COVID-19 Coronavirus current events

Here in South Africa, as a 50+er, I got my first Pfizer shot today :) . The vax is also being rolled out to teachers and the police services (but not my younger academic colleagues). 60+ and health workers are already vaccinated by now.

Our third wave has just surpassed our second (our population size being 60 million).

1625499750076.png

i'm glad you were finally able to get it. so many poorer countries are stuck waiting and waiting. just take it easy for a few days afterwards. no heavy exercise. and of course get your 2nd shot when required.
 
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JMartJr

Senior Member
Having gotten covid vaccinated, and being in a Let's Not Get Sick Needlessly head-space, I got dose 1 of the Shingrix vaccine against shingles the other day. It interested me that while I had almost no reaction to the Covid vax, the shingles jab kicked my but for about 36 hours. If I was conspiracy-minded I'd probably be convinced that some tech billionaire was out to get me.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Having gotten covid vaccinated, and being in a Let's Not Get Sick Needlessly head-space, I got dose 1 of the Shingrix vaccine against shingles the other day. It interested me that while I had almost no reaction to the Covid vax, the shingles jab kicked my but for about 36 hours. If I was conspiracy-minded I'd probably be convinced that some tech billionaire was out to get me.
I just got that too. Sore arm for a day, but less than the second Moderna.
 

DavidB66

Active Member
Having gotten covid vaccinated, and being in a Let's Not Get Sick Needlessly head-space, I got dose 1 of the Shingrix vaccine against shingles the other day. It interested me that while I had almost no reaction to the Covid vax, the shingles jab kicked my but for about 36 hours. If I was conspiracy-minded I'd probably be convinced that some tech billionaire was out to get me.
Individual differences. I've had two doses of Pfizer, with no side effects either time other than a sore arm for a few days, which you would probably get if someone stuck a needle in your arm anyway. Then my doctor rang up and said 'would you like a shingles vaccine? someone just pulled out of an appointment.' I didn't even know there was a shingles vaccine, but I jumped at the offer, as shingles can be nasty at my (unspecified) age. I hardly even got a sore arm. In fact, the only mildly annoying jab I've had was one for flu last year, which gave me a sore arm for about a week. But real side effects - fever, weakness, etc - I seem to be immune. I just hope this isn't a sign that the vaccines aren't working!
 

econ41

Senior Member
My wife and I had our second AstraZeneca "shot" on Saturday - our GP's staff running a production line and following the aged based priorities of the AU federal program. I had zero effects either time. She felt tired and slept a few hours both occasions. Safety of AZ has been a minor bit of a contentious issue here in AU - never concerned either of us - we understand the stats.
 

CarolynD

New Member
Having gotten covid vaccinated, and being in a Let's Not Get Sick Needlessly head-space, I got dose 1 of the Shingrix vaccine against shingles the other day. It interested me that while I had almost no reaction to the Covid vax, the shingles jab kicked my but for about 36 hours. If I was conspiracy-minded I'd probably be convinced that some tech billionaire was out to get me.
I got shingles shot last year and had a bad reaction, so I never got the second jab. I admit, I was a little nervous about a reactions with the vaccines, but my health issues make me high risk, so I was very thankful when I got the Moderna shots. The second dose knocked me on my behind for several days, but was still thankful a little peace of mind. And as someone who wore masks long before COVID, I still wear my mask in indoor public spaces, stink-eye looks or no. ;)
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
And as someone who wore masks long before COVID, I still wear my mask in indoor public spaces, stink-eye looks or no.
Someone needs to make a mask that says something like

i work with
HIGH RISK babies
please stand back

(that's what i tell strangers if they come to close to me now. and it works...add: well i say "medically fragile" but that's too long for a mask. but now im thinking "high risk babies" might be confusing... hhhmmm)
 

Ravi

Active Member
Got my 2nd shot of Pfizer today, and no probs so far.

Hilariously, The extremely knowledgeable Dutch political leaders decided 2 weeks ago to "loosen" the measures. So, clubs opened, cafes, parties and holidays etc. Of course, as youngsters saw this as a go-ahead, they went all went to party, and party hard that is. So, now the positive tests are close to 10.000 per day, and before it was less than 800.

I hope this will not become a "normal" thing (measures taken/measured loosened).

How do other countries deal with this effect?
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
How do other countries deal with this effect?
in America, some states themselves are trying money and prize giveaways, some private colleges are mandating vaccines.

My state has a color coded case system per town, and will reinstate limitations if cases go above a certain level. But my guess is the most they will do (in the autumn if cases rise, we were low last summer before vaccines too) is maybe reclose bars that don't serve food and lower capacity limits again. But our state colleges are not mandating vaccines. We are setting up vaccine booths in various recreational areas, some churches.

which i do think will help a bit, these venues are expensive for low income and/or young families to afford.
https://portal.ct.gov/vaccine-portal/summer?language=en_US

Article:
Local restaurants, as part of a program coordinated by the state, offered free drinks with proof of vaccination. The Hartford Yard Goats pledged free tickets for people vaccinated at their games. More recently, the city of Hartford has handed out Six Flags passes and $1,000 debit cards for those vaccinated at select clinics. Mystic Aquarium, Quassy Amusement Park, the CT Science Center and other attractions have offered free admission. The Department of Public Health is giving out tickets to big-name concerts for those who have already been vaccinated and those who show up for clinics on certain dates.



We have a pretty high vaccination rate for older adults though, and nursing homes/assisted living are being watched like hawks. So at some point, it will be what it is and eventually all those younger adults will get covid and hopefully some natural immunity. Meanwhile higher risk people will just have to continue to use precautions. I avoid towns with lower vaccination rates and stores (like walmart, grocery ) where young adults tend to go. But i am beyond spoiled, can get really everything delivered free*

*well 11$ a month for Amazon prime (groceries).
 

Ravi

Active Member
Thanks for the response @deirdre. Interesting to see that all states have a different way (just like in Europe: all countries decide themselves what to do).

What worries me, and I am talking specifically about my own country, is that the power of the government is huge. An example is that as now the measures have been put again, all the organized outdoor festivals have to cancel it! Not because they decided it is too risky, but it has been banned by the government.. I believe in the US it is much more distanced from authorities, correct?

This means my government can just put in place new measures whenever it feels like it. This really bother me.
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
This means my government can just put in place new measures whenever it feels like it.
well state governments trump federal. but state governments can basically do whatever they want. There is a process to give this power though. like our governor they are reevaluating his covid authority (forget the technical term) and they tried a while back to strip Cuomo (New York) of his power to make such mandates too.

So we do here have processes (and courts which take time).

this one is old(ish) but shows the process a bit
Article:
A day after the state Supreme Court upheld the constitutionality of Connecticut’s emergency power laws, the Senate voted Tuesday for final passage of a bill that ratifies Gov. Ned Lamont’s pandemic declarations and extends his authority by one month until May 20.

The party-line vote for the bill, as well as the rejection of a Republican amendment that would have required legislative ratification of any emergency lasting longer than seven days, underscored a partisan divide over how power has been granted to Lamont during the pandemic.



edit add: note: our states have the same set up as the Federal government. we all have our own constitutions, our own exectutive branch, our own supreme courts, our own congress (House+Senate)
 
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econ41

Senior Member
So, now the positive tests are close to 10.000 per day, and before it was less than 800.


How do other countries deal with this effect?
Wow! And - you ask "How do other countries deal with this effect?"

Well Australia has been at the other extreme of the spectrum - my state NSW population 8.2 million - has had several months with daily zero or low single digit new local origin infections and a small typically 5 or 6 imported infections. Then a recent outbreak and 50 new cases going to over 100 the last couple of days. Pushing the limits of contact tracing and re-imposition of strict lockdown for the state capital city area.

Hard to quantify why - our political situation is definitely less polarised or volatile than USA. Our two dominant parties only slightly right and slightly left and the ultra right splinter is locked up in a minority party - not in defacto control of a major party. Party politics has not been a significant issue - the main players federal and state coming from both sides of the major party divide and zero influence from the ultra-right splinter.

The anti-vax CT and "my rights are supreme" demographic sectors surprisingly quiet. A few - only three I can be sure of - high profile police arrests of persons playing the "my rights" game over mask wearing health orders. The Aussie culture certainly more balanced on the "my rights" versus "my community responsibilities" dimension than what we see in the media from other countries. (Yes - with all the inherent potential for biasing... )

The media has been playing up the state of COVID surge on daily TV news plus giving high profile to a couple of AstraZenaca linked bloodclot deaths but few signs of the anti-vax zealots trying to leverage that issue. I suspect general apathy is a big factor given that the absolute numbers are still relatively low. Very hard to quantify any comparisons.
 
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deirdre

Senior Member.
and re-imposition of strict lockdown for the state capital city area.
who imposes the rules though? did NSW decide to implement lock downs or did your federal government implement them? (assuming you have a federal gov?)
 

econ41

Senior Member
well state governments trump federal. but state governments can basically do whatever they want.

edit add: note: our states have the same set up as the Federal government. we all have our own constitutions, our own exectutive branch, our own supreme courts, our own congress (House+Senate)
The Australian arrangements for federation are similar - they can be seen as a mix of UK "Westminster" governance with the federation of states aspects added on. But the balance of powers arrangements are significantly different. One detail issue - voting in federal elections is by one set of federal rules. No possibility of polarised state politics enacting state legislation to "stack" a federal election. Amendments to the AU Constitution similar to US BUT with only 6 states and two territories ratification of amendment SHOULD be easier. And it isdecided by the one process of voting. Not by state rules. But it still took us a couple of goes at the Constitution and a big legal case to give rights to indigenous Australians.
 

econ41

Senior Member
who imposes the rules though? did NSW decide to implement lock downs or did your federal government implement them? (assuming you have a federal gov?)
State Rules. There is a little bit of tension state to federal because Federal is largely funding a both the medication side and income protection for affected workers and employers. Procurement of vaccines still federally dominated - I'm not sure how much Australia has taken second priority in the overall picture of world supply.. part of the downside of initially controlling COVID too well our needs possible not seen as urgent as other countries. I haven't been following closely - letting things emerge.

My state leader is same politics as federal leader but no sign of any party political bias. The previous lockdowns in another state (Victoria) where thestate leader is the other side of politics. (Federal and my state more "right", victoria more "left" - but the calibration of left and right is different to USA - probably less divergent.)
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
one thing to note, in my state (Connecticut near New York) our vaccine hesitancy is mostly age related, not politics related. Granted our state was never hyper partisan (no big BLM riots or squirmishes etc, no riots when they took the young uns' ability to buy AR-15s away etc).

And our cases are still fairly low, but as i said we were low last summer too and young adults were partying last summer too.

so as far as young people partying and driving cases up this summer, we really won't know much til autumn at least i think. when colleges really open up. our movie theaters and whatnot are full capacity now, but none of our towns or cities are in the yellow or red zones, which means less then 5 cases per 100,000.. possible the young people are infected from the reopenings, but just not getting tested. ??

still if we were seeing 2,000 new covid cases a day i imagine our government would reinstate capacity limitations and possibly indoor mask mandates again for everyone..




Screenshot 2021-07-12 232722.png
 

econ41

Senior Member
still if we were seeing 2,000 new covid cases a day i imagine our government would reinstate capacity limitations and possibly indoor mask mandates again for everyone..
As a basis of comparison, allowing for Connecticut being slightly less than half my state's population and much more densly concentrated. That is 40 times larger than the current surge in NSW that has resulted in imposition of lock downs and mask mandates.
 
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well state governments trump federal. but state governments can basically do whatever they want. There is a process to give this power though. like our governor they are reevaluating his covid authority (forget the technical term) and they tried a while back to strip Cuomo (New York) of his power to make such mandates too.

So we do here have processes (and courts which take time).

this one is old(ish) but shows the process a bit
Article:
A day after the state Supreme Court upheld the constitutionality of Connecticut’s emergency power laws, the Senate voted Tuesday for final passage of a bill that ratifies Gov. Ned Lamont’s pandemic declarations and extends his authority by one month until May 20.

The party-line vote for the bill, as well as the rejection of a Republican amendment that would have required legislative ratification of any emergency lasting longer than seven days, underscored a partisan divide over how power has been granted to Lamont during the pandemic.



edit add: note: our states have the same set up as the Federal government. we all have our own constitutions, our own exectutive branch, our own supreme courts, our own congress (House+Senate)

Michigan has certainly gone about the same way, the Reps have the house and senate but the govenor is Dem so they've been fighting over everything since the pandemic started. then there was one ruling which threw out a lot of regulations the govenor was issuing but they just shifted things to the state department of health so that is where it sits now.

pretty much all restrictions are lifted at the moment except a few things that i haven't looked up. there is an effort to repeal the laws that are being used to address the pandemic. i hope it doesn't happen. sometimes you do need a central authority that can act quickly enough in an emergency. yes, i do want oversight, but otherwise get out of the way.

state cases of covid have been down quite a bit from the high of 9000 new cases a day (detected). hospitalisations are down quite a bit too. recent bumps due to the Delta variant are showing signs that there might be a change coming soon to the numbers of cases and some hospitalisations but the real fact of the matter is that those who are not vaccinated are the majority of hospitalisations (98+%). which just shows how badly off the anti-vaxers are on this score.
 

derwoodii

Senior Member.
yay just great my state got 1 day with out masks an eased restriction then on que the plague rats from next door state NSW take a trip and infected us again

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-07...t-removalists-trip-through-victoria/100287062

 

derwoodii

Senior Member.

Victoria reintroduces masks in outdoor and indoor settings amid new COVID-19 outbreak​

Posted 6h ago6 hours ago, updated 3h ago

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-07...ed-victoria-covid-health-department/100294588


 

econ41

Senior Member
ouch
Article:
Just 11% of Australia's adult population of just over 20.5 million have been fully vaccinated. read more
it's a complicated story. We are still dealing with infection numbers an order of magnitude less than most other countries. So apathy at community level probably significant. Then political slowness in the logistics of vaccine provision. I haven't a clue to what extent world wide supply priorities have affected AU given the success of our "lock it out" campaign. Our situation definitely less urgent than others. Some minor effects probably from the AstraZeneca blood clots issues affecting genuinely conservative community members. I doubt the "anti-vaxers" have had much effect.
 

FatPhil

Active Member
logistics of vaccine provision
Estonia owes you an apology, I guess I can proxy it to you. We oversubbed all the vaccines (probably enough jabs for 2x the population were ordered, but that number includes future vaccines), and let our populace chose whichever one they wanted. AZ fell out of favour here quite quickly, so we promised our excess to Oz (and to some Balkan/Caucasian countries too, IIRC). Yay, sounds great, no? And then magically two weeks back the fridges all broke and the dog ate the health minister's excuse. It's funny how we have done some things so well, and then shown abject incompetence in such closely related fields.
 

Ravi

Active Member
Yay, over here we are going into the 4th wave. Going well isn't it. I have serious doubts we will ever "return to normal" in the world. If that is the case, I don't want to be in it.
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
We are still dealing with infection numbers an order of magnitude less than most other countries. So apathy at community level probably significant.
the article makes it sound like you have almost no vaccine to give. so while i agree with apathy amongst populations that didnt see high infections and deaths, I'm guessing that isnt a huge issue for Australia yet.

I should have expanded my "ouch" to "no wonder you guys have to keep locking down". If my state had those vaccination rates and projections, I imagine our restrictions situation would be much different. We would definitely still have mask mandates for all situations.
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
Yay, over here we are going into the 4th wave. Going well isn't it. I have serious doubts we will ever "return to normal" in the world. If that is the case, I don't want to be in it.

sometimes we have to adjust to "the new normal" whether we like it or not. Although i'm saying that as someone who got to live at least half my life with all the bells and whistles of freedom and growing economies.

The "normal" before the pandemic was a sad ghost of the normal i enjoyed growing up through young adultdom anyway.

Treatments are already improving, and if they get better still... that will aid in getting life back to "normal".

we are super lucky with this virus actually. if it had the fatality rate of sars1 and the incubation/asymptomatic status of this sars2... 25% (or more) of the world would be dead. economies would crash even worse. a bad bad situation. I think people should consider this as sort of test run/practice for when a virus like i described breaks out. (of course if it waits 100 years, humans will have forgotten all the lessons we learned this time!)

I'm not belittling your frustration. at all. I think that's why Republicans are so grumpy and unhappy with the world in general and covid restrictions now. My theory is we don't adjust well to [stupid] change. or at least we don't adjust well quickly. But unfortunately that's the price of being part of a society. Eventually covid will be 'manageable' like other diseases the human race has endured. Hang in there!
 

Ravi

Active Member
I see your point @deirdre, and thanks for the heads up.

I meant to say that it looks like we are going to move in a future where we cannot have normal (ok, old?) human interactions anymore, like kissing, touching or having plain fun. I foresee that this is going to happen. It is already seen as normal to not touch anybody anymore. I am not a biologist, but I think us humans cannot do without this close contact. For chimpanzees, if we want to compare us to them, the main sensory tool used it touch..

I am not claiming of course that I need to hug everyone I see..
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
I am not claiming of course that I need to hug everyone I see..

i just hold my breath when i hug. :)

(unless i'm doing more than hugging of course. but i'm pretty sure the sex drive will always be more powerful then the death fear)
 

JMartJr

Senior Member
cubation/asymptomatic status of this sars2... 25% (or more) of the world would be dead. economies would crash even worse. a bad bad situation. I think people should consider this as sort of test run/practice for when a virus like i described breaks out. (of course if it waits 100 years, humans will have forgotten all the lessons we learned this time!)

Always assuming we learned anything this time. Scientifically, possibly. As a society? I am not convinced.
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
Always assuming we learned anything this time. Scientifically, possibly. As a society? I am not convinced.
i was thinking more infrastructure logistics. like how to effectively isolate high risk groups (like nursing homes), to not have infected caregivers spread disease in multiple nursing homes (florida), not put infected old people back in nursing homes (NY) etc.

what works and what doesnt work to best protect frontline workers. keeping a stock of n95s for frontline workers.

whether to give bonuses and stimulus money to rich people who dont really need it right now (but allegedly helps economy), or is it better to give more to poor people to prevent starvation and homelessness.

the after effects of eviction mandates and how people are gonna pay off 12 months of unpaid rent when mandates end. all that kind of stuff.

food and supply delivery systems. stuff like that, we can now go back and contemplate the data. Try to come up with better ideas for next time. and maybe write down actual plans.. which i thought we already had but apparently we didnt.
 

Ravi

Active Member
food and supply delivery systems. stuff like that, we can now go back and contemplate the data. Try to come up with better ideas for next time. and maybe write down actual plans.. which i thought we already had but apparently we didnt.

I hope dearly you are correct, but I don't think the "next time" we will go to the cupboard and take out the file called "lessons learnt from COVID19". Perhaps some countries or communities will, but definitely not all of the world (not implying you mean that).
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
I hope dearly you are correct, but I don't think the "next time" we will go to the cupboard and take out the file called "lessons learnt from COVID19". Perhaps some countries or communities will, but definitely not all of the world (not implying you mean that).
i think most places will absorb learned lessons.

ex: it's bad to be the guy who put infected people into nursing homes and killed hundreds. But it's really really bad to be the guy who does that when you already know the outcome.

(How cuomo couldnt deduce the outcome i have no idea, but apparently his health department didnt know covid would come in from spain and italy... even though all flights from spain and italy go into NY o_O ...anyway at least they can claim naiveté, the next guy can't. )



edit add: i should say that my state messed up with nursing homes too. we knew right away what needed to be done, but they messed up in the implementation and it took too long. next time theyll know better.
 

dc_hatman

Member
My wife and I had our first Pfizer shot a few weeks ago (I live in Sydney Australia) and we are booked go for oir second dose next weekend. I am booked to get it at a vaccination center set up specifically for this in Olympic Park, where the 2000 Sydney Olympics were held. Although I was extremely impressed with the running of this site when I got my first vaccine, queues have been long with not much social distance distancing, which we are a bit anxious about. I received a text message from my GP last weekend that they now permitted to give Pfizer vaccines to people our age, so I rang them up to see if we can get our second dose there instead of the vaccination centre. I was told that we have to get both doses at the same site. One would think that with such long lines seen at Olympic Park, they would be allowing and even encouraging people to switch their second dose to their local GP. This would help take pressure off the vaccination centre which is so busy it is bursting at the seems, as well as being itself a possible risk site for COVID-19 transmission.
 
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deirdre

Senior Member.
as well as being itself a possible risk site for COVID-19 transmission.
from what ive been reading you get pretty decent protection (2 weeks) after the first shot. (of course this varies by age and how your body personally responded to the vaccine). still be careful, but based on your case numbers and your previous shot, your chances of catching covid during
vaccination next weekend should be fairly low. and if you do get it the first shot should protect you against severe symptoms still.

https://www.businessinsider.com/cov...izer-moderna-astrazeneca-vaccines-dose-2021-3


add: and if they scheduled everyone around you the first day for the same 21 days later (like me) then you should have the same people around you for the second dose. ie. everyone that day maybe has their first dose too.

1626392544671.png
 
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dc_hatman

Member
from what ive been reading you get pretty decent protection (2 weeks) after the first shot. (of course this varies by age and how your body personally responded to the vaccine). still be careful, but based on your case numbers and your previous shot, your chances of catching covid during
vaccination next weekend should be fairly low. and if you do get it the first shot should protect you against severe symptoms still.

https://www.businessinsider.com/cov...izer-moderna-astrazeneca-vaccines-dose-2021-3


add: and if they scheduled everyone around you the first day for the same 21 days later (like me) then you should have the same people around you for the second dose. ie. everyone that day maybe has their first dose too.

True
Although we had to get our second at 4 weeks as we couldn’t make it on the 3rd week for personal reasons.

There will be a lot of extra people getting their first dose as well, so they will increase numbers I expect. We will just have to wear our masks and do our best when it comes to social distancing. We will feel somewhat safer once it’s done.
 
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