Absence of contrails in old films

c.eileen

Member
As you all know, the absence of contrails in old films is sited as evidence of chemtrails. The reason for this absence is an artistic one. A film (or a photograph) is someone's work of art, and they have a specific vision for what that piece of art work should look like. In years past, films aimed to create some ideal world, one that was unmarred by everyday reality, so the clutter of everyday life was carefully controlled. If a plane cruised into the frame (or the unwanted sound of a train could be heard in the background), shooting stopped, and was resumed after it passed. If a contrail was left behind, shooting resumed in a different direction or another place until the sky was clear again. Errant visual or auditory clutter that was not caught on set would either require a reshoot of the scene or a painful edit (this back before there were computers to clean up such messes). Can you imagine a western with planes flying by in the background? You know that, no matter how remote the location, planes intruded into the frame. So why don't we see or hear them? Because the film makers were careful to avoid getting them into the shot.
These days, films are more reality based*, so such visual clutter as contrails are considered "added production value" rather than a problem. If the contrails weren't already there, the film makers might be tempted to add them with CGI if the presence of such artifacts was important to the film.
There's also the plain fact that there are hundreds of times more planes in the air today than there were decades ago, so it would be much more difficult for a film maker to avoid getting planes and contrails in the frame. At some point, as long as these intrusions do not hurt the film maker's vision, he or she would have to accept them as part of their film.
*Obviously, I'm not referring to sci-fi and fantasy films or pre-aviation historical films.
 

WeedWhacker

Senior Member
As you all know, the absence of contrails in old films is sited as evidence of chemtrails.

Actually, there are numerous examples of contrails that appear in older films....and often in films that are set as "period pieces" (Westerns, Middle Ages, etc) where the director and cinematographer (and editor) either didn't notice or, on low-budget films didn't care that contrails happened to be in the shots.

Let me hunt, there are a raft of resources that cite these examples....someone on MetaBunk likely has a full file folder on his/her computer already...

(Because, just ran into this issue a few months ago, saw clips from a Western circa the 1960s, used as an example....of course, now the film's title has slipped my memory....)
 

c.eileen

Member
Actually, there are numerous examples of contrails that appear in older films....and often in films that are set as "period pieces" (Westerns, Middle Ages, etc) where the director and cinematographer (and editor) either didn't notice or, on low-budget films didn't care that contrails happened to be in the shots.

Let me hunt, there are a raft of resources that cite these examples....someone on MetaBunk likely has a full file folder on his/her computer already...

(Because, just ran into this issue a few months ago, saw clips from a Western circa the 1960s, used as an example....of course, now the film's title has slipped my memory....)


Oh, I know! Years and years ago, I saw a blooper show in TV that showed anomalous artifacts in films, such as passing planes, trucks on the distant highway, some crew member's thermos, unlikely signage, and other weird things. What's really interesting though is that, no matter how many times you watch the same film, you never see that kind of thing until someone points it out, then suddenly, that's all you see! The failings of human perception...a fascinating thing! And one of the reasons why there is a need for this website!
 

c.eileen

Member
Y'know, I keep expecting to see the hero come over the rise in Top Gun togs. I will definitely check out your archive.

Generally speaking, though, film makers really did try to avoid such things.
 

c.eileen

Member
Actually, there are numerous examples of contrails that appear in older films....and often in films that are set as "period pieces" (Westerns, Middle Ages, etc) where the director and cinematographer (and editor) either didn't notice or, on low-budget films didn't care that contrails happened to be in the shots.

Let me hunt, there are a raft of resources that cite these examples....someone on MetaBunk likely has a full file folder on his/her computer already...

(Because, just ran into this issue a few months ago, saw clips from a Western circa the 1960s, used as an example....of course, now the film's title has slipped my memory....)


Actually, IMdB will have notes about artifacts in the "Goofs" sections of their pages.
 

c.eileen

Member
I found this site while looking for photos of contrails pre-1960 in an effort to debunk my sister's growing belief in the chemtrail conspiracy. I found the page with the WWII bomber (B17s?) squadron, copied it, and sent it to my sister along with some other anti-chem stuff I found. Later I looked more into this site and that is when I decided to join. I referred her to it. She hasn't looked at it, or at least she hasn't let up in her chemtrail beliefs. I'm up against people who claim that old photos and old movies which show chemtrails are digital fakes of some kind, and she is inclined to believe them. Is there an example of two photos which have been analyzed for such fakery—one genuine, one fake—that will demonstrate how a fake can be discovered with a simple home computer. Something that I can forward to her to show her that she can analyze photos herself and see the fraud...or lack of one. I have some minor PhotoShop experience and I can sometimes see where a photo has been faked, but I don't have the skills to catch a really good fake, nor show someone else how to discover them. I need to be able to show her that these old photos of persistent contrails are not fake. Seriously, she's scaring herself with this malarky and I'm afraid she's going to end up hiding in her closet, armed and wearing a tinfoil hat.
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
I found this site while looking for photos of contrails pre-1960 in an effort to debunk my sister's growing belief in the chemtrail conspiracy. I found the page with the WWII bomber (B17s?) squadron, copied it, and sent it to my sister along with some other anti-chem stuff I found. Later I looked more into this site and that is when I decided to join. I referred her to it. She hasn't looked at it, or at least she hasn't let up in her chemtrail beliefs. I'm up against people who claim that old photos and old movies which show chemtrails are digital fakes of some kind, and she is inclined to believe them. Is there an example of two photos which have been analyzed for such fakery—one genuine, one fake—that will demonstrate how a fake can be discovered with a simple home computer. Something that I can forward to her to show her that she can analyze photos herself and see the fraud...or lack of one. I have some minor PhotoShop experience and I can sometimes see where a photo has been faked, but I don't have the skills to catch a really good fake, nor show someone else how to discover them. I need to be able to show her that these old photos of persistent contrails are not fake. Seriously, she's scaring herself with this malarky and I'm afraid she's going to end up hiding in her closet, armed and wearing a tinfoil hat.

There are ways of detecting fake photos, but then there are ways of getting around those detectors. The best way of proving they are genuine is to get original copies of books that have the photos in. I have several such books, which can be found quite cheap online. I recommend this one:

https://plus.google.com/photos/107393796095434664991/albums/5363662113705530081?banne

$15 on Amazon for a used copy:
http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-list...2&keywords=clouds+of+the+world&condition=used
 

WeedWhacker

Senior Member
I found the page with the WWII bomber (B17s?) squadron, copied it, and sent it to my sister along with some other anti-chem stuff I found.

If you refer to these images:

https://www.google.com/search?q=b-17 contrails&newwindow=1&rlz=1C1CHFX_enUS499US499&es_sm=122&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=n7B-U82LIMveoASC2YGQBQ&ved=0CCgQsAQ&biw=1589&bih=735

Well, interspersed in there there are some B-17s, surely....and many others. There are YouTube links as well. Simply search IN YouTube, you will find those videos (if you can watch videos).

Here's one:

Later I looked more into this site and that is when I decided to join. I referred her to it. She hasn't looked at it, or at least she hasn't let up in her chemtrail beliefs.

Well, as a pilot for over 40 years, who knows for a fact that "chem"trails are just a modern 'Urban Myth', I wish you all the best in helping your sister to understand the science of contrails, and the facts as well.
 

Pete Tar

Senior Member.
Later I looked more into this site and that is when I decided to join. I referred her to it. She hasn't looked at it, or at least she hasn't let up in her chemtrail beliefs.
If she is travelling in chemtrail circles then she's already heard that metabunk and contrailscience are at the forefront of some vague 'disinformation' campaign. The appeal to reason would be to check what is being referenced and go to the sources - all these sites do is gather information that is out there and can be looked into, none of it is 'invented' here.
 

Leifer

Senior Member.
If she is travelling in chemtrail circles then she's already heard that metabunk and contrailscience are at the forefront of some vague 'disinformation' campaign.
Perhaps ask her if she is willing to examine all sides of the issue, before making a decision.
Unfortunately, there is a popular movement to judge what we say here....as "disinfo".
A common problem with this thinking is, people rarely attempt to factually describe or debunk our supposed "disinfo".

Quite often, any individual offering an explanation that's anything close to a gov't explanation....are liars, because gov't can't be trusted. There are a lot of pre-judgments in these areas.
.....and, a pre-judgment is technically defined as "prejudice".
 

Hevach

Senior Member.
Some filmmakers used to go to crazy lengths to make sure there were no contrails in their shots for the sake of authenticity. As the Spartacus shot shows, some didn't bother or gave up. But there were some that would redesign entire scenes, change locales, or take days on a scene waiting for clear enough skies.

You don't always see as many contrails in modern films as real life, either. Take The Avengers or Transformers 3 and their big city battles, what should have been busy airspace shooting in New York and Chicago. There are several graphics companies that do this sort of touch up work. The same company that CGI'd out Superman's tights bulge in Superman Returns also removes a lot of other flying objects like contrails and airplanes.
 

Trailspotter

Senior Member.
Funny enough, I've just been browsing our TV channels and spotted contrails in the El Cid movie (1961), shown on BBC 2. They are in the beginning of one of the key scenes, Battle for Calahorra:
or at 40:55 in the full movie:
 

Mick West

Administrator
Staff member
Funny enough, I've just been browsing our TV channels and spotted contrails in the El Cid movie (1961), shown on BBC 2. They are in the beginning of one of the key scenes, Battle for Calahorra:
or at 40:55 in the full movie:
Can you take some screenshots? Those videos can't be viewed in the US
 

Balance

Senior Member.
Coincidentally, I caught the film "633 Squadron" on TV earlier (which was made in 1964). Appx 25mins into the film as some german fighters were strafing the RAF squadron's airfield I noticed high in the sky, two long persistent contrails.

ETA: It's barely visible in this captured video but if someone has access to an original copy it's much clearer. The contrails are in frame from 25:51-25:54 as the 'schimtt's bug out. Centre of screen between the clouds one trail goes horizontal and a second trail almost vertically intersects.

 
Last edited:

wotgorilla

Member
I found this site while looking for photos of contrails pre-1960 in an effort to debunk my sister's growing belief in the chemtrail conspiracy. I found the page with the WWII bomber (B17s?) squadron, copied it, and sent it to my sister along with some other anti-chem stuff I found. Later I looked more into this site and that is when I decided to join. I referred her to it. She hasn't looked at it, or at least she hasn't let up in her chemtrail beliefs. I'm up against people who claim that old photos and old movies which show chemtrails are digital fakes of some kind, and she is inclined to believe them. Is there an example of two photos which have been analyzed for such fakery—one genuine, one fake—that will demonstrate how a fake can be discovered with a simple home computer. Something that I can forward to her to show her that she can analyze photos herself and see the fraud...or lack of one. I have some minor PhotoShop experience and I can sometimes see where a photo has been faked, but I don't have the skills to catch a really good fake, nor show someone else how to discover them. I need to be able to show her that these old photos of persistent contrails are not fake. Seriously, she's scaring herself with this malarky and I'm afraid she's going to end up hiding in her closet, armed and wearing a tinfoil hat.
Just throwing this out there, but for many that I've met, the appeal to logic and rationale doesn't work. It just makes people dig their heels in more. Often, it's an emotional issue, and that's the best way to approach it if you have a relationship with the believer. The conspiracy beliefs are just the symptoms of the underlying cause.
 

Hama Neggs

Senior Member.
Just throwing this out there, but for many that I've met, the appeal to logic and rationale doesn't work. It just makes people dig their heels in more. Often, it's an emotional issue, and that's the best way to approach it if you have a relationship with the believer. The conspiracy beliefs are just the symptoms of the underlying cause.

Yes. Somehow they just dodge the logic and facts and brush it and you off as being merely "annoying" as if it was meaningless drivel you were offering. I would have thought it impossible if I had not seen it. It seems to be some sort of universal Human reaction. I saw the same thing with the "Planet X" believers. They just get defensive when you show them where they are wrong and simply shut down their intellectual capacity to even grasp what you are talking about. That's when they call you a "shill".
 
Thread starter Related Articles Forum Replies Date
Mick West When Absence of Evidence is Evidence of Absence in Conspiracy Theories Practical Debunking 35
Mick West Three Contrails "Descending" over Denver on Jan 31, 2021 [Military, C-17A Globemasters] Skydentify - What is that Thing in the Sky? 1
S Lasers Making Contrails Contrails and Chemtrails 1
Mick West Curved and Looped Contrails in SoCal [San Diego Delays] Skydentify - What is that Thing in the Sky? 1
Mick West Crazy Contrails from LAX Ground Stop Skydentify - What is that Thing in the Sky? 1
D Explained: Photo of 747 with Contrails Only on One Side [Fake, April Fool] Contrails and Chemtrails 21
Mick West Infrared Photos of Clouds and Contrails Images and Videos: Contrails, Skies, and Aviation 18
Mick West Moonlight Contrails Images and Videos: Contrails, Skies, and Aviation 1
Mick West YouTube adds Encyclopedia Britannica article on Contrails to "Chemtrail" Videos Contrails and Chemtrails 18
Mick West Aerodynamic Contrails at 27,000 to 31,000 feet near Sacramento Images and Videos: Contrails, Skies, and Aviation 2
Trailblazer Sharp boundary between contrails and clear sky Images and Videos: Contrails, Skies, and Aviation 1
Mick West Plane Flies in Front of Super Blue Blood Moon Eclipse Images and Videos: Contrails, Skies, and Aviation 1
Clouds Givemethewillies Contrail lobes or mamma? The importance of correct terminology Contrails and Chemtrails 0
cloudspotter How Changing Weather Conditions Make Contrails Show Up Contrails and Chemtrails 9
Trailspotter Contrail cross over Tasmania and spinning contrails over Victoria Images and Videos: Contrails, Skies, and Aviation 0
Mick West Explained: Manurewa NZ, 'Extra-terrestrial' Fireball Jumps Up [Contrail, Altitude change] Skydentify - What is that Thing in the Sky? 7
Mick West Halifax, NS: Regularly Spaced Gaps in Contrails [Ethiopian Flight 501] Skydentify - What is that Thing in the Sky? 47
Mick West Some Perspective on Perspective Foreshortening - Contrails and UFOs Skydentify - What is that Thing in the Sky? 1
Mick West Explained: Viral Video of 787 Leaving Thick Contrails with Forced Perspective Skydentify - What is that Thing in the Sky? 1
Mick West A Plane Flying Across the Face of the Sun, with Contrails [Virgin Flight 353] Skydentify - What is that Thing in the Sky? 7
TEEJ Contrails filmed from commercial flight over the Irish Sea - 6th May 2017 Skydentify - What is that Thing in the Sky? 2
ki_cz Contrails 'breaking up' clouds Contrails and Chemtrails 10
E Can someone tell me what these are? [Grid pattern contrails] Skydentify - What is that Thing in the Sky? 7
P Can someone please explain these trails at sunset [Contrails] Skydentify - What is that Thing in the Sky? 13
Mick West There Are No New Clouds, Just New Latin Classifications Contrails and Chemtrails 2
MikeC BBC: Biofuels 'could limit jet contrails' Contrails and Chemtrails 10
Mick West Spiral Contrails viewed from the International Space Station Skydentify - What is that Thing in the Sky? 12
ki_cz Claim: Satellite imagery showing 'sheet' of contrails Contrails and Chemtrails 7
Mick West GOES-16 Satellite Images of Contrails Images and Videos: Contrails, Skies, and Aviation 0
Mick West Explained: Contrails Appear "Hot" in Thermal Imaging because the Sky Appears Very Cold Skydentify - What is that Thing in the Sky? 4
Mick West Explained: Chilean Navy "UFO" video - Aerodynamic Contrails, Flight IB6830 Skydentify - What is that Thing in the Sky? 186
Clouds Givemethewillies Why do inner contrails spread more than outer contrails? Contrails and Chemtrails 9
Mick West Contrails Hidden In 1950s and 1960s Family Photos Images and Videos: Contrails, Skies, and Aviation 2
Mick West Four Engines, Flying West over Sacramento Skydentify - What is that Thing in the Sky? 6
Clouds Givemethewillies Persistent Aerodynamic Contrails From Propellor Tips Contrails and Chemtrails 12
Mick West A Sunlit Contrail Viewed From the Side Images and Videos: Contrails, Skies, and Aviation 0
Mick West Close Up Videos of Contrails Forming And Evolving Images and Videos: Contrails, Skies, and Aviation 19
Mick West Some "Black" Shadowed Aerodynamic Contrails Images and Videos: Contrails, Skies, and Aviation 4
Mick West Relative Humidity at Flight Altitudes. Resources and Contrail prediction. Contrails and Chemtrails 11
Mick West What's the Highest Contrail You've Taken a Photo Of? Contrails and Chemtrails 8
Mick West P900 Plane and Contrails Photos and Video Images and Videos: Contrails, Skies, and Aviation 17
Mick West Persistent Aerodynamic Contrail Forming @28,500 on 787 Images and Videos: Contrails, Skies, and Aviation 0
steve holmes Problems with Identifying Contrails in FlightRadar24 Contrails and Chemtrails 57
Mick West Why Were There Contrails Today, But Not Yesterday? It's the Weather! Contrails and Chemtrails 21
Mick West How Do You Take Good Photos of High Altitude Planes and Contrails? Images and Videos: Contrails, Skies, and Aviation 1
Mick West Debunked: Irrefutable Film Footage Of Climate Engineering Aerosol Spraying [Aerodynamic Contrails] Contrails and Chemtrails 4
Mick West Contrails over Sting & Peter Gabriel Concert in Lake Tahoe Skydentify - What is that Thing in the Sky? 5
Mick West Giant Dark Persistent Aerodynamic Contrail Images and Videos: Contrails, Skies, and Aviation 6
Kaylene Contrails in USA vs. Austraila Contrails and Chemtrails 4
C Strange Flickering in Contrail Video Posted in Earlier Thread [Focussing artifacts] Contrails and Chemtrails 7
Related Articles


















































Related Articles

Top