1. Pete Tar

    Pete Tar Moderator Staff Member

    Is this credible science? Good if so.


     
  2. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    No. It's just an old scam. They just sell consulting services at $300 per hour, as you try to get the machine to work, for as long as you let them.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2014
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  3. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    This is a particularly silly example. At no point does he unplug it. It's just the mains power driving a motor that then powers a reluctance generator that is lighting some bulbs:
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    So all he is demonstrating is that he's assembled the machine. "Achieving resonance" sounds very new age, but really it's just getting the generator running at the right speed to form a resonant circuit ( a "tank circuit") with the capacitors. Assuming he's genuine he'll now move on to trying to get it to run when it is not plugged in. He may manage to get it to run for a short while off the capacitors, but it will quickly stop. Then he will contact the inventors, and they will charge him consulting fees as they try to troubleshoot what he "did wrong". Eventually he will give up.

    Here's the schematic of the device. The red circuit is the actual generator. The green circuit is a resonant circuit - a "tank circuit" that will store energy (but not create energy).

    [​IMG]

    So all he is doing is spinning it up fast enough so that the generator circuit will light the bulbs, and the tank circuit is resonating. It's unclear to me if the tank circuit does anything.
     
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  4. Pete Tar

    Pete Tar Moderator Staff Member

    Bugger, so I see.
    http://www.overunity.com/14443/quantum-energy-generator-qeg-open-sourced-by-hopegirl/
    http://revolution-green.com/open-sourced-qeg-generator-show-data/

    The fine print is kind of interesting.


     
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  5. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    And unfortunately, based on this post, I suspect they might actually be a group of honest true believers who think they are getting something:
    http://sitsshow.blogspot.com/2014/04/status-of-qeg-build-morocco-build-day-3.html



    "Orbs" are a reference to things like illuminated specks of dust that people mistake for some kind of ethereal spirit, like this one, from a speck of dust close to the lens that is lit by the flash:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orb_(optics)
    [​IMG]

    Unfortunately these people have been conned. But they are so optimistic it's going to take a while before they realize (if ever).
     
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  6. FreiZeitGeist

    FreiZeitGeist Senior Member

  7. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    Another example of the same thing, again they don't disconnect it from the power supply
     
  8. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    This is from the guy who actually sells it, and he claims that he's unplugged it. Impossible to tell from the video, but of course it's trivially easy to fake.


    And this is what he is selling:

    [​IMG]
     
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  9. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    • Winner Winner x 2
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  10. Pete Tar

    Pete Tar Moderator Staff Member


    True believers.
     
  11. WeedWhacker

    WeedWhacker Senior Member

    As soon as I saw the posted examples of their publications and appeals for "Donations", and use the word "ministry", then the scam was self-evident.

    Man, they even throw in "chem"trails... [...]
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 30, 2014
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  12. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    Actually I don't think WITTS are entirely true believers. They are the ones selling things.

    The people in the original video probably are though, which is rather unfortunate. I suppose no great harm will come to them though.

    [Politeness note: WITTS seems to be a scam, there's no problem with pointing that out. They have scammed innocent people - but in order to convince those people that they have been scammed, it's best to be polite in pointing it out. i.e. avoid critiquing their education, etc. ]
     
  13. Pete Tar

    Pete Tar Moderator Staff Member

    I wonder if there's any self-aware irony over their use of FTW.
     
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  14. deirdre

    deirdre Moderator Staff Member

    Does this count as a perpetual motion machine?
     
  15. Pete Tar

    Pete Tar Moderator Staff Member

    Over unity device.
    http://www.overunity.com/


    (although overunity redirects to perpetual motion on wiki, so more or less it is under the same umbrella)
     
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2014
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  16. FreiZeitGeist

    FreiZeitGeist Senior Member

    The Mean-Goal of this isn´t debunked at all, but there isn´t any proof for their claims also...

    Besides that these machines where not unplugged, their claim is that they get 10KW electrical power from just 1KW input - to proofe that claim, you need at least a set of Multimeters on the input and on the output-side.

    I can´t see any Multimeter anywhere! Where are they?!

    You have to measure and monitore Volt/Ampere at the Inside and also on the Outside. Light-Bulbs doesn´t proofe anything.

    Free-Energy-Believers mostly just show Voltage or Ampere on the Input/Output-Side. Electrical Power is the combination of Voltage and Current (in Ampere), so you have to measure both at the Inside and Outside of your wonderfull Free-Energy-Machine to proofe that you´re getting additional Energy with it.

    ... where are the measuring instruments in those Videos?I can´t spot anyone!
     
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2014
  17. Pete Tar

    Pete Tar Moderator Staff Member

    Yeah it's not a 'hard' debunk, I think this is 'debunked' for lack of any verifiable evidence for an extraordinary claim. If it's claiming something contrary to known physics, and without verifiable evidence of an actual working device, then it can be dismissed.
    The fact that they have a dubious worldview isn't hard evidence against them but it does contribute.
     
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  18. Joe

    Joe Senior Member

  19. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

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  20. Joe

    Joe Senior Member

     
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  21. Pete Tar

    Pete Tar Moderator Staff Member

    Does this mean anything to anyone?
     
  22. NoParty

    NoParty Senior Member

    Yes. :p

    images.
     
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  23. WeedWhacker

    WeedWhacker Senior Member

    Well, am finding a lot when using a simple search of "qeg scam".

    Been around for many years, keeps popping up apparently.

    Open Sourced QEG generator: Show Me The Data



     
  24. Charlesinsandiego

    Charlesinsandiego New Member

    Per http://quantamagnetics.com/:

    ,

    . . . etc, etc. I see no claims that more energy is coming out than is going in. Doesn't sound like overunity to me.
     
  25. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    If people have a problem with a post, then report it.

    Otherwise, let's stick to the topic. Here we have a video of a supposed free-energy machine, yet it's clearly only running because it's plugged in. That's really all there is to it.
     
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  26. Pete Tar

    Pete Tar Moderator Staff Member

    Posting this from the overunity forum as it seems to be a summary of what's going on with the device, though it's all greek to me.


    ETA. The post following this disputes the COP 1.2 claim, so I'm including that just to cover possible bunk...

     
    Last edited: May 1, 2014
  27. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    The overunity people also seem to be overenthusiastic. 30 years of fiddling with this device, and they have never demonstrated actual "overunity" to actually power a light bulb, let alone a house.

    And if they DID actually get 120% efficiency, then they would indeed win the Nobel prize, revolutionize the world of science, and save the planet. Their excuse for failing to document it was that it was "pre-internet".

    To the OP, the cheering group got their plans (for free) from Fix the World. Here's the FTW consulting page:
    http://www.fixtheworldproject.net/ftw-qeg-consulting.html


    It's basically a more easy-going version of the WITTS Ministry, Enlightened Technology, from above.
     
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  28. NoParty

    NoParty Senior Member

    I've seen a lot of scams in my time, but this strikes me as one of the most cynical and cruel.

    You basically get someone to believe that building this bizarre machine will mysteriously defy the laws of science
    and accomplish something that no one--Einstein, Tesla, etc.--has ever been able to accomplish...

    and when that inevitably fails, you try to sell them multiple $300 phone calls to talk with "servants of god."

    It makes the Nigerian scam look downright benign and quaint by comparison.
     
    Last edited: May 1, 2014
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  29. Pete Tar

    Pete Tar Moderator Staff Member

    They were consulting with people in Taiwan last month, and had plans to take the scheme to Morocco. I don't see how they can stay ahead of their failure to produce.
     
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  30. Pete Tar

    Pete Tar Moderator Staff Member

    From their forum


    Invoking the 'bad vibes make it not work' line.
     
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  31. WeedWhacker

    WeedWhacker Senior Member

    Even worse (and, I had noted that previously...as if they are implying that one must "believe" in the process in order for it to "work"?).

    The reference to the famed "Double-Slit" experiment in the physics of quantum mechanics, and what seems to be an appeal to (again) a very simplistic and layperson understanding of what is represented by that science, in a manner that seems intent on attempting to perpetuate a hoax.

    This does not intend to slur those not familiar with QM (surely, it is NOT my field!), but I make a concerted effort to attempt (also a layperson in this science) to at least understand it to the best of my abilities. Not always successful, so I rely on the established experts in the field, as guides.
     
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  32. Charlesinsandiego

    Charlesinsandiego New Member



    It doesn't require a shift in consciousness to measure power in and compare it to power out. Who are these people?
     
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  33. Balance

    Balance Senior Member

    Class act! Give away schematics for a wealth machine that will not produce the goods and sell premium support services for it, adding the clause 'having the right frame of mind' required.

    "but sir, it's not a scam you simply have the wrong attitude, that's why it won't work". "and when it is working for you, we're selling today only at a rock-bottom price of $1million a month, a five-year exclusive sales right for your area" "p,s, want to buy a bridge?"
     
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  34. Mick West

    Mick West Administrator Staff Member

    In general "funny" YouTube videos are to be avoided. Most people don't watch them, and they confuse people.
     
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  35. JesusSuperLight

    JesusSuperLight New Member

    To be fair to Peter Linderman he did not use the fact that it was pre internet as an excuse but a fact. 120% over unity was not enough to make the machine run itself making it a failure. This is a terrible scam, I dont know why this is being circulated as of interest...except their reaction was interesting. The man seems to look like he has scored a goal but maybe the ball bounced off the back of his head into the net. This guy is pretty much lost for words whilst he turns the machine slotwly off. Odd stuff. Maybe it is over efficient and we just need about three of these machine in each room of the house, i'm sure we would get used to the noise
     
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  36. Pete Tar

    Pete Tar Moderator Staff Member

    Well according to the forum I'm following, the latest build in Morocco didn't achieve anything special.
     
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  37. Jazzy

    Jazzy Closed Account

    It's a popular sport, searching for a niche to suspend a loose trick of one's imagination in, so that one can become a leader in a hitherto-unknown field. One is a child running out into a freshly fallen snowfield, placing one's steps where no man has trod. Until the snow melts.

    Not that I know much about it either, but I do know of "the quantum barrier", that the quantum world is frictionless, and once one's in it, one's calculations are Newtonian only. In other words, there's very little in the way of connections or extrapolations which connect to our middle world, let alone the cosmic world of the universe. The whole idea is a straw man perpetrated by straw people.
     
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  38. Jazzy

    Jazzy Closed Account

    It can certainly warm cold soup then. Let's call it a "microwave oven", poorly described.
     
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  39. AB Hammer

    AB Hammer New Member

    The biggest problem with overunity videos are some have so many wires it is easy to slip in something to fake people out. I will admit that I do play with the gravity approach. But one must understand that it is not always the journey's end, but what you learn on the way. There are other inventions that can come from such a quest. Here are some of my crazy attempts at the quest. I do find it fascinating and have had some interesting builds that are not yet on my youtube. http://www.youtube.com/user/ABthehammer?feature=watch

    Things to look for on a gravity wheel.
    1. A slow start on its own, or a small bump or push to get it started. Not a fast hand actions.
    2. It will pick up noticeable speed if it is a possible.
    3. have them set it on its side for it will stop and make no noise in that position. If a motor is in it? It will still make noise.
    These are indication in a closed design demo. An open demo have the wheel removed from it's stand and it still be running and have them turn around for full visibility.
    Also look closely for any fishing line for it is used in fakes.

    Alan
     
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  40. WeedWhacker

    WeedWhacker Senior Member

    Wouldn't it be a fair and true thing to mention that even using gravity, friction will get you in the end. ;)

    Entropy always wins, eh?
     
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