Charles Bukowski quote

Hartski

New Member
I'm a big lover of irony, so I had to share this...

The following meme popped up on my Facebook (reposted from a Charles Bukowski 'tribute' page) accompanied with a comment from the poster :

"Yea I would fully agree with this. Most of the confident extroverted types in this world are as thick as pig s***, emotionally and mentally lol !!"



It is a shame however, he didn't doubt the quote and check it out....

The closest approximation of the quote is actually attributed to Bertrand Russell in 1933:

EDIT - Or you could go earlier to WB Yeats from his 'Second Coming' poem:
The closest Bukowski came to that quote was from an interview in the 80's:

"But the problem is that bad writers tend to have the self-confidence, while the good ones tend to have self-doubt."

Semantically similar, but over 50yrs after Russell and Yeats.
Its an excellent demonstration from the meme makers and the re-posters; of the Dunning-Kruger Effect.

https://timpanogos.wordpress.com/dunning-kruger-effect/

I didn't have the heart to tell him.... [removed off topic comment that may lead to off topic discussion]
Now, am I experiencing Dunning-Kruger by posting this....?
 
Last edited:

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Now, am I experiencing Dunning-Kruger by posting this....?

Probably. I think it's important to note that DK is something that we all share in. We all have biases that we are blind to, and areas of unwarranted certainty. It's a danger to divide the world into the stupid and the intelligent, as there's really a vast variety of spectrums there. We are all stupid sometimes, it's very much context dependent.
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
Its an excellent demonstration from the meme makers and the re-posters; of the Dunning-Kruger Effect.

Content from external source The Dunning–Kruger effect is a cognitive bias in which unskilled individuals suffer from illusory superiority, mistakenly rating their ability much higher than average. This bias is attributed to a metacognitive inability of the unskilled to recognize their mistakes

Content from external source Sometimes it’s difficult to separate Dunning-Kruger from just plain old gullibility; and how can we really distinguish it from the (misnamed) Barnum Effect (really, the Forer Effect)?

Sniffing out stupid and humorous, and sometimes malicious, distortions of history, we run into people under the spell of the effect way too often.

https://timpanogos.wordpress.com/dunning-kruger-effect/

I didn't have the heart to tell him.... [removed off topic comment that may lead to off topic discussion]
Now, am I experiencing Dunning-Kruger by posting this....?
Now, am I experiencing Dunning-Kruger by posting this....?
yes :)
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
While i agree the quote probably should be attributed to Russell, would seem odd if he hadnt read Yeats prior to his thought.

 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Another problem with DK is that those who are most affected by it (i.e. those who most over-estimate their own understanding of a topic) are the least likely to be helped by bringing it up. I feel it's generally counterproductive to mention it in the conspiracysphere.

Like the bible says:
The wise respond best to debunking, but they are usually least in need of it.
 

Hartski

New Member
oh and your debunk quote seems wrong. the book is called "Mortals and Others", 'The Triumph of Stupidity' is the title of a chapter/essay in the book.
upload_2016-6-1_10-22-18.png

and the quote he writes is:
upload_2016-6-1_10-22-48.png

https://books.google.com/books?id=_qfrAgAAQBAJ&pg=PA27&dq=The+Triumph+of+Stupidity+in+Mortals+and+Others&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjosdvVgofNAhUMM1IKHRD6DJUQ6AEIHDAA#v=onepage&q=The Triumph of Stupidity in Mortals and Others&f=false

Thanks Deirdre. I was aware of Yeats, and should have expanded more. <wrist-slap> (I'll make some edits to the OP)
It wasn't so much a debunk as such, but an observation and self-imposed example of DK.

As Mick says, we all share it to a degree.

Interesting psychology.
 

deirdre

Senior Member.
but an observation and self-imposed example of DK
i dont agree with that based on what you shared. i, like the poster, agree with the quote and i dont care who it is attributed to. While finding the original source is interesting to me personally, it isnt a requirement when i read thought provoking quotes.

Eitehr way, this is the "quotes debunked" forum, not a place for you to mock or comment on some Truther you have interactions with. It's not the forum to contemplate DK. Next time use the "Metadebunking" forum.
 

rnippoldt

New Member
Probably. I think it's important to note that DK is something that we all share in. We all have biases that we are blind to, and areas of unwarranted certainty. It's a danger to divide the world into the stupid and the intelligent, as there's really a vast variety of spectrums there. We are all stupid sometimes, it's very much context dependent.
I appreciate the DK effect. In my career I have been on both sides of it; once coming out of college and once mentoring new people after 30 years of experience. I now approach teaching others differently. Now I try to teach how to think so the answer becomes clear; before I would pile on details until the answer was produced.
 

NoParty

Senior Member.
I agree with Mick that bringing up DK to those most affected by it is usually not going to be productive,

but I also think that the principal is important for young people to understand,

as they will encounter hundreds of cocksure blowhards over their lives...and, for some reason,

there seems to be something in human nature that makes some people trust someone who never admits error.
 
Thread starter Related Articles Forum Replies Date
Svartbjørn Debunked: Charles Manson Parole [Satire] General Discussion 0
Mick West Debunked: CNNs Fake News Broadcasts - Charles Jaco and the Fake Live Gulf War Reports Conspiracy Theories 222
DavidB66 Dubious Darwin quote Quotes Debunked 14
Rory Fake quote? "World events do not occur by accident. They are made to happen [...] by those who hold the purse strings" (attributed to Denis Healey) Quotes Debunked 12
Inti Confirmed Tesla quote; "Today's scientists have substituted mathematics for experiments" Quotes Debunked 12
Rory Debunked: "You must love yourself before you love another" - fake Buddha quote Quotes Debunked 7
Robin Evans Lenin quote check Quotes Debunked 8
D The World is Rudderless:Conspiracy Theory quote General Discussion 27
Mick West Conspiracy? Trump Repeating Falsely Attributed Quote from Russian Media. Conspiracy Theories 26
Mick West Debunked: 9/11 Truth New York Times Billboard Quote 9/11 53
Rory Debunked: "Buddha said, 'Enlightenment is found in the Yoni'" Quotes Debunked 20
McGurnicle Brock Chisholm(first Director-General of the World Health Organization) Quote Quotes Debunked 32
Jean-François A false quote attributed to Aldous Huxley Quotes Debunked 30
derwoodii any help to prove or disprove this quote or claim Quotes Debunked 22
TemplarJLS Context: George Washington acknowledges the Illuminati Exists? Quotes Debunked 16
TemplarJLS Can someone debunk this George Washington quote? Quotes Debunked 6
TemplarJLS Debunked:"If I were reincarnated, I would wish to be... - Prince Philip Quotes Debunked 3
TemplarJLS Some depopulation quotes to debunk? Quotes Debunked 16
Leifer "If you can't pronounce it, don't eat it" ...commonly seen quote General Discussion 32
Graham2001 George Ellery Hale: "No time has been lost." Quotes Debunked 5
Mick West Context: "The Eyes of that Species of Extinct Giants ..." - Abraham Lincoln Quotes Debunked 10
Mick West Debunked: "There are many ways to make the death rate increase." - Robert McNamara Quotes Debunked 0
Critical Thinker Can't find if De Niro "apartheid" quote is legit or not Quotes Debunked 3
Mick West Quote: We’ll know our disinformation program is complete when everything the American public believes is false. Quotes Debunked 17
Leifer "Atheists' billboard quote isn't Jefferson's" Quotes Debunked 0
Mick West Debunked: "The CIA owns everyone of any significance in the major media" Quotes Debunked 91
Related Articles


























Related Articles

Top