Debunked: Military Chemtrails On/Off [SU-30 Smoke Skywriting]

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
This video of four jets flying in formation proports to show some kind of "chemtrail" because what looks like a contrail starts and stops on two of the jets, but not the other two, and the on/off is at different times for each jet. This video was repurposed for a chemtrail video titled "ChemTrails 100% NOT DEBUNKABLE! I Challenge Pilots and DeBunkers to TRY to Discredit This Video!"


What's particularly interesting is that there's a gap between the engine and the trail, something that you normally only see with a contrail (as a contrail starts out as invisible water vapor). This gap initially led me to think it actually was a contrail, and the on/off was to something to do with power settings.


Luckily the video description gives the original source, "IAF SU 30K and French Mirages French India Air Exercise Garuda". (IAF is the Indian Air Force). This identifies the flight as part of a military exercise, and the twin-engined planes leaving the trails as Russian-made Sukhoi SU-30MIK jet fighters.

What we are actually seeing here is what has been described as the "party trick" of the SU-30, the ability to inject unburnt fuel into the exhaust plume via the afterburner system. The super hot air of the exhaust instantly evaporates the volatile fuel, and then when it mixes with the cold air behind the plane the fuel reforms as a fine mist, essentially a fuel smoke cloud. Because the jet engine exhaust is so hot and so fast, you get this noticeable gap while the fuel is in gaseous form.

The following video shows this in close-up at 1:370



The above photos show the initial narrow stream of liquid fuel right at the engine, then a transparent gap as the fuel is evaporated into invisible gas, and then the smoke trail formed by the fuel recondensing into liquid form again (as a fog of microscopic fuel drops that refract the light, like the water drops in a cloud do).

This is essentially the same technique used by skywriters. In normal sky-writing however, the plane is a prop plane, and the smoke comes out of the engine exhaust and has already started to condense, so you don't see the gap. Sky-writers generally use some kind of specific smoke oil for the purpose, like the one shown below (Hydrotreated Middle Distillate, aka Gasoil, aka C12-20 Isoparaffin). Pure kerosene (or a simple 50/50 kerosene/diesel mix) can also be used to make smoke, but would not be safe to use in a small plane, especially as the exhaust is usually at the front of the plane.


Here's a small plane with the smoke coming directly from the engine exhaust.


And here's a jet engined plane (Soko G-2 Galeb) with the smoke fuel being directly sprayed into the exhaust gasses. Notice it's initially a thin visible stream (as it's liquid) and then it rapidly evaporates. Here they can use pure kerosene (jet fuel) to create the smoke, or possible a 50/50 mix of kerosene and diesel.
http://achtungskyhawk.wordpress.com...tional-airshow-varazdin-11-12-07-2009-part-1/


Here's a photo the the G2, with the smoke trails, with gap. If you click on the image for the full size version, you can see the smoke fuel outlet, and the initial narrow spray of liquid fuel.
http://www.airliners.net/photo/STARS-Aerobatic-Team/Soko-G-2-Galeb/1367762/L/


The twin engined SU-30 from the original video is largely unique to the Indian Air Force, and regularly features in a flyover at the annual Republic Day Parade. Here you can see three SU-30s leaving the smoke trails just about 1,000 feet above the ground in hot New Delhi, so they are obviously not contrails, and you can see the distinctive gap.


And here (below) is a close-up of those same three planes. You can see the gap, and also quite a bit of variation, which will be to do with power settings and the flow of the unburnt smoke fuel.


What's interesting is that the gap only exists when pure fuel is used to create a white trail. The addition of other chemicals to create color means that the trail is visible instantly on exit from the engine. SU-30's don't seem to make colored trails, but here are some more Indian jets, showing the gap with the pure white smoke, and no gap with colored smoke.


(Thanks to @TWCobra, @Trigger Hippie, and others for helping me track down these photos and info.
 

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Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Some more technical detail regarding this SU-30 fuel dump / smoke system in this thread.
http://forum.keypublishing.com/show...-Aviation-thread-part-V&p=1771392#post1771392
On this particular aircraft/engine, the afterburner fuel pump & piping/injectors are used for emergency fuel dumping. It's just that the hot streak ignition system is not activated like when selecting the afterburner regime, and the fuel is blown out without burning.
Content from External Source
I checked the fuel system chapter from Su-27 flight manual, but unfortunately it doesn't say how many Kg/min can be dumped. It says among other things that fuel dumping will stop automatically when there's 1,500Kg left.
Nice.
So how fast can this Su-30 drain say 2000kg of fuel?
Is it equall with normal AB fuel consumption?
Content from External Source
Anyway, due to high flow any afterburner pump is capable (even more than the engine's automatics will ever ask for) IMO the fuel tanks can be emptied (if full) in a few minutes, using the maximum flow the pump is capable.
Content from External Source
This page is from AL-31 engine technical description book that is available for some years at airwar.ru.

Right before 11.2 begins, it would translate like “Afterburning fuel flow”: through II and III contour < 16,200 Kg/hr, through I and IV contour < 16,200 Kg/hr, through V contour < 3,600 Kg/hr.

Those “contours” are separate afterburner fuel lines with sprayers, on this engine there are 5 of them. So through all 5 of them there is possible a maximum fuel flow of 36,000Kg/hr. Taking this number as the fuel dump flow, with both engines afterburner fuel systems dumping the Su-27’s entire 9,400Kg of fuel would be dumped in 7.83 min.

For anybody thinking that for this particular engine, emergency fuel dump using afterburner fuel system is just a theory – it is not. It is a fact that can be checked easily in the book I took the page from. It clearly states that FN-31A afterburner pump is used for afterburner operation AND for emergency fuel dump.
Content from External Source
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
I OCRed and Google-translated the above, and got:

Глава II. ТСЩИВНАЯ СИСТЕМА

11.1. Общая характеристика топливной система

Топливная система двигателя предназначена для подачи топ
лива к рабочим форсункам в количествах, обеспечивающих запуск и
.работу двигателя на всех режимах, во всех условиях эксплуатация.
Основное : ■:-■■; системы

Сорта применяемых теплив:

Основное РТ ГОСТ 16504-71; Резервное 1-1, ТС-1 ГОСТ 10327-63. Температура топлив на входе в двигатель: РГ - 50 + ЕС°С Т-1, ТС-1 - 50 + 60°С. Тонкость фильтрация 16.,.25мкм. Производительность павооа ДЦН-33 77,000 м3/ч. Частота вращения наоооа ДЦН-83 8000 об/иди. Давлениз топлива на входе в НР-31В 0.43...ЦХО МПа

(4,4...1,1 Шв/ОЛ2). Давление топлива на выхода из НР-Э1В < Э,32 мПа. Давление топлива ва входе в РТ-ЭГБ 6 8,83 МПа. Расход основного топлива через; I воятур -* 750 кг/ч; И контур й 9000 кг/ч. Давление топлива ва входе в ФВ-Э1А 0,43...С,1С8 Ше

(4,4...1,1 кгс/ои2).

Давление топлива на выходе из 1Н-31А 6,85 Ша 170 кто/он2).

Частота враикния ^Н-31А 11>„0, = 26906 об/мон.

Расход форсажного топлива: через Л и Ш контур 4 16300 яг/ч,

через I и П контур й16200 кг/ч,

через У контур ^ 36С0 кг/ч.

11.2. Состав и устройство топливной системы
Топливная сиатема включает: топливную систему низкого давле
ния, основную топлизнув систему, топливную систему.йорсакнсй ка
меры, дренахнуе систему, систему аварийного слива топлива.
Принцип нал ьная схема топливной системы приведена на рис. ИЛ.

Топливная система низкого давления предназначена для яовше-
Content from External Source

Chapter II. TSSCHIVNAYA SYSTEM
11.1 . General characteristics of the fuel system
Engine fuel system is designed to supply top ¬
Lebanon by working injectors in amounts to provide start-up and
. motor operation in all modes , in all operating conditions.
Main : ■: - ■ ■; system
Grades apply heat :
GOST 16504-71 Main RT ; Backing 1-1 , TS-1 GOST 10327-63 . Low fuel entering the engine: RG - 50 + EU ° C T-1, TS-1 - 50 + 60 ° C. Fineness 16. , .25 Microns. Performance pavooa DCN -33 77,000 m3 / h Speed naoooa DCN -83 8000 / Come. Davleniz fuel inlet in the HP- 31B 0.43 MPa CCO ...
( 4.4 ... 1.1 Shv/OL2 ) . Fuel pressure at the output of the HP- E1V < E , 32 MPa. Pressure fuel inlet wa PT EGB 6 8.83 MPa. Flow through the main fuel ; I voyatur - * 750 kg / h and the second circuit 9000 kg / h The fuel pressure in the PV input va - E1A 0.43 ... C 1S8 Shae
( 4.4 ... 1.1 kgs/oi2 ) .
Fuel pressure at the outlet of the 1H -31A 6.85 Sha kto/on2 170 ) .
Frequency vraikniya ^ H -31A 11 > "0 = 26906 rev / Mon .
Afterburner fuel consumption: through L and W circuit 4 16300 Hr / h
through I and II circuit y16200 kg / h ,
Do loop through ^ 36S0 kg / h
11.2. The composition and device of the fuel system
Fuel siatema include: low pressure fuel system ¬
tion , the main topliznuv system , fuel sistemu.yorsaknsy ka ¬
measures drenahnue systems, emergency draining fuel.
Principle cash te fuel system diagram is shown in Fig . IL .
The fuel system is designed for low pressure yaovshe -
Content from External Source
 

TEEJ

Senior Member.
Another Indian Air Force type that has a "party trick" is the HAL/SEPECAT Jaguar. See from 04:03 on the following video. MiG-29s follow demonstrating their notoriously smokey engines. Su-30s appear at 05:00 with their "party trick".


The twin-engined HAL/SEPECAT Jaguar fuel jettison pipe is located at the base of the tail fin. (The elevated pipe)





From

http://www.aame.in/2013/01/indian-military-hardware-displayed-at.html



From

http://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/70916-sepecat-jaguar/page-2
 
Thats the first time I have heard chemtrails being called a party trick, how amusing, again you havent been able to successfully debunk this one, once again BUSTED!
 

George B

Extinct but not forgotten Staff Member
Thats the first time I have heard chemtrails being called a party trick, how amusing, again you havent been able to successfully debunk this one, once again BUSTED!
Seems it is very obvious and not much of a secret. How would then an entire fleet of aircraft across the planet get away with such tricks ?
 

Bill

Senior Member.
Thats the first time I have heard chemtrails being called a party trick, how amusing, again you havent been able to successfully debunk this one, once again BUSTED!
It may shock you but without producing any evidence to the contrary your pronouncements that topics haven't been debunked are inane.
 

TEEJ

Senior Member.
Thats the first time I have heard chemtrails being called a party trick, how amusing, again you havent been able to successfully debunk this one, once again BUSTED!

So you are claiming that Indian Su-30s don't dump fuel to create their "party trick"?. Did you watch the videos on this thread?
 

WeedWhacker

Senior Member
Thats the first time I have heard chemtrails being called a party trick, how amusing, again you havent been able to successfully debunk this one, once again BUSTED!

They are not "chemtrails" (as the particular Urban Legend defines them, nowadays).

But, to be precise, if I walk down the hallway and fart, I leave a "chemtrail" of sorts. Just, invisible to the Human eye. Which leads me to this:

If "chemtrails" are real, Why In The World Are They So Visible?
 

KC-10FE

Senior Member.
Thats the first time I have heard chemtrails being called a party trick, how amusing, again you havent been able to successfully debunk this one, once again BUSTED!

Yeah, perhaps you should call up the USAF Thunderbirds and Navy Blue Angels demo teams and file a complaint, telling them they are chemtrailing during every one of their shows. You would give them a good laugh for sure!

superdelta-600x398.jpg

blue-angels-formation-02.jpg
 

TWCobra

Senior Member.
Yes, chemtrailing in front of millions of people during a season of air shows. As Daffy Duck would say.... "Devilishly clever...."
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
A little more about the Blue Angels:

http://aerobaticteams.net/blue-angels.html
Secondly, the airplanes used by the "Blue Angels" are equipped with smoke generators to better highlight the maneuvers as well as for better tracking of one aircraft to another. The smoke generators work on following basis: paraffin-based oil is injected through a special nozzle placed in the exhaust plume (on the left exhaust nozzle). This causes the immediate formation of white smoke.
Content from External Source
This can be seen here, on the top of the left nozzle:


and here:
 
They are not "chemtrails" (as the particular Urban Legend defines them, nowadays).

But, to be precise, if I walk down the hallway and fart, I leave a "chemtrail" of sorts. Just, invisible to the Human eye. Which leads me to this:

If "chemtrails" are real, Why In The World Are They So Visible?
Not if you light it, WW! :p
 

TEEJ

Senior Member.
The latest from Max on his Facebook.

upload_2016-2-7_20-28-26.png

Max still deluding himself over WW2 contrails.

upload_2016-2-7_20-30-54.png
 

Gridlock

Senior Member.
FWIW I visited the Red Arrows once upon a time, and was told the fancy chemical they use to produce the colours was called "biro ink".
 

TWCobra

Senior Member.
Max is fixated on the use of water injection as a means of creating a contrail.

It is a self-defeating argument as it admits that water in aircraft exhaust is responsible for contrails, and we know that the combustion of aviation fuel creates large amounts of water.

The use of ADI was limited to takeoff in larger aircraft, and about 5 minutes when used to boost combat power in smaller fighter aircraft.

I think there is one BAC-111 still flying in the world. They used water injection on takeoff, but it may be the only aircraft left that actually uses it.
 

TEEJ

Senior Member.
I agree he is fixated on water injection. Here is his latest "research". He can't understand why the Superfortress mother ship (US Navy P2B) is producing contrails and the chase F-86F Sabre isn't.

 

Balance

Senior Member.
I wonder if Max is finally conceding some (debunked) points as he appears to be calling them contrails nowadays.
 

WeedWhacker

Senior Member
Ummm......"DisInfo"? Is "Max Bliss" still relevant? "Max Bliss' used the term "contrails"? Because, that is what they are....CONdensation TRAILS......simple H2O......water ice.....
 

Hartski

New Member
What's interesting is that the gap only exists when pure fuel is used to create a white trail. The addition of other chemicals to create color means that the trail is visible instantly on exit from the engine. SU-30's don't seem to make colored trails, but here are some more Indian jets, showing the gap with the pure white smoke, and no gap with colored smoke.


(Thanks to @TWCobra, @Trigger Hippie, and others for helping me track down these photos and info.

Just been watching a rather excellent doc on the beeb (Britain's ultimate pilots: inside the RAF. Ep2) this episode followed an airshow which featured a Red Arrow full display. You could clearly see gaps to the white trails compared to the coloured ones. Will try and grab a screenshot.
 

TEEJ

Senior Member.
Russian Air Force Sukhoi 35 making a close pass on Russian Air Force Sukhoi 30 over Syria. The Su-35 is dumping fuel into the exhaust.

upload_2017-12-15_0-32-17.png


 

TEEJ

Senior Member.
Footage doing the rounds as "The Fastest Chemtrail Ever!". Original video is reversed/mirrored.

upload_2017-12-15_10-21-40.png
From

 
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