Accidental Geoengineering

MikeG

Senior Member.
This article by Derrick Broze appeared yesterday in Activist Post:


Scientists Say Airplane Contrails May Be Accidentally Geoengineering The Climate


Chuck Long is a researcher with the Cooperative Institute for Research in Environmental Sciences (CIRES) at the NOAA Earth System Research Laboratory at the University of Colorado in Boulder. At the recent American Geophysical Union Fall Meeting, Long and his team released their paper, “Evidence of Clear-Sky Daylight Whitening: Are we already conducting geoengineering?” The analysis found that vapor from airplanes may be altering the climate through accidental geoengineering.
Content from External Source

http://www.activistpost.com/2015/12...-accidentally-geoengineering-the-climate.html


The author starts out fairly reasonably:

More research is needed before Long can conclusively show much of an effect contrails are having on the climate, or whether they are leading to cooling or warming. However, Long says this is another way humans are altering the climate and, he says, “you can see this with your own eyes.”
Content from External Source
The first part of the article is actually lifted from a Smithsonian Magazine story that came out last week:

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/scien...g-accidental-geoengineering-180957561/?no-ist


Broze then moves to familiar territory by citing “Weather as a Force Multiplier: Owning the Weather by 2025,” Operation Popeye, and others.

So are geoengineering programs already active? Perhaps what Chuck Long and his team are noticing is not that standard contrails are causing geoengineering, but that geoengineering programs are already live and changing the climate.
Content from External Source
It is a pretty disingenuous “Just asking questions” approach.

More to the point, in the mishmash of comingling historical examples of weather modification with proposed geoengineering projects, I continually notice that chemtrail believers either do not understand or simply refuse to make a distinction between weather and climate.


There have been some recent studies on the effect of contrails on cloudiness:

C. Ryan, A. R. MacKenzie, S. Watkins, and R. Timmis, “World War II contrails: a case study of aviation-induced cloudiness,” International Journal of Climatology, 32 (2012): 1745-1753.

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/joc.2392/abstract

https://www.metabunk.org/new-penn-state-study-into-the-affect-of-contrails-on-local-weather.t6407/

None that I know have addressed the long-term impact of contrails on climate, although the idea of unintended consequences is interesting.
 

SR1419

Senior Member.
I continually notice that chemtrail believers either do not understand or simply refuse to make a distinction between weather and climate.


Its not just Believers but a general trend in the AGW discussion. Using single weather events as "proof" one way or the other.

There have been studies over the years in potential effects of contrails on the radiative forcing of the climate...but this was this honest question of Mr. Long's will be twisted into "proof" by the less than critical herd.
 

MikeC

Closed Account
Everything we do that affects the climate is "accidental" geo-engineering - carbon emissions themselves are "accidental geoengineering" in that their geoengineering outcome is a by product.

So yeah......aircraft have been "accidentally geoengineering" since 1903!!

Of course there might be some confusion about the term since geoengineering is defined as "the DELIBERATE altering...."...so exactly how a deliberate activity can be accidental may be the source of some debate!! :)
 

NoParty

Senior Member.
Everything we do that affects the climate is "accidental" geo-engineering - carbon emissions themselves are "accidental geoengineering" in that their geoengineering outcome is a by product.

So yeah......aircraft have been "accidentally geoengineering" since 1903!!

Of course there might be some confusion about the term since geoengineering is defined as "the DELIBERATE altering...."...so exactly how a deliberate activity can be accidental may be the source of some debate!! :)
Amen.

Since any "engineering" implies an engineer, and planning, "accidental geoengineering" is pretty absurd.




Sadly, the mostly hypothetical concept of future "geoengineering" (aka "climate engineering") has been so
hijacked by conspiracy theorists and charlatans, that a google search turns up nutty websites before any
serious discussion.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Amen.

Since any "engineering" implies an engineer, and planning, "accidental geoengineering" is pretty absurd.

Unfortunately people converse using the vernacular, and figures of speech. They tend not to be swayed on arguments based on dictionary definitions, or the usage of a word in science.

The phrase "accidental experiment" is fairly common in science, even though "experiment" i generally defined as a procedure carried to to verify or refute a hypothesis. But climate change due to carbon emissions is describe as an accidental experiment.

"Accidental Geoengineering" might be a bit of an oxymoron, but unfortunately it's not an entirely unreasonable term.
 

Svartbjørn

Senior Member.
This article by Derrick Broze appeared yesterday in Activist Post:


Scientists Say Airplane Contrails May Be Accidentally Geoengineering The Climate


Chuck Long is a researcher with the Cooperative Institute for Research in Environmental Sciences (CIRES) at the NOAA Earth System Research Laboratory at the University of Colorado in Boulder. At the recent American Geophysical Union Fall Meeting, Long and his team released their paper, “Evidence of Clear-Sky Daylight Whitening: Are we already conducting geoengineering?” The analysis found that vapor from airplanes may be altering the climate through accidental geoengineering.
Content from External Source

http://www.activistpost.com/2015/12...-accidentally-geoengineering-the-climate.html


The author starts out fairly reasonably:

More research is needed before Long can conclusively show much of an effect contrails are having on the climate, or whether they are leading to cooling or warming. However, Long says this is another way humans are altering the climate and, he says, “you can see this with your own eyes.”
Content from External Source
The first part of the article is actually lifted from a Smithsonian Magazine story that came out last week:

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/scien...g-accidental-geoengineering-180957561/?no-ist


Broze then moves to familiar territory by citing “Weather as a Force Multiplier: Owning the Weather by 2025,” Operation Popeye, and others.

So are geoengineering programs already active? Perhaps what Chuck Long and his team are noticing is not that standard contrails are causing geoengineering, but that geoengineering programs are already live and changing the climate.
Content from External Source
It is a pretty disingenuous “Just asking questions” approach.

More to the point, in the mishmash of comingling historical examples of weather modification with proposed geoengineering projects, I continually notice that chemtrail believers either do not understand or simply refuse to make a distinction between weather and climate.


There have been some recent studies on the effect of contrails on cloudiness:

C. Ryan, A. R. MacKenzie, S. Watkins, and R. Timmis, “World War II contrails: a case study of aviation-induced cloudiness,” International Journal of Climatology, 32 (2012): 1745-1753.

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/joc.2392/abstract

https://www.metabunk.org/new-penn-state-study-into-the-affect-of-contrails-on-local-weather.t6407/

None that I know have addressed the long-term impact of contrails on climate, although the idea of unintended consequences is interesting.

So... basically... they're saying that the world governments just accidentalyied the planet.. thats a first.
 

MikeC

Closed Account
"Accidental Geoengineering" might be a bit of an oxymoron, but unfortunately it's not an entirely unreasonable term.

Yeah I know - but I was suddenly struck by a channeling of my dad's primary school teacher grammer Nazi :D
 

skephu

Senior Member.
I find it outrageous that the top hit in Google for the word "geoengineering" is Dane Wigington's site, ranked higher than Wikipedia. As geoengineering is mentioned more and more in mainstream media, people will search for the word and end up on Dane's web site. Google even lends it credibility by showing the definition of the word from that site.
 

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