Crisis Actors.

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AluminumTheory

Senior Member.
This seems to be the go to conspiracy theory now for pretty much any disaster. I personally never heard the term until Sandy Hook, but like many CTs, I would guess that it's origins go back further.

TBH, I have never looked into them in depth, mostly because I find them ridiculous. All you have to do now is find a guy who kinda looks like another guy and voila! You have a crisis actor conspiracy theory.

I recently stumbled across this page, http://www.wellaware1.com/. The author seems to believe that everybody, and I MEAN EVERYBODY is an actor.....
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Crisis actors are a real thing though, there actually are actors used in drills to pretend to be injured.

Unfortunately in the Conspiracy Theory world, the term now only used to refer to people who are secretly acting in a fake situation that the powers that be are trying to pass off as real.

http://crisisactors.org/

wellaware1 is Ed Chiarini, he's been mentioned here before several time in connection with the Sandy Hook shooting. See:

https://www.metabunk.org/threads/de...-laura-phelps-actors-jennifer-greenberg.1231/
 
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AluminumTheory

Senior Member.
Well to be clear, I knew that there were such a thing at crisis actors, but I had never heard of any conspiracy theories involving them until Sandy Hook.
 

David Fraser

Senior Member.
Well to be clear, I knew that there were such a thing at crisis actors, but I had never heard of any conspiracy theories involving them until Sandy Hook.

I may be wrong but I think it all started with James Tracy, a lecturer at Florida University. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/08/fau-professor-newtown-massacre-james-tracy_n_2428898.html

It really is a ridiculous claim and fails at most levels. At the end of the day actors are not well known for their discretion are they? ;)
 

Josh Heuer

Active Member
Actors aren't known for discretion, sure, but it's a whole different ball park when signing a government contract. It's not like they can just go around talking about what they do. FEMA has plenty of employees in this field; it's for emergency preparedness. Disaster training. Whether there's involvement in actual events such as Boston has yet to be proven. Why people are so certain these people are actors without credible evidence is beyond me. I'm not saying it's not a possibility; it's just a leap.
 

Landru

Moderator
Staff member
Actors aren't known for discretion, sure, but it's a whole different ball park when signing a government contract. It's not like they can just go around talking about what they do. FEMA has plenty of employees in this field; it's for emergency preparedness. Disaster training. Whether there's involvement in actual events such as Boston has yet to be proven. Why people are so certain these people are actors without credible evidence is beyond me. I'm not saying it's not a possibility; it's just a leap.

Do you have any proof that FEMA has any employees in this field? FEMA has guidelines for local agencies hiring said employees but zero employees working for FEMA unless you can show proof.
 

Josh Heuer

Active Member
Proof? Go to their site. They have job listings right on there.
Not to mention they have videos on YouTube showing how they set up 'hyper-real' scenarios to train first responders for preparedness. I'm posting from my phone so it's harder to link things, but basically google FEMA and go to their site and poke around the career section. Or go to YouTube and look for their videos. Easy to find.
 

David Fraser

Senior Member.
Actors aren't known for discretion, sure, but it's a whole different ball park when signing a government contract. It's not like they can just go around talking about what they do. FEMA has plenty of employees in this field; it's for emergency preparedness. Disaster training. Whether there's involvement in actual events such as Boston has yet to be proven. Why people are so certain these people are actors without credible evidence is beyond me. I'm not saying it's not a possibility; it's just a leap.
No, it is not a leap, it is total crap. What are the government asking them to do? Role play one televised scenario and then give up their career for the rest of their life in case they get spotted? Some idiot in Florida puts the idea out there and suddenly you have people stroking their chins and thinking mmm?
 

David Fraser

Senior Member.
I sometimes volunteer for a game in the UK called 2.8 hours later. http://8hourslater.com/how-to-play You know it is a little suspect. Why have all these actors that can play zombies and never make use of them. Is this a cunning plot to get the population acclimatised to the realities that we will become a zombie nation if they start fluoridating the water, installing smart meters or introducing GM food?
 

Cairenn

Senior Member.
And I research and often dress up as a lady from 10th century Ireland. There are thousands of us that do that and similar hobbies. Are we being 'trained' to live in the middle ages or the Old West?
 

Josh Heuer

Active Member
What are you guys even talking about? None of this is really relevant to crisis actors, sounds to me like you're just poking fun at the idea. These guys act in hyper real situations to help train first responders to do their jobs efficiently. If you are making fun of them, maybe you should be poking fun at the fools who sign up and go to war and risk their lives. At least these folks aren't putting themselves in danger in the name of 'freedom'
Maybe actors aren't involved in things like the Boston attacks. But it's because of these folks that first responders are better able to do their jobs and save actual lives. They're moreso heroes than some guy in a foreign country with guns killing people.
 

Josh Heuer

Active Member
For what? Believing in a real thing that exists? Are you guys against outsiders in this forum? I think some people here may be a little bias.
 

Cairenn

Senior Member.
Where is YOUR evidence that 'crisis actors' were used in Newtown or Boston or anywhere AFTER something happened?

You claimed that FEMA hired them and then didn't give any evidence.

Volunteers are often used for training drills.

Try Googling disaster drills volunteers and you will get pages

ttps://www.google.com/search?q=disaster+drill+volunteers&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:eek:fficial&client=firefox-a

It seems that governments aren't the only groups that do disaster drills and that use volunteers, other non profits do that as well.


http://www.click2houston.com/news/d...food-bank/-/1735978/20586220/-/xmnke6/-/index

http://www.prweb.com/releases/2013/5/prweb10759836.htm


Volunteering to help in a disaster drill is not the same as being a 'crisis actor'.

There are some 'crisis actors'

http://crisisactors.org/

Please read that page, they are not what you seem to think they are.
 

MikeC

Closed Account
For what? Believing in a real thing that exists? Are you guys against outsiders in this forum? I think some people here may be a little bias.

for believing in a conspiracy theory that has no good evidence to support it of course - what did you expect after all the silly claims have been debunked and you keep on with it?
 

Landru

Moderator
Staff member
For what? Believing in a real thing that exists? Are you guys against outsiders in this forum? I think some people here may be a little bias.

Can you provide evidence that FEMA hires crisis actors? Remember, FEMA is not a first responder agency and therefore would not train at that level.
 

MikeC

Closed Account
They train all the time, here is the calendar.

http://www.ct.gov/demhs/ical/calendar.asp

none of which are first responder training that I can see

Let's check the date in question:

12/14 9 AM - 4 PM
FEMA L-366 Planning for the Needs of Children in Disasters
Location: 2800 Main Street, Bridgeport, CT

http://www.ct.gov/demhs/ical/eventDetail_page.asp?date_ID=CAC9C6C9CD83CDC9C7

Also not first responder training:

 

Tazmanian

Account Closed
With all that training on how to keep children safe in the event of an emergency, you would think they would do a better job.

There are too many unanswered questions. Why? This is not a national security case, there's nothing to hide, so why not use this information to keep other schools safe? Why are there no photos released from the crime scene? The lone shooter is dead, so it's not like there's a trial coming up where a jury may be tainted.

I'm not trying to derail the thread from crisis actors, but if I may, can someone please answer these questions?

1. How did he get in the building?
He couldn't shoot through the door because the glass has a metal screen in the glass. Go to any school and look at their doors. Why not look at the evidence of this entry and make sure other schools learn from this experience? Do we need to change all the doors?

2. What about the gun in the trunk?
Did you see the video of them handling the gun? Is this any way to treat a crime scene? What exactly do they train about crime scene investigation?

3. How did they identify the kids?
By showing photos of their faces? What faces? They were shot multiple times. The kids were huddling together, but he carefully shot them and left their faces intact?

4. Why did the coroner not know anything about the bodies?
He didn't know how many were boys, how many were girls, he didn't even know what kind of bullets were used. What kind of coroner is this?
 

Cairenn

Senior Member.
Isn't there a thread or two or 3 where all those points have been discussed?

It seem that when it is shown that a poster's of what crisis actors are, they retreat to a short Gish Gallop that is unrelated to the subject.
 

MikeC

Closed Account
With all that training on how to keep children safe in the event of an emergency, you would think they would do a better job.

"all that training"?? A course for communities to help kids is "all that training"??

Do you expect the community volunteers or disaster workers to be perfect or something? It is training - if it improves what would have happened before such training then it is a success - expecting perfection is just setting up a strawman!
 

Tazmanian

Account Closed
Isn't there a thread or two or 3 where all those points have been discussed?

It seem that when it is shown that a poster's of what crisis actors are, they retreat to a short Gish Gallop that is unrelated to the subject.

FYI crisis actors are at the site of the first blast. The second blast are the real injuries, so no photos.



 
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Pete Tar

Senior Member.
This is fucked.

edit..
I mean, I do not see the point of this and it seems to unnecessarily mock victims in a way that makes me wonder about the failure of basic empathy in certain segments of the population.
 

Tazmanian

Account Closed
What you link to is not evidence that FEMA is a first responder. FEMA sponsors training.

I'm not sure why it matters whether FEMA is a first responder or not, but for clarification:

Community Emergency Response Team or CERT step in to provide aide to people who find themselves in any type of disaster.

The CERT program is part of FEMA.

http://www.turnto23.com/news/local-...unity-safe-during-emergency-situations-070713


One of the primary ways the federal government supports first responders is through Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) grant programs, which fund a range of emergency preparedness and response activities

http://price.house.gov/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=2502&Itemid=100251
 

Tazmanian

Account Closed
I won't post the photo of the guy with his legs blown off, since some people may find it offensive. However, where is the tourniquet? Why is he not on a stretcher? Why did a woman with fewer injuries get a stretcher and got carried out first? This one:

 
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David Fraser

Senior Member.
Tazmanian. In the first picture the areas of injury are obscured in your photograph, although you can clearly see her jacket is damaged, and what was the time of the photograph as compared to the second? Much of what seems to be on this poor ladys face are smears and finger marks. As to the poor lady on the stretcher, who knows? Disaster areas are very confusing areas and notoriously difficult to manage. A medic made a call, simple as that.

As to a tourniquet. Why would one be needed? Don't tell me. You have seen it on a film. This is not fucked up,
[...], along with that list of tragedies you posted.
 

Tazmanian

Account Closed
Tazmanian. In the first picture the areas of injury are obscured in your photograph, although you can clearly see her jacket is damaged, and what was the time of the photograph as compared to the second? Much of what seems to be on this poor ladys face are smears and finger marks. As to the poor lady on the stretcher, who knows? Disaster areas are very confusing areas and notoriously difficult to manage. A medic made a call, simple as that.

As to a tourniquet. Why would one be needed? Don't tell me. You have seen it on a film. This is not fucked up, you are fucked up, along with that list of tragedies you posted.

I could take you frame by frame, but it's even more graphic. If you're really interested, feel free to google it, it's all there.

"A medic made a call, simple as that."

That's just it, medics are trained to triage, which means they attend to the most severe injuries first. The guy with his legs blown off is clearly a priority.

This is a photo of a real person, not an actor, and the AP has no sales agreement with him, so it can only be used in an editorial.


Compared to this photo, which is available for sale.



Source: Associated Press
http://bigstory.ap.org/article/two-explosions-boston-marathon-finish-line-0
 
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Pete Tar

Senior Member.
What segment of the population would that be? The segment that asks questions?
No, the segment that takes a photo, puts arrows and question marks on it and thinks that is a valid investigation. I've seen work stuck to fridges that has more intellectual merit.
 

David Fraser

Senior Member.
I could take you frame by frame, but it's even more graphic. If you're really interested, feel free to google it, it's all there.

"A medic made a call, simple as that."

That's just it, medics are trained to triage, which means they attend to the most severe injuries first. The guy with his legs blown off is clearly a priority.

This is a photo of a real person, not an actor, and the AP has no sales agreement with him, so it can only be used in an editorial.


Compared to this photo, which is available for sale.



Source: Associated Press
http://bigstory.ap.org/article/two-explosions-boston-marathon-finish-line-0

Do you know anything about casualty simulation? Do you know the time and materials necessary to put such injuries in place? To give that lady the injuries would take 20 to 30 minutes, never mind the poor sod with his lower legs blown off.

Why is the guy with his legs blown of a priority? Do you know what injuries the lady on the stretcher may have. How do you know she is not suffering from overpressure injuries, internal or skeletal? I certainly can't tell. Also while triage may well mean that the most serious injuries are treated first it does not mean that others are left. Don't forget you want to get those with lesser injuries out of the way. Is evacuation not a priority in triage? A medic has made a call with this lady, as simple as that.
 
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Tazmanian

Account Closed
Is evacuation not a priority in triage? A medic has made a call with this lady, as simple as that.

No, evacuation is not a priority over someone bleeding out. Well, since the medic made that call, it should be fine then. If you were the guy bleeding out, you would be fine with that call, since the medic made it. Right?
 

David Fraser

Senior Member.
No, evacuation is not a priority over someone bleeding out. Well, since the medic made that call, it should be fine then. If you were the guy bleeding out, you would be fine with that call, since the medic made it. Right?
Is the guy bleeding out? Would he have to be bleeding out, especially given the blood supply to the lower leg. To interprete a photo he certainly seems to have a high GCS, so how severe is his blood loss? How do you know the woman on the stretcher does NOT have a barotrauma? Obviously you know the priorities of triage and is not breathing the first issue? Can you discount that for the lady on the stretcher?

So first question. What injuries does the lady on the stretcher potentially have? I recommend you read up about primary blast injuries.
 

David Fraser

Senior Member.

You tell me. The guy with the traumatic amputation seems to be stable and the bleeding has stopped, possibly due to the contraction of the muscles.

May I ask what experience you have of triage and blast trauma? Also I presume that in your training you have come into contact with casualty simulation so can you tell me exactly what would be required, well as the time required, to produce an injury like the poor bloke with the traumatic amputation, especially given the lower leg has been degloved.
 

Cairenn

Senior Member.
I for one am sick and tired of folks that make up and that 'buy into' harmful, damaging tales like 'crisis actors'.

Not all explosive amputations 'bleed out'. If they did, we would have a lot less vets coming home without limbs.

http://www.royonrescue.com/2013/05/why-wouldnt-someone-bleed-much-after-a-traumatic-amputation/


http://quinazagga.wordpress.com/2013/04/27/more-hoaxes-and-fake-news-and-hoax-creation/


 
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