Giant Snowflakes [Rimed Dendrites]

[MikeG]

In keeping with the snowstorm that has engulfed my part of the country, a friend sent me this old post from Global Skywatch.

Strange Precipitation - Giant Snowflakes, Snow Blankets, Styrofoam Snow, Milky/Dirty Rain

Once again, we are seeing anomalies with snow that we've never seen before. Not since we've been alive have we seen anything like this. Giant, ornate snowflakes.

Is this the result of some kind of chemical nucleation process? Most likely it is.

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http://globalskywatch.com/chemtrails/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=15045#Post15045

Metabunk has covered “fake snow” claims in many, many threads.

https://www.metabunk.org/debunked-fake-snow-burning-snow.t3026/
https://www.metabunk.org/dane-wigington-nucleated-fake-snow-demystified.t3043/

I could not find any references to “giant snowflakes,” so I did a little research.

They are called dendrites

A crystal dendrite is a crystal that develops with a typical multi-branching tree-like form. Dendritic crystal growth is very common and illustrated by snowflake formation and frost patterns on a window. Dendritic crystallization forms a natural fractal pattern.

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dendrite_(crystal)

In fact, they are very beautiful.



http://www.noaa.gov/features/02_monitoring/snowflakes_2013.html

Anyway, back to shoveling!

 

[deirdre]

Nice @MikeG . seems to be a 'popular' subject with this storm too (at least NY area).

All snow falls roughly in this shape but it is not usually visible with the naked eye – these large ones are likely sector plates, which are snowflakes with cloud droplets frozen on them, forming a hexagonal structure often with a star-like shape in the centre.

When temperatures fall to -20 to -25C dendrite snowflakes form, the most eye-catching kind with a full tree-like structure. http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...e-falling-in-new-york-right-now-10005058.html

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i'm a little confused about if dendrites and sector plates are the same thing.




PDF attached isnt as old as it looks
http://www.oema.us/files/Snowflake_identification_manual.pdf

 

[deirdre]

Snowflakes that fall to the ground can vary in size from nearly perfect hexagonal prisms just 0.2 mm wide (called diamond dust) up to large ‘dendritic’ snow crystals of width 5 mm http://www.thenakedscientists.com/HTML/articles/article/science-of-snowflakes/

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edit: realized my ruler pic originally was confusing the issue.

 

[MikeG]

Nice @MikeG . seems to be a 'popular' subject with this storm too (at least NY area).

All snow falls roughly in this shape but it is not usually visible with the naked eye – these large ones are likely sector plates, which are snowflakes with cloud droplets frozen on them, forming a hexagonal structure often with a star-like shape in the centre.

When temperatures fall to -20 to -25C dendrite snowflakes form, the most eye-catching kind with a full tree-like structure. http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...e-falling-in-new-york-right-now-10005058.html

Content from external source

i'm a little confused about if dendrites and sector plates are the same thing.




PDF attached isnt as old as it looks
http://www.oema.us/files/Snowflake_identification_manual.pdf

Thank you.

I don't know anything about sector plates, but there seem to be quite a few resources available to find out.

http://www.its.caltech.edu/~atomic/snowcrystals/class/class-old.htm

 

[deirdre]

Thank you.

I don't know anything about sector plates, but there seem to be quite a few resources available to find out.

http://www.its.caltech.edu/~atomic/snowcrystals/class/class-old.htm

yea found this too, that might explain sizes more in depth.. but figure since you are the academic i'd let you figure it all out

Factors Affecting the Size Distribution of Raindrops and Snowflakes
TakeshiOhtake
Geophysical Institute, University of Alaska, College, Alaska
http://journals.ametsoc.org/doi/abs/10.1175/1520-0469(1970)027<0804:FATSDO>2.0.CO;2

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[MikeG]

yea found this too, that might explain sizes more in depth.. but figure since you are the academic i'd let you figure it all out

Factors Affecting the Size Distribution of Raindrops and Snowflakes
TakeshiOhtake
Geophysical Institute, University of Alaska, College, Alaska
http://journals.ametsoc.org/doi/abs/10.1175/1520-0469(1970)027<0804:FATSDO>2.0.CO;2

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Sure, give me all the work.

 

[JRBids]

I've noticed a lot of people never noticed snow is SPARKLY! They are saying it is pieces of metal.

 

[NoParty]

Everything is sadly mysteriously sinister--for some folks--these days.

But since there's always metal in the soil---even if there were no modern pollution--wouldn't
there always be some small amount of metal in rainfall...and snow?



ETA...oh, I just remembered your location: take care out there in NY after that storm!

 

[cloudspotter]

I've noticed a lot of people never noticed snow is SPARKLY! They are saying it is pieces of metal.

They've never walked in a winter wonderland and seen the snow glistening?

 

[Trailblazer]

I can't believe people don't know snowflakes are ornate six-sided stars. Haven't they ever seen the Frozen movie poster?

Seriously though, I often see snow crystals like this on my jacket and gloves while skiing, when it's very cold. Here in the UK what little snow we get tends to be the wet clumpy stuff, so you don't see them so often.

 

[deirdre]

I can't believe people don't know snowflakes are ornate six-sided stars. Haven't they ever seen the Frozen movie poster?

Seriously though, I often see snow crystals like this on my jacket and gloves while skiing, when it's very cold. Here in the UK what little snow we get tends to be the wet clumpy stuff, so you don't see them so often.

i think it's more the size (in OP pic for ex) that has people questioning. I've never noticed real live snowflakes looking like actual star snowflakes, but then i never zoomed into my knitted gloves to look at shapes.

 

[NoParty]

They've never walked in a winter wonderland and seen the snow glistening?

According to "Winter Wonderland," that snow has been glistening in the lane since at least 1934...
so believers may need to push the "beginning of 'chemtrails'" up, yet again.

I've always know dendrites were a thing (though we don't see a lot of snow here in SoCal), I must say,
when I first saw the pic in the OP, I thought some of those "snowflakes" looked pretty fake...
especially the big sweet one right in the middle of the pic.It and the one at 7 o'clock just look a little too perfect.

I read on Stormfront once that that (wait...for...it...) the Jews were behind "chemtrails"...
so the perfect little six-sided stars in the OP sure aren't gonna help!

 

[MikeG]

I read on Stormfront once that that (wait...for...it...) the Jews were behind "chemtrails"...
so the perfect little six-sided stars in the OP sure aren't gonna help!

Sad. But I wouldn't be surprised to see how various CT believers can articulate just what the "global power structure" means. It does give me an idea about the persistence of certain myths.

 

[MikeG]

Everything is sadly mysteriously sinister--for some folks--these days.

But since there's always metal in the soil---even if there were no modern pollution--wouldn't
there always be some small amount of metal in rainfall...and snow?



ETA...oh, I just remembered your location: take care out there in NY after that storm!

One of the earliest discussions that I read on Metabunk talked about this topic.

https://www.metabunk.org/chemical-composition-of-rain-and-snow-aluminum-barium-etc.t135/#post-12992

I knew practically nothing about it, but it wasn't that hard to get up to speed.

 

[deirdre]

The topic is "size of snowflakes" and what causes it. New topics in new threads.

 

[SR1419]

The topic is "size of snowflakes" and what causes it. New topics in new threads.

So....giant hail is off topic?? (dendtritic hailstones no less)

 

[Trailblazer]

i think it's more the size (in OP pic for ex) that has people questioning. I've never noticed real live snowflakes looking like actual star snowflakes, but then i never zoomed into my knitted gloves to look at shapes.

Pic of my ski jacket cuff. They'd melted/broken a little but you can see they were proper stars. Not as big, obviously, but I also saw plenty of the "fat" stars like the OP pic.

 

[MikeG]

So....giant hail is off topic?? (dendtritic hailstones no less)

Very Nice.

 

[Mick West]

I was quite surprised when I first saw actual hexagonal star shaped snowflakes for the first time a few years ago. Like with Trailblazer it was on my ski jacket. I never realized they were visible to the naked eye before - I previously thought the hexagonal structures were only visible with magnification. But of course if you actually look up snowflake sizes, they are quite visible when conditions are right.

https://www.google.com/search?biw=1170&bih=1105&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=snowflake+on+my+jacket

 

[Steve Funk]

This is a little off topic, but I just noticed the next to last line in the Canadian Journal Table, post #14, showing alkalinity values of 14 and higher. How is this possible? The scale normally used goes from 1 to 14, and I have never heard of values greater than 9 in the natural environment, unless it is industrial waste or volcanic.

 

[CapnPegleg]

This is a little off topic, but I just noticed the next to last line in the Canadian Journal Table, post #14, showing alkalinity values of 14 and higher. How is this possible? The scale normally used goes from 1 to 14, and I have never heard of values greater than 9 in the natural environment, unless it is industrial waste or volcanic.

Alkalinity is a quantitative measurement, not simply pH:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alkalinity

 

[Mick West]

This is a little off topic, but I just noticed the next to last line in the Canadian Journal Table, post #14, showing alkalinity values of 14 and higher. How is this possible? The scale normally used goes from 1 to 14, and I have never heard of values greater than 9 in the natural environment, unless it is industrial waste or volcanic.

It's ppm of CaCO3 here.

•Alkalinity of 14 p.p.m. is the equivalent neutralization power of a strong acid as a solution of 14p.p.m. CaCO3 at pH 4.7.

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[Mick West]

Minor update, this came up again on Twitter, so I looked it up in more detail, as the images of dendrites did not look exactly like the furry stars in the OP.

It turns out this sub-type is rimed dendrites (or rimed plates, there's some overlap). The "rimed" part means it's coated in this fur of much smaller ice crystals. At the simplest level this can be quite slight:

source: http://www.storyofsnow.com/blog6.php/more-snowflake-photographs-with-classifications

But can get fuzzier:


And fuzzier:


Source: http://www.atmos.washington.edu/~hakim/101/snowflakes/

 

[JFDee]

Isn't it also possible that some of the more plate-shaped forms are created by partial melting and re-freezing, e.g. when the flakes have passed a warmer layer of air?

 

[Mick West]

Isn't it also possible that some of the more plate-shaped forms are created by partial melting and re-freezing, e.g. when the flakes have passed a warmer layer of air?

That would create clear surfaced blob-like flakes, not white furry flakes. Although it's possible a snowflake might melt, refreeze, and then be subject to additional deposition and/or riming.

Regular snowflakes form from water vapor being deposited directly on the ice surface (i.e. gas to solid phase transition).

Riming happens when there are supercooled microdroplets of liquid water (i.e. a liquid cloud or fog at <0°C/32°F. The microdroplets collide with the much bigger snowflake and instantly freeze, coating it with the "fur".


Source: https://miscellaneousmeanderings.wordpress.com/2016/01/11/on-snowflakes-snow/