Leaked Osama bin Laden Abbottabad Commission report on Al Jazeera - Debunks Conspiracy Theories

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
This leaked report details the Pakistani reaction to the bin Laden killing by US forces. It concludes that bin Laden was killed more or less as described, and not killed many years earlier, as conspiracy theories suggest.





It will be interesting to see how conspiracy culture incorporates this report into the various theories.

http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/spotlight/binladenfiles/
http://webapps.aljazeera.net/aje/custom/binladenfiles/Pakistan-Bin-Laden-Dossier.pdf
In an Al Jazeera exclusive, the results of the Abbottabad Commission are now being made public.

It was charged with establishing whether the failures of the Pakistani government and military were due to incompetence, or complicity. It was given overarching investigative powers, and, in the course of its inquiry, it interviewed more than 201 witnesses - including members of Bin Laden’s own family, the chief of Pakistan’s spy agency, and other senior provincial, federal and military officials.

The Commission’s 336-page report is scathing, holding both politicians and the military responsible for “gross incompetence”, leading to “collective failures” that allowed Bin Laden to escape detection, and the United States to perpetrate “an act of war”.
Content from External Source
 
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Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Page 197 of this report is missing. That would contain paragraphs 463 (partial), 464, and 465 (partial)
 

Soulfly

Banned
Banned
Page 197 of this report is missing. That would contain paragraphs 463 (partial), 464, and 465 (partial)

Is there anyway to tell that the missing page contains important details. Does the page before and after contain important details?

It is a scanned document, the person who scanned it could have just missed a page.
 
J

Joe

Guest
Al Jazeera ? Im not buying it . Burial at sea ? Something about the whole Bin Laden Killing stinks .
 

MikeC

Closed Account
Is there anyway to tell that the missing page contains important details. Does the page before and after contain important details?

the preceding page is talking about the USA making statements about OBL's presence in Pakistan with the knowledge of "elements of the intelligence community", and the ISI asking for more details but getting no answer. It then says the ISI was neither "complicit nor incompetent" in the presence of OBL, stating that heir role was counter-terrorism, it's performance against AQ "spoke for itself", and if it was protecting OBL it wouldn't have provided phone numbers & handed over persons to the US.

The subsequent page talks about Shamsi airbase being developed into a Predator drone base used for lethal strikes and co-operation between the ISI and CIA being undermined by various factors.

So it looks like the missing section probably covers similar aspects or questions regarding information sharing and potential ISI knowledge about OBL's presence.
 
J

Joe

Guest
Any evidence?
No how could I have evidence ? Burial at sea isnt a muslim tradition
CAIRO — Muslim clerics said Monday that Osama bin Laden's burial at sea was a violation of Islamic tradition that may further provoke militant calls for revenge attacks against American targets.
Content from External Source
.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/05/02/osama-bin-laden-sea-burial-muslim-scholars_n_856315.html
Content from External Source
If it were the boston Bomber could have been tossed into the Atlantic . where is the evidence that whats happened ? I havent seen any ? No Body ? With most of the seals killed in a helicopter in Afghanistan Thanks to big mouth Biden .there is no eveidence that naything we were told has happened . Just like Benghazi all lies . Gun running and over 30 armed CIA that were told to stand down as Stevens was murdered . OH thats right another Phony scandal
 

Landru

Moderator
Staff member
No how could I have evidence ? Burial at sea isnt a muslim tradition
CAIRO — Muslim clerics said Monday that Osama bin Laden's burial at sea was a violation of Islamic tradition that may further provoke militant calls for revenge attacks against American targets.
Content from External Source
.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/05/02/osama-bin-laden-sea-burial-muslim-scholars_n_856315.html
Content from External Source
If it were the boston Bomber could have been tossed into the Atlantic . where is the evidence that whats happened ? I havent seen any ? No Body ? With most of the seals killed in a helicopter in Afghanistan Thanks to big mouth Biden .there is no eveidence that naything we were told has happened . Just like Benghazi all lies . Gun running and over 30 armed CIA that were told to stand down as Stevens was murdered . OH thats right another Phony scandal

The Seals killed were not the same ones from the raid. They were from DEVGRU but not the same guys.
 
J

Joe

Guest
The Seals killed were not the same ones from the raid. They were from DEVGRU but not the same guys.
None of them ? It was seal team six that supposedly killed Osama and seal team six Killed in Afghanistan . Im not sure if anyone knows who exactly Who out of seal team six were on the Bin Laden raid .
 

Cairenn

Senior Member.
Where would you have buried bin Laden? His burial site would have become a shrine for some, that is why no Muslim country wanted it.

And Landru is correct, different Seals. Joe it helps one's credibility when they make sure of basic facts.

The Gish Gallop about Bengazi and 'gun running' doesn't help you either.


"We don't believe that any of the special operators who were killed were involved in the bin Laden operation," a senior U.S. military official told Fox News.
Content from External Source
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/world/2011/0...ans-killed-in-helicopter-crash/#ixzz2b9LonUDn

Fifteen members of DEVGRU's Gold Squadron were among the 38 killed on Saturday, 6 August 2011 in Maidan Wardak province, Afghanistan, when a Chinook helicopter flown by B Company, 7th Battalion, 158th Aviation Regiment, was shot down by a Taliban-fired rocket-propelled grenade; the crash wiped out an entire troop. The personnel killed in the helicopter crash are said to have belonged to an "immediate reaction force" that were en route to intercept a group of Taliban who were escaping the area following an operation by United States Army Rangers.[61][62][63] It was the largest single loss of U.S. life since the beginning of the 2001 Afghan War, and is the largest single loss ever suffered by the SEALs.
Content from External Source
 

Landru

Moderator
Staff member
None of them ? It was seal team six that supposedly killed Osama and seal team six Killed in Afghanistan . Im not sure if anyone knows who exactly Who out of seal team six were on the Bin Laden raid .

Any evidence that the guys killed were the same guys? Do you know how big DEVGRU is?
 

xenon

Active Member
Al Jazeera ? Im not buying it . Burial at sea ? Something about the whole Bin Laden Killing stinks .

Here's an interesting theory, put forth by Paul Craig Roberts. (not endorsing, just posting)

Now Paul Craig Roberts will probably be called all manner of things, but one should take just a second to review his background:

Paul Craig Roberts (born April 3, 1939) is an American economist and a columnist for Creators Syndicate. He served as an Assistant Secretary of the Treasury in the Reagan Administration and was noted as a co-founder of Reaganomics.[1] He is a former editor and columnist for the Wall Street Journal, Business Week, and Scripps Howard News Service. He has testified before congressional committees on 30 occasions on issues of economic policy...

Roberts is a graduate of the Georgia Institute of Technology and holds a Ph.D. from the University of Virginia. He was a post-graduate at the University of California, Berkeley and at Merton College, Oxford University.[3] His first scholarly article (Classica et Mediaevalia) was a reformulation of "The Pirenne Thesis."...more http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Craig_Roberts
Not an everyday run of the mill Kook conspiracy theorist, Dr. Roberts...But this is one explosive and controversial interview.


I believe what he says about the Pakistani tv broadcast. That should be a relatively easy thing to confirm. And more evidence hopefully will come out because of the families of those killed on the helicopter.
 
J

Joe

Guest
Where would you have buried bin Laden? His burial site would have become a shrine for some, that is why no Muslim country wanted it.

And Landru is correct, different Seals. Joe it helps one's credibility when they make sure of basic facts.

The Gish Gallop about Bengazi and 'gun running' doesn't help you either.


"We don't believe that any of the special operators who were killed were involved in the bin Laden operation," a senior U.S. military official told Fox News.
Content from External Source
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/world/2011/0...ans-killed-in-helicopter-crash/#ixzz2b9LonUDn

Fifteen members of DEVGRU's Gold Squadron were among the 38 killed on Saturday, 6 August 2011 in Maidan Wardak province, Afghanistan, when a Chinook helicopter flown by B Company, 7th Battalion, 158th Aviation Regiment, was shot down by a Taliban-fired rocket-propelled grenade; the crash wiped out an entire troop. The personnel killed in the helicopter crash are said to have belonged to an "immediate reaction force" that were en route to intercept a group of Taliban who were escaping the area following an operation by United States Army Rangers.[61][62][63] It was the largest single loss of U.S. life since the beginning of the 2001 Afghan War, and is the largest single loss ever suffered by the SEALs.
Content from External Source
where is the proof of who was on the Bin Laden Raid ? Names ? Gish Gallop ? It was quite Obvious from the beginning and the truth is coming out after a year . Thats why the fake terror alert . http://thelead.blogs.cnn.com/2013/0...ratives-on-the-ground-during-benghazi-attack/ Im going to laugh when the truth comes out and rub it in .
 
J

Joe

Guest
Any evidence that the guys killed were the same guys? Do you know how big DEVGRU is?
No None at all . Cant prove either way . Cant debunk what we will never know and Im speculating thats why they were targeted in the first place . Eye for a eye works in the Muslim world .The whole Bin laden thing stinks .
 

MikeC

Closed Account
where is the proof of who was on the Bin Laden Raid ?

You are the one who said they were the same:

With most of the seals killed in a helicopter in Afghanistan Thanks to big mouth Biden .there is no eveidence that naything we were told has happened
Content from External Source
how about you back up your own claim before accusing everyone else of a gish gallop??

I note that not a single member of any family of the known casualties from the Chinook crash has suggested that their loved ones were involved in the OBL raid.
 
J

Joe

Guest
You are the one who said they were the same:

With most of the seals killed in a helicopter in Afghanistan Thanks to big mouth Biden .there is no eveidence that naything we were told has happened
Content from External Source
how about you back up your own claim before accusing everyone else of a gish gallop??

I note that not a single member of any family of the known casualties from the Chinook crash has suggested that their loved ones were involved in the OBL raid.
I didn't accuse any one of gish gallop ? I was responding to Caireen about accusing me of Gish gallop . The families wouldn't even know at all who was on the Bin laden raid . There is know way of knowing who was on the raid . So no proof they werent on the Chinook . Ill ask next time Im at the Navy Seal Museum http://navysealmuseum.com/
 

Pete Tar

Senior Member.
That doesnt mean they would say who is who . Youll never know who was on the raid and there is no way of knowing at all .


Then how can you justify making a statement like "With most of the seals killed in a helicopter in Afghanistan"?
 

MikeC

Closed Account
I didn't accuse any one of gish gallop ? I was responding to Caireen about accusing me of Gish gallop .

Fair enough - my mistake and I apologise.

The families wouldn't even know at all who was on the Bin laden raid . There is know way of knowing who was on the raid . So no proof they werent on the Chinook .

But you said they DEFINITELY WERE on the Chinook - despite it being a completely different squadron from ST 6. It was part of the evidence that you used to support the idea that the story about OBL being dead and buried at sea is a lie.

Are you withdrawing that claim??
 
J

Joe

Guest
Fair enough - my mistake and I apologise.



But you said they DEFINITELY WERE on the Chinook - despite it being a completely different squadron from ST 6. It was part of the evidence that you used to support the idea that the story about OBL being dead and buried at sea is a lie.

Are you withdrawing that claim??
Ill take back the claim about them definitely being on the chinook although its possible some were . I still think the whole story about Bin laden stinks .
 
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J

Joe

Guest
We are not discussing Benghazi in this thread. Start one for it, I will ignore it.
Your right it was off topic and Im sure you wouldnt want to know the truth anyhow . When the whole truth comes out Ill post it and you can Ignore it all you want. :)
 

Cairenn

Senior Member.
The truth is is out, I know you won't believe it. that is your problem, not other's problem.
 

SR1419

Senior Member.
Youll never know who was on the raid and there is no way of knowing at all .

Of course, there is always this....


No Easy Day: The Firsthand Account of the Mission that Killed Osama bin Laden (2012) is a military memoir by "Mark Owen", the pseudonym of a former member of the United States Naval Special Warfare Development Group (DEVGRU)[1][2] who participated in the mission that resulted in the death of Osama bin Laden. The book details Owen's career with DEVGRU, including several combat missions with which he participated with the unit. At least half of the book focuses on Owen's participation in the mission that killed bin Laden.

Owen and his publisher's decision to release the book without first submitting it for United States Department of Defense (DoD) review generated controversy. The DoD claims that the book contains classified information, which the book's publisher denies. In late August 2012, advance publicity drove the book to the top of the Amazon.com and Barnes & Noble.com best-seller lists,[3] bumped up the initial print run from 300,000 copies to 575,000,[4] and led the publisher to release the book on September 4, a week earlier than the originally planned September 11 release date.[5] It also made the New York Times best seller list.[6]

Shortly after the book's announcement, Owen's identity was revealed as Matt Bissonnette; the Department of Defense confirmed that he was the author.[1] For media appearances, including an interview on 60 Minutes, Owen appeared incognito.
Content from External Source

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Easy_Day
 

Oxymoron

Banned
Banned
The simple fact is, it was foretold that OBL would be a scapegoat for a 9/11 type attack, before 9/11. About 15 of the terrorists were Saudis and the Bush attacked Afghanistan. They holed up OBL and then let him go. There have been so many lies told about him and AQ and so much obfuscation and secrecy that I wouldn't believe anything the US government says.

Not to gish gallop, I'll limit to that and also the wildly different accounts of what happened such as the fact that different seals have claimed to have killed him and under different circumstances:

http://www.enstarz.com/articles/593...nd-unarmed-and-maybe-already-dead-details.htm

Matt Bissonnette Navy SEAL Memoir Tells Different Story of Bin Laden Death; Terrorist Found Unarmed, Maybe Already Dead [DETAILS]
By Shiryn Ghermezian, EnStarz | Aug 29, 2012 10:41 AM EDT


Former Navy SEAL Matt Bissonnette details in his new book, "No Easy Day," about the raid that killed international terrorist Osama bin Laden, however, his story may be contradicting official statements of whether or not the terrorist was armed and a threat when he was gunned down, or if he was even alive anymore.

The Associated Press reported the following, including excerpts from Bissonnette's book:

"He heard gunfire: 'BOP. BOP.' The [SEAL] point man had seen a 'man peeking out of the door' on the right side of the hallway. The author writes that bin Laden ducked back into his bedroom and the SEALs followed, only to find the terrorist crumpled on the floor in a pool of blood with a hole visible on the right side of his head...The SEALs later found two weapons stored by the doorway, untouched, the author said."

The untouched weapons also had their chambers empty of bullets, according to Forbes. The distinction hinted to through the excerpt, when comparing Bissonnette's details to those stated by the White House after the raid, is that, according to the author, bin Laden was already dead, or dying, when SEALs entered his room and opened fire on him.

In a different telling of the event, U.S. administration officials announced after the raid that bin Laden was shot only after he ducked back into his room because the SEALs assumed "he might be reaching for a weapon." Bissonnette's memoir claimed bin Laden did not reach for the gun nor make any efforts to defend himself.

Forbes noted that on the other hand, U.S. administrators described in their narrative "of a prolonged gunfight between the SEALs and bin Laden's operatives outside the compound" during the raid. The memoir makes no mention of this.

The two versions of what happened raise suspicions that bin Laden was killed, and afterwards shot several more times, though he was unarmed and showed no immediate danger the day of the raid.

"No Easy Day" was written by Bissonnette under the pseudo Mark Owen. It is scheduled for public release on Sept. 4.
Content from External Source
http://whitehouse.blogs.cnn.com/2011/05/03/even-more-on-the-photos/
3. There are photos of the raid itself that include photos of the two dead brothers, one of OBLs dead son (adult adolescent, maybe approx 18 yrs old) and some of the inside scene of the compound.

The official says the challenge is that the picture that includes the most recognizable image of OBLs face – from the hangar in Afghanistan – is so gruesome and mangled its not appropriate for say the front page of the newspaper. On the other hand, this is the one that is most identifiable as him.
Content from External Source
Doesn't sound too convincing. Either they are gruesome and mangled or they are identifiable, can't see both as applicable.


Personally, I believe he died in Dec 2001, as do many others.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/23674587/The-Last-Days-of-Bin-Laden-by-Nick-Kollerstrom-PhD

The Last Days of Bin Laden
by Nick Kollerstrom, PhDIn Orwell’s novel 1984, there is a figure called Emmanuel Goldstein who functions as an all-purposeenemy - even though we gather, in the story, that he may have died some time ago. Osama BinLaden (1947 – 2001) has been used in a similar manner by the Powers that Be, through a processof identity theft during the last days of his life. In reality there have been no sightings or reports of him since 2001. I here argue that he died on or around December 16th, 2001, in consequence of theintensive bombing of his then-residence the Tora Bora caves of eastern Afghanistan; and that hehad no involvement in the events of 9/11
Content from External Source
 

Josh Heuer

Active Member
What's interesting was that it was reported initially that bin Laden was ill and was on dialysis in 2001, but most reports were retracted or new reports came out stating he only was treated for kidney stones.
http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/RIC111B.html
Explains how a CIA agent payed a visit to bin Laden while he was in a hospital in Dubai in 2001. Even though he was public enemy #1 at the time, no arrest or attempted arrest appears to have been made.
 

mynym

Banned
Banned
Here is a link to the Seal Team Six families:
If you watch it all, sounds like some of them might pursue it. Although if some of their sons were the same people on the "Osama raid" then they'll probably run across the same thing that Sibel Edmonds did. I.e. normal bureaucratic inertia and so forth might begin to look like something else if they follow the trail far enough.

From my perspective as a conspiracy theorist, the fact that people closer to the top apparently "made it happen on purpose" or "let it happen on purpose" as far as an agent provocateur officiating at the funeral is an interesting element. That seems similar to provoking the fire fighters on 911, given that they were the people most likely to question and investigate the events of the day if they weren't distracted by a moral degenerate like Giuliani.

If you read Sibel Edmond's book you'll find why few people get very far against the usual bureaucratic inertia and corruption within the establishment that's usually mixed in with any conspiracies within it. It takes a special type of person to even begin to get through it. And a notepad to record everything, etc... not to mention that fact that people are risking their careers and so forth.
 

SR1419

Senior Member.
Personally, I believe he died in Dec 2001, as do many others.


Perhaps....but none of his colleagues seem to hold the same belief:

On May 6, Al Qaeda confirmed the death of Osama bin Laden in a statement posted on jihadist internet forums. It said, "We also stress that the blood of the mujahid Sheikh Osama bin Laden, may Allah have mercy upon him, weighs more to us and is more precious to us and to every Muslim than to be wasted in vain." The message called upon Pakistan, where bin Laden was discovered, "We call upon our Muslim people in Pakistan, on whose land Sheikh Osama was killed, to rise up and revolt to cleanse this shame that has been attached to them by a clique of traitors and thieves who sold everything to the enemies."
Content from External Source
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reactions_to_the_death_of_Osama_bin_Laden#Islamic_organizations

This site has a lot of reactions from other Jihadists...

http://jihadology.net/?s=Death+of+Osama+Bin+Laden&submit=


http://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/may/02/taliban-avenge-bin-laden-death

http://www.longwarjournal.org/archives/2013/05/pakistani_taliban_pr_1.php

http://www.theatlanticwire.com/national/2012/08/jihadists-websites-target-navy-seal-author/56185/
 

Oxymoron

Banned
Banned
Perhaps....but none of his colleagues seem to hold the same belief:

On May 6, Al Qaeda confirmed the death of Osama bin Laden in a statement posted on jihadist internet forums. It said, "We also stress that the blood of the mujahid Sheikh Osama bin Laden, may Allah have mercy upon him, weighs more to us and is more precious to us and to every Muslim than to be wasted in vain." The message called upon Pakistan, where bin Laden was discovered, "We call upon our Muslim people in Pakistan, on whose land Sheikh Osama was killed, to rise up and revolt to cleanse this shame that has been attached to them by a clique of traitors and thieves who sold everything to the enemies."
Content from External Source
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reactions_to_the_death_of_Osama_bin_Laden#Islamic_organizations

This site has a lot of reactions from other Jihadists...

http://jihadology.net/?s=Death of Osama Bin Laden&submit=


http://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/may/02/taliban-avenge-bin-laden-death

http://www.longwarjournal.org/archives/2013/05/pakistani_taliban_pr_1.php

http://www.theatlanticwire.com/national/2012/08/jihadists-websites-target-navy-seal-author/56185/
Yes, I have wondered about that myself but is it politics? By hiding his death in the first place, he became the 'catch me if you can' icon and rallying call but he couldn't go on forever in that role so is it good politic to capitalise on 'the death' to raise him to martyr status?

I don't know but it is my strong feeling he died in 2001... there were reports of it which I will root out later and it makes sense of why they held off on Tora Bora... I mean if the had kiled him there what justification could they have for being in Afghanistan, (which was weak anyway)?

I think of things like El Cid and Scientology guy Hubbard, etc... it is a well known ploy after all.
 

MikeC

Closed Account
Yes it is a well known ploy - but is there any actual evidence, beyond wishful thinking, that it is being employed in this case??
 
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SR1419

Senior Member.
Yes, I have wondered about that myself but is it politics? By hiding his death in the first place, he became the 'catch me if you can' icon and rallying call but he couldn't go on forever in that role so is it good politic to capitalise on 'the death' to raise him to martyr status?

I just do not see the inner circle of AQ going along with any charade or conspiracy put forth by the US for whatever reason.
 
J

Joe

Guest
Yes it is a well known ply - but is there any actual evidence, beyond wishful thinking, that it is being employed in this case??
So because there is no evidence we should expect our government is telling the truth and there is no cover up ? We shouldn't question just go along like shepple ? Because governments are always open and honest with their citizens ????????
 

MikeC

Closed Account
So because there is no evidence we should expect our government is telling the truth and there is no cover up ? We shouldn't question just go along like shepple ? Because governments are always open and honest with their citizens ????????

If you believed everything there is no evidence for you'd be a pretty sad case.:D:rolleyes::eek:

I am saying that suspicion should not be allowed to become belief without evidence.
 
J

Joe

Guest
If you believed everything there is no evidence for you'd be a pretty sad case.:D:rolleyes::eek:

I am saying that suspicion should not be allowed to become belief without evidence.
But many things are impossible for the average joe to prove and when you have a corrupt media that doesn't do its job . So we should take them at their word because they are so honest and truthful ? Its not that I believe as much as I question weather or not what they say is the truth . They are all liars or lawyers so why should we trust them at all ?
 
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