Ice experiments: Orgonite vs. No orgonite

deirdre

Senior Member.
You probably confused it with a static sound, but its there
i know what a bubble sounds like when its popping through ice, so i believe you are hearing it.

i'd also like to remind you, that just because this thread is showing that ice doesnt prove orgone (in any orgone or cemenite pics i could find) doesnt mean 'orgone' is debunked. We are only discussing if ice is a good test method.

here i hammered a nail through my ice. now the nail is alot bigger than your ice holes but hopefully you can see the effect. in the beginning i hold my finger over the hole for about 15 seconds to let the bubbles accumulate (my ice is mostly frozen through so my bubbles arent as rapid as half frozen ice)... hopefully you could seee if i had more bubbles, less frozen ice container and a smaller hole, how your effect could happen.

you are also using a much larger container...mine is a spice jar only ie. less water, less bubbles, much much bigger hole in ratio.
 

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  • P1020194.MOV
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thankyou for the link. timestamps are also appreciated :)

at :35 -1:17 or so, secs he starts wiping then declares "this thing is MELTIN" because "i just took it out of the freezer"...that's not melting, thats condensation. probably with your first experiments the humidity was lower so you didn't get as much condensation happening. If you have more questions about condensation you can ask @Mick West or any of the "contrail" guys, they can explain it better to you or direct you to threads that explain condensation.

note :contrail really means "condensation trail" so they know ALL about condensation :)

Well, if my pyramid still has power, then i could give it a try again in a few days. Then we'll see. I also didn't have to put a nail through my ice. Just take the ice out and let it happen.
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
Well, if my pyramid still has power, then i could give it a try again in a few days. Then we'll see.
another way to look at it is that plastic containers HOLD water. so even if the ice was melting fast, it wouldnt be on the outside of the plastic container.
 
An
another way to look at it is that plastic containers HOLD water. so even if the ice was melting fast, it wouldnt be on the outside of the plastic container.

And that makes it different how? And if you were to look at the original video on youtube, some of the commenters do acknowledge that it was melting fast.
 
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deirdre

Senior Member.
And that makes it different how?
i dont understand the question.

testing "melt speeds" would be easy.

Take two of the exact same containers. Put your orgonite or cemenite in one. Fill with water 3/4 ths to the same level. Put in freezer. wait 24 hours.

take both containers out of the freezer. Do NOT run hot water over them. Flip them both upside down in the sink.

If the "orgonite" one melts and slides out of the container first, then it is melting faster.
 
i dont understand the question.

testing "melt speeds" would be easy.

Take two of the exact same containers. Put your orgonite or cemenite in one. Fill with water 3/4 ths to the same level. Put in freezer. wait 24 hours.

take both containers out of the freezer. Do NOT run hot water over them. Flip them both upside down in the sink.

If the "orgonite" one melts and slides out of the container first, then it is melting faster.

Well, there was some issue about a plastic container. Anyway, i still have that other one from the last photo frozen. I could put the pyramid on that one and watch it melt. The other way would take a couple of days. I can even put pyramid in freezer for a few hours. I might get a couple of thermometers. It's not that the pyramid is hot, it just somehow has an effect of melting ice (in my past experience). The room temperature of my apartment may be around 65 ○F right now.
 
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deirdre

Senior Member.
Well, there was some issue about a plastic container. Anyway, i still have that other one from the last photo frozen. I could put the pyramid on that one and watch it melt. The other way would take a couple of days. I can even put pyramid in freezer for a few hours. I might get a couple of thermometers. It's not that the pyramid is hot, it just somehow has an effect of melting ice (in my past experience). The room temperature of my apartment may be around 65 ○F right now.
you cant show anything without a control. ie doing the EXACT same thing, in the EXACT same size containers- one with orgone and one without orgone.

it would take 24 hours. up to you.

The issue with the plastic container is that even IF the ice with orgone in it is melting faster, you wouldnt know that from the condensation on the OUTSIDE of the container. Any melted ice would still be INSIDE the container.

Now if you want to say "orgonite" attracts humidity to it, that's fine. Would be good for the skin if it's true. But a singel wet container with orgone in it doesnt prove that unless you have a control (ie one without orgone) sitting right next to it, taken from the freezer at the same time.
 
you cant show anything without a control. ie doing the EXACT same thing, in the EXACT same size containers- one with orgone and one without orgone.

it would take 24 hours. up to you.

The issue with the plastic container is that even IF the ice with orgone in it is melting faster, you wouldnt know that from the condensation on the OUTSIDE of the container. Any melted ice would still be INSIDE the container.

Now if you want to say "orgonite" attracts humidity to it, that's fine. Would be good for the skin if it's true. But a singel wet container with orgone in it doesnt prove that unless you have a control (ie one without orgone) sitting right next to it, taken from the freezer at the same time.

Well, i can put it on there tonight just to reassure myself it will work. Then fill up two containers for test later.
 

Gridlock

Senior Member.
Sorry if I missed it, but how do you make your orgonite? It seems to me there's no one recipe, so I'm curious as to what precisely you are freezing?

http://www.orgonite.info/how-to-make-orgonite.html

 
Sorry if I missed it, but how do you make your orgonite? It seems to me there's no one recipe, so I'm curious as to what precisely you are freezing?

http://www.orgonite.info/how-to-make-orgonite.html

Well, i just order from someone. Kossgr41 or sucahyo. There's another name alba - something or other. Still waiting on sucahyo. Yes, i acknowledge that everyone makes theirs differently (although cemenite makers aren't supposed to have any variations), but that doesn't necessarily have to mean anything.
 
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Spectrar Ghost

Senior Member.
Well, i just order from someone. Kossgr41 or sucahyo. There's another name alba - something or other. Still waiting on sucahyo. Yes, i acknowledge that everyone makes theirs differently (although cemenite makers aren't supposed to have any variations), but that doesn't necessarily have to mean anything.

Doesn't it? Differing proportions of ingredients significantly alter the properties of such substances as steel and doped nanomaterials. Why is orgonite different in this respect?

Differing orgonite compositions affect the 'field' or whatever could make a difference in effects? (I still haven't heard a coherent explanation of how the field works, but that's another thread.)
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
Doesn't it? Differing proportions of ingredients significantly alter the properties of such substances as steel and doped nanomaterials. Why is orgonite different in this respect?

Differing orgonite compositions affect the 'field' or whatever could make a difference in effects? (I still haven't heard a coherent explanation of how the field works, but that's another thread.)
my only question with ice formations... i did notice that it seemed i got more of the 'bulbed' end bubble trails (flowers)when i added a rock to the container. so im wondering if the surface of the rock..being not smooth like the containers affects the bubbles a bit.


The orgonite i've seen (youtube vids ive seen of people making the things, they are just throwing random amounts of materials in ie. no measuring or anything) is smooth on the surface. Where as this "cemenite", that nathan says has the 'bulbed end trails' (look like flowers or sperms) is a slab of cement basically...so a rougher surface than orgonite. ?

as far as if cement interacts with water differently than resin (orgonite's main base) vs just plain water, i dont know anything about chemistry. But im wondering, yes, if the materials react differently a bit in water.

i read if you throw salt in the water the freeze is different, although i forget now how..i think it was about getting 'clearer ice'.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
When water freezes it has to freeze "on" something. This is known as a "nucleation" site.

The best nucleation sites are just ice, so ice "grows" on ice, and hence it grows from the nucleation site. This might be the sides of a container, or it might be the surface of the water, or the meniscus, or something in the water, an object or impurities.

This all depends on how warm things are. If the container is well insulated, or poorly insulated, but sat on something thats above freezing, then freezing might start from the top.

Adding salt to water lowers the freezing point.

Water that does not have any good nucleation sites can become supercooled, where all the water is well below freezing, and then nucleation and freezing can happen very suddenly and in odd ways when nucleation is initiated by adding something or shaking the water.
 
Doesn't it? Differing proportions of ingredients significantly alter the properties of such substances as steel and doped nanomaterials. Why is orgonite different in this respect?

Differing orgonite compositions affect the 'field' or whatever could make a difference in effects? (I still haven't heard a coherent explanation of how the field works, but that's another thread.)
As long as it works, how it is made doesn't matter. Everyone has different opinions of how orgonite should be made. Cemenite is different in that variations could produce an opposite effect. For more info on that, just look up "suchanyovideo". It's not on topic, so i won't discuss it here, except to say that cemenite is just a tad more than cement.
 
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deirdre

Senior Member.
When water freezes it has to freeze "on" something. This is known as a "nucleation" site.

The best nucleation sites are just ice, so ice "grows" on ice, and hence it grows from the nucleation site. This might be the sides of a container, or it might be the surface of the water, or the meniscus, or something in the water, an object or impurities.

This all depends on how warm things are. If the container is well insulated, or poorly insulated, but sat on something thats above freezing, then freezing might start from the top.

Adding salt to water lowers the freezing point.

Water that does not have any good nucleation sites can become supercooled, where all the water is well below freezing, and then nucleation and freezing can happen very suddenly and in odd ways when nucleation is initiated by adding something or shaking the water.
i'm sure you're thrilled, but how cool is this? its a small roundish rock in one of those small styrofoam gravy containers from KFC. thin plastic lid and a bag of frozen spinach on top. (ran it through my 'dynamic monochrome' filter)

P1020257.JPG



and from the side it looks like a bundt cake on a glass platter :)

P1020251.JPG
 
i'm sure you're thrilled, but how cool is this? its a small roundish rock in one of those small styrofoam gravy containers from KFC. thin plastic lid and a bag of frozen spinach on top. (ran it through my 'dynamic monochrome' filter)

P1020257.JPG



and from the side it looks like a bundt cake on a glass platter :)

P1020251.JPG
Yeah, it looks cool. On my ice melting, not working, but since i know it did happen before, it may just need to be charged properly.
 

Galan

New Member
This also works with containers. It doesn't have to be ice cubes, and people have done tests with or without, try "ang el" s page on youtube, it goes by the title of "proof orgone charges water-cool ice experiment". Many other ice tests out there. Also, not the only way to verify orgone has power. Reason why nobody has gotten a nobel prize yet is because the government is against it. If you haven't tried it, then you can't say it doesn't work. It just makes you someone who refuses to look at the evidence.

So far all I have seen are pictures of frozen ice. It not clear to me what is being debunked.
The reason that no one has gotten a Nobel prize is that there is no science to back any claim.
As to the government stopping research on this subject, why? If it has any of these interesting properties scientists would leap at the chance to do some research.

Am I missing something? New to this whole process. :)
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
Due to restriction of free speech, it cannot be discussed here.
You can discuss it in PM. or if you think what i wrote is bunk you can write a proper thread following posting guidelines, showing how orgonite is different from the "crystal healing etc" of the past. You can even use my quote as your bunk claim.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
So far all I have seen are pictures of frozen ice. It not clear to me what is being debunked.
The reason that no one has gotten a Nobel prize is that there is no science to back any claim.
As to the government stopping research on this subject, why? If it has any of these interesting properties scientists would leap at the chance to do some research.

Am I missing something? New to this whole process. :)

There's a specific claim of evidence, that "orgonite" affects the formation of ice in some way. The majority of the thread is attempting to nail down what the claim actually is. Basically discussing the need for proper controls in any such experiment, and noting that there aren't any in the example discussed.
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
So far all I have seen are pictures of frozen ice. It not clear to me what is being debunked.
The reason that no one has gotten a Nobel prize is that there is no science to back any claim.
As to the government stopping research on this subject, why? If it has any of these interesting properties scientists would leap at the chance to do some research.

Am I missing something? New to this whole process. :)
i also split this thread from the thread the OP [Opening thread Post] was originally posted in: https://www.metabunk.org/debunked-orgone-ice-stalagmites-and-spikes.t520/ , as the topic and OP was off topic in that particular thread. But this thread continues the premise. I updated the OP to reflect this, sorry i forgot to do that earlier.
 

mm1145

Member
I may be a bit behind the curve here but here is the result of my ice experiment
2016-01-31 13.33.14.jpg

2016-01-31 13.32.56.jpg

to me it looks like that is the standard pattern you see when you freeze water that freezes for all sides at once what was interesting was I took it out halfway through and the half-formed ice round the edge was perfectly clear as you can see the bubble effect is only in the centre.

just as interestingly you can see the same bubbly effect is some wax I had left over form candles I was doing

2016-01-31 18.10.42.jpg

if anybody actuality knows how to get rid of it I would be interested as I want to create a clearer candle
 

cloudspotter

Senior Member.
if anybody actuality knows how to get rid of it I would be interested as I want to create a clearer candle

That video I posted in the other thread might give you some pointers

[mod strike out due to thread move]
 
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txt29

Senior Member.
if anybody actuality knows how to get rid of it I would be interested as I want to create a clearer candle
Not sure whether the same method as at the blocks of ice (keeping water in motion) would work with wax, but perhaps the technique used for removing bubbles from hardening epoxy resin might be suitable here too - simply use a vacuum pump. In emergency even a vacuum cleaner may help.

EDIT: you can find plenty of videos for epoxy degassing on YouTube. For example this one:


You will probably have to make your set up so that you can degas it while heating, and then let it cool in the vacuum container. I think that an old pressure cooker might be quite suitable for that purpose.
 
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Kyle nance

New Member
So i did an experiment with an orgonite pyramid to test its effects on food coloring and water freezing. i used tap water and one drop of red food coloring. I did the control last so i will have to do it again to be sure orgone energy does not change the outcome of the experiment. So far the food coloring seems to be pulled towards the pyramid. When i put it on top food coloring was pulled more towards the top. Went i put the pyramid on the bottom the food coloring was pulled more towards the bottom. With no pyramid the food coloring was pulled more towards the top but also more evenly distributed.Screenshot_20190421-122811_Video Player.jpg
Pyramid on top
IMG_20190421_123041_407.jpg
Pyramid on bottom(ice flipped upside down)
IMG_20190421_123041_406.jpg
Control no pyramid (possibly contaminated with energy left in freezer. Was aired out for 24 hrs.
20190421_073135.jpg
Control
20190421_073130.jpg
Pyramid on bottom
20190421_073121.jpg
Pyramid on top
 
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Leifer

Senior Member.
Looking at the ways of producing "clear ice" like for fancy bar-tending cocktails.... reveals some ways that ice freezes. (like a solid chunk of clear ice in a glass of Scotch)

https://www.wikihow.com/Make-Clear-Ice
Various methods are "boiling the water twice" , "distilled water", or freezing any water in a small cooler put in the freezer (easiest).
Different effects are had when water freezes slowly, from the top-down, or from the bottom-up. So when placing an Orgone block (or a rock or a metal figurine of a Buddha) above or below a glass of formed ice is effectively acting as a heat-sink, and will create different ice formation. It doesn't need to be "orgone"..... it just needs some thermal mass.

I suspect that many youtube videos are only posted when the ice formed, is chosen from a few tests - that which best "proves" or describes their theory..... because like individual snowflakes, the ice formed is usually all different.
 
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Leifer

Senior Member.
I wondered....
I looked-up what is in "food coloring".... and often the carrier for the coloring is water and propylene glycol.

.... so it freezes slower. I wonder at it's specific gravity, or flotation or separation in water. (suspension)

My armchair theory is that the colorant and propylene glycol somewhat hold together and is sent to the inner parts of the ice vessel, to freeze last.....seen in the inner core color.
 
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