MH17 Hypotheses

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WeedWhacker

Senior Member

Yup....hail. I recognized it as either a B727 or B737....sure enough, a B727:

http://www.mustangevolution.com/forum/f168/t25030/

BAX Global WAS an all-cargo airline. Ceased operations in 2011.

I note with some confusion, pictures of the same airplane as I posted, but a different N-number. Here is a more accurate reference (N708AA, so a former American Airlines jet):
http://jetphotos.net/viewphoto.php?id=6583711

Belonging to Capitol Cargo at the time of the damage:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_Cargo_International_Airlines
 
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Danver

Member
Considering the aluminum alloys used in airliners is of high quality. My guess is this is what "rusty" aluminum airline skin would look like.

The paint is never for the purpose of making a car or a plane beautiful ,but to seal it
 

Soulfly

Banned
Banned
The paint is never for the purpose of making a car or a plane beautiful ,but to seal it
This makes zero sense.

They have clear sealers for metal that could be used for cars and planes. People like their cars painted nice pretty colors. And airline companies want to advertise themselves on their planes by painting their logos and company colors.

You have completely lost me now, since I didn't say anything about paint.
 

WeedWhacker

Senior Member
The paint is never for the purpose of making a car or a plane beautiful ,but to seal it

For many decades American Airlines prided themselves on simply polishing the bare aluminium as part of their livery. This reduced several thousand pounds of weight that a fully-painted airliner must carry. The trade-off was an increase in the man-hours to maintain it.

Recently, so many components of the airframe are made from carbon fiber and other composite materials (black or dark gray naturally) that they needed to be painted, anyway. So, AAL has a new livery scheme now.
 

Danver

Member
@Danver Lets say you're right and it is rust. What does that prove?

It proves what made those holes is shrapnel and not machine gun/cannon ,and the missile they used is more a special edition item than a regular known sa 11 or 17 or sa 6. And they made all this on purpose to make us crazy trying to find out what this is and who made it.
 

Soulfly

Banned
Banned
It proves what made those holes is shrapnel and not machine gun/cannon ,and the missile they used is more a special edition item than a regular known sa 11 or 17 or sa 6. And they made all this on purpose to make us crazy trying to find out what this is and who made it.
But it doesn't prove any of that.
 

MikeC

Closed Account
The paint is never for the purpose of making a car or a plane beautiful ,but to seal it

If by "seal" u mean to protect from erosion and corrosion, then yes, that is often the primary purpose, and why some aircraft are pained even without livery or logo.
 

KAT

Active Member
Or... rust

Give over, Danver. Aluminium and titanium do not rust. It can't be blood on the outside. It could be dirt but unlikely to be just in the holes. Rust is a lot redder than those little heat-discoloured bits.
RUST on iron

Discolouration on an aluminium engine block


Now let it rest, okay?
 

KAT

Active Member
uhmmm antiaircraft exploding shells and ice. I dont think the buk or the manpad can launch either of them..


C'mon!!!! you asked to see pictures of planes with holes in the nose. You got pictures of planes with holes in the nose. From now on go find your own pictures. You might accidentally discover stuff to set you on the right track, instead of imaging stuff that doesn't exist.
 

Jason

Senior Member
It proves what made those holes is shrapnel and not machine gun/cannon ,and the missile they used is more a special edition item than a regular known sa 11 or 17 or sa 6. And they made all this on purpose to make us crazy trying to find out what this is and who made it.
Has it ever occurred to you that the world (western) has all the evidence it needs, and there's a reason why sanctions were brought upon Russia in the US and EU. Whether it was a SA-11 or SA-6 is neither here nor there, the fact that they shot down the plane is relevant. The western world is only trying to establish how involved Russia was with this accident, but the rest is in the past so to speak. They tracked the Buk, the saw it lock onto MH17, they used advanced satellites to detect the heat signature from the missile, and were able to trace it back to it's origin. The western world has no reason to lie, and on top of that when someone gets caught in a lie they usually tend to make more lies. We can see this happening right in front of our eyes with the way Russia and its propaganda machine are operating. The US made its claim, and moved on.
 

David Coulter

Senior Member.
The western world has no reason to lie, and on top of that when someone gets caught in a lie they usually tend to make more lies. We can see this happening right in front of our eyes with the way Russia and its propaganda machine are operating. The US made its claim, and moved on.

Yes. The West operates under international norms for investigations. The US made the claim publicly and likely handed over the evidence to the investigators. For a good investigation you should not hear a lot until a preliminary report is released. Russia is quite different. They quickly trotted out a lot of speculation and theories. Comments like "almost everything on the (non-Russian) Internet is lies" says something about the level of brainwashing the Russian propaganda machine has achieved.
 

KAT

Active Member
The western world has no reason to lie, and on top of that when someone gets caught in a lie they usually tend to make more lies. We can see this happening right in front of our eyes with the way Russia and its propaganda machine are operating.

Every country looks after its own interests, and every country will lie if they feel it's necessary for this purpose. Lie to others and/or lie to their own people. Not only Ukraine and Russia have been spreading propaganda on this issue (and it's not just those two who have a dog in the fight, either).

Tell me again, how this goes -- sanctions were put on Russia because we have all the evidence we need, but we don't know yet how involved they were? sounds a bit like sending ME to jail because SOMEONE in my street stole a car?
 

David Coulter

Senior Member.
Tell me again, how this goes -- sanctions were put on Russia because we have all the evidence we need, but we don't know yet how involved they were? sounds a bit like sending ME to jail because SOMEONE in my street stole a car?

Sanctions were put on the Russians for supplying and assisting the separatists, not shooting down MH17. Evidence of a training camp in Russia, materiel moving across the border, and hyperbole from Russian politicians caused the sanctions. All MH17 did was get the Europeans to recognize the threat Russia's involvement in Ukraine was posing and get them on-board with sanctions.
 

Faithless

Member
Hi, Firstly my belief of what happened to MH-17 is that it was 'hit' by a radar controlled SAM, probably an SA-11, fired in error at what the separatists thought was a military target of some description. I'm no expert but have read an awful lot about the incident and reached my own conclusion.

With that in mind I've been searching for examples of aircraft hit by SAM's just for comparison. The only one I can find that hasn't already been posted here is of a U.S F-16A, Serial No. 79-0391, 138th TFS, 174th TFW, that suffered damage during the first gulf war. I'm posting a photograph of the damage purely for comparison. It is believed that it was damaged by either an SA-8 or SA-6 SAM. Sadly its quite a low res image but the damage to the AIM-9 and gunpod is quite clear and I thought it might be relevant to the conversation, its also a picture that I hadn't seen before.
 

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Danver

Member
Has it ever occurred to you that the world (western) has all the evidence it needs, and there's a reason why sanctions were brought upon Russia in the US and EU. Whether it was a SA-11 or SA-6 is neither here nor there, the fact that they shot down the plane is relevant. The western world is only trying to establish how involved Russia was with this accident, but the rest is in the past so to speak. They tracked the Buk, the saw it lock onto MH17, they used advanced satellites to detect the heat signature from the missile, and were able to trace it back to it's origin. The western world has no reason to lie, and on top of that when someone gets caught in a lie they usually tend to make more lies. We can see this happening right in front of our eyes with the way Russia and its propaganda machine are operating. The US made its claim, and moved on.

I think You are correct. I am only saying that there is more and the cards are not all over the table. I do think the western world is very naive and sometimes its necesary to push harder to defeat the enemy.. today Russia..,tomorrow china.
 

Nehmo

New Member
which "lie" do you think it does not fit with?

AFAIK Kiev has not put any particular reason why they think rebels would have shot down MH17 other than this one.
In one Kiev lie, the rebels are surprised to discover it was a civilian airliner when they though they were targeting a military transport. In another, which is recently fielded, the rebels are attempting to shoot down a Russian civilian airliner but accidentally get a Malaysian one instead. The stories are inconsistent because the rebels wouldn't be _surprised_ it was a civilian airliner if that were their intention.
 

KAT

Active Member
The stories are inconsistent because the rebels wouldn't be _surprised_ it was a civilian airliner if that were their intention.

SPOT ON. And they can't deny the surprise, after all it was Ukrainian "intelligence" recordings of them saying so. They were saying how come it's civilians, not how come it's Dutch and Malaysians.

That said, Nehmo, I did see an analysis of this version, according to which the separatists were told to aim for an Aeroflot plane but being told it is an Antonov. It makes the difference between separatists thinking this will get them more help from Russia, or Russia cynically fooling them into it (killing a planeload of their own people) to have a reason for war. Must depend on which group they want to demonise most at the moment.

On a US site which was so crazy I closed it and will not look for it again, it was a false flag by guess who?? Uncle Sam of course -- to have an excuse for war with Russia. On top of that I personally can think of at least 3 other impossible scenarios but I don't want to give anyone ideas.
 

KAT

Active Member
WOW another theory, this time a false flag fake defector involved.
Kiev guy claims to defect, claims he can steal a truck/BUK (but he's given it,of course). The rebels, happy to have the BUK, let him in with it, and his people do the shooting. The separatists disgusted when they find out, deny any knowledge of bot the BUK and the fake defector. Recordings implicating the separatists are actually this guy making fake (rehearsed) calls.
Keep you updated when I get more of a line on what evidence this is based on.
 

David Coulter

Senior Member.
In one Kiev lie, the rebels are surprised to discover it was a civilian airliner when they though they were targeting a military transport.

What evidence do you have that this is a lie? It is the working hypothesis of all the countries involved except Russia. It is also the hypothesis that requires the fewest contorted explanations of the evidence.

In another, which is recently fielded, the rebels are attempting to shoot down a Russian civilian airliner but accidentally get a Malaysian one instead.

This theory is pretty preposterous and I would like to see if this claim of statements from Ukraine has been verified by any reputable journalists. The source given earlier in the thread is "Global Resources" which, if your read some of their stories, appears to be dedicated to all kinds of conspiracies. I didn't see an Aeroflot airliner anywhere in the radar records shown here or by the Russians.
 

David Coulter

Senior Member.
WOW another theory, this time a false flag fake defector involved.
Kiev guy claims to defect, claims he can steal a truck/BUK (but he's given it,of course). The rebels, happy to have the BUK, let him in with it, and his people do the shooting. The separatists disgusted when they find out, deny any knowledge of bot the BUK and the fake defector. Recordings implicating the separatists are actually this guy making fake (rehearsed) calls.
Keep you updated when I get more of a line on what evidence this is based on.

That is quite a rabbit hole. Perhaps a simpler explanation is that the Russians are floating all kinds of crazy stories to seed doubt in people's minds about what really happened.
 

Jason

Senior Member
SPOT ON. And they can't deny the surprise, after all it was Ukrainian "intelligence" recordings of them saying so. They were saying how come it's civilians, not how come it's Dutch and Malaysians.
How is that Spot On? It's been reported since the day of the accident. If their intentions were to shoot down a military plane, its obvious their response would've been OMG we messed up here, and we shot down a civilian plane by accident. Besides the bodies, there is "0" military hardware or uniforms being worn by the victims. It's sort of difficult to identify a dead person as being anything other than dead (white, black, spanish, or asian). I doubt they knew if the dead were "dutch" or "malaysian" because they weren't in the least concerned about that aspect. They were concerned that it wasn't an Ukranian Cargo plane like they thought it was.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
If people can actually debunking a particular claim, then I encourage them to start a new thread. However if it's just "seems very suspicious to me", then I encourage you to refine your focus.
 

KAT

Active Member
SPOT ON. And they can't deny the surprise, after all it was Ukrainian "intelligence" recordings of them saying so. They were saying how come it's civilians, not how come it's Dutch and Malaysians.
Content from External Source
Nehmo's point was, that they would NOT have been surprised, had they been going for an Aeroflot. But they were surprised, by the fact that it was civilians, not by them being not Russian - the nationality they would expect from an Aeroflot. (which they knew from finding passports, first up, because they WERE concerned, trying to understand what the heck just happened). Who are they? what are they? what the F*** are they doing here, there's a war going on here.

That is quite a rabbit hole.

Not from a Russian source, I'm trying to get more on it. That whole area is one giant rabbit hole anyway, if you think there are fewer than 5 "sides" there you'd be mistaken.
 

Pete Tar

Senior Member.
This theory is pretty preposterous and I would like to see if this claim of statements from Ukraine has been verified by any reputable journalists. The source given earlier in the thread is "Global Resources" which, if your read some of their stories, appears to be dedicated to all kinds of conspiracies. I didn't see an Aeroflot airliner anywhere in the radar records shown here or by the Russians.
Here is the source which says it is the official SSU site.
http://www.sbu.gov.ua/sbu/control/e...0BF852482D3C0.app1?art_id=129860&cat_id=35317

Yes, this story, if official, is a direct contradiction of the supplied taped evidence of responsibility, so would require some explanation. But I suspect they're not that much different to Russia in their unconcern over whether floating contradicting or unproven theories is irresponsible.
 

KAT

Active Member
In our world, if someone tells several versions,we still don't know what the truth is, but at least we know he's LYING.

In their world whatever they are saying NOW is the truth 'cos kinda dictatorship.

But then look at all the weird conspiracies Malaysian government came up with for MH370.
 

MikeC

Closed Account
In one Kiev lie, the rebels are surprised to discover it was a civilian airliner when they though they were targeting a military transport. In another, which is recently fielded, the rebels are attempting to shoot down a Russian civilian airliner but accidentally get a Malaysian one instead. The stories are inconsistent because the rebels wouldn't be _surprised_ it was a civilian airliner if that were their intention.

Gotcha - ok - the stories are inconsistent, but of course there are many POSSIBILITIES - and so what is wrong with making them all available for scrutiny?

And how do you know they are lies?
 

Sgt.Tinfoil

Member
And how do you know they are lies?
You don't. If I would be The Great Dictator of Ukraine I would suggest that they should start investigations about their intelligence service and check where the conflicting information is coming. If the intelligence agencies has been reporting things as best as they can and the source of false information is not there they should check it out what source is playing them 10-0 by injecting false information and what were their motives. You know it is kinda embarracing for the state release false information as an fact. And when there is international communitys intrest on the subject are high that in my books puts this thing as an top lists of priorities what comes to international diplomacy.

One hypothesis which I myself invented for this thing is that Ukrainian secret service has been manifacturing evidence against separatists and they are claiming everyday anything against them and hope that people won't spot the conflicting of theories.

Other hypothesis is that phone call was real and now separatists counter intelligency has "leaked" preposterious false information about "trying to shoot down civilian plane as an excuse for Russian attack" to descredit their real evidence which was the phone call. Or maybe vice-versa the phone call was separatists counter intelligence lightning fast project to dicredit any real facts which can be traced the real reason just in case if something is revealed like ths time the plan to shoot passenger plane down as a pretext for Russian invasion.

Or maybe the false information is coming from CIA sources which act as an separatists who spread it as an part of trade war between BRIC:s countries and EU/USA coalition.

Or maybe the false information is coming from FSB sources which act as an separatists who spread it as an part of trade war between BRIC:s countries and EU/USA coalition.

Or maybe EU/USA and BRIC:s is just an reptilian scheme to enslave human race to obey it lizard masters who needs warmer climate where they can live in huminidy spraying skies with aluminium t̜͎̱̺͕h̪͍̘̩̗͊̎̏r̛̳̖͖̯̞̄̋̍͂̏ō̧̦̪͙͕͒̐̑ͣͫ̍ų̐ͅg̭̰̫̪͔̅͢ḩṭ̯̠͍̰͞ ̵̼̼̹̬̓p̖̜̣̞ͨ͋ͧ́̚͞l͚̹̦͎̞͎͔͗ͭͬ̚a͕͈̻̝͌n̛͍̒ͅe͍̩̫̠̓ͪ͊ͮ̃ͭͤ̀s̛̥̦̜̺͒͊ͥ͂͐ͪ ̭̺̬̺̦͡a̘̹̗̒ͥn̲͉̖̣̐̌̋͘d̝͎̲̟ͤ̔̑͐ ̡̜̖̬ͭͨ͐̿̽t̺͔̭͈ͦ̐h͕̱̊͋̍͆ͨ̒̚ẽ͜r̖̬͎ͦ̃̃ͮe͎ͩ̌ͧ͆ͪͩ͌ ̧̘̬̬͎͙̯ i͍̠̘̜͟s̨̭̳̟͉͕̤ͅ ̈̓̿͏n͐̚͏̪̲͚̣̪ͅo̗̜̭̻͖̺ ̬͇̘ͅn͈̦̬̼̤ͮ́̈́̃́̿ͪe̢͓̼̘̠̩ͥ̊͊e͈̟̰̬̖d̨̜̞̞̻̮̪͒̇ ͖ͭ̓̚͝c̡͕̬̟̪ͦ͊̅̃ͬͨu̯͚̻͙̮̹̗̐̉̂̂͂̌ͨr̻̝͈͖̱͎͓ͩe͚̊̎͝ͅ ̵̙͎̬͔̀ͦ̾͒̐a̡̩͉͉̫̣̹̤ͨ͑̎ͯn̴̦̩͓̮ͣ̚d̥͓͈̭̲̦̘̈́ͪͩ̄̈́̄ ͕̐̇͛O̯̗̭̫̹͓͊ͩͧ̾ͨ̚̚͠H̯͙̥̮̥̦̎ͣ͢ ̀̋MY͉̹͖͎̦̩͒ͦ͊̃ ̬̣̫̣̖̬͓G̭̰Ỏ̵̬͈̐Ḑ̯̥͑̀ͩ ̢̖͕̹̄ͤͯ̚t̨͎̳̯͖̙ͭͩ̑̅h̶͕̥̫̄̒ͭ̎ͩ̍̑ͅe̡͚͖̹̲͎̲͖̓̈́͒͗̚y̺̿ͫͭ ̞̜̹̩͔ͩ͂͛̀̂̂̍͢ą͈̖͈͚̲̼̥̌ͨ̈̏̅ͩṙ̟̋͐̾̍ͬ̀e̼͓̅͆ͭ͛ͣ̍ͥ ͎͎̬͎̟̈́́ͯ̚s̡̱̣̤̣̹͍͛̎̈õ̧̬͎̞͔͚̱ͨ͌ͨo̼͉̦̱ͦ̈́͑̿̀ͅn͉͚͇͓̩̩͊ͥ͟ͅ ̜̰̻̾̅ͯj̩̱̤̰͈̹eͩ͂ͤ̓̂̄ṱ̢̹͙͍̮̽̂̂ŝ͚͍̮̗͓̰͝ ̷̅͐̏̽s̛̥̱̘̻̲̬̝k̝̬̮͕ͯͤͅẏ̶̯̦̗̅̈́̈ͅ ͍̜͉̭̩̳͚́ͧͭ͆͋̓̀w͍̳̿̆ͣͤi̟͓̪̥͓̼͗̆̿̂͌͆̋ḻ̣̗̠̔̿̚l̬͎̯͍̱̞̩̈ͩ̓ ͇̯͔̜͉̪͎t̜͇̤̞̖̞̒ͤ̊́ͤ̈́h̛͇͖̫̫͒e̺̱̟̮̺̦ ̺̈́ͦ͌̿̆ċ̪͓͇̎ḷ̭̖͈͔͚̊i͉̠̯̺̘m̼͙͔ͧͫͬ̄ͦa̢͙̞̍̍t̜̥̯͒ͮ̍͋̂e̴̼͕̎̓͗̿̆͆̐ ̩͎͓̣̞̻͛͐͌̇ͫ̃̚c̥͙͍͍̯̉ͧ̄̇ȟ̩̒̚a̞̻̖̝n̫̤̰͍͑g͉̩͗̂̃̽̍ͭ̿́é̤͎̬͉͇̃̊͋̃̇ͯ́ ͎̠̯̰̞ͨͬͩ͒ i̠ͪͯ͒͂̕s̝̺̠̰̽ͤ̐͠ ̶̳͔̙̱͙͂̈̎ͅh̸̥̰͖ͤ̂ë́̽ͧ̈́͊̂͊r̶̹̤̭̟̓̾̈ͭ͐ͧȩ̝̮̤͔̥̼̀́ͫ̇̔̈́̚ ͇͇͎̦̈́ͬ̿ͅw̐͂̉̎ͨ̚҉̜̦̥̟͙h̪̗͉̬̓̄͛̌ͅoͤ̍ͮ͊̈́͝ ̹̰͇̪͂̎͐̓ͤi̯̜̪̲̤̩͙̽̽
s͎͚͍͔̳ͬ ̓ͧ̉ͩͬ́T̟̬͖̫̺̳ͦͭ̀̒ͯ̚͘o̯͖͔͑́͘ ̡͆̎҉̘̩̝̯͎̤̳ḯ̢̗̙̙̤̻̫͔̻͘n̴̶̫̜͇̋̍̅͒ͦ̃ͨv̵̞͈̱͈ͥͩ͟͞ǫ̣̩̤̤̺̻̤̩͕̑̍̒͑ͤ͞k͈̱̖̏ͫ̃ͬ͌ͤͯ̃e̛̞̮̐̀ ̥̺̙̖̱̌ͭ̑t̰͎̹ͧ͂̋ͭ̆͆͝hͧͭ̏ͦ̇̾́͏̼̱̜͚ȩ̤̦̮̟̟͖̝̼ͤ͊͂̽ͣ̋̕̕ ͎̯̣͋̒ͬͦ͗͌͜ͅh̨̼̮ͫ̌̐̈̍̌̽i͚̻̥͔͖̞̝ͪ̎͘v̤̜̱̗̭̖̝ͫͮͥ̇͟ͅe̝̞͊̆ͪ̐͊̽́-̖̞̼̙̬̐̆̅͛͟m̧̬̭͖̲̣ͪ̾̏͑̋́̃̿̀i̸̷͚̙̗̞̘͚̱̯̫ͧ͊̚͜ń͚̩̄̎ͨ̂͞d͎̻̮͔̼̍̎ͭ́͆́̆͜ ̸̶͙͙̜̪͚̻͎̍ͣr̛̗̞̳̱̰̼̒͑̂́͜ę͍̼̦̖̾͛́p͇͉͍̟̙̝̳͓̋͑̓͑ͬͦͩ͗́͠ͅr̹̞͚̪̠̝̟̬̓̽̄̓̽̇͠ͅe͊̓̇͌͗ͤ͏̵̥̺̣̰͍̫͔̣̱s̙͇̱̞̙̝͍̋͗͂̀ê̵͎̣̬̗ͤͫ͝͞n͊̿ͧ҉̻̗̯̗͚͍t̰͎̟̣̘ͬ̋̾ͥi͈̘̪͌ͬ͒͛̽̈̓̈͠͞ń͏̵̡ͅg̡̪͔̭̰̰͕͔̺ͩͯ̄͞ ̬͓̳̣͇̜̬̩̌ͥ͛̿ͤc̑͌̐͜͏̵̫̱̫̘͎͇ͅȟ͈̳̜̼̠̲͈ͮ͋̃̀̌̿͘ǎ̧͚̥̻̰̖̱́̋̄̊̿ͫ͊͘ö̷͍̮̪̜̪̞̭̝̎ͮ͋̑͆ͬͮs̠̲̱̑̉̾͞.̠̲̠̞͙͉̹ͯ̅ ̡̠͈̟̤̰̭̈ͩ̿́Ï͂͗ͧ͆ͪ̏ͭ͟͝͏̣͎͕͇͉ͅn̛͕̼̳͎̹̋ͣ̽́ͮ̕v̪̳̓̊̈́̀o̶̺̙̗̞ͤ̔̋̒̾ͣ͛͘͞k͖͈͓̟̤̻͇̑͟͝íͥ̓ͤ͌҉͎͍͉̣̥n̷̓̊ͬ͐͠͏̩̳g̙̳̠̞̎̃̿ͬ͞ ̱̥̺̤͎͚̅ͧ͋͋͟ͅͅẗ̫̞̪͈̦̞́͂̄̀̅ͮ̽ͣ͂̕̕h͐͞҉̫̫̞̥̜͉͈̰̲͞e͙̺̤̫̳̒̉͒́͟ ̴̩̗͔͎̤̓̃̑̋͊̿͢f͈̪̦̩̈́́e̹̙̼̬͚̓ͫ͝e̩̗̦͋̐̒̍̉̈̾l̾͌ͪͦ͛̉͋҉̹̪͡ḭ̟͚̥̮̅̒̓͂̈́̋͘͢n̷̴̨͙̙̘̓̄̅gͯͤ҉̣̩͇͖͟ ͖͙̬̣̝͉ͥ͐͘͢ͅơ̡͖̘̖̫̻̼͈̄͗̆ͬͭ̚͞ͅf̰̩̾ͮ͟͠ ̭̯̊̆͐͌ͪͭc͆͂ͭͧ͋̐̔͂̒͏̖̙h̛̲̬͇̺͈̑ͥ́͑ͦ̓͠a̝̳ͮ̂̐̒ͯ͝o̵̱̭͗̓̔ͫ̐̄̂ͅs̸̏̇ͤ̒͑ͩ͘͏͖̭.̸̵̟̼̰̝̗̩̜̗͉ͨ͛ͫ ̂͏̥̞̲ͅͅW̷̨̩͈̺̟̫͕̖̟ͣ̂̊̏̽i̵͚̣͎͉̣̖͇ͧ͌̈́͒̓̅͌͛̑͠ͅt̟̩͔̩̓h̺ͧͤ̈̈́o̜͚͇̣̭͎̰͓̹͐͗̉̍̈́ͣ̓͞͞u͍̙̓̿̿̅̃t̷͔̳̩̓̓̌̆ͮ͛̏̌ ͍̞̫͉̝̏̄̾͢ͅò͚̹͂͗͌̂ͧ͊̒ͅṛ̶͖͙͐̔d͓̫̍̔ͨ͗ͪ̚e̴̼̦̻͓͓̥̎͆͛ͨ͐ͩ͡ŗ̷̴̣̦̏.̛̣̲̓̓͑̏ͅ ͖͐̽͌ͨ̒͊̊͠T̯͍̤ͣͩ̃̎̉̌̑̑ͧh̐̏ͪ̐ͯͣͮ͐҉̖̞̟̩̭͝e͔̥ͮ̃ͫ ̽͆̍ͣͫ͏͢҉̩̭͍̲̣̪N̵̞̭̈ͯ͑̓ͪ͟ĕ̞̝̥̬̍̈́̓͐̉͘͜͠ż̷̭̾̊ͫ̚ͅṗ̥̞̞͈͢͟e̙͙̳̰̖̩ͧ̓̑̾͛̒ͬ͞
I AM PRETTY SURE THEY ARE HERE!!!!!!
r̰͈̘͓̮̟ͤͥͯͫ̏̓͡d̹͎̙͕̜̉̓̒̚̚i͈̓̎́a̰̫͇̫͉͇̗̤͑n̶̡̺̎ͧ̓͐̏̄̂̃͋ ͓͕͕̺̔͆h̖̠̮͍̪̭͕͈̠͒̾ͭͥ̕͞ï̬̘̭̦ͩ͒̇v̛̮͚̗͆̎ͤ̀e̶̖̟ͮ̓͊-̾ͨͭ̽̏̊͏̵̹͖ͅm̭̼̝̻̥̰̱̜ͧ̌ͯ̈́ͦ̔͛̌͘͢i͎͎͍̼͉̯ͪͣ̓̄̓̽͊n̔͂̑҉̺̟͓̤̪͓̤̭d̵͈̲͎͉̮͎̗̝ͥ̏͋̋͜ ̷̫͚̪͓̗̝͙ͦ̍̉̐͝ͅͅǒ͉͈̭͉̺ͨ͜f̢̬̱̄̉̓ͮͭͩ͝ ͇̻͍͇̏ͥ̐͢͟ͅc̽͒̄͒͐́͏̶͙̜̤̜̖̩̥̫͚h̴̭̟͇̹̪̐̃̅̇ͬͩ̓͛a̷̢͍͖͎̜ͥ͋ͧ͢o͙̬̙̣̤̳͎͒ͥ͞s̮̗̪ͣ̒̾ͦ̀ͅ.̌̊̌͛͆͂ͯͮ͏̞̩̠̲̥͚̞͟ ̡͙̬͚͚̯͔͙̬̆̅̓̃ͯ̈̑ͅZ̖͈̘ͯ͋̉́a̢̟ͫ̓͊ḻ̩̜ͧ̍̑̋͢g̞̱̰̻͕̬̫͒̇͘o̪̻̲̞͗͑.̻̇͆̾̃ ͍̙ͦ͐̿́H͉ͧ̎̊̑̋͂ͬͯẹ̡̛̯̱̥̏̄̔ͣ̔̽̌ͥ ̡̱̣͐̍̃̕w̤̖̜̼̰̥̳̭͆͒͒̊ͩ̀͒̈́ḥ̢̟́ͣ͆͌ͅơ̴̖̘͕̲͍ͪ̿̈̀͋ͩ͠ͅ ͍̠͕ͣ̐̉͊̂̿͝W̫̪̲̍̇͐ͥͥͫ͝ͅa̷̼̜̩ͫ͝iͩ̾̂͐̓ͬ̚͜҉̛̫̺̦͕̫͇̯̝̘ẗ̵̹͇̼̥́s̙͇͈̠͗̑̀ͬ̔̈́ ̘͖̖̗͙̫̮̱̖͊͑͆͊͑͐̄͛̓͞B̗̰̗̦̦͙̫̰̄̇̆̌̈̎̑̏́̀̚͝e̹̜͈̹͕̖̯̳̍̊͘ͅh̢̹̰̥̬̭͓͉̀ͤ͘i͙̙̼͛ͤͨ͆̔͂n̜̯̞͈ͩ̾̎ͫ͆͟ͅḏ̵͚̜͙̖̖̩̻͆̅͢ ̱̦̼̜̉̀ͮ̒ͫ̆̉ͣ́Ț̸̹͎̱͚̤ͬ̀h̴̨͈̯̲̥̘̬̭̦͌ͮ̍ͫͯ̔ͅẽ̖̙ ͎̞̌ͧ̅̏ͧ͐͠W̫̰̠̽͂̇ͪͦ̃́ầ̦̤͎̙̇̌̀ͭl̊̿͌ͦ̒͗̾̌̑҉͍̖̰̬̮l̆̈́ͧ̍̅̄̏ͥ҉̳̞̤̭̀͘ͅ.̴̷̪̲͆ͧ͗ͤ͐̿̇͘ ̷̤̬͖͒̌̉͟Z̪͔̦͙ͩ̂́͑̈́̊̅̃́A̶̮͎̖̜̫̖͈͇͒ͨ̆͠͠L̗̟̄̊͑͒͗̇͆ͩ͘G͉̺̱̐̈͟͠O̝̘͙͎͙̙̮͇̓̅͟͠!̗̗͈̩̾͑ͯ̾͒̆͛ͫ͛̕͡
̗̬̹͖̥͗̏ͯ̔͜͢͞
 
Last edited:

KAT

Active Member
And how do you know they are lies?

There is one truth, there are a million lies because there are a million possibilities.

Point is, we don't know which of the many stories is the true one (if at all). But we can know they are liars, because they've told so many versions, all but one of which are untrue by definition.

Occam's Razor would normally choose the simplest explanation. In the atmosphere prevailing over there, this may not apply.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Sorry chaps, but I think this is all getting beyond the concise debunking focus we are trying to go for here at Metabunk. Feel free to start new threads on more focussed MH17 topics.
 
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