Switching on and off of trails?

Gary Cook

Active Member
Hi guys,

I am new here.

I have been passed this video footage that seems to show contrails/chemtrails being switched on and off during flight.


How is this possible? If they are etiher just condensation or exhaust fumes?

If they are exhaust fumes then that is as bad as chemtrails, no? Since they are so bad now that clouds of them comepletly blanket the sky on some days.

Thanks in response for any considered replies.

~Gary.
 
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Pete Tar

Senior Member.
It's condensation of water that is already present in the air into ice crystals, initiated by the engines, it's not exhaust fumes from the engines.
The atmosphere rises and falls in layers and bubbles, a straight line through varying layers of condensation/crystallisation potential will produce contrails then not.
 

Jay Reynolds

Senior Member.
Gary,
Now that you have been informed, consider why and how you got the impression that what you observed was unusual. As you should know by now,
having read the references laid out by Mick, there was a simple explanation.

Now consider who may have not told you these simple facts and explanations, who may have either misled you, been misinformed, or who may have hidden the simple reasons why ordinary water ice contrails can start and stop.

Hopefully, by thinking about this, you will understand that some people know, some don't, and remarkably some don't even want you to know.

Lastly, remember who told you what you wanted and needed to know. See you later and good luck.
 

Gary Cook

Active Member
Thanks for your replys and I have taken your opinions on board but I am still 50/50 on this video. For me, unless it is doctored, which it still could be, then that is not explained by flying through different enviromental conditions. They dont change that abruptly, especially with several planes in the sky at the same time like I have seen with my own eyes. I will record that when I have better equipment to be able to make videos like this myself Like you guys have said in posts, it could be exhaust fumes. So it is at best pollution should be considered just a bad a cover up as if it was chemtrails anyway. Who wants to live in a world where the sky is blanketed by exhaust fumes from planes. If that is what it is.
 
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Pete Tar

Senior Member.
They do change abruptly with definite boundaries between patches where there is the condition for a contrail to form and where there isn't.
Why do you think it should be gradual change only, what is that understanding based on?

(And NO, it's not exhaust fumes and if you think anyone has said that you must have misunderstood. The condensation produced from a car's tail-pipe on a cold day is not exhaust fumes or smoke, it's water.{mostly})
ETA, unless you mean fuel dumps or something like that.
 

ki_cz

Member
Gary, you so far are the only person saying that it is exhaust fumes in the thread, it seems you aren't even reading the answers that people are providing before jumping to a new, incorrect assumption.
 

Gary Cook

Active Member
I was basing that on a few comments I have read on this forum and contrialscience.com website. I thought they were connected? Sorry If I am mistaken.

I am not here to prove a point. I saw this vid and decided that it will likely be debunked so i should find a forum where people know about such things.

The only thing is I cant believe in the video that a change in the atomosphere describes what happens in this video.

I would sooner believe that the video MAYBE doctured.

The trails, whatever they are, change almost instantly.

I have asked around and weather speciealists agree that this cant be the atmostphere. It is just too sudden.

Just asking, is it the general consensus on this forum that geoengineering using aerosals is not happening at all? Or just that it is not some kind of global thing used to cloud seed?
 

Gary Cook

Active Member
I have reviewed Micks link: http://contrailscience.com/broken-contrails/

I am conscious of the sheer volume difference in the amout of moisture that such an effect would need to occur. Especially when these trails form clouds that blanket the sky and that this apperant broken contrail phenomen happens multiple time in various places in the sky and another plane can fly through the same patch of sky creating a trail where the other plane didnt.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
I have reviewed Micks link: http://contrailscience.com/broken-contrails/

I am conscious of the sheer volume difference in the amout of moisture that such an effect would need to occur. Especially when these trails form clouds that blanket the sky and that this apperant broken contrail phenomen happens multiple time in various places in the sky and another plane can fly through the same patch of sky creating a trail where the other plane didnt.
Respectfully Gary, you are not conscious of the difference. Because the difference is really very very small.

Given a certain temperature and pressure, theres a specific point in relative humidity at which contrails will form. Say 60%.
So at 59%, contrails will not form, at 60% they will. And clouds will not form at either, as clouds form at 100%.

It's just crossing over a thin line. A line that is as abrupt as the edge of a cloud. A line that varies greatly with altitude.
 

Gary Cook

Active Member
The trails are more prevalent on days when there are no natural clouds it seems. On these days the trails seem to form far more often.

I understand what you are saying but my point is the sheer volume of the trails are not just subtle and then gone they are a huge volume visually and then gone and then back again.

But ike I said what is still making me 50/50 is that the clouds seem to be produced by some planes and not others in the same airspace exactly.

I will do my own recodings or find more footage to demonstrate what I mean.
 

George B

Extinct but not forgotten Staff Member
The trails are more prevalent on days when there are no natural clouds it seems. On these days the trails seem to form far more often.

I understand what you are saying but my point is the sheer volume of the trails are not just subtle and then gone they are a huge volume visually and then gone and then back again.

But ike I said what is still making me 50/50 is that the clouds seem to be produced by some planes and not others in the same airspace exactly.

I will do my own recodings or find more footage to demonstrate what I mean.
Aircraft fly at different altitudes within the same general airspace for safety reasons . . . temperatures vary dramatically every few hundred feet of elevation and differing wind direction and velocities can alter visual characteristics completely from one moment to the next . . . up drafts and down drafts etc. . . .
 

Hama Neggs

Senior Member.
Thanks for your replys and I have taken your opinions on board but I am still 50/50 on this video. For me, unless it is doctored, which it still could be, then that is not explained by flying through different enviromental conditions. They dont change that abruptly, especially with several planes in the sky at the same time like I have seen with my own eyes. I will record that when I have better equipment to be able to make videos like this myself Like you guys have said in posts, it could be exhaust fumes. So it is at best pollution should be considered just a bad a cover up as if it was chemtrails anyway. Who wants to live in a world where the sky is blanketed by exhaust fumes from planes. If that is what it is.
'Exhaust fumes are, for the most part, invisible. Visible contrails are made primarily of ice crystals.

But ike I said what is still making me 50/50 is that the clouds seem to be produced by some planes and not others in the same airspace exactly.
Incorrect assumption. Two aircraft would almost never fly through the same airspace exactly.
 

Jay Reynolds

Senior Member.
I have asked around and weather speciealists agree that this cant be the atmostphere. It is just too sudden.

Just asking, is it the general consensus on this forum that geoengineering using aerosals is not happening at all? Or just that it is not some kind of global thing used to cloud seed?
Which weather specialists? I don't know of qualified meteorologists who would say that.

Cloud seeding is done where there are clouds. Geoengineering isn't cloud seeding as clouds almost never occur where geoengineering would be done. The planes people see making contrails are not making them in the mid-stratosphere where geoengineering would be done, and the planes being identified are incapable of reaching geoengneering altitudes.

Gary, you have obviously been influenced by reading some pro-chemtrails material. Have you found any of it credible, if so, which was the most credible?
 

scombrid

Senior Member.
the clouds seem to be produced by some planes and not others in the same airspace exactly.
How have you gone about verifying that they are in the same airspace?

GeorgeB already said it. Planes are separated vertically for safety reasons. There can be quite a difference in temp and relative humidity with small changes in altitude. If you are looking at two 737s with one at 33k feet and another at 35k feet from the ground it will be pretty much impossible to discern that 2k foot difference in altitude by naked eye.

Plus flights on the same path but in opposite directing may separate even more than that if the winds dictate. If I'm flying from Florida to Rhode Island and back and the jet stream is oriented so that SW winds are at 100kts at 33kt feet then my flight to RI from FL will be at about 33k feet to take advantage of the tail wind. We'd likely leave a big trail too. The return flight will probably climb up to 39-40k feet where the head wind would be lighter. It may or may not be leaving a trail.
 

Pete Tar

Senior Member.
The trails are more prevalent on days when there are no natural clouds it seems. On these days the trails seem to form far more often.
You are more likely to see them lingering and spreading when the other clouds are cirrostratus or high cloud types rather than typical fluffy clouds, or just before a front comes in. Do you notice a change in weather? This is not 'caused' by the contrails but indicates the conditions that precede the change.

I will do my own recodings or find more footage to demonstrate what I mean.
Document your position, time, direction, etc, to help us better answer your questions.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
How have you gone about verifying that they are in the same airspace?

GeorgeB already said it. Planes are separated vertically for safety reasons. There can be quite a difference in temp and relative humidity with small changes in altitude. If you are looking at two 737s with one at 33k feet and another at 35k feet from the ground it will be pretty much impossible to discern that 2k foot difference in altitude by naked eye.
This is covered in more depth here:
http://contrailscience.com/why-do-some-planes-leave-long-trails-but-others-dont/
 

Gary Cook

Active Member
What I mean by same airspace is not that the planes are in the same place at the same time obviously. What I mean is a plane could fly through a so called broken contrail and make a trail where the original plane only produced the break. Of course this could be perpspective but its an almost constant thing in the London skies.

The other thing making me 50/50 right now is the phenomem you call 'exhaust contrails'. I have seen them before over the last few years but within the last few months in London they are pratically constant. I watch them being produced from the planes while I am sitting in my garden and they are litrally more than a couple in the sky almost always.

For me, I am going by what I am seeing with my eyes. I apprciate all your comments and your evidence and I am sincerely learning a lot. The debunking of the alluminaium resisting crops relating to chemtrails for example was very interesting and comepelling. But like I say about this exhaust contrails being proocued as often as they are now to me either means they are intentional or at least something has changed such as atomospheric pressure in general.

Again, for me, a big thing is not whether gvernment is doing things that are wrong, (because it is just human nature to as power corrupts people.) It is that it should not be possible to and it is. Same thing I was saying when people were worried they would be a nuclear false flag during the Olympics. For me it wasnt wether it would happen or not it was that it should not even be possible for government agents to do that.

I do not mean to rant but I was asked here why I was 50/50 and I know I have not produced evidence baking my claims I am simply discribing what I witnissing.

We cant test every plane and the motive for population culling etc is there even if the evidence is sketchy.

I am not sure the chemtrail theory is possible to conclusively debunk or prove.

After all there is even a geoengineering association where they openly discuss they are spraying chemicals.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
What I mean by same airspace is not that the planes are in the same place at the same time obviously. What I mean is a plane could fly through a so called broken contrail and make a trail where the original plane only produced the break. Of course this could be perpspective but its an almost constant thing in the London skies.
This is from planes at different altitudes, say one at 35,000 feet, and one at 37,000 feet. One makes contrails. The other does not.

After all there is even a geoengineering association where they openly discuss they are spraying chemicals.
No, there is not. If you think there is, then link to it, and quote their discussion.

People have only ever discussed doing it in the future (unless you mean weather modification or cloud seeding, which is an entirely different thing).

And nobody has ever said they wanted to do population culling. They want reduced the birth rate, that's it.
 

Mumbles

Active Member
For me, I am going by what I am seeing with my eyes.
Except your eyes aren't necessarily going to give you all the information you need in this context. How many NON-contrailing aircraft can you spot with the naked eye for example?
 

Gary Cook

Active Member
Except your eyes aren't necessarily going to give you all the information you need in this context. How many NON-contrailing aircraft can you spot with the naked eye for example?
Quite a few. Around 50/50. Hence why I am 50/50. It just doesnt look right at all. It just doesnt look right that some have none and some have so much they make big clouds.
 

Gary Cook

Active Member
This is from planes at different altitudes, say one at 35,000 feet, and one at 37,000 feet. One makes contrails. The other does not.



No, there is not. If you think there is, then link to it, and quote their discussion.

People have only ever discussed doing it in the future (unless you mean weather modification or cloud seeding, which is an entirely different thing).

And nobody has ever said they wanted to do population culling. They want reduced the birth rate, that's it.
Ok well yeah its weather modifacation but they describe what is essentially chemtrailing.
http://www.weathermodification.org/

Some of you here are really aburbt and condescending to people who believe 100% in chemtrails.

Are you guys saying it is not happening, never has or is impossible?

The governments ceritanly seem capable.

http://www.weathermodification.org/

The fascist globalists have commited genocide in certian countries. Would it be such a stretch for them to use slow-kill globally?
 

cloudspotter

Senior Member.
Ok well yeah its weather modifacation but they describe what is essentially chemtrailing.
http://www.weathermodification.org/

Some of you here are really aburbt and condescending to people who believe 100% in chemtrails.

Are you guys saying it is not happening, never has or is impossible?

The governments ceritanly seem capable.

http://www.weathermodification.org/

The fascist globalists have commited genocide in certian countries. Would it be such a stretch for them to use slow-kill globally?

Depends what you class as chemtrailing. Yes they release chemicals from a plane but chemtrail believers point to big white lines left across the sky by planes at high altitude. That is not what weather modification is.
 

SR1419

Senior Member.
Ok well yeah its weather modifacation but they describe what is essentially chemtrailing.
http://www.weathermodification.org/

Some of you here are really aburbt and condescending to people who believe 100% in chemtrails.

Are you guys saying it is not happening, never has or is impossible?

The governments ceritanly seem capable.

http://www.weathermodification.org/

The fascist globalists have commited genocide in certian countries. Would it be such a stretch for them to use slow-kill globally?


Hi Gary-

keep in mind "weather modification" and "geo-engineering" are not the same thing. Geo-engineering is about altering the climate on a large scale of both time (years) and geography (globe). Weather Mod is about effecting local weather in the moment ie; cloud seeding (precip enhancement) or hail mitigation. Cloud seeding has been done for decades and is not secret. It involves burning flares of silver iodide into already existing rain clouds. Its typically done from small planes or shot from rockets on the ground. It doesn't involve jets at high altitude, it doesn't involve making clouds, it doesn't involve leaving long persistent trails.... here is an example of cloud seeding (skip to about 1:50 if you want to skip the take off):


Can you explain why clouds have abrupt edges - who turns them on and off?

Why would the globalists want us dead? Who would they take their money from or buy their stuff? Whats the point in being in control if there is nobody to control?
 
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Hama Neggs

Senior Member.
By the way... nobody is claiming that aircraft aren't capable of releasing chemicals in the sky. However, cloud seeding is NOT "chemtrials".
 

scombrid

Senior Member.
What I mean by same airspace is not that the planes are in the same place at the same time obviously. What I mean is a plane could fly through a so called broken contrail and make a trail where the original plane only produced the break. Of course this could be perpspective but its an almost constant thing in the London skies.
The plane that you perceived as flying through the broken trail was likely a couple of thousand feet above or below the broken trail.

I have seen them before over the last few years but within the last few months in London they are pratically constant.
I don't think forecast or research meteorologists have noticed a recent spike in contrail frequency or coverage. If they have they're keeping quiet about it and there are a lot of meteorologists.
 

Pete Tar

Senior Member.
...
The fascist globalists have commited genocide in certian countries. Would it be such a stretch for them to use slow-kill globally?
How slow exactly? So slow one would seem to live the normal span of life? Where's the mass of unprecedented deaths? It's been 15 years since the idea we were being culled from the sky was conceived.
What would the 'fascist globalists' gain from a global slow-kill?
 

Ross Marsden

Senior Member.
Gary Cook, Are you happy now with the explanation of trails stopping and starting, and that the trails are ice clouds, and not something else. If there are still some concerns there, lets get them out of the way.

Then we will see if there is a need to investigate the intentions of the fascist globalists in relation to the presence of the ice clouds.
 

TEEJ

Senior Member.
Quite a few. Around 50/50. Hence why I am 50/50. It just doesnt look right at all. It just doesnt look right that some have none and some have so much they make big clouds.
Gary,
You will be surprised how many non contrailing aircraft that you miss.

Try matching up what you see with Flight Radar 24.

http://www.flightradar24.com/

There is also an app for your phone.

http://www.flightradar24.com/apps

At the moment you are just looking and guessing. The reality is somewhat different in regards to how aircraft are separated and the altitudes you think they are at.

In regard to your video showing start/stop contrails then this is nothing abnormal or unusual. See following from WW2 showing Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_B-17_Flying_Fortress

Watch from 14:44


Watch the contrails of the first B-17 and note at one point the trails fade and break slightly. Now watch the next B-17 and see how the contrails cease completely. Also observe the B-17 to the left and note that the contrails have ceased.

Also note the B-17s in formation at 15:11 and note the variation in contrails with the B-17 nearest the camera producing a less distinct contrail.
 

Mumbles

Active Member
Quite a few. Around 50/50. Hence why I am 50/50. It just doesnt look right at all. It just doesnt look right that some have none and some have so much they make big clouds.
I'll rephrase that. How many non contrailing aircraft at 30,000+ ft agl do you see from the ground with the naked eye?

You say it "doesn't look right". It sounds perfectly normal to me given all the variables that affect contrail formation. As the Memphis Belle documentary linked above shows you can have variations in contrails from two aircraft of the same type that are practically flying next to each other, let alone thousands of feet apart.
 
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TWCobra

Senior Member.
One thing to realise with the Memphis Belle video is the large throttle movements, and hence the large changes in the amount of water being produced by the engines, that is required to fly a heavy aircraft like a B17 in a large formation.

The only pilot in the formation who is not "throttle bashing" is the lead pilot. The rest are constantly moving their throttles back and forth, and the further you are away from the lead the more you are required to fly this way, sometimes with movements of the throttle from full thrust to idle and back for extended periods of time.

I have quite often been following a con-trailing aircraft that stops producing a trail as the thrust is reduced to commence descent.

I have no doubt that this is what is causing the contrails to switch on and off in that video.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
One thing to realise with the Memphis Belle video is the large throttle movements, and hence the large changes in the amount of water being produced by the engines, that is required to fly a heavy aircraft like a B17 in a large formation.

The only pilot in the formation who is not "throttle bashing" is the lead pilot. The rest are constantly moving their throttles back and forth, and the further you are away from the lead the more you are required to fly this way, sometimes with movements of the throttle from full thrust to idle and back for extended periods of time.

I have quite often been following a con-trailing aircraft that stops producing a trail as the thrust is reduced to commence descent.

I have no doubt that this is what is causing the contrails to switch on and off in that video.
This thread has a great example of that:
https://www.metabunk.org/threads/awacs-being-refueled-with-off-on-contrails.816/
 
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Gary Cook

Active Member
Hi Gary-

keep in mind "weather modification" and "geo-engineering" are not the same thing. Geo-engineering is about altering the climate on a large scale of both time (years) and geography (globe). Weather Mod is about effecting local weather in the moment ie; cloud seeding (precip enhancement) or hail mitigation. Cloud seeding has been done for decades and is not secret. It involves burning flares of silver iodide into already existing rain clouds. Its typically done from small planes or shot from rockets on the ground. It doesn't involve jets at high altitude, it doesn't involve making clouds, it doesn't involve leaving long persistent trails.... here is an example of cloud seeding (skip to about 1:50 if you want to skip the take off):


Can you explain why clouds have abrupt edges - who turns them on and off?

Why would the globalists want us dead? Who would they take their money from or buy their stuff? Whats the point in being in control if there is nobody to control?
Like i said I am 50/50 On chemtrails, but from what I know of what is being uncovered in the banking world, I would be scared if I was them. the level of fraud is monumental. But not a story for this thread.
 

Hama Neggs

Senior Member.
Like i said I am 50/50 On chemtrails, but from what I know of what is being uncovered in the banking world, I would be scared if I was them. the level of fraud is monumental. But not a story for this thread.
Please don't conflate banking misdeeds with "chemtrails". No one is saying that there are no nefarious deeds taking place in the world. Banking fraud is not evidence of "chemtrails", but that is indicative of the level of "proof" being offered for their existence.
 

Gary Cook

Active Member
Please don't conflate banking misdeeds with "chemtrails". No one is saying that there are no nefarious deeds taking place in the world. Banking fraud is not evidence of "chemtrails", but that is indicative of the level of "proof" being offered for their existence.
I never said it was evidence. You are putting words in my fingers. I am answering a direct question with my opinion.
 
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