Bunk you are willing to live with?

Leifer

Senior Member.
Is there anything that you live with or (otherwise surrounds you), that likely contains "bunk"......
.....and you are OK with and just let it be ?


myths
unproven ideas
suspicions
memes
possibilities
etc...

(i'd rather leave religion out, but if you must....)
 

RolandD

Active Member
been to a chiropractor about 10 years ago for a really bad back.
Been pain free ever since.

If you are lucky enough to find a chiropractor that admits that all he is doing is pushing stuff back where it goes to make you feel better, you've got a keeper. I've only found two like that and moved away from both of them. Too many claim to be able to cure anything that ails you.


As to the question at hand. Personally, I'd prefer to live bunk free.
 

Lost World

New Member
The placebo effect.

I've never - knowingly - been party to it, but if someones suffering can be cured by homeopathic water witchcraft then I'm all for it. Same goes for acupuncture.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
The placebo effect.

I've never - knowingly - been party to it, but if someones suffering can be cured by homeopathic water witchcraft then I'm all for it. Same goes for acupuncture.

Yeah, I can agree with that to some degree. People DO feel better after taking quack cures. Sure it's all mental, but it's still better.

It's double edged sword though, what if they become so convinced that alternative medicine is the answer that they refuse conventional treatment for more serious aliments. Lots of people have died because of this. See:

http://whatstheharm.net/alternativemedicine.html
 

David Fraser

Senior Member.
Is there anything that you live with or (otherwise surrounds you), that likely contains "bunk"......
.....and you are OK with and just let it be ?


myths
unproven ideas
suspicions
memes
possibilities
etc...

(i'd rather leave religion out, but if you must....)

Superstitions. I think I have been conditioned to follow some. I found myself telling my 23 year old son off for putting his new shoes on the table the other day.
 

Leifer

Senior Member.
My ex girlfriend occasionally took some homeopathic remedies, to "help her fight off a cold". She didn't go overboard with the whole idea...it just made her "feel" better". (Oscillococcinum)
I didn't have the heart to start a debate, especially when she wasn't feeling well.

Same principle if friends have a few harmless misconceptions or beliefs....I'll not bring up the subject.
...ok, maybe friendly sarcasm, but I'll drop the subject pretty fast. Sometimes if I point out something contrary to their idea, in a humorous fashion....they'll chuckle at it too.

Some people can get defensive about their beliefs, and by just asking one or two light-hearted questions to them, is my way of "testing their waters" to see how strongly they feel about the subject.
I have a close co-worker, and he is deeply religious. But he feels confident enough about it that we can carry on a friendly debate. I like that.
 

Lost World

New Member
Yeah, I can agree with that to some degree. People DO feel better after taking quack cures. Sure it's all mental, but it's still better.

It's double edged sword though, what if they become so convinced that alternative medicine is the answer that they refuse conventional treatment for more serious aliments. Lots of people have died because of this. See:

http://whatstheharm.net/alternativemedicine.html

Yeah, not good.

It's difficult to measure though, because the folks who died of cancer may have done so anyway, even if they had gone for established therapies, although conventional treatments may have bought them more time I guess.

My friends sister believes passionately in homeopathy and recently harshly criticised my friend and his wife for pumping so many anti biotics into their three year old son. In fairness the drugs didn't really have much effect, but even so you don't takes chances with your children. As an adult feel free to choose whatever therapy you want for yourself, and accept the risks that come with those choices, but children are not in a position to choose!
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
My ex girlfriend occasionally took some homeopathic remedies, to "help her fight off a cold". She didn't go overboard with the whole idea...it just made her "feel" better". (Oscillococcinum)
I didn't have the heart to start a debate, especially when she wasn't feeling well.

I know what you mean but you often don't need to start a debate, just explain how those things are made.

Oscillococcinum, for example is made by fermenting a duck heart for a while, then taking a drop of it, putting it in water, then washing out the container 200 times with distilled water, then filling up the container with distilled water, and then taking a drop of that distilled water and putting it on a sugar pill.

A lot of people think homeopathy is herbs. I think it's worth at least trying to explain what it actually is, even if you don't want to debate if it works or not.
 

Soulfly

Banned
Banned
Same principle if friends have a few harmless misconceptions or beliefs....I'll not bring up the subject.
...ok, maybe friendly sarcasm, but I'll drop the subject pretty fast. Sometimes if I point out something contrary to their idea, in a humorous fashion....they'll chuckle at it too.
I have a few hippie type friends and attend events (mostly Burning Man types events) with many other hippie types. Lots of crystals, sage, cleansing and chanting going on. At a festival, a friend asked if I wanted my tent cleansed, I politely told her I had just hexed it and was all set, she giggled, didn't want to come in my tent, but giggled. Usually I just politely decline random offers of hippie magic. For that counter culture it is almost ingrained as all powerful knowledge, so engaging some in a debate is futile. I have noticed many open to debate or even them actually understanding it doesn't work but they still do it because, like people said, it makes them feel better. There are also those that are fascinated by science. Some will understand and acknowledge how the universe is understood to work by science, yet still read their horoscope.

I see a chiropractor that fixed my back with in a few months. I see him maybe once a month, or more often if my pain returns. Doesn't take long for him to get me pain free. Most of my pain is from a pinched nerves in my neck and shoulder. He had me lay in this thingy, (I think it is called decompression) your head is strapped in it and stretches your spin. Fixes compressed disc. He never claims adjustments fix anything and only work to help put things back. The E-stim rocks and he used to have this water table massage thingy. It can work for minor ailments but I have heard him directly tell people to go see a back specialist.
 

Steve Funk

Senior Member.
There are four stores in Mount Shasta that sell crystals, and I don't think it's Waterford. You have to pick your battles. Also, one store claims to have the 13th Mayan skull.
 

David Fraser

Senior Member.
There are four stores in Mount Shasta that sell crystals, and I don't think it's Waterford. You have to pick your battles. Also, one store claims to have the 13th Mayan skull.

Why on earth is there a need to have 4 shops selling crystals? Then again you should visit Glastonbury. Every second shop sells crystals and other New Age bunk. Shopping there is nightmare. I once stopped off on the look out for duct tape and ended up with a dream catcher, some tie dyed pants and a bag of glass beads.
 

Soulfly

Banned
Banned
I can live with things like crystal power, horoscopes, taro cards or psychic readings, as long as it remains only a fun curiosity. When people start trying to seriously affect peoples lives with their advice it becomes dangerous. Psychics or taro readers telling people to change jobs, move, marry or divorce, have kids or don't. Telling people their loved ones are dead like in the Cleveland kidding napping case.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/cri...-false-claim-cleveland-case-article-1.1338326
 

RolandD

Active Member
I know what you mean but you often don't need to start a debate, just explain how those things are made.

Oscillococcinum, for example is made by fermenting a duck heart for a while, then taking a drop of it, putting it in water, then washing out the container 200 times with distilled water, then filling up the container with distilled water, and then taking a drop of that distilled water and putting it on a sugar pill.

A lot of people think homeopathy is herbs. I think it's worth at least trying to explain what it actually is, even if you don't want to debate if it works or not.


Just read on Snopes where Hyland Teething Tablets had contained "inconsistant amounts of belladonna", possibly causing seizures in children. (Can't seem to cut and paste from Snopes, sorry)

I have, in the past, taken Hyland's Leg Cramp pills. I was never dissatisfied with their action, but also can't prove that they helped.
 

AluminumTheory

Senior Member.
If you are lucky enough to find a chiropractor that admits that all he is doing is pushing stuff back where it goes to make you feel better, you've got a keeper. I've only found two like that and moved away from both of them. Too many claim to be able to cure anything that ails you.


As to the question at hand. Personally, I'd prefer to live bunk free.

Well they didn't seem too hokey to me. They were recommended by a friend who is into alot of Yoga, Natural Foods, and overall healthy living etc.
Before they would do any treatments, they wanted x rays, and they used some sort of electronic sensors on my back that is supposed to indicate where the pain is located.

My treatments were (IIRC) 2 vists a week for 20 weeks and it consisted of the chiropractor basically doing his thing and about 20 minutes of some yoga(ish) exercises.
But since then I have been pain free ever since other than a mild back ache here and there which might last 1 to 3 days typically but I think that's normal. The problem I had when I initially visited the chiropractor lasted 3 months and got worse to the point that I could barely drive.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
I met a guy yesterday who is into Rolfing (a type of massage), but he thinks it's mostly bunk, and they keep try to push crystals and stuff. He keeps going because it kind of works for him.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
I also had a brief demo of the Model 400 Consciousness Lifestream Generator:



Which apparently lots of people say makes them feel better. It made my arm hurt (although this might have been because I electrocuted myself a while ago, and that arm is a bit dodgy now). Anyway, mostly harmless for most people, regardless of if it actually does something physically.

When it comes to "feeling better", the subjective is objective.
 
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Soulfly

Banned
Banned
I met a guy yesterday who is into Rolfing (a type of massage), but he thinks it's mostly bunk, and they keep try to push crystals and stuff. He keeps going because it kind of works for him.
My chiropractor has massage therapist there, he offers half price on your birthday. One lady asked if it was okay that she did some reiki on me, I respectfully declined.
 

Cairenn

Senior Member.
I will put up with things that might help as long as they do not infringe on established help/care.

Most of the cartilage in my knees is gone, I do need knee replacements. There are some good reasons why I am holding off on this. I sell copper jewelry. The story is that copper helps arthritis. I made myself a copper anklet. I don't believe it does, I did it more to get folks to stop telling me I needed one--you don't start an argument with your customers. About a month later, I started getting folks asking me if I had had my knees replaced, because I was walking better.

I still don't believe in it, but I am going to make myself another one (I gave mine to a friend). Somehow the placebo effect worked.

I may smudge my house after my hubby and I have had several arguments, to 'dispel' the bad thoughts. Does it work? It seems to. I think it works by making us more careful in our choice of words.

I have seen massage help. Maybe it does just relax one more.
 

David Fraser

Senior Member.
I will put up with things that might help as long as they do not infringe on established help/care.

Most of the cartilage in my knees is gone, I do need knee replacements. There are some good reasons why I am holding off on this. I sell copper jewelry. The story is that copper helps arthritis. I made myself a copper anklet. I don't believe it does, I did it more to get folks to stop telling me I needed one--you don't start an argument with your customers. About a month later, I started getting folks asking me if I had had my knees replaced, because I was walking better.

I still don't believe in it, but I am going to make myself another one (I gave mine to a friend). Somehow the placebo effect worked.

I may smudge my house after my hubby and I have had several arguments, to 'dispel' the bad thoughts. Does it work? It seems to. I think it works by making us more careful in our choice of words.

I have seen massage help. Maybe it does just relax one more.

I would not say that massage is nonsense. When I was training as a psychiatric nurse back in the 80's our occupational therapists used to use massage and aromatherapy to good effect. Eventually I did a course and used to use it when in the army. It works on so many different levels. You have the physical relaxation of tension in the muscles but also the intimacy of the touch and conversation. But then again I am a bit of a hippy and I do believe that hugs can really help. I think as a society we are less for the loss of that tactile response.
 

FuzzyUK

Active Member
Health pill shops which I generally walk right past. Take your choice if you succumb:

A, D & K Vitamins
Acai
Aloe Vera
Antioxidants
B Vitamins
C Vitamins
Calcium Supplements
Co Enzyme Q-10
Cod Liver Oil
Collagen
Cranberry
Creatine
E Vitamins
Echinacea
Evening Primrose Oil / GLA
Fish Oils
Garlic
Ginkgo Biloba
Ginseng
Glucosamine
Green Tea
Magnesium
Multi Vitamins
Nuts
Omega 3
Protein
Seeds
Vitamin D
Vitamin E
Zinc
 

Lost World

New Member
Health pill shops which I generally walk right past. Take your choice if you succumb:

A, D & K Vitamins
Acai
Aloe Vera
Antioxidants
B Vitamins
C Vitamins
Calcium Supplements
Co Enzyme Q-10
Cod Liver Oil
Collagen
Cranberry
Creatine
E Vitamins
Echinacea
Evening Primrose Oil / GLA
Fish Oils
Garlic
Ginkgo Biloba
Ginseng
Glucosamine
Green Tea
Magnesium
Multi Vitamins
Nuts
Omega 3
Protein
Seeds
Vitamin D
Vitamin E
Zinc

A healthy balanced diet should eliminate the need to buy these products anyway, but there is nothing wrong with them per se imo, and may be of beneit to some people, who have specific deficencies or conditions that may be improved with additional amounts of of certain nutritional coponants, in particular trace elemnts like selenium or iron.
 

FuzzyUK

Active Member
A healthy balanced diet should eliminate the need to buy these products anyway, but there is nothing wrong with them per se imo, and may be of beneit to some people, who have specific deficencies or conditions that may be improved with additional amounts of of certain nutritional coponants, in particular trace elemnts like selenium or iron.

Ah, but the general population don't know what deficiencies they have, if at all! People buy these products on a whim because of their own confirmation bias. X will buy Vitamin C, Y will buy Omega 3 and me? I buy FA and get told off by my wife for not subscribing to this pseudo nonsense.
 

Soulfly

Banned
Banned
A healthy balanced diet should eliminate the need to buy these products anyway, but there is nothing wrong with them per se imo, and may be of beneit to some people, who have specific deficencies or conditions that may be improved with additional amounts of of certain nutritional coponants, in particular trace elemnts like selenium or iron.
I forget where I heard this. "Its not what you eat but how often you eat that something." Eat something different everyday. I have a friend with a 4 yeard old who has never eaten a Happy Meal. Feel sorry for any kid who has never had a happy meal! I tell her it is not going to kill you to eat fast food every now and then. Just don't make it the back bone of your diet. She just doesn't get it!
 

FuzzyUK

Active Member
A healthy balanced diet should eliminate the need to buy these products anyway, but there is nothing wrong with them per se imo, and may be of beneit to some people, who have specific deficencies or conditions that may be improved with additional amounts of of certain nutritional coponants, in particular trace elemnts like selenium or iron.

Actually there is a case to support that an overload of certain things like Vitamins can be dangerous.
 

Grieves

Senior Member
Feel sorry for any kid who has never had a happy meal!
Why in the world would you feel sorry for that kid? Happy meals are horrible. A squashed little industrial demi-burger with a slice of pickle or two and a squirt of ketchup, a paper slip of fries (which I have to admit are tasty, but god knows what they do to them..) a few slices of apple (maybe), and a cheap piece of plastic crap. Kids who don't get happy meals aren't missing a thing.
 

Cairenn

Senior Member.
The big thing that Micky Ds does to their fries is to cook them twice. First thing in the day they pre cooked their fries for lunch. Then they are pulled out and allowed to drip and cool. Then they are fried to finish.

Since potatoes have a lot of water in them, well this explains it better than I would

I have tried this at home and the fries are a lot better.
 

Soulfly

Banned
Banned
Why in the world would you feel sorry for that kid? Happy meals are horrible. A squashed little industrial demi-burger with a slice of pickle or two and a squirt of ketchup, a paper slip of fries (which I have to admit are tasty, but god knows what they do to them..) a few slices of apple (maybe), and a cheap piece of plastic crap. Kids who don't get happy meals aren't missing a thing.
If you would like to converse with me please be less argumentative with things. I get that you disagree with me, about everything, but do I really need to explain why having a Happy Meal every NOW AND THEN isn't going to make a kid ill, that is about letting a kid have fun during a meal?
 

RolandD

Active Member
If you would like to converse with me please be less argumentative with things. I get that you disagree with me, about everything, but do I really need to explain why having a Happy Meal every NOW AND THEN isn't going to make a kid ill, that is about letting a kid have fun during a meal?

I believe that I was 8 years old the first time I ate fast food and that was because one of my classmates father owned the local MickeyDs and we had a class trip with a tour of the kitchen and free food. That classmate died of a heart attack last year at the age of 44.
 

Soulfly

Banned
Banned
I believe that I was 8 years old the first time I ate fast food and that was because one of my classmates father owned the local MickeyDs and we had a class trip with a tour of the kitchen and free food. That classmate died of a heart attack last year at the age of 44.
People die of heart attacks all the time, at lots of ages. Don't see why that is relevant though.
 

Robinson

New Member
Why does the crap weather always arrive in time for the weekend?? :)

I know you are being funny, but there is a well researched study that found it actually does rain more on the weekends. And less during the start of the week. (I think this was in the industrial areas of the US)

Best guess (hypothesis) is air pollution builds up during the week, leading to rain on the weekend. After the rain clears out the air pollution the rain stops, just in time for the work week, which builds the particulates back up in time for the weekend.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
And wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rain#Human_influence

The reference is:
http://classes.maxwell.syr.edu/geo300/Syllabus/cerveny and balling 1998.pdf
 

solrey

Senior Member.
And a recent study seems to be in contradiction, stating that pollution peaks mid-week which produces more tornadoes and hail compared to the weekend.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/...rms-hail-science-summer-pollution-environment

So one study says pollution accumulates throughout the week, peaking on the weekend and causing more rain on Saturday and Sunday, while another study says pollution peaks mid-week and causes more storms on Tuesday and Wednesday.

Lies, damned lies and statistics?
 

Melbury's Brick

Senior Member.
I'd miss the humour in a bunkless world.

I know a woman who dangles a crystal over food as it's cooking to see if any negative energy has entered....or that the positive energy has not escaped....I forget which. She also maintains that care should be taken when drinking water, in case it's angry.


(I woke up with a raging headache this morning...I bet the water used to make the Jack Daniels that I drank last night was pissed off about something......)
 
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