1. Trailspotter

    Trailspotter Senior Member

    Other people also noted the contrail star above Manchester and now its pictures make rounds on "chemtrail" sites. Here are a few from
    the Chemtrails Project UK and its members' facebook pages:

    10383509_1428118847475042_2280212881095315149_n. 10462802_10154345501715595_9219075861439024019_n.
    10497159_1421166254832215_7838919896412473770_o. 10306396_10201191800716426_5631705595613944328_n. 10354172_10201191837677350_9104405930334851647_n.

    The first four pictures apparently were taken before and the last one after the David's picture above (post #139 in https://www.metabunk.org/threads/co...ther-signs-in-the-sky.3659/page-4#post-111989). There are nine contrails in the last picture with five of them making the star. Comparison of photos allows the deduction of partial order of plane appearances and their headings relative to the camera (left or right, toward or away).

    Unlike previous contrail pentagrams, it is known where and when this star was observed. Moreover, the photos provide sufficient information for its explanation. In particular, the last two photos taken in Stockport area with a ten-minute interval at 18:40 and 18:50 BST (on 20th June 2014) show the contrail star position relative the sun, the azimuth and altitude of which at that moment are readily calculated. These data place the contrail star northwest of Manchester with its centre being somewhere over Bolton. In ten minutes between the two Stockport photos the star went up in the sky relative to the sun, that is, it was brought closer to the camera position by a high altitude north-westerly wind.

    Fligthradar24 playback for this area from 17:25 UTC till 17:50 UTC shows nine planes flying above this area at the contrail altitudes:

    The order of appearances and headings of these planes are fully consistent with the photos. The contrails from the flights EZY49EY, VIR302G, DHL5CK, RYR39CF and H2B (1, 2, 3, 5 and 6) probably have made the star. Taking the wind factor into account, I have modelled these contrails on Google Earth, using the Flightradar24 data on flight routes and altitudes:
    Manchester Star from above.
    The earliest blue contrail was formed about five minutes before the green and yellow contrails and ten minutes before the orange and red ones. I've moved it in the SE direction by about 13 km parallel to its flight route (purple line), which corresponds to a modest wind speed of 80 km/h or 50 mph. The green and yellow contrails have also been moved by a half of this distance in the same direction. Note that from above the resulting star looks very asymmetric, but from the ground it looks more proportional due to the perspective:
    Manchester Star from Stockport.
    Here is a view of the modelled contrails from the centre of Stockport (compare with photo #4).
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2014
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  2. mrfintoil

    mrfintoil Active Member

    Incredible work.
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  3. WeedWhacker

    WeedWhacker Senior Member

    Kudos....your level of devotion and attention to detail....outstanding!!!!!
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  4. RFMarine

    RFMarine Member

    and i thought it was supposed to be a secret yet they blabber all about it in the sky. lolz
  5. Trailspotter

    Trailspotter Senior Member

  6. David Fraser

    David Fraser Senior Member

    So does this mean my application to join the Freemasons wasn't successful after all?
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  7. JDubyah

    JDubyah Member

    That's just great work. Good stuff.
  8. Presumably this kind of frivolous spraying would be counterintuitive wouldn't it? Surely it would make more sense to deliver the toxins in a regular pattern of straight lines in order to ensure coverage. I'm no Illuminati deathbringer but I have worked with spray paint and this kind of wastage doesn't wash.
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  9. Hevach

    Hevach Senior Member

    Well, if you want to be efficient then you also wouldn't spray at cruising altitude, and you wouldn't do it in a form that created persistent trails that stayed aloft for hours and dispersed while still at altitude.
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  10. WeedWhacker

    WeedWhacker Senior Member

    ;) Yeah, I know how to use spray paint too...generally I've found that trying to use spray paint when several miles away from the object you wish to "paint" is somewhat ineffective....
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  11. Pfft, you say ineffective, I say subtle... :p
  12. Brainiachick

    Brainiachick Active Member

    Well, my application to join the Illuminati has apparently failed as well ;-). So funny, really. Who would waste time, energy, and financial resources in spraying targets that are so far away and also leave such glaring evidence behind?
  13. Pete Tar

    Pete Tar Senior Member

    When people filter things through the view of some kind of 'spiritual warfare' for domination over people's minds, such things make sense. They're interpreting their experience of the world through symbols, and coincidences and randomness do not exist for them.
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  14. Brainiachick

    Brainiachick Active Member

    Pete, you are absolutely right and it is a real pity. Luckily, there are some pretty spiritual people out there who appreciate their own intelligence and analytical ability and don't buy into these sort of warped symbolisms. These are nothing but just contrails - the patterns are pure coincidence. And I rather like this particular pattern - does that make me one of the bad guys/Illuminatis/NWO/Freemasons ;-)?
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  15. Cy Halothrin

    Cy Halothrin New Member

    My first post on this forum...

    I live in Taiwan, but formerly resided in the USA. I want to say that I've never seen such vivid contrails/chemtrails (like the ones depicted here) in Taiwan. I have indeed noticed them in the USA. I have a theory about that, which could be totally wrong, but here goes...

    Taiwan actually has stricter emissions controls than the USA, at least for jet fuel. Acid rain used to be a problem here (mostly due to coal burning, but also motor vehicle emissions). They've cracked down pretty hard in recent years on sulfur content of fuel, as sulfur emissions from burning fossil fuels is well-known to form sulfuric acid and thus acid rain. So our problem with acid rain has greatly diminished.

    I'm not a big believer in chemtrail conspiracies, but high sulfur content in jet fuel could certainly result in far more visible and durable contrails. So could the difference simply be due to Taiwan's more strict jet fuel sulfur-content restrictions? Since I don't know just how strict the USA is on these emissions, I'll have to leave my own question unanswered for now.

    I know that a number of you on this forum are in the EU. I don't know anything about your jet fuel emission regulations there, but perhaps some of you do. Would be interested to hear more about the visibility of contrails/chemtrails in various countries around the world, versus sulfur content regulations in such countries.
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  16. deirdre

    deirdre Moderator Staff Member

    interesting idea. but don't American/English planes fly to Taiwan?
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  17. Cy Halothrin

    Cy Halothrin New Member

    Hi Deirdre. Yes, indeed aircraft from the USA fly to/from Taiwan. I don't live near the two international airports we have here, so I don't get to see their contrails. On landing, jets are idling anyway, and don't put out much vapor. Also, the landing approach at both airports is over water. I assume that when departing Taiwan, they refuel here, so whatever jet fuel they use for take-off should be in compliance with local standards.

    The small city I live in does have a domestic airport, and we also have a nearby military base with lots of fighter jets (old F5's for training, newer F16's for getting serious). I never see anything but very short and brief (a few seconds in duration) contrails. Plenty of noise though from those military jets though.
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2014
  18. WeedWhacker

    WeedWhacker Senior Member

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  19. David Fraser

    David Fraser Senior Member

    Just out of interest can you link me to the legislation requiring low sulphur jet fuel in Taiwan. Just a Google shows that Taipei is still supplying standard Jet A1 http://www.uvair.com/jet-fuel-suppliers/RCTP-Taipei-Taiwan-jet-a1-fuel

    There have been numerous studies conducted with regards to sulphur and contrail formation and it was found that tbe difference on contrail formation between low and high sulphur fuels was that low sulphur form a little later than high sulphur. Sorry I can't quote but read page 36 of this document. http://www.easa.europa.eu/system/files/dfu/EASA_SULPHUR_Project_11-01-2010.pdf
  20. Ross Marsden

    Ross Marsden Senior Member

    Hello Cy Halothrin, and welcome.
    Any aircraft you see on approach to (or departure from) descended out of (climb into) possible contrail altitude something like 60 to 100 miles away from the airport.
    Also the contrails you see over Taiwan will be from aircraft that are overflying and are on routes between quite distant (from Taiwan) locations.

    Contrails are all about the atmospheric conditions at flight level and the mixing of the hot water vapor in the exhaust with the environment the plane is flying through. It's very very little to do with the fuel except to provide the H for the H2O.
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  21. Cy Halothrin

    Cy Halothrin New Member

    Thanks for pointing that out Ross. I should mention that we do have a major international air route just off the east coast of Taiwan with quite a bit of traffic on it going in a north-south direction (ie Japan-Korea-Taiwan to/from Philippines-Singapore-Indonesia-Australia). I can see that from my house - lots of jets far off in the distance at cruising altitude, perhaps one every 5 minutes. I can hardly make them out in the daytime - that is to say, no visible contrails and the aircraft themselves are just tiny specks. The aircraft are much more visible at night thanks to their lights.

    Agreed, contrails are water vapor, not "smoke" as some people mistakenly think. But high-sulfur content in the fuel should lead to longer-lasting, more visible contrails. Thus, the conspiracy theories about governments secretly forcing airlines to add sulfur to their fuel to create more cloud cover and thus reduce global warming. But I'm not a believer in that particular conspiracy. If airlines are using high-sulfur fuel nowadays, it's probably to do with economics. Fact is, sulfur is a nuisance pollutant in crude oil - its presence leads to acid rain (sulfuric acid). Removing sulfur is expensive, and high-sulfur oil (called "sour crude") is cheaper than low-sulfur ("sweet crude"). So money could be saved by using high-sulfur fuel, but at the risk of air pollution and greater engine wear.

    I confess that I do not have figures to back this up. I cannot say how much money airlines could save by using high-sulfur fuel, at the cost of having to replace engine components more frequently. I wish I had the resources to run around and take jet fuel samples from various airports in the world, and compare the sulfur content to see if there is a correlation with the presence of "chemtrails." Alas, I will have to leave that to someone else.
  22. Ross Marsden

    Ross Marsden Senior Member

    Contrails are not "vapor" becaues water vapor is an invisible gas. Contrails are composed of ice clouds that started out as frozen condensation which formed when the exhaust+environment mixture reached water saturation a short distance behind the engine.
    If the environment is not cold enough, water saturation is not reached and the water in the exhust remains an invisible vapor.
    This is not the whole story. It's a good start.
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  23. WeedWhacker

    WeedWhacker Senior Member

    Yes, excellent again to clarify points (that are NOT mere "semantics") as was suggested earlier.

    Scientific clarity, and specific terms are important.

    ETA: I have seen this countless times, in the vernacular, when people say something like "I saw the steam..." (etc). No, you do NOT "see steam". You see the condensation effects OF the steam as it inter-acts with the moisture already present in the atmosphere.

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  24. Ross Marsden

    Ross Marsden Senior Member

    The density and volume of persistent contrails depends on the extent of ice-supersaturation. A few % over, ten thin and whispy. Tens of % over, then thick and luscious.
    The amount of sulfur in the exhaust has a bit of an effect as it is a source of freezing nuclii.
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  25. WeedWhacker

    WeedWhacker Senior Member

    Oh dear....yes this is true, there ARE nuclei particles in ALL fossil-fuel-burning engines' exhaust...there are ALSO nuclei from the approximately 5 to perhaps 300 TONS of space "junk" that enter the Earth's atmosphere every day also. (This is NATURAL "dust" and other small particles that exist in space, and burn up in our atmosphere, to become "dust"...and particulate nuclei for cloud formation, By The Way!). [**] (see below)...

    ONE source for my figures...(estimates vary):

    [**] THIS is for 'vindog'. I would hope that those who are truly interested in science...the FULL RANGE of science, will take the time to investigate and learn, as a result of their searching.

    It is way TOO easy to be lied to, and then fall into that "lie"....the best solution is to do the proper diligence, and LEARN.
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2014
  26. Trailspotter

    Trailspotter Senior Member

    Hi Cy Halothrin,

    I've looked at the satellite images of Taiwan on the EOSDIS Worldview, there are some long contrails pictured in some of them, for example, yesterday, July 6th, or, at a better quality, on June 19th, 2014:
    (cropped from http://lance-modis.eosdis.nasa.gov/imagery/subsets/?subset=AERONET_NCU_Taiwan.2014170.terra.250m)

    There are quite a few contrails along the west and southwest coast casting shadows on the ground and water. There seem to be some contrails on the east side, but these would probably obscured from the ground by low clouds. This composite image is taken at 2:55 UTC, or 10:55 of your local time. The Flightradar24 playback for this date from 2:40 UTC shows that air traffic along the west coast of Taiwan is greater than along the east coast:
    Screen shot 2014-07-07 at 20.29.12.
    These flight routes correlate well with the locations and directions of the observed contrails

    I would speculate here that the conditions for contrail formation near Taiwan are more likely to occur over South China Sea than over open Pacific Ocean and you simply live on the "wrong" coast for their regular observations. Otherwise, there is nothing special about contrail formation in Taiwan compared to other countries with substantial air traffic.

    Having noted from the satellite images that June 18-19, 2014 were good contrail days in your country, I've searched flickr for ground images taken in Taiwan on these dates:

    There are quite a few contrail pictures taken mostly from Penghu County, situated off the west coast:

    but also from the middle of the country:
    Last edited: Jul 7, 2014
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  27. Trailspotter

    Trailspotter Senior Member

    There is another photo of the Manchester contrail star posted by waynos on ATS:
    I do not have an ATS account to post a link to this thread there and ask the guy about when (the exact time) and where (approximate location) this photo had been taken. Could anybody help me here, please.

    EDIT: @Rob48 (ATS userID) Many thanks. TS

    EDIT(2): @waynos
    Thank you for the info on ATS:

    From the position of the contrail star relative the Sun I did expect that your picture had been taken near Stockport and hoped that the knowledge of more exact location would allow direct comparison of the observed and modelled contrails on Google Earth :(
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2014
  28. Ross Marsden

    Ross Marsden Senior Member

    Trailspotter, could you give us a bit of a tutorial on how you model contrails, or the path of an aircraft, on Google Earth?
    Maybe start a new thread for that. Thanks in antici - Pation.
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  29. WeedWhacker

    WeedWhacker Senior Member


    CANNOT resist:

    (AT the end).....
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2014
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  30. Trailspotter

    Trailspotter Senior Member

    Just dotting the i's and crossing the t's in the Manchester contrail star study.

    A closer look at the available photos collected in this and related threads showed that two of them are taken from very close locations at practically the same time:
    Screen shot 2014-07-13 at 09.44.39.

    The left picture is taken just a few seconds after the right one. Both pictures have apparently the same FOVs, with the size and shape of the contrail star being very similar. In the left picture, the sun is just outside the frame but its position can be inferred as the divergence point of sun glare beams. Relative the sun, the star in the left picture is slightly lower and more to the right than in the right picture. This suggests that the left camera location was to the left and behind the right camera location relative their common viewing direction.

    The location of the latter has already been established in the related thread. Using the above information, I've identified the location of the left photo in the same suburb Brinnington, approximately 450 metres away from the location of the right photo:
    Brinnington viewpoints.

    This location is inside a back garden and cannot be seen in Google StreetView, but I verified it by adding this photo to Google Earth:
    Pentagram left photo overlay.
    The three houses and brick shed, which are seen in the photo, match their footprints on Google Earth.

    The two cameras are separated by about 220 metres perpendicular to their viewing direction (orange line), whereas the contrail star is about 22 km away. That is, in a pseudo stereo image made from the two photos, the star would be seen as an object 6-7 metres away would be seen by naked eyes:
    stereo contrail star.

    The stereoscopic effect in the image is not great, but is sufficient to show that
    1) all these contrails are horizontal;
    2) they are at the different altitudes (as expected from FR24 data)
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2014
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  31. Lord Hexagon

    Lord Hexagon Member

    It's my opinion that symbols in the sky should be a separate discussion, in some ways, from chemtrails, because I know of situations where symbols are fully intended! In May, 2014 (I believe the 25th) I watched the blue angels over my house (only a few hundred feet above my house) repeatedly make symbols in the sky. Why? It was the USAFA graduation and I live next to the academy. At this time, I have no desire to initiate a thread on intended symbols (I'm a newbie), but I will continue to read everyone's thread to see if I should upload images.
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  32. David Fraser

    David Fraser Senior Member

    There is a discussion here about pentagrams in the sky
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