z.W. Wolf]

Knowing that he registered as a Republican has no value. It's just something that could be bandied about in a tribalistic way.

That T-shirt may have some value. He wore it to what he must have suspected was a suicidal gesture. It may be meaningful to him. Or he just picked it out of the closet because it's grey and would blend into the rooftop.


So far what has caught my attention:
-The T-Shirt and what it is associated with
-Very young
-Very little social media presence
-No laws suits (Many lawsuits - being litigious - is a good indicator of a paranoia.)
-No criminal record

Seems very quiet. Certainly not in the tradition Oswald for example. He had a long history of being political and difficult.

My impression so far, is a young guy who very quietly self-radicalized. Depression is more likely than narcissism or paranoia.

The age of 20 is when schizophrenia often develops. But he's functional and capable of carrying out long term plans, so something like schizophrenia doesn't seem likely.

Major Depressive Disorder. Major Depressive Disorder with Psychotic Features. Maybe, but these are usually associated with lack of action. But not always

Delusional Disorder. Delusional Disorder with secondary depression. Seems more on the money. Maybe the grandiose type.

Schizoid Personality Disorder with secondary depression. Arthur Bremer (attempted assassin of George Wallace) was diagnosed with schizoid personality disorder with depression and obsessive tendencies. He, and his diary writings, were one of the things that Travis Bickle and his diary were based on. Taxi Driver, remember? Bremer's diary was full of feelings of isolation, anger, and a desire to achieve notoriety through violent acts.


Just early speculation, remember.

 

[Dan Burt]

It's possible that he was one of those who are criticizing Trump for not being right-wing enough. Trump has said a few things recently to try to distance himself from the more radical members of his party (probably for political reasons, not from any sincere feelings), and there are those who are upset that he might be abandoning their beloved "Project 2025".

As for the shooter, I note that no matter his registration, he never lived long enough to cast a vote.

Agreed. There are some "far" right wing types that believe they don't need anyone's permission to own any type of firearm, ammunition, magazine capacity...etc. They feel it is their God given right to bear any arms.

 

[deirdre]

Its also possible that he just wanted to be famous. And Trump was in the neighborhood at a convenient location.

Aside from Lanza, the only killer i can name (aside from famous serial killers like ted bundy) are the guys who assassinated (or tried to like Hinkley) Presidents.

 

[JWrightBrain]

It's waaaay to early to ascribe a motive to Crooks yet. He WAS a registered Republican who once donated $15 to Biden. They are important elements but mean nothing in and of themselves. Hell, how many Republicans railed against Trump after Jan. 6, only to kiss his dupa later?

No the real info might come from Crook's computer and phone if and when the FBI gains custody of them. He may have had a political grudge against Trump or maybe he wanted to impress Jodie Foster like Hinkley. We just don't have the info yet.

 

[Z.W. Wolf]

Travis Bickle is stuck in my mind, now. Palantine for President. The scene where he buys the guns. The scene where he knocks over his little TV and it breaks open. "Damn. Goddamn."

 

[deirdre]

No the real info might come from Crook's computer and phone if and when the FBI gains custody of them. He may have had a political grudge against Trump or maybe he wanted to impress Jodie Foster like Hinkley

either way it boils down to mental health issues.

Article:

Crooks' parents, Matthew and Mary Crooks, née Frizzi, are certified behavioral health counselors, according to state licensing records.

Source: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/thomas-matthew-crooks-trump-shooting-mark-crooks-b2579587.html

 

[Z.W. Wolf]

The more I ponder, the more I'm getting the vibe that this was a suicidal gesture with elements of grandiosity.

 

[JMartJr]

We'll find out what can be found out about motive, eventually. I think it is a mistake to assume it was political. It may turn out that it was, but it is not a sure assumption. Reading descriptions of him on CNN:

But CNN interviews with a half-dozen former classmates and neighbors of Crooks painted him as quiet and aloof, with classmates remembering him as a misfit in high school. And a review of public records suggests he may have had divergent political leanings, with Crooks registering to vote as a Republican but making a small donation to a Democratic-leaning group.

and

Jason Kohler, 21, who went to the same high school, told CNN that Crooks was bullied by other students and seemed to be a loner.

Crooks had "no facial expression" when he walked through the school hallways, Kohler said. "He wasn't, like, with the clique, so he always had, I guess, a target on his back."

Another former student at the school, Sarah D'Angelo, remembered Crooks as "a quiet kid, not obviously political or violent in any way." She said the only time he spoke with her was when their class was waiting for their graduation ceremony to start.

and

...the classmate said, "I was just, like, shocked — I just couldn't believe he did something that bold, considering he was such a quiet and kept-to-himself kind of person."

Source: https://www.cnn.com/2024/07/14/us/trump-rally-gunman-thomas-crooks-invs/index.html

If you remove references to Trump, that reads almost like the stereotype story-that-writes-itself after any mass shooting. It MAY be that the rally was a target of opportunity, happening near his home, for some guy who would otherwise have opened fire on other people somewhere else. All motives remain on the table until we know more.

 

[Ann K]

Just early speculation, remember.

Speculation about this particular individual, certainly, but not speculation without precedent.