"Hovering" C-130 Spraying in Corpus Christi, Texas

muttkat68

Member
I had seen a C130 hovering over the roof of this tall building that in this picture in the downtown area. It was very close to the roof and then it dipped down some more and saw a mist mixture coming out of the wings. Have you ever seen any military planes spraying a mist over building? I wasn't able to get a picture because I was driving.

http://oneshorelineplaza.com/

800 N Shoreline Blvd, Corpus Christi, TX
 
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Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
C-130s don't hover. When you are driving a plane can seem to be hovering because of the parallax effect (the closer objects move faster across your field of view than the further objects). Here is an example:

What you saw was likely just landing or taking off from the Naval Air Station, which is about ten miles to the south west of there. Shoreline Plaza is lined up with the longer runway.


The "spray" may just have been moisture forming from the wings, like:


C-130s are used for mosquito spraying
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Were you driving south on the 35? That would give the correct position and motion for the "hovering" effect.
 

David Fraser

Senior Member.
I stand to be corrected but I think the slowest a C130 can fly is 100 to 125 knots, which may be fast for a car but, as Mick says, with a different perspective may not seem fast for the aircraft.
 

Svartbjørn

Senior Member.
I had seen a C130 hovering over the roof of this tall building that in this picture in the downtown area. It was very close to the roof and then it dipped down some more and saw a mist mixture coming out of the wings. Have you ever seen any military planes spraying a mist over building? I wasn't able to get a picture because I was driving.

http://oneshorelineplaza.com/

800 N Shoreline Blvd, Corpus Christi, TX

Can you define "hover" for me please? Do you mean hovering as in hanging around the area for an extended period of time, or Hovering like a helicopter?
 

muttkat68

Member
The “International Chemtrail Association”. https://www.facebook.com/InternationalChemtrail/info
has started a facebook group. Here are some quotations from its content. Would Metabunk want to debunk this content?

[Admin: large cut-and-paste of material from facebook removed]

Halva they are spraying something where I live, but pertaining to cloud seeding.....preventing rain that is. I have some pictures to upload. I tried but something didn't go right but I did see a C130 plane spraying a mist over the downtown area for whatever reason I don't know.
 

WeedWhacker

Senior Member
but I did see a C130 plane spraying a mist over the downtown area for whatever reason I don't know.

In most such instances it is related to pest control of some kind...usually mosquito pesticide. But depending on where you live, this will be public information.
 

muttkat68

Member
In most such instances it is related to pest control of some kind...usually mosquito pesticide. But depending on where you live, this will be public information.

If it would of been for mosquitos, they would of had the city maintainance trucks spraying but there is very little vegetation there so they're not going to pay to have a military plane spray concrete and steel. As I was driving I see that C 130 about 100 feet above this skyscraper. I thought it was having engine trouble and was going to crash or flop down on the roof of the building. Then it dips down even more and starts spraying. The only thing that plane sprayed on was concrete and steel and the only body of water there is there is the hotel swimming pool. It sprayed the hotel. Here is the best picture I could find. Its the tallest building. That plane which was large wasn't suppose to be there. There is a flight training base 10 - 12 miles away but when they land they fly a specific route and its not 50 to 100 feet above those downtown buildings. If anybody was looking out any of the north west side windows they would thought it was 911 all over again.

http://www.stxmaps.com/go/corpus-christi-bayfront.html
 

scombrid

Senior Member.
As I was driving I see that C 130 about 100 feet above this skyscraper. I thought it was having engine trouble and was going to crash or flop down on the roof of the building. Then it dips down even more and starts spraying.
Sounds like mosquito spraying. Back home in Hampton Roads they’ve been using C-130s for my entire life. When I was little it looked like they were scraping the tree tops with the belly of the plane.

Running a web search it looks like aerial spraying is new to Corpus Christi as of 2013. The city started the program in response to detections of West Nile Virus.
http://www.caller.com/news/a-year-after-west-nile-plagued-texas-aerial-a-to

Aerial mosquito control isn’t new to the urban environment in general.
http://stopaerialspraying.com/docs/story.asp.html

Here’s a paper from CDC showing results of aerial spraying for mosquitoes in Sacremento CA in 2005 to control West Nile Virus.
http://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/14/5/07-1347_article

The only thing that plane sprayed on was concrete and steel and the only body of water there is there is the hotel swimming pool.

Aerial spraying is targeting adult mosquitoes. It doesn’t need to target water. It targets the areas where mosquitoes are interacting with the most people.
 
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scombrid

Senior Member.
It may also be worth noting how different chemical application from an airplane looks when compared to persistent contrails and contrail cirrus.
 

WeedWhacker

Senior Member
As I was driving I see that C 130 about 100 feet above this skyscraper.

With all due respect, I think that judging altitude (from the ground) is difficult at best for an experienced pilot....and is exaggeration (usually) by the layperson.

(Must take into account perspective too...angles, POV, etc).
 

muttkat68

Member
I stand to be corrected but I think the slowest a C130 can fly is 100 to 125 knots, which may be fast for a car but, as Mick says, with a different perspective may not seem fast for the aircraft.

IT SEEMED to be flying at a very low speed. Like I said I thought it had mechanical problems. Propeller planes can kinda glide where a jet goes straight down basically if it loses power.
 

muttkat68

Member
Sounds like mosquito spraying. Back home in Hampton Roads they’ve been using C-130s for my entire life. When I was little it looked like they were scraping the tree tops with the belly of the plane.

Running a web search it looks like aerial spraying is new to Corpus Christi as of 2013. The city started the program in response to detections of West Nile Virus.
http://www.caller.com/news/a-year-after-west-nile-plagued-texas-aerial-a-to

Aerial mosquito control isn’t new to the urban environment in general.
http://stopaerialspraying.com/docs/story.asp.html

Here’s a paper from CDC showing results of aerial spraying for mosquitoes in Sacremento CA in 2005 to control West Nile Virus.
http://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/14/5/07-1347_article



Aerial spraying is targeting adult mosquitoes. It doesn’t need to target water. It targets the areas where mosquitoes are interacting with the most people.

THAT could be a possibility but if they just started spraying last June, then it was before that because I hadn't bought my car yet and I bought it July 2012. I'm still looking for the date that I saw that plane.
 

scombrid

Senior Member.
I've seen C17 Globemasters coming into Patrick that look like they are stationary. That's a freaky illusion. Globemasters are huge.
 

WeedWhacker

Senior Member
I shouldn't of used the hovering, that would be like a helicopter, slow motion would be more like it.

Here is an example of the illusion of a "hovering" airplane, while YOU (yourself) are in motion (on the ground):

It is ALL about perspective, relative motion, and POV (Point-Of-View). Oh! And basic geometry, too!!! ;)

ETA: I really hope you understand this concept???
 
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Hevach

Senior Member.
IT SEEMED to be flying at a very low speed. Like I said I thought it had mechanical problems. Propeller planes can kinda glide where a jet goes straight down basically if it loses power.
This is not at all true. Once the power is out, the source of thrust doesn't matter so much as the aerodynamic properties of the plane do, and a lot of jets have surprisingly good glide ratios. In 1983, Air Canada 143 managed a 12:1 glide ratio while making an unpowered landing at what turned out to be a car track with a race in progress.

The C-130 has an official stall speed rating of 114 miles per hour (slower than the airliners that I know of), but upon Googling I've found some pilots claiming speeds as low as 85 mph in ones they've flown, and conflicting claims of glide ratios up to 9:1.



As for the illusion of hovering, it's important to remember that your eyes don't see anything in a linear matter, they see everything in angles (99% of what we "see" is really post production trickery your brain does, and it isn't exactly running on Michael Bay's effects budget):

Excuse my terrible MSPaint diagram, but here you see yourself heading one direction on a road, while a plane heads in the opposite direction in the air. Between you is a stationary building. Since you're moving, the building has an apparent angular speed to your eyes.

If the ratio of your distance to the building and the plane's distance to the building is close to the ratio of your relative speeds (in the simplified version you and the plane are roughly equidistant at roughly the same speed because I'm bad at diagrams), the angular speed of the plane and the building will be the same, even though one is moving and one is stationary.

Your brain is really bad at solving this type of conflict - if the plane was over a clear horizon, it wouldn't appear to be stationary to you, but with the building, your perceptions are messed up. Normally your brain is pretty good at sorting out what it thinks everything you see should be doing, and you perceive them as doing those things. But any time things you see create a conflict - like a stationary object and a moving one right next to each other with the same angular speed - it just throws up its hands and you get this sort of illusion instead.

Fundamentally, it's the same thing as the hollow face illusion. Just another one of those little ways our brains betray us because we're subjecting them to situations and stimuli that evolution never had a chance to prepare them for.
 
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WeedWhacker

Senior Member
if the plane was over a clear horizon, it wouldn't appear to be stationary to you, but with the building, your perceptions are messed up. Normally your brain is pretty good at sorting out what it thinks everything you see should be doing, and you perceive them as doing those things. But any time things you see create a conflict - like a stationary object and a moving one right next to each other with the same angular speed - it just throws up its hands and you get this sort of illusion instead.

I think that explains it quite well.....
 

WeedWhacker

Senior Member
Weed Part of the time I was driving slowly but when I saw the plane spraying, I was stationary......at a red light.

OK....you were stopped at a red light. BUT THEN? The airplane (the "C-130") wasn't "hovering"...was it?

Oh and still...."spraying" has been explained. Mosquito/pest control.
 

muttkat68

Member
OK....you were stopped at a red light. BUT THEN? The airplane (the "C-130") wasn't "hovering"...was it?

Oh and still...."spraying" has been explained. Mosquito/pest control.



C-130s don't hover. When you are driving a plane can seem to be hovering because of the parallax effect (the closer objects move faster across your field of view than the further objects). Here is an example:

What you saw was likely just landing or taking off from the Naval Air Station, which is about ten miles to the south west of there. Shoreline Plaza is lined up with the longer runway.
I had used the wrong wording as to how it was flying.

The plane was going the opposite way and when they land it goes that way but further east crossing more over the bay and not over the downtown area.


The "spray" may just have been moisture forming from the wings, like:


C-130s are used for mosquito spraying
Let me see if this reply goes thru. I've tried about 3 or 4 times.

Coasting not hovering is a better phrase to use.

On your arrow picture....When planes land at the base they go opposite of your arrow and fly over that area like where that 35 icon is at over the water. When they take off they go east over Padre Island or west of the city.

The moisture on that jet landing. ... It didn't look like that all. An "on" switched was turned and it started spraying like the C130 picture and I think it was spraying out of 4 nozzles


[cleaned up quote errors]
 
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muttkat68

Member
A C-130 is a turbo-prop, and by design can fly much slower (when needed) than most commercial airliners. Just so you know.

Yes I was already aware of that.

OK I'm going to try to answer the questions in sequence again. I've had problems trying to post here. I answered some of your questions and they didn't go thru. I've tried a good 10 to 15 times and apparently the computer trouble shooter people don't have any common sense.
 

muttkat68

Member
With all due respect, I think that judging altitude (from the ground) is difficult at best for an experienced pilot....and is exaggeration (usually) by the layperson.

(Must take into account perspective too...angles, POV, etc).

How about it was too close to the top of the building.
 

Efftup

Senior Member.
OK, seeing as how we seem to have sorted out some confusion, let's start again.
Muttkat68 saw a C130 flying low and very slowly over Corpus Christi, Texas, that appeared to be spraying something.

This was BEFORE July 2012.

Where do we go from here? it would obviously help if Muttkat could somehow narrow the date down.
but what avenues are there for finding out about military flights over this area?

If Muttkat 68 does NOT go by the name Leslie Crofford on Facebook then there is one other person who claims they have seen C130s spraying for over a year.
 

muttkat68

Member
Sounds like mosquito spraying. Back home in Hampton Roads they’ve been using C-130s for my entire life. When I was little it looked like they were scraping the tree tops with the belly of the plane.

Running a web search it looks like aerial spraying is new to Corpus Christi as of 2013. The city started the program in response to detections of West Nile Virus.
http://www.caller.com/news/a-year-after-west-nile-plagued-texas-aerial-a-to

Aerial mosquito control isn’t new to the urban environment in general.
http://stopaerialspraying.com/docs/story.asp.html

Here’s a paper from CDC showing results of aerial spraying for mosquitoes in Sacremento CA in 2005 to control West Nile Virus.
http://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/14/5/07-1347_article



Aerial spraying is targeting adult mosquitoes. It doesn’t need to target water. It targets the areas where mosquitoes are interacting with the most people.
 

muttkat68

Member
OK they're spraying for mosquitos.

I saw this on Jan 23, 2012, almost a year and a half before, at noon. The Callertimes article is dated June 19, 2013. There hadn't been any rain and the military sprays around sunset according to your article.

I can understand aerial spraying but this doesn't match the criteria for doing so.
 

muttkat68

Member
OK, seeing as how we seem to have sorted out some confusion, let's start again.
Muttkat68 saw a C130 flying low and very slowly over Corpus Christi, Texas, that appeared to be spraying something.

This was BEFORE July 2012.

Where do we go from here? it would obviously help if Muttkat could somehow narrow the date down.
but what avenues are there for finding out about military flights over this area?

If Muttkat 68 does NOT go by the name Leslie Crofford on Facebook then there is one other person who claims they have seen C130s spraying for over a year.

She did. Jan 23, 2012
 

muttkat68

Member
Again....perspective.

It's rather amazing how our ability to perceive things can be fooled, very easily:



(http://www.instantshift.com/2010/08/24/88-brilliant-examples-of-forced-perspective-photography/)

AND the iconic "classic":


OK. Then how would you explain the C-130's behavior?
I had seen a C130 hovering over the roof of this tall building that in this picture in the downtown area. It was very close to the roof and then it dipped down some more and saw a mist mixture coming out of the wings. Have you ever seen any military planes spraying a mist over building? I wasn't able to get a picture because I was driving.

http://oneshorelineplaza.com/

[fixed quotes]
 

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solrey

Senior Member.
She did. Jan 23, 2012

On Jan. 23, 2012 the weather in Corpus Christi seems like it was conducive to forming aerodynamic contrails and I've watched them form under similar conditions... Cool-moderate temps, humid, cloudy/overcast/hazy, near/over water. Then we have a large airplane performing who knows what kind of landing procedure at a training base for naval aviators. C-130 pilots don't learn to fly C-130's at NASCC but that doesn't mean that some sort of C-130 training doesn't happen there at times or that even a routine landing might look odd from a particular angle.

http://www.wunderground.com/history...tml?req_city=NA&req_state=NA&req_statename=NA

Knowing the approximate time of day would help to better understand atmospheric conditions at the time.
 

muttkat68

Member
Again....perspective.

It's rather amazing how our ability to perceive things can be fooled, very easily:
How far away were you from the plane?
Sounds like mosquito spraying. Back home in Hampton Roads they’ve been using C-130s for my entire life. When I was little it looked like they were scraping the tree tops with the belly of the plane.

Running a web search it looks like aerial spraying is new to Corpus Christi as of 2013. The city started the program in response to detections of West Nile Virus.
http://www.caller.com/news/a-year-after-west-nile-plagued-texas-aerial-a-to

Aerial mosquito control isn’t new to the urban environment in general.
http://stopaerialspraying.com/docs/story.asp.html

Here’s a paper from CDC showing results of aerial spraying for mosquitoes in Sacremento CA in 2005 to control West Nile Virus.
http://wwwnc.cdc.gov
Again....perspective.
It's rather amazing how our ability to perceive things can be fooled, very easily
Sometimes people try to talk you out of what you saw also.

Would distance have anything to do with it?



(

/eid/article/14/5/07-1347_article




Aerial spraying is targeting adult mosquitoes. It doesn’t need to target water. It targets the areas where mosquitoes are interacting with the most people.



(http://www.instantshift.com/2010/08/24/88-brilliant-examples-of-forced-perspective-photography/)

AND the iconic "classic":
I've seen C17 Globemasters coming into Patrick that look like they are stationary. That's a freaky illusion. Globemasters are huge.
Again....perspective.

It's rather amazing how our ability to perceive things can be fooled, very easily:



(http://www.instantshift.com/2010/08/24/88-brilliant-examples-of-forced-perspective-photography/)

AND the iconic "classic":
 

muttkat68

Member
What do you think is more probable. The USAF has a secret hovering C-130 that sprayed Corpus Cristi, or your relative motion on that day made it look like the C-130 was moving in slow motion?

You mean secretive like Fast and Furious until a whistleblower blew the whistle?

I think the USAF DOES alot of things in secret.

If the city didn't know about it, I guess it was a secret. A plane that wasn't going at full speed spraying Corpus Christi in an area which it shouldn't of been flying.

Hovering was so long ago, seriously?

My relative motion? I saw what I saw and if that goes against your norm, then too bad.

What am I suppose to say? It was going fast, not close to the rooftop and I was having a moment of relative motion and I didn't see it spraying?
 

Pete Tar

Senior Member.
You mean secretive like Fast and Furious until a whistleblower blew the whistle?
The existence of secrets does not validate the existence of any secret you can imagine.
What am I suppose to say? It was going fast, not close to the rooftop and I was having a moment of relative motion and I didn't see it spraying?
I think people are just trying to get you to see there are viable alternative explanations, and that everyone's vision and judgement is fallible.
Optical illusions are a universal reality, but secret hovering spraying aircraft programs are much less so; and are an unproven assumption for which there is only poor evidence.
There is a benign interpretation, can you give a good reason for dismissing that? ('fast and furious' does not really qualify)
 
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