How did barium get into chemtrails?

Jay Reynolds

Senior Member.
This is a historical and factual examination of how the claim that chemtrails contain barium came about.

Historical
http://www.chemtrailcentral.com/forum/thread5946-30.html


June 15th, 2000
A.C. Griffith introduces his idea that "electroactive polymer fibers" are in contrails, which he attempts to support by quoting a DARPA document which refers to these fibers being used in robotics and image processing. He also issues a veiled threat to scientists and government employees whom he mistakenly believes are "spraying" fibers on them: "If the government told the people of the nature of the experiments, I believe the citizens would physically attack the government employees and scientists involved."
http://chemtrails.yuku.com/topic/1033/Electroactive-Polymer-Fibers

June 16th, 2000
Griffith uses the phrase, "The experiments are layered from the ground of the earth up to the ionosphere and beyond." This phrase is found within "The Spotlight" article:
http://www.rense.com/general4/chmmm.htm

"A member of the research group told The Spotlight that "an over-whelming array of ongoing military research and development and defense-related activity is layered from ground level into space,"
http://chemtrails.yuku.com/reply/9780/Electroactive-Polymer-Fibers#reply-9780

July 6, 2000
Posted by Clifford Carnicom "on behalf of Griff" were this photo and text entitled "Enemy Radar View".
http://chemtrails.yuku.com/topic/985/ENEMY-RADAR-VIEW

Rather than being the work of either A.C. Griffith or Carnicom, both the image and the text was taken from this 1996 "Popular Mechanics" article.
http://books.google.co.vi/books?id=...g=PA26#v=onepage&q="enemy radar view"&f=false


In order to alter the original so that it served his purpose, Griffith has added the final sentence:" The Variable Terrain Radio Parabolic Equation (VTRPE) model has been tested and perfected after aerosol barium titanate salt mixture was released from military aircraft, forming chemical trails in the atmosphere across America. This was ONE experiment / project conducted with barium salt mixture in the atmosphere."

At the same time, realizing that if people knew VTRPE was simply an equation used to approximate real-life situations of radar propagation, Griffith removed the phrase "A complex mathematical model that currently can run only on a supercomputer" from his version of the article. Griffith lifted a "Popular Mechanics" article, including an image, without attribution, and altered it, adding and deleting text. His goal was to impress readers with what he hoped they would accept as his "research". Within several days, I was able to uncover and expose the hoax for all to see.

July 14th, 2000
Griffith introduces his idea that Barium is a component of contrails:
"I have every reason to believe that a barium salt mixture has been released into the atmosphere - but not limited to barium salt. If I were not sure of what I'm telling you I would not post this document." However, Griffith proceeds to tell none of the reasons he believes this to be true.
http://chemtrails.yuku.com/topic/973/Breathing-Barium-Salt-Mixture

July 16th, 2000
Griffith urges people to use search engines to find references to "advanced radar studies". He says: "New doors of understanding will open for you. Stay with "Advanced Radar Studies" until you get enough insight to begin to see into their projects. Later other project doors will open to you for further understanding."
http://chemtrails.yuku.com/reply/9460/Breathing-Barium-Salt-Mixture#reply-9460
http://chemtrails.yuku.com/reply/9445/Breathing-Barium-Salt-Mixture#reply-9445

July 24,2000
Griffith describes an anonymous conversation he says was related to him regarding barium, because of this, he says, "We know we're right on target!"
http://chemtrails.yuku.com/topic/974/BARIUM-Where-did-you-hear-that

July 25th, 2000
Clifford Carnicom creates a messageboard forum specifically for Griffith's barium idea, saying, "One suggestion is to invite Griff to present an opening statement here, since to my understanding, he is the source and genesis of this research. Deborah may be inclined as well as you suggest since there has been extensive research on both accounts."
http://chemtrails.yuku.com/reply/9569/OPENING-STATEMENT#reply-9569

Griffith Goes to Ground After this point, A.C. Griffith dropped out and away from public view, not making public comments but asking people to confer via e-mail.

10/3/2000
Clifford Carnicom posts "Project Report #1 at his website.
http://www.carnicom.com/report1.htm

10/5/2000
On October 5th, I informed both A.C. Griffith and Clifford Carnicom by e-mail that I had begun research and intended to expose the process by which Griffith had created "Project Report No. 1" and the identity of it's author(s).

10/7/2000
A.C. Griffith, in response to my message, began circulating an e-mail message warning of an attack coming on what he called "The Spotlight Report". I have never had any intention of disputing what was contained in "The Spotlight", which I believe accurately reported the story told to it by A.C.Griffith.


In his email, Griffith cites his sources, "As investigators get closer to the truth, informed sources in government say that an aggressive effort is forthcoming and will attempt to systematically discredit people and information found in the recent Spotlight Chemtrail Report." I say, "Which INFORMED SOURCES IN GOVERNMENT, GRIFFITH?"

To the present day, A.C Griffith has not made further public appearances, or responded to my requests for further information, including verifiable documentation of his military record. It is almost as if he's hiding out, waiting for the next shoe to drop.
-END

Note: This report was displayed at a website I created in 2001, but which subsequently disappeared offline. Repeated emails to the free host regarding what happened went unanswered. I assume that threats of legal action were made against the host which dropped the site as part of their risk aversion policy.

WHO IS A.C. GRIFFITH?

A.C. Griffith as Airman 2nd Class, 1959,serving with the 6925th Radio Squadron, Mobile as a radio repairman, http://www.clarkab.org/organizations/6925thrsm/griffith/GriffithAC282.jpg

A.C. Griffith, age sixty,


is a resident of Richmond, VA, who also operates a business near Winston-Salem,NC, called Yesterdayradio.com
http://web.archive.org/web/20030426192833/http://yesterdayradio.com/

which specializes in reproductions of historical radio broadcasts. To my knowledge, Griffith has not engaged in commercial activity related to the contrail controversy, or advertised his business among his fellow "believers". I have asked Griffith if he was indeed an Air Force officer, but he has refused to respond. This leads me to conclude that he is not able to document his service without revealing that he was only an enlisted man, and never an officer as he claimed to "The Spotlight". He maintains a webspace at the Clark Air Force Base website http://www.clarkab.org/organizations/6925thrsm/griffith/

where he displays photos and reminiscences of his duty there as an enlisted man between 1959-60. He served with the 6925th Mobile Radio Squadron, which operated radios which monitored transmitters in China and took bearings on their locations. While this work could be considered "intelligence gathering", it does not amount to being an "NSA official", as Griffith claimed to "The Spotlight".
 
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Jay Reynolds

Senior Member.
June 5, 2001
A.C. Griffith and several others created the following website called "Chemtrails Over America":
http://web.archive.org/web/20010812...quakker/Documents/Chemtrails_Over_America.htm

The site claimed to have been produced by NSA and CIA associated people, and claimed that chemtrails were four projects:

1. Reduce solar radiation due to an ozone crisis
2. "The most secretive project" is the Radio Frequency Mission Planner(RFMP)
and the Variable Terrain Radio Parabolic Equation(VTRPE)
3. Weather control using Haarp
4. Biological detection and decontamination programs

The website goes into its greatest detail describing the RFMP and the VTPRE. The site includes many images and text yet does not link to any of them. The authors did this to achieve the appearance of secret knowledge being revealed, which is what they had opened with.

There is, however, no secret about either the RFMP or the VTPRE.

In a nutshell, the RMP and VTPRE are computer modeling programs and apps which help military planners determine if they wll have successful communications between given sites under particular weather and terrain conditions.

It was developed mainly by the University of Texas at Arlington's Research Laboratory:
http://wwwext.arlut.utexas.edu/lab/index.html

Here is a complete tutorial for the RFMP:
http://sgl.arlut.utexas.edu/tutorials/rfmptutor.html

A User's Guide to VTRPE:
http://adsabs.harvard.edu/abs/1991nosc.reptS....R

Here is a person who worked on the project:
http://shirlenepearson.com/

Here are many papers on the subject:
http://scholar.google.com/scholar?q...ion+model&hl=en&as_sdt=0&as_vis=1&oi=scholart

This link even contains a promotional video for the RFMP!
http://www.prismnet.com/~atc/movies.shtml

Conclusion

Griff and his compadres engaged in some levels of deception.
They deliberately omitted the original sources for the material they claimed was secret to give the appearance of having special knowledge.

They have never shown proof of their CIA and NSA connections, indeed most of the participants remained anonymous and never explained any qualifications at all.

Though they claimed to have "gotten inside the chemtrail program", they never named any participants, locations, dates, or anything of real value. This begs the question of why they would say anything at all if no usable information had been gathered?

The whole set of claims essentially informs the readers of very little, and appears designed to simply develop a sense in the audience that the persons telling the story have credibility.

Now that a decade has passed since this gambit was floated, we find the original participants have again gone under ground. Their website is defunct, the persons are no longer participating, and what occurred to start the "Barium In Chemtrails" idea is probably unknown to 99% of people who make the claim at present.

I hope that this article can help the current crop of believers understand how easy that a wild claim with no real basis can become a tenet of faith underlying a movement.
 

Jay Reynolds

Senior Member.
PS

Some of what I know about the above came from ordinary research. Some of it I credit with a lady who once believed in chemtrails who was a member f the same group with AC. Griffith. She was privy to their inside discussions and afterwards she revealed what they had done. This thread was stated by her as a humorous way to poke fun at the group:
http://www.chemtrailcentral.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/000135.html
 
G

Geezer

Guest
Barium - Brake Pads

A repost of mine from the contrailscience.com website:

Barium Sulphate is commonly used as a filler in vehicle brake pads (Chan and Stachowiak, 2004) and barium has been used to trace brake pad dust in a pollution study in central London (Gietl et al, 2010).

1) Chan D., Stachowiak G.W. (2004). Review of automotive brake friction materials. Proceedings of the Institution of Mechanical Engineers, Part D: Journal of Automobile Engineering

2) Gietl J.K., Lawrence R., Thorpe A.J., Harrison R.M. (2010). Identification of brake wear particles and derivation of a quantitative tracer for brake dust at a major road. Atmospheric Environment.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Salient points highlighted:

Particulate matter can also be released by the wear and tear of car brakes and tyres, or even by the normal abrasion of road surfaces. Brake dust, especially, is thought to be an 'important source of particulate matter pollution,' says Harrison. Its emissions are not regulated, although 'they need to be if particulate matter pollution levels are to be maximally controlled,' he adds.
One of the reasons behind the lack of legislation is that it's difficult to quantify how much particulate matter comes out of the abrasion of the different parts of the car. Harrison and his Birmingham team set out to find an accurate method to trace brake dust emissions.
They decided to look especially at barium because barite (also known as barium sulphate), used by most manufacturers as filler in break pads, is one of the few sources of barium in cities and can be traced back to brakes.
The team set up camp at Marylebone Road in central London and sampled the air along the busy six-lane road daily for three weeks. They also collected samples from an urban background location at Regent's Park, 800 metres north of Marylebone Road, away from local traffic influence.
They used Regent's Park as a comparison: 'the difference between Marylebone Road and the urban background is the pollution emitted by the traffic at the road,' explains Harrison.
Back in the lab, they analysed the air samples and measured both the amount of particulate matter, its metal content, and the sizes of the particles. The results, published last week in the journal Atmospheric Environment, show that the concentration of barium, copper, iron and antimony increase dramatically near Marylebone Road.
Iron comprises up to 75 per cent of brake dust particles. Barium represents only one per cent, but it makes a better tracer for brake dust pollution as iron particles can also be emitted by tyre and road surface wear.
 

Jay Reynolds

Senior Member.
If this video and comment are to be believed, A.C. Griffith is dead at 72 years old. His son gives the following comment:

Charles Griffiths said:
AC Griffith was my father. His actual name was Arvon Calcote Griffiths. He was not really an expert on any government activities. I find these untrue and intentionally misleading claims to be offensive with his passing. He served in the USAF and worked for the US postal service, not the NSA. It's a lie. He simply had a way of storytelling that captured the imagination and seemed like he knew everything about the subject. Ask me anything you want to know about his life. Charles Griffiths 4 days ago



 

George B

Extinct but not forgotten Staff Member
I think the research below also had something to do with connecting Barium with the chemtrail conspiracy . . . I am not making any claims as to its accuracy . . . before you all get energized . . .

The following non-peer reviewed research by Purdy . . . suggested a connection between military applications and aerosols containing Barium and Strontium . . . could be a source for some of the concepts . . .

 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
George, given that that's from 2004, and Griffiths was talking about it in 2000, then it seems more likely that Purdy was simply following Griffiths ideas.
 

George B

Extinct but not forgotten Staff Member
George, given that that's from 2004, and Griffiths was talking about it in 2000, then it seems more likely that Purdy was simply following Griffiths ideas.
I am not thinking about just origins . . . where I agree with you . . . I am thinkin about the care and feeding of the concept as well . . .
 

George B

Extinct but not forgotten Staff Member
These are examples of a 'nested or infinite do loops' without a termination or exit command . . a circular argument without resolution replicating itself infinitely . . . when one doesn't validate sources to the extreme . . . single sources, true or questionable, get proliferated as multiple sources and self-replicate . . .
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
These are examples of a 'nested or infinite do loops' without a termination or exit command . . a circular argument without resolution replicating itself infinitely . . . when one doesn't validate sources to the extreme . . . single sources, true or questionable, get proliferated as multiple sources and self-replicate . . .

Yeah, but you can check the log file to determine event order.
 

George B

Extinct but not forgotten Staff Member
In this case though it's pretty clear that one precedes the other by several years.
I am not arguing the chicken or the egg . . . no doubt you are correct . . . I am just indicating the research paper reinforces the connection . . . and for those late to the game . . . possibly just as influential . . .
 

Jay Reynolds

Senior Member.
I am just indicating the research paper reinforces the connection . . .

It reinforces nothing at all .

The citations in Purdy's paper were bogus, pure and simple, and referred to making electronic parts and tiny experiments on the edge of space, not at all what he said it was about.

The journal it was published in had no reviewers at the time, and is widely considered pseudoscience.
Read the controversy and it becomes clear why Purdy's work got published with no one ever bothering to check that his citations had any relevance.

Medical Hypothesis is the National Inquirer!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medical_Hypotheses
 

George B

Extinct but not forgotten Staff Member
It reinforces nothing at all .

The citations in Purdy's paper were bogus, pure and simple, and referred to making electronic parts and tiny experiments on the edge of space, not at all what he said it was about.

The journal it was published in had no reviewers at the time, and is widely considered pseudoscience.
Read the controversy and it becomes clear why Purdy's work got published with no one ever bothering to check that his citations had any relevance.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medical_Hypotheses

So . . . reinforcement is independent of accuracy or relevance . . . unless someone investigates all the footnotes . . . the origin and credentials of the author . . . no one knows the pitfalls . . . see #11 above . . .
 

MikeC

Closed Account
Of course the relevance/quality of the footnotes has to be investigated - otherwise how would you know if the information is "good" or not? just accept it because someone has included a footnote or reference??

And it is not an infinite loop - although yes it can be a deep hole if you are researching a subject that is obscure, because yes, the quality of the information IS only as good as its foundations.

Why would you expect otherwise?

This is what REAL research is like - it is a great deal more than looking up the 'net and accepting the first article you find that you like! This is why scientists value peer review and publication, and why repeatability matters!
 

Belfrey

Senior Member.
The way I read GeorgeB's posts, he seems to be saying that articles like that serve to perpetuate the meme among those who are ill-equipped or disinclined to evaluate them critically. Not that they actually provide solid supporting evidence.
 

George B

Extinct but not forgotten Staff Member
Of course the relevance/quality of the footnotes has to be investigated - otherwise how would you know if the information is "good" or not? just accept it because someone has included a footnote or reference??

And it is not an infinite loop - although yes it can be a deep hole if you are researching a subject that is obscure, because yes, the quality of the information IS only as good as its foundations.

Why would you expect otherwise?

This is what REAL research is like - it is a great deal more than looking up the 'net and accepting the first article you find that you like! This is why scientists value peer review and publication, and why repeatability matters!
Geeeez. . . I am not arguing your impressive speech . . . I noted the lack of peer review above myself . . . the point and only point I have been making is the paper could have reinforced the concept of Barium and Strontium's connection to the chemtrail conspiracy advocates . . . they by the way don't read your debunking research on this Forum . . .
 

George B

Extinct but not forgotten Staff Member
The way I read GeorgeB's posts, he seems to be saying that articles like that serve to perpetuate the meme among those who are ill-equipped or disinclined to evaluate them critically. Not that they actually provide solid supporting evidence.
Close . . . except first glance the research appeared to be fairly well done and presented . . . the failure was in the footnotes and lack of peer review, both of which are not immediately apparent . . . without the sophistication to discover the weaknesses and knowledge of Purdy's work it could have reinforced or perpetuated the belief . . .
 

Jay Reynolds

Senior Member.
BTW, the Purdy reference to barium stearate comes directly from Bob Fritakis, who claimed contact with a whistleblower who never gave anything of substance.
http://rense.com/general18/mn.htm
Not the way whistleblowers are treated by reporters. Fritakis copied some of what he claimed from other CT'ers. It's clear enough that Purdy was influenced by the conspiracy culture, and got what he did from it.
 

TWCobra

Senior Member.
The MSDS of Barium- Dangerous Goods Category 4.3

Air Transport IATA:
UN/ID Number: 1400 Packing Group: II
Special provisions: None
Cargo Only
Packing Instructions: 490 Maximum Qty/Pack: 50 kg
Passenger and Cargo Passenger and Cargo
Packing Instructions: Y475 Maximum Qty/Pack: 15 kg
Passenger and Cargo Limited Quantity Passenger and Cargo Limited Quantity
Packing Instructions: 484 Maximum Qty/Pack: 5 kg
! Air transport may be forbidden if this material is flammable, corrosive or toxic gases may be released under normal conditions of
transport.
Shipping Name: BARIUM

Conditions to Avoid: Water or moisture and air. Avoid friction, heat, sparks, and flame.
Incompatibility (Materials to Avoid): Water or moisture, oxidizing agents, oxygen, acids, alcohols, halocarbons, carbon dioxide, ammonia.
Hazardous Decomposition Products: Toxic fumes of hydrogen and barium oxide.


Barium oxide
" is an oxidiser
" reacts with water or steam, producing heat and corrosive barium hydroxide; may cause spontaneous combustion
" reacts violently or explosively with reducing agents, alcohols, ethers, fluorine, glycols, glycol ethers, hydrazine, hydrogen sulfide, hydrogen
trisulfide, hydroxylamine
" is incompatible with ammonium nitrate, diboron tetrafluoride, hydrazinium nitrate, hydrogen sulfide, nitroalkanes, red phosphorus, sulfur
trioxide, rubidium acetylide, selenium oxychloride
" forms heat-sensitive explosive material with anilinium perchlorate
" increase the explosive or thermal sensitivity of nitromethane, nitroethane, 1-nitropropane, silver azide
" increase explosive sensitivity of hydrazinium perchlorate
" reacts with carbon dioxide, nickel monoxide, nitrogen tetroxide
" is strongly basic in aqueous solution.
TSCA Listed: Yes

DOT Regulations:
Hazard Class: 4.3
Identification Number: UN1400
Packing Group: II
Proper Shipping Name: Barium
Label: Dangerous when wet
 

TWCobra

Senior Member.
What it all means.. Maximum permissible weight to be carried on Passenger aircraft: 15KG. Special packaging required. Avoid contact with water moisture and air. Not a substance that would be in general use in aviation and would require special handling when packed, transported and stored. A spill would likely cause a fire and anyone handling it in liquid form would be required to wear heavily protective gear. A leak on board an aircraft would would be a major emergency.
 

Jay Reynolds

Senior Member.
If this video and comment are to be believed, A.C. Griffith is dead at 72 years old. His son gives the following comment:

Charles Griffiths said:
AC Griffith was my father. His actual name was Arvon Calcote Griffiths. He was not really an expert on any government activities. I find these untrue and intentionally misleading claims to be offensive with his passing. He served in the USAF and worked for the US postal service, not the NSA. It's a lie. He simply had a way of storytelling that captured the imagination and seemed like he knew everything about the subject. Ask me anything you want to know about his life. Charles Griffiths 4 days ago




I just got off the phone with Charles Griffiths, who confirmed that the above quote is from him and is truthful. He told me that anyone can contact him through his youtube channel and he will tell them whatever they need to know about his father. He has been aware for thirty years that his father was becoming more and more into conspiracy culture and saying things that weren't true. With his father's passing, the stories that were told are an embarrassment to the family, and he wants them to stop. He is in possession of all his father's military and work-related records which show that he was never associated in any way with the CIA or NSA, and as he stated on youtube, A.C was only an enlisted man and postal service employee.

Charles told me that A.C. was an attention seeker who was able to convince people with stories and that he had heard these stories his whole life. When the stories weren't believed, A.C. became alienated from his family and increasingly depended on internet contacts for friendship. A.C.'s companion, Kimberly Dawley, is living in the home with a dozen cats and will not leave, the situation was descibed as "hoarding", and he believes that she is also posting using his ID. He is seeking a court order to straighten these things out.

I hope that Charles Griffiths will be able to find some closure on this episode. For now, this seems to be the end of the trail for the claims of A.C. Griffith, who I credit for initiating the hoax that barium was part of "chemtrails". The idea has become firmly engrained in the myth, which should be astonishing to anyone reading this account, but also holds a very good lesson for the people that have believed it and those who promote this hoax need to take in the lesson.

In particular, the followers of Clifford Carnicom need to know that Carnicom has based much of what he says directly on the stories that were told to him by A.C. Griffith. The lesson here is that Carnicom has been manipulated and has willingly carried on the hoax material given to him by A.C. Griffith to many many others.
 
C

Chickiedeb

Guest
Hello Jay! Funny that I was researching something else and came upon this board. Some really good reading here!

I am at a loss for words about A.C. Griffith and the information relayed by his son. I can't help but wonder if the people taken in by him are aware of this information.

On the lighter side, do you remember the night on Carnicom's Board that C.L.U.C.K. was organized circa Fall of 1999, as referred to in this fake AP article?http://www.chemtrailcentral.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/000135.html It was a joke because you referred to the believers as "chicken littles", and a fellow who called himself Drummerboy ran with it, thus the moniker, Chickiedeb. What was even funnier was that you seriously thought this was the first attempt for the chemmies to organize. (Just so you know it's really me.)

I had an experience a few weeks ago that might get you to smile. I was visiting my nephew, and his wife's younger cousins were there. When I came into the house, they were having a conversation about chemtrails. I should have exited stage left, but I sat there and smiled while listening to them. When I had enough, I asked them if they ever heard of a debunker named "Chickiedeb." Now realize that my nephew never knew about my involvement, and he shot me a look like 'oh no.' They knew more about Chickiedeb, just a housewife from Indiana then I expected. And then I hit them with it. They didn't believe me at first until I pointed out that how would I even know about chemtrails, debunkers, and all the rest. The look on their faces said it all. I invited them to debate and they backed off after stating they refused to be in the company of an agent, and stormed out the door. My nephew asked, "Seriously?" And I told him I just don't have the time to tell the whole story. And that was the end of that.

Hope you and the family are well. Give me a call sometime.
Best regards,
Deb
 

Jay Reynolds

Senior Member.
Thanks for stopping in, Deb. Very few of those around back then ever show up that I am aware of. I think that for the more rational people there is a limit to how many years they can live in that sort of world. I'm glad if they have left the hoax as it is a great sign that they have grown personally. The ones like Clifford Carnicom, who continue on telling and re-telling the same lies, inventing new lies and covering for people like A.C. Griffith, while also covering for themselves by doing so, are the ones who I feel sorry for and at the same time also dislike the most.

For over a decade, Carnicom has NEVER been able to interest ANY real scientist in his bunk, though he encouraged his followers to engage in real massive campaigns to do so. This actually tired them out and most have left him from what I've seen. He has been forced further and further down the food chain and is now prinicipally associating himself with the most vulnerable sort of people who have delusions of parasitosis, an actual mental illness. Of course he tells them he will be their savior and is seeking endless donations.

I understand that the folks who have been most influenced by A.C. Griffith have no idea how that man's own mental contortions have influenced them. It is amazing and I'm not sure just how to let them know about it. I'll do some thinking about how this might be accomplished. Of course, there is always that book I intend to write someday, this will make an interesting chapter.
 

Jazzy

Closed Account
Wow. This is a complete surprise to me. All of it, except knowledge of Chickiedeb's sterling work against the chemtrail myth. Talk about late to the party. Wonderful. ;)
 

Jay Reynolds

Senior Member.


The video titled: A.C. Griffith: The Man Who Broke the “Chemtrail” Story, Dead at 72. A Tribute to a Fallen Hero

has been removed by the youube user.
 

David Fraser

Senior Member.
Some excellent information here. Thanks. I have been asking what form barium is been sprayed as obviously that has an effect on toxicity.
 

Jay Reynolds

Senior Member.
Very few chemtrail believers have any idea that the elements they receive lab reports on are almost always part of a compound with various levels of toxicity or availability. The satanic element aluminum has a long history of pseudoscientific fearmongering. Barium, though the sulfate is safely consumable in mass quantites for radiology, "barium tianate salts" seem to have been chosen out of thin air by Griffith as his personal demonic substance, we'll probably never know what went on in his head to start him down that road.
 

David Fraser

Senior Member.
Reading your timeline as well as the comments from his son there may have been some thought went into it. Given that he provided his audience terms to put into search engines I think he is assuming low technical ability. All good stories have a modicum of truth and barium could stand cursury scrutiny, especially as the atmospheric levels are variable, not to mention water content.I presume that there would have been enough information available on the internet to keep his audience happy, especially as there is no real danger compared to other elements. A really good piece of story telling. The UK military have a term of "Bullshit baffles Brains" were you throw in as much jargon as you can.

I do feel sorry for him in a way as it is obvious his tale was going to be exposed and I doubt he was prepared. It is actually a little sad.
 

George B

Extinct but not forgotten Staff Member

Interesting there is a Barium shortage . . .


 

Jay Reynolds

Senior Member.

Interesting there is a Barium shortage . . .

There isn't a "shortage". Barite will always be produced in sufficient quantities for medical purposes. Most of it, well over 90%, goes back underground in the oil well drilling business, so unless the medical supply companies are having technical difficulties, their small demand shouldn't even affect the market.

I see shiploads of it going in and out of port in Louisiana all night and day. If there was a shortage of barite, oil and gas wells would cease to be drilled.

The barite is used in drilling for three main purposes:
It is added to liquids to form a heavy mud and circulated down the hole to the drill bit. This lubricates the bit as well as brings the cuttings of rock back up for removal, whence the barite mud is cleaned and sent back down the hole. The incredible density of this mineral builds up a tremendous pressure from it's own weght as a column of mud thousands of feet will be present. It it this pressure which counteracts the oil/gas pressure at the bottom of the hole and keeps the well from blowing out.

Just to give you an idea how much is used,

The price has indeed gone up, and some production has gone down, some might call this a "shortage", but as prices rise, more mines become competitive:
http://news.yahoo.com/mabwe-minerals-inc-secures-long-120000411.html

Here is a recent summary of the barite market:
http://www.rigzone.com/news/article.asp?a_id=113495

And here is a guy using a 6" vacuum truck hose to suck clean the bottom of a barite tank on the ship I worked on. It is just anuisance dust and as you can see he is covered in it. Barite is not harmful when ingested which is why doctors use it to contrast for radiology. The BS abut barite being poisonous is just that, BS.

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George B

Extinct but not forgotten Staff Member
There isn't a "shortage". Barite will always be produced in sufficient quantities for medical purposes. Most of it, well over 90%, goes back underground in the oil well drilling business, so unless the medical supply companies are having technical difficulties, their small demand shouldn't even affect the market.

I see shiploads of it going in and out of port in Louisiana all night and day. If there was a shortage of barite, oil and gas wells would cease to be drilled.

The barite is used in drilling for three main purposes:
It is added to liquids to form a heavy mud and circulated down the hole to the drill bit. This lubricates the bit as well as brings the cuttings of rock back up for removal, whence the barite mud is cleaned and sent back down the hole. The incredible density of this mineral builds up a tremendous pressure from it's own weght as a column of mud thousands of feet will be present. It it this pressure which counteracts the oil/gas pressure at the bottom of the hole and keeps the well from blowing out.

Just to give you an idea how much is used,

The price has indeed gone up, and some production has gone down, some might call this a "shortage", but as prices rise, more mines become competitive:
http://news.yahoo.com/mabwe-minerals-inc-secures-long-120000411.html

Here is a recent summary of the barite market:
http://www.rigzone.com/news/article.asp?a_id=113495

And here is a guy using a 6" vacuum truck hose to suck clean the bottom of a barite tank on the ship I worked on. It is just anuisance dust and as you can see he is covered in it. Barite is not harmful when ingested which is why doctors use it to contrast for radiology. The BS abut barite being poisonous is just that, BS.

View attachment 1519
Seems there is something going on with the medical supply . . . one person I know recently had contrast studies cancelled and told it is because of a Barium shortage . . .
 
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