1. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Moderator Staff Member


    So as mentioned earlier, they found a small amount of barium, but not aluminium.

    Translated:

    A PC6 [plane] from a private skydiving company is then flown into the clouds. The machine is equipped with measuring instruments which are intended to measure the barium and aluminum content of the air at an altitude of eight kilometers. A first flight brings certainty, discovering a barium level 10 times higher than the blank value. Barium should not occur at this level. Aluminium, however, was not found. Such a financially costly flight has never before been carried out and documented. So, you get to see a world premiere here. This turns the issue of chemtrails from a conspiracy theory into a serious issue that needs to be investigated. Because, as I said, there are no studies on this. The only Swiss study available for barium in the environment is that of the National Air Pollution Monitoring Network (NABEL), which studied the fine particle load in Switzerland examined 10 year intervals, but at ground level. Here, barium was found, with an increase in urban centres, but this is, for example, due to the abrasion of brakes, according to the experimenters. Had it been chemtrails, there would not be these differences between town and country.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2016
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  2. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    It has been released on DVD. Does not seem to be available for streaming yet.
    http://www.overcast-the-movie.com/

    There are several "outtakes" just published:
    https://www.youtube.com/user/OVERCASTTHEMOVIE/videos

    But this is probably going to get the most attention:

    Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ic4dml5oUVk


    Scientist analyzes jet fuel, engine crud, and jet exhaust, finds various traces of metal, as expected. But the filmmakers act all horrified at the "pollution"

    Jim Lee commented:
     
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  3. M Bornong

    M Bornong Senior Member

    I'm not a scientist, was the ambient air test adequate for a control? From what I read, it was a stagnant air test. For a proper control shouldn't they have run the ambient air through the system at a similar volume through the instruments as the volume produced by the engines? I still agree that the final results are pollution is bad, planes contribute.

    I'm just not sure they explained everything in the ambient air.
     
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  4. cloudspotter

    cloudspotter Senior Member


    Why is she focusing on aluminium and barium? Is that in the editing or have the film makers specifically asked her to?
     
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  5. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    Probably both. The actual research does not single them out at all. See attached presentation
     

    Attached Files:

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  6. Hama Neggs

    Hama Neggs Senior Member

    " For a proper control shouldn't they have run the ambient air through the system at a similar volume through the instruments as the volume produced by the engines?"

    They would, I think, just have to test the same volume of air as taken from the engine exhaust. They didn't take the entire output of the engine and test it, right?
     
  7. M Bornong

    M Bornong Senior Member

    That's what I'm getting at, how many Cubic feet of ambient air were being pushed through the instruments by the engines, compared to just opening the doors of the chamber and letting the ambient air passively go by the instruments?
    I'm just wondering if more of the metals found in the exhaust came from the dust in the ambient air, than is accounted for?
     
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  8. Hama Neggs

    Hama Neggs Senior Member

    Looks like no ambient air was forced to go through. In other words, bad science.
     
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  9. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    I don't think it's a problem, as proportions are relative to the total collected solids, or individual particles, not a mass of air.

    What I posted above is a link to a powerpoint presentation. The full article (Chemical characterization of freshly emitted particulate matter from aircraft exhaust using single particle mass spectrometry) is paywalled, and was posted in a closed group of Facebook, but I've not found a publicly available version. I have a copy, but can't post it for copyright reasons.
     
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  10. Hama Neggs

    Hama Neggs Senior Member

    I get that, but if no air is forced through the collector, how can they even get a useful measurement? Just sounds ill-prepared.
     
  11. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    They mention this problem:
    I'm not sure this would introduce significant errors though. And it's basically irrelevant to the idea of this being evidence of covert geoengineering. There's no real unexplained high numbers here.
     
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  12. Lisa P

    Lisa P Active Member

    The professor states they tested the fuel and it had aluminium and barium. What we don't know is, is it on purpose for geoengineering to have a cooling effect? Have other people tested it and found the same? I have only looked at the proposals for SRM at 60000+ feet so I have no idea if there is science out there that states adding a bit of aluminium/barium or anything else to the fuel used by commercial jets can offset anthropogenic global warming. My only concern here is if chemicals are being added to combat AGW I want transparency. I am not so concerned about health effects because I drive a car, burn fossil fuels etc so I am a hypocrite if I were to be concerned about minimal amounts of aluminium in jet fuel to help offset the heating effect of contrails and pollution.

    What we as humans tend to do if we aren't rational is we get a snippet of information and make a huge delusional story out of it. This is why I love science as I am very good at making up stories!!

    And remember, as per Wikipedia, 'Tea drinking accounts for a high proportion of aluminum in the human diet'. If you are concerned about aluminium in jet fuel stop drinking tea or other foods that are high. If your blood test are normal then you have nothing to worry about but worry itself ;)
     
  13. M Bornong

    M Bornong Senior Member

    There are small amounts of metal contaminants in your drinking water, due to the conveyance of said water, from what I've read from this study, that's the kind of contamination we are dealing with. In the paper, she states there is a warming effect from contrails.
     
  14. Hama Neggs

    Hama Neggs Senior Member

    Don't overlook that it was found in parts per million. Levels like that can be found in ambient air that gets sucked into the front of the engine from the surrounding atmosphere and also mixed into the exhaust stream behind the engine from the surrounding atmosphere.
     
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  15. skephu

    skephu Senior Member

  16. deirdre

    deirdre Moderator Staff Member

    where did you see a link? al the links in my article are to "before it's news" and the end of the "article" says
    upload_2016-10-1_18-54-57.
     
  17. skephu

    skephu Senior Member

    Here:
    upload_2016-10-2_1-0-16.
     
  18. deirdre

    deirdre Moderator Staff Member

    thanks, i looked 4 times! :) Do you mean the documentary muddies the waters for the Conspiracy Theorists?
     
  19. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    I have a DVD of the documentary (I had to pay for it). I think any impact from this is really going to be limited if it remains pay-to-view.
     
  20. skephu

    skephu Senior Member

    It muddies the waters for its viewers by conflating chemtrails (which would be deliberate spraying) with pollution in airplane exhaust.

    Interestingly, I also found the same article on another site with a different author named, and this seems to be the original:
    http://wakeup-world.com/2016/09/01/...poses-whats-really-behind-airplane-contrails/
     
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  21. skephu

    skephu Senior Member

    The synopsis of the movie says:
    From what I gleaned from various sources about this movie (I haven't seen it), it does not provide conclusive answers at all. Instead it is the type of movie that presents all kinds of stuff while keeping an air of mystery and then leaves the decision to the viewer.
     
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  22. deirdre

    deirdre Moderator Staff Member

    yea i saw that too when i was looking up that alleged quote from German Aerospace- because why would anyone say aluminum shouldnt be in the atmosphere? it's in dust, it's everywhere- anyway they are both conspiracy woo sites. so, same old same old.
    It is interesting they have two different authors listed. maybe the author on your first link was just who posted the article on before its news?

    I think if it 'muddies the waters' for nonchemtrailists, that only helps. The population will (well i would anyway) just think "chemtrails are just airplane exhaust, and we have vehicle exhaust/brakepad dust etc everywhere we breathe anyway so why are these people so freaked out about airplanes?"
     
  23. M Bornong

    M Bornong Senior Member

    The video might become available for streaming once they paid off their debts.

    debts.
    https://www.facebook.com/groups/glo...0157508760850302&comment_tracking={"tn":"R3"}

    Russ Tanner is not happy with the trailers, it seems to go against some of his claims.

    Russ.

    https://www.facebook.com/groups/globalskywatch/permalink/10157537443065302/?match=cnVzcyB0YW5uZXI=

    http://globalskywatch.com/chemtrails/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=17693#Post17693



    Overcast has offered to send Russ a copy of the movie to smooth things out.

    RussVsOvercast.
     
  24. Spectrar Ghost

    Spectrar Ghost Senior Member

    Do you think Russ is aware the 737 has never been a tanker?
     
  25. Landru

    Landru Moderator Staff Member

    Has the 747 or the dc-9?
     
  26. skephu

    skephu Senior Member

    Regarding "Overcast Themovie"'s claims above, I have checked out the "Swiss Federal Institute of Technology" study, which has been published this year:

    Abegglen, M., Brem, B. T., Ellenrieder, M., Durdina, L., Rindlisbacher, T., Wang, J., ... & Sierau, B. (2016). Chemical characterization of freshly emitted particulate matter from aircraft exhaust using single particle mass spectrometry. Atmospheric Environment, 134, 181-197.
    http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1352231016302424

    It contains this table reporting the metals found in jet fuel and oil:

    upload_2016-10-2_3-56-47.

    As you see, it does not even list barium separately because its concentration was on the order of a few tenths of mg/kg (could not be measured accurately), so it was lumped into the "Others" category. Most of these metals probably get into the jet fuel as simple contamination from the environment.
     
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  27. Spectrar Ghost

    Spectrar Ghost Senior Member

    Only as fire tankers (which Russ calls contractor, I assume). Erickson operates some MD-87s (aka DC-9-87)
    [​IMG]

    and then there are the evergreen 747 tankers...
    [​IMG]
     
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  28. MikeC

    MikeC Senior Member

    This means that all those A380's are producing contrails! :D
     
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  29. Hama Neggs

    Hama Neggs Senior Member

    How can any rational person believe that no marked commercial planes are leaving trails in the sky? How is it possible to avoid knowing that is an utterly false notion?
     
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  30. Dan Page

    Dan Page Active Member

    Exactly, this is so easily proven these days with FR24 and a good zoom camera. Perhaps THEY need to "look up".
     
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  31. skephu

    skephu Senior Member

    Apparently the filmmakers think otherwise:
    upload_2016-10-2_12-34-20.
     
  32. Jay Reynolds

    Jay Reynolds Senior Member

    The recognition that when people see persistent contrails they are seeing commercial flights rather than air tankers
    is the Achilles Heel of the idea of chemtrails. The leadership know this vulnerability and dodge it because of the peril.
    It 'took out' G. Edward Griffin who co-produced the WITWATS movie, probably the only major figure to back out of support for chemtrails.
    https://www.metabunk.org/14-years-of-chemtrails-comments-and-suggestions.t100/
     
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  33. WeedWhacker

    WeedWhacker Senior Member

    I just want to add one thing.....the word "OVERCAST" in the movie description caught me eye.

    I began learning to fly at a stupid young age, to most,,,at 14. Just as driving a car, you can learn,
    but not be "licensed" until a certain age.

    So, as I have had a long career in aviation, many decades....the term "overcast" is a term I've dealt with, have seen,
    and am familiar with....since AT LEAST 1973.
     
  34. WeedWhacker

    WeedWhacker Senior Member

    Here's the thing....A typical airliner, when viewed from the ground, and it's 35,000 feet above? It just looks "white"....I've noticed a few
    airlines have begun to PAINT the belly of the fuselage, and even underside of the wings....so that the nonsense of the "chemtrail debate" can be finally put to rest.
     
  35. Hama Neggs

    Hama Neggs Senior Member

    Is Griffin completely out of the movement? Did he say anything at the end? Sorry if that is shown in your link.
     
  36. Hama Neggs

    Hama Neggs Senior Member

    I just today looked at a vid from a chemtrail believer. I guess he thinks the windows would be LOTS bigger than they really are relative to the plane. Low-res vid, which he thinks proves that the plane "has no windows". Even with a decent amount of zoom, you still can't make out windows which ARE there.
     
  37. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Moderator Staff Member

    Meanwhile Look-up.org.uk have a decent zoom camera and are taking videos of easily identifiable commercial airliners leaving trails. But none of the chemtrail followers seem to notice the glaring inconsistencies in the narrative.
     
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  38. TEEJ

    TEEJ Senior Member

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  39. Jay Reynolds

    Jay Reynolds Senior Member

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  40. M Bornong

    M Bornong Senior Member

    Evergreen is now under new ownership.

    GlobalSupertanker.
    http://globalsupertanker.com/
     
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