Debunked: Ghost car seems to appear out of nowhere! [Illusion]

From the angle the car would seem to be making a u turn from the 2nd turn lane and cutting
off the other car. But it would have been at least partially visible as the cars started to turn.
 

WeedWhacker

Senior Member
Angles, and illusion then?

Makes sense. This was accidental, compared to the way that movies use a similar technique (not needing to involve optical special effects).

But, it is counter-intuitive in a way.

Here's something similar:

The "disappearance" is near the end. I once saw the explanation, in a YT video, but cannot find it now :(

Essentially, a chain link fence when "pushed through" by a car will flip up, allow the car to drive under, then flop back down and appear to be "intact" afterwards. This presumes that the vertical fence posts on the the side where the car approaches, and the small clips that secure the chain-link just snap off. Kinda like a pet-door flap.
 
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Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
I think the effect is magnified a little by the ghost car swerving to avoid the front car, and so it's faced more towards the camera than if it went straight through, then he's trying to turn the other way, so the back end of the car hits the front car. All just a coincidence of angles.

Or perhaps a dimensional portal. :)
 

derwoodii

Senior Member.
The A pillars on modern cars have designed evolved to be big thick sloped racked and with large mirror reducing practical vision of seeing approaching from your front sides beyond safe. Wait till the tort lawyers figure it out.
Ask any motor cyclist, they look but can not see.
 

Trigger Hippie

Senior Member.
I have a slightly different take on it. I decide to put a short bout of insomnia to some use and learned some PowerDirector last night. Apologies for the poor video resolution.

 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
I have a slightly different take on it. I decide to put a short bout of insomnia to some use and learned some PowerDirector last night. Apologies for the poor video resolution.


Looks somewhat plausible, but wouldn't the ghost have to jump over the raised grassy area, and also avoid the sign?

I wish the actual intersection could be identified, as it would make figuring out possibilities easier.
 

Trigger Hippie

Senior Member.
Looks somewhat plausible, but wouldn't the ghost have to jump over the raised grassy area, and also avoid the sign?

Actually that's one of the scenarios I was considering, but couldn't really see any damage to the bushes.

It looks like there is an open lane to the left of the left most stopped car. I'm thinking the ghost car (car #2) used it to enter the intersection.

gc1.png
 
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Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Actually that's one of the scenarios I was considering, but couldn't really see any damage to the bushes.

It looks like there is an open lane to the left of the left most stopped car. Approximately where the arrow is pointing. I'm thinking the ghost car used it to enter the intersection.

At the start of your video, the second of the two cars in the back (the one you say is the ghost car), seems to be turning as if it's going behind the round building, now going straight.


Which would explain why it does not show up.
 

Trigger Hippie

Senior Member.
At the start of your video, the second of the two cars in the back (the one you say is the ghost car), seems to be turning as if it's going behind the round building, now going straight.

Ya, car #2 could just be following the same path as car #1 and slowed for some other reason. Unfortunately the first car seems to have his daytime running lights on and car #2 is using his night headlights. So it's hard to use them for a comparison.

I've had no luck identifying the intersection.
 

jonnyH

Senior Member.
Jonny, how the heck did you find that?

I did a google video search for "машина призрак," no idea what it means but its in the title of the clip in the OP. The search pulled up the clip on some Russian sites so I copied the comments into google translate and looked for some mention of an address.

I got lucky.
 

NoParty

Senior Member.
I did a google video search for "машина призрак," no idea what it means but its in the title of the clip in the OP. The search pulled up the clip on some Russian sites so I copied the comments into google translate and looked for some mention of an address.

I got lucky.
Nicely done.

(when I googled "машина призрак," all I got was: "Backward иs and 3s in our words...our signs look silly...no wonder we lost the Cold War!")
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
So it think this would be the POV of the "ghost" car.


It's dark and raining. The lane ahead is clear, and there's the green light at the pedestrian crossing, and they register that, but not the red light a short distance ahead. They see the cross traffic has stopped. They don't see that there's a turn arrow for the oncoming traffic, and they can't see it because it's obscured by the tram.

There isn't a fourth lane (just a wider right lane), and the grassy kerbed area make Trigger's scenario seem unlikely to me - unless the driver was particularly crazy, which is of course possible.

 

Pete Tar

Senior Member.
Found an article that explains the prevalence of Russian footage of awful driving, as I was curious.

http://www.carenvy.ca/2013/09/russians-really-bad-driving/
On your average Russian commute you are likely to see: close tailgating, abrupt lane changes without signalling, driving between lanes, disregard for traffic signs, disregard for traffic lights, crossing over the double solid line, and, of course, extreme — and I mean extreme — speeding. So, it isn’t just a disregard for the traffic rules. It’s more of a disregard for the elemental norms of safety.

You are probably thinking: this doesn’t make sense. What about the self-preservation instinct?

You are right, of course. None of the people you see doing stupid things in the videos actually intend to die. The answer lies in a unique cultural phenomenon known as avos’.

Avos’ roughly translates into English as “on the off-chance”, but it doesn’t quite capture the true meaning of the word (that the English language does not have a direct equivalent is in itself quite telling). It is a generic expression of fatalism that basically means: “I know I’m doing something very risky/against the rules, but I think it’ll be okay.”
...
The Avos’ approach, perhaps better described as “the gut approach“, is more common in the Eastern cultures and, specifically, in Russia. Its main postulate is: rules are rules, but I think I know better. There is no way the guy who wrote the rulebook could foresee everything. You go with your gut, rather than the rules.
...
Unfortunately, the Avos’ approach also carries a significant downside: most of the time, the I-know-better attitude just doesn’t work. Quite simply, completely unforeseen emergencies do not happen all that often in real life. And if they do, in many cases there are fifteen different rules that can help prevent the situation altogether.

The Avos’ approach therefore usually results in either miraculous salvations or great catastrophes, with little middle ground in between. It is rarely consistent. Meanwhile, a person following the procedural approach may not make the impossible saves the gut guy will, but at least he will be consistent in achieving a decent, “safe” result. If you graph it, it looks something like this:


Content from External Source
 
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WeedWhacker

Senior Member
Found an article that explains the prevalence of Russian footage of awful driving, as I was curious.

My understanding of the Russian prevalence to dash-cameras was slightly more prosaic: Insurance. Specifically, false claims.

Like this:

And this: (Ultra hilarious)

Many more examples are extant.

( On an interesting side-note....not a "chem"trail in view!! ;) )
 

NoParty

Senior Member.
D'oh!



I initially tried to post a 6 second clip (from my dash cam) here...first at 1080, then 720, then 480...but since it wasn't linked to YouTube I decided it was too big...I'm no tech whiz
 
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Pete Tar

Senior Member.
Yeah the article did go into that as well. There is a bit of selection bias in that there are a lot more dash-cams in Russia compared to other countries, but there is a reality to the wildness of Russian driving as well.
 

Trigger Hippie

Senior Member.
It's dark and raining. The lane ahead is clear, and there's the green light at the pedestrian crossing, and they register that, but not the red light a short distance ahead. They see the cross traffic has stopped. They don't see that there's a turn arrow for the oncoming traffic, and they can't see it because it's obscured by the tram.

There isn't a fourth lane (just a wider right lane), and the grassy kerbed area make Trigger's scenario seem unlikely to me - unless the driver was particularly crazy, which is of course possible.

Ya, the green light and no forth lane is making your scenario sound better. Wonder what happened to the second car? Hope they didn't drive down that stairwell off to the right in the first picture.
 

WeedWhacker

Senior Member
Do we know the direction of the camera car? I mean, from the Google maps images, the overhead is usually oriented North Up.

The intersection has four possible approaches. (The buildings in the camera car footage will help to provide orientation) (?)
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
whats the yelling at the end? the ca
Ya, the green light and no forth lane is making your scenario sound better. Wonder what happened to the second car? Hope they didn't drive down that stairwell off to the right in the first picture.
speaking of..does Canada still have its stop lights on the wrong side of the intersection? I still cant believe I didn't kill anybody.
 

Trigger Hippie

Senior Member.
So it think this would be the POV of the "ghost" car.

It's dark and raining. The lane ahead is clear, and there's the green light at the pedestrian crossing, and they register that, but not the red light a short distance ahead.

Granted, but there is a similar green light on the opposite side... in the "fourth lane".

2a.png



There isn't a fourth lane (just a wider right lane), and the grassy kerbed area make Trigger's scenario seem unlikely to me - unless the driver was particularly crazy, which is of course possible.

It is true that there is no fourth lane, however the third lane is almost double wide.

3a.png

Judging from the wear on the stop line, it looks like that part of the road is used often.

3c.png

That stop light poses a problem to the fourth lane theory. The driver would have had to ignore it completely.
 
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Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Here's the layout of the cars just after impact, with the ghost car in green, and two possible entry points in dim green. Camera car is in blue.



I'm still voting for the empty lane by the train, as it seems like the most direct route, and is consistent with the motion of the ghost car after the impact.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
And here's what I think it was shortly before, with the blue area being the field of view of the camera, and the magenta area being the region obscured by the BMW:
 
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