"Pyramid Power Plant" Debunked

[derrick06]

A friend of mine sent me this one from a student in her history class... We've heard Pyramid Power theories before but here's a certain one she heard. The following claim is a quote from her emails...

"
Ok then..

Apparently the Ancient Egyptians used electricty to power their lights and the pyramids acted as giant powerplants generating consistent energy for the lights. Arguments for this theory: 1. the pyramids were coated with limestone (which acted as an insulator to keep energy inside) 2. granite lined the shafts, causing ionization of the air (aka electric charge) 3. Due to aquifers (water... channels underground) below the pyramids, electricty was transmitted by way of additional channels to the pyramids from the moving water AND the last one I will share, 4. the capstone(!) made of Gold, an excellent conductor of electricity (fact!). Still im skeptical..."

She even included a picture her classmate sent to her... (I guess people make diagrams for something they didn't test?)

Here is a debunk from Michael Hiser of the (Interior lighting) aspect...

As for the rest of the theory. Does anyone else have any debunks for the "Power Plant" aspect? Its a fascinating theory, but nothing more it seems... I think its great that people are fascinated by one of the coolest world heritage sites, but of course a lot of misconceptions can be made!

 

[Chew]

Given the height scale on the left of the graphic, this is the Great Pyramid of Giza. It was constructed from 5.5 million tonnes of limestone and 8000 tonnes of granite. To say it was "coated" with limestone is like saying modern bowling balls are coated with polyurethane. The granite was used in the inner chambers and passages. You could have the best electrical conductor in the world but it still isn't going to help conduct electricity through 70 meters of limestone. Limestone is a good insulator so it will "keep energy inside" but it will also keep "energy" out.

Granite will ionize the air due to radioactive decay from elements found in it but how much? This website lists the major radioactive elements in granite: http://www.physics.isu.edu/radinf/natural.htm

8000 tonnes of granite contains:
U-238 504,000,000 Bq
Th-232 64,000,000 Bq
K-40 9,472,000,000 Bq

Total Emitted Energy:
U-238 4.269 MeV
Th-232 4.083 Mev
K-40 0.6785 Mev

Throwing all the math together (and ignoring the fact that alpha particles have a +2 charge and beta particles have a -1 charge) and converting electronvolts to joules/second we get:
U-238 .00034 watts
Th-232 .000042 watts
K-40 .001 watts

For a grand total of .00138 watts.

But that is assuming all the emitted energy ionizes the air. Radiaton emits in all directions so less than half would aim towards the air. Alpha particles only have a range of a few micrometers in rock so only the decays extremely close to the surface would enter the air. Beta particles only have a range of a few millimeters in rock so again only a tiny fraction would enter the air. Gamma rays can ionize atoms via the photoelectric effect but they are quite transparent to air so only a percent or so would interact with air molecules.

It's bunk.

 

[Auldy]

She even included a picture her classmate sent to her... (I guess people make diagrams for something they didn't test?) View attachment 10006

Diagram should be labelled "Pyramid Scheme(atic)"

 

[Trailblazer]

What's with the "ionosphere" label? Just how high is this pyramid??

 

[Efftup]

the y axis is labelled potential magnetic field charge.
I am pretty sure that magnetic fields do not have potential energy from their height above the ground compared to lifting something against gravity.

 

[Bill]

I believe application the theory to the Great Pyramid is the brainchild of a mechanical engineer named Christopher Dunn. He supports his work with statements like this:

Though the power plant theory may explain every characteristic and noted phenomena found within the Great Pyramid, without actually replicating its function (way beyond my own personal resources) it could be ignored or dismissed as being too fantastic by those who feel more secure with conventional views of prehistory.

http://www.gizapower.com/Articles/return.html
He bases a lot of his proof on the idea that the granite in the pyramid could only have been worked with advance machinery.

Not so with the hard evidence of machining!

http://www.gizapower.com/Articles/return.html
Jason Colavito rebuts aspects of it in several places on his website

After this we review Chris Dunn's Giza Power Plant theory, which argues that the Great Pyramid was a machine for generating electrical power. This material has been covered on several episodes, including S05E03, which I reviewed:

In the pyramids there are symbolic passageways, closed to the outside, pointing to the stars. Because they are closed, AATs tell us that the pyramid was really a power plant, on the authority of Chris Dunn, who follows his Victorian predecessors in attributing to the pyramid fabulous precision (to "a fraction of an inch"—which isn't true: Flinders Petrie, for example found a discrepancy in the orientation between core and casing stones amounting to 75 inches) and thus making it a machine capable of generating electricity due to "vibrations" caused by water flooding the subterranean chamber. To make this work, Dunn suggests that hydrogen gas was pumped into the pyramid (from what pumps?) to create a proton energy beam. There is no evidence whatsoever that the Egyptians had any hydrogen gas or could manufacture or store it (no impermeable containers for such gas have ever been found); he deduces the gas based on the suitability of the King's Chamber's dimensions for a laser system to run the gas system! And where were the lasers attached? There aren't any holes to hold them. "We can use our imaginations and come up with all kinds of devices" to run on the imaginary proton beam, Dunn says. No fooling.

I suppose I should have mentioned the hydrated zinc and hydrochloric acid he apparently feels were essential to creating the hydrogen gas, but does it really matter? Dunn's theory depends on the air shafts being open, but they were not. They were sealed behind the walls until they were cut open in modern times.

http://www.jasoncolavito.com/blog/review-of-ancient-aliens-s06e22-mysterious-devices
Rational Wiki takes a less than polite approach to Dunn's work. Here's an excerpt that meets the posting standards:

Central to his argument is the supposition that the ancient Egyptians had a generally ultra-high level of technology, as evidenced by the accuracy and quality of their stonework. In support of this he points to examples of work with hard stone around the Giza pyramids and the Serapeum at Saqqara. He fails, however, to mention several key points:

• The Serapeum was constructed in the 19th Dynasty, and used though much of the Late Period, a time with ample textual and archaeological sources, rather than belonging to "prehistory" as Dunn describes the artifacts.
• There is absolutely no archaeological or textual evidence whatsoever to support the existence of these hypothetical super-technologies.
• That the effects on stone he describes have been accurately reproduced through the use of experimental archaeology, and widely published,[22] including in the mass media.[23]
• That the power station theory he postulates uses the internal layout of Khufu's pyramid, which is significantly different from the others at Giza, let alone elsewhere in Egypt. What the others were for, then, is anyone's guess.

Whilst the achievements in accuracy and quality of engineering and workmanship in both the Pyramids of Giza and elsewhere in Egyptian sculpture and architecture are humbling, it was well within their capabilities as a Bronze Age civilization thanks to an efficient bureaucratic and social organisation that was able to control the quality and speed of work, availability of labour, tools, and supplies, and provide literate expertise to oversee and guide the work being done.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Giza_pyramids

 

[derrick06]

Forgot to reply so let me say thank you for the contributions and replies! =) @Bill @Efftup @Trailblazer @Auldy @Chew Always appreciated!

 

[Laura Wagoner]

What's with the "ionosphere" label? Just how high is this pyramid??

Just watched a documentary on this and it's reported you can stand on top the pyramid and you would have sparks radiate around your body.. I'd bring a light bulb

 

[DasKleineTeilchen]

Just watched a documentary

Link? title of docu?

on this and it's reported you can stand on top the pyramid and you would have sparks radiate around your body

ah, the old story about werner von siemens visit the pyramids in 1859 and stands on top of it, feeling static electricity, generated by flying sand (well, yeah, desert and stuff, sorry my sarcasm). doesnt have anything to do with the ionosphere. its seems btw this is the only description of such an event on top of the great pyramide ever happend, if ever at all and this whole story is made up anyway.

 

[Rory]

This recent paper might be interest to you pyramid fans. Main author is from the University of St Petersburg. Published in the Journal of Applied Physics:

Propagation of electromagnetic waves inside the pyramids of Cheops at different lengths of radio waves (from 200 to 400 meters). The black rectangular position of the so-called King's Chamber. Credit: ITMO University, Laser Zentrum Hannover
An international research group has applied methods of theoretical physics to investigate the electromagnetic response of the Great Pyramid to radio waves. Scientists predicted that under resonance conditions, the pyramid can concentrate electromagnetic energy in its internal chambers and under the base. The research group plans to use these theoretical results to design nanoparticles capable of reproducing similar effects in the optical range. Such nanoparticles may be used, for example, to develop sensors and highly efficient solar cells. The study was published in the Journal of Applied Physics.

While Egyptian pyramids are surrounded by many myths and legends, researchers have little scientifically reliable information about their physical properties. Physicists recently took an interest in how the Great Pyramid would interact with electromagnetic waves of a resonant length. Calculations showed that in the resonant state, the pyramid can concentrate electromagnetic energy in the its internal chambers as well as under its base, where the third unfinished chamber is located.

These conclusions were derived on the basis of numerical modeling and analytical methods of physics. The researchers first estimated that resonances in the pyramid can be induced by radio waves with a length ranging from 200 to 600 meters. Then they made a model of the electromagnetic response of the pyramid and calculated the extinction cross section. This value helps to estimate which part of the incident wave energy can be scattered or absorbed by the pyramid under resonant conditions. Finally, for the same conditions, the scientists obtained the electromagnetic field distribution inside the pyramid.

In order to explain the results, the scientists conducted a multipole analysis. This method is widely used in physics to study the interaction between a complex object and electromagnetic field. The object scattering the field is replaced by a set of simpler sources of radiation: multipoles. The collection of multipole radiation coincides with the field scattering by an entire object. Therefore, knowing the type of each multipole, it is possible to predict and explain the distribution and configuration of the scattered fields in the whole system.

The Great Pyramid attracted the researchers while they were studying the interaction between light and dielectric nanoparticles. The scattering of light by nanoparticles depends on their size, shape and refractive index of the source material. Varying these parameters, it is possible to determine the resonance scattering regimes and use them to develop devices for controlling light at the nanoscale.

"Egyptian pyramids have always attracted great attention. We as scientists were interested in them as well, so we decided to look at the Great Pyramid as a particle dissipating radio waves resonantly. Due to the lack of information about the physical properties of the pyramid, we had to use some assumptions. For example, we assumed that there are no unknown cavities inside, and the building material with the properties of an ordinary limestone is evenly distributed in and out of the pyramid. With these assumptions made, we obtained interesting results that can find important practical applications," says Dr. Sc. Andrey Evlyukhin, scientific supervisor and coordinator of the research.

Now, the scientists plan to use the results to reproduce similar effects at the nanoscale. "Choosing a material with suitable electromagnetic properties, we can obtain pyramidal nanoparticles with a promise for practical application in nanosensors and effective solar cells," says Polina Kapitainova, Ph.D., a member of the Faculty of Physics and Technology of ITMO University.

https://phys.org/news/2018-07-reveals-great-pyramid-giza-focus.html

 

[Nefbauer]

This video makes different claims suporting the pyramid being a power plant:

Source: https://youtu.be/Xk4iLoGpr7A?t=317

Claim about the pyramid interior being linned with dolomite and "being know to multiply electrical conductivity."

Source: https://youtu.be/Xk4iLoGpr7A?t=477

Claims they found cooper wire and also "something resembling instrucctions accompanied of wiring diagrams on the floor." with the intent to produce energy since, and I quote the video once again, "Keeping copper pieces in windowless sealed room could result in a powerful release of electromagnetic energy" inside the hidden chamber (queen's chamber) at the great giza pyramid.

Source: https://youtu.be/Xk4iLoGpr7A?t=543

Another claim, apparently water slid upwards through the limestone and probably even reach the top due "the capillary effect" and that created a vibration strong enough for the quarz inside the pyramid to release piezoelectricity, generating a lot of electromagnetic energy that would move all the way to the top of the pyramid.

Source: https://youtu.be/Xk4iLoGpr7A?t=615

Claims of recent carvings depicting ancient egyptians holding devices akin to lightbulbs and wireless antennas.

Source: https://youtu.be/Xk4iLoGpr7A?t=665

One last claim
"Scientist know for sure is that the electromagnetic measurements around the pyramid are similar to those taked during a lighting storm, if you climb to the top of the mountain holding a bottle covered in cloth you'd see sparks coming from the bottle stay there for too long and you might even see sparks coming from you"

 

[Mick West]

This video makes different claims about the pyramid being a power plant:

Claims are pointless without evidence. Can you show any actual evidence they use in the video. Not them saying something happened or will happen, but actual evidence of that thing happening.

 

[Nefbauer]

About the findings inside the queen's chamber and the depictions of ancient egiptian anachronisms they show photos on the video.

They don't seem to have any evidence suporting any of their other claims beyond the composition of the pyramids composition seemingly matching what it's stated in the video and capilarity and piezoelectricity being actual abilities of fluids and quarzt respectively.

 

[Scaramanga]

Even if all the 'technical' aspects of a pyramid that could hold electric charge were true ( which they are not ), the whole system violates the law of conservation of energy...as the electric charge has to actually come from somewhere in the first place, and I see no valid or viable source. Thus the whole thing is just a giant perpetual energy/motion system and can be consigned to the garbage bin for that reason alone.

 

[dudeman]

Potential Source for Electric Charge:

Millions of pounds of limestone crushing Rose Quartz Granite.

"...if you squeeze a block of granite hard enough, it becomes a battery."

"The idea that squeezing crystals has electrical consequences is not new. A phenomenon called piezoelectricity, which is exploited in pressure sensors and quartz watches, involves creating a voltage between the ends of a piece of crystal by applying pressure. In this case, the voltage arises because the crystal deforms and a symmetry between positively and negatively charged atoms is disturbed.

Piezoelectricity, however, cannot sustain a sizeable current. So Dr Freund is proposing a different mechanism—similar to the one that goes on in the semiconductors from which computer chips are made. This mechanism relies on another phenomenon, called charge separation.

In many kinds of rock, most notably granite, the application of pressure and the resulting deformation of the rock's constituent crystals turn some of the oxygen atoms in those crystals into charge carriers. These atoms are missing an electron and are thus positively charged.

When the rock is further deformed, it becomes possible for these atoms, called "holes", to steal an electron from a neighbouring atom, in effect shifting the hole. In this way, the holes can move through the rock. Indeed, they do this so easily, Dr Freund has calculated, that many of them move out of the section of rock under stress altogether, leaving it with a surplus of electrons. Thus, a granite battery is charged.

The electrons from the stressed rock cannot follow the holes, because granite is not a very good conductor of this more usual form of electricity. But when, if you do this trick in a laboratory, you give the electrons the chance to bypass a section of rock by way of a metal wire, quite large currents will flow. Outside the laboratory, Dr Freund believes, the role of the wire is played by heated rock (at temperatures above 500°C, granite becomes conductive to electrons as well as holes)."


https://www.economist.com/science-and-technology/2005/12/14/granite-batteries