Psychic
Senior Member
That's a pretty cool idea.... I can see it:
@Horatio: @HamletPrinceOfDenmark
There r many things not dreamt of in ur philosophy, mate #GhostOfHamlet #KylieJennerChallenge
Claim: US military are preparing a major PSYOP/martial law - Op Jade Helm
- Thread starter occams rusty scissor
- Start date
@Horatio: @HamletPrinceOfDenmark
There r many things not dreamt of in ur philosophy, mate #GhostOfHamlet #KylieJennerChallenge
David Coulter
Senior Member.
And those closed Walmarts over underground military bases and prison camps are all connected by tunnels! There is even a map showing the secret tunnel system. Logic does not have a place with people that believe this stuff.
BombDr
Senior Member.
I have had this very same conversation with some of them on Youtube: I am Detcord1
It is the utter lack of critical examination of the evidence that I find depressing.
+Amy Tudor Martial Law, they're training for a false flag to happen so they can take over.
BOB Baggins
+Amy Tudor They are supposed to fight like they train. Which is in an environment similar to what they will be fighting in. America is not like any other country, and why would troops that have a lot of combat experiance need training in such a large arena?
Everything about this screams LIE.
Domink Homeensintmeanohpee
+Austin Cordell slay the martial law basterds get them first claim sanity freasons and self defense Mayor Homan Vicew to realamericanandmade and Hulk Hogan thosetwoforeve r
detcord1
+Amy Tudor The vehicles are those returned from Afghanistan. They are in the south as it is the best storage area due to its dryness. No doubt you have been fed a load of bullshit from Infowars about how this is a takeover.
Amy Tudor
They may very well be...But you cant deny all that is going on...
detcord1
+Amy Tudor What exactly? An exercise?
Don't you think the military should train?
Amy Tudor
Are you serious right now?? Do you think the military should train in our cities and streets???If so then I am not discussing this any further..
detcord1
+Amy Tudor Are they going to be in the streets? I don't think that is part of the plan.
Where would you like the US military to train?
dragon six
+detcord1 it is a take over you just choked on the bullshit they told you. let them train and as soon as they get out of line blood will spill
detcord1
+dragon six OK Mr Dragon, when September comes and NOTHING has happened, I assume you will retract your assertion and realise that the bullshit is what is being fed to you by paranoid morons.
Its not clear in my head how Obama/Illuminati/NWO are going to coerce the US military into doing something illegal. How are you going to get the US military to fight and oppress their own families?
The only 'takeover' that has occurred is inside your head by paranoid CTs, and they rely on your fear to stay in business.
Hama Neggs
Senior Member.
And the way they 'flounce' out of the conversation and refuse to discuss it any more.
BombDr
Senior Member.
Indeed, but there is something odd going on and I am wondering if this is a generational thing, or due to the way people get their information these days.
I am 42, so twenty years ago 'news' came to me from a reliable(ish) source. In the UK the broadcasters have a code of conduct to adhere to, and one of them is that if they report something inaccurate, they are obliged to correct it. Newspapers have a slightly different code, but in essence they would hardly ever report rumours as news.
Someone aged 24 probably has a different view on how news is disseminated, and if all providers more or less look the same, then all are more or less equally trustworthy. What I am struggling with is the lack of credibility: If a source continuously asserts false information, unproven (and unprovable), baseless speculation or lies, then one would assume logically they should be ignored. The weird thing is that all the usual subjects can move on to the next claim, and the last one is forgotten like a bad smell, on to the next one.
Jade Helm though seems to have gathered momentum with each nutty CT taking it to another level. This whole thing with Vehicles is especially laughable as 1. They are obviously in transit from Afghanistan and 2. If they are on rails, they aren't coming to get your guns!
All the conversations have a predictable path though: I point out something that they could even check themselves, such as the transit of vehicles from operations, but the response is "you are stupid!" or "Isn't it obvious?" to the classic "you are a disinfo agent"
AMTV with Christopher Greene is one of my favourites. With no explanation, retraction or self-awareness to remove his prediction from his website, he posts films with titles like:
2012:
"US to outright murder Bashar-al Assad"
"London braces for terror attack in 2012 Olympics"
"US to invade Syria"
"US and Israel prepare for October attack on Iran"
"King Bibi: red line with Iran means war in the next 60 days"
"CAMP FEMA" Global oligarchs plan mass fatlities"
"War is coming to the streets of America"
"War comes after 2012 election results"
"50 states to secede from the US"
"Obama to ban guns after school massacre"
"EMERGENCY BROADCAST: Obama plans for civil war ahead of gun ban"
etc etc etc. He doesn't bother taking any of them down, yet still manages to pull in the crowds of uncritical disciples.
CapnPegleg
Member
Psychic
Senior Member
Political scientist Ivan Krastev proposes that the proliferation of 'custom' media sources (ie blogs and news sites that cater to people with ever more specific political/ideological tastes) leads to polarisation and fragmentation of political opinion, as every person can find a plethora of sites reaffirming and encouraging her original political opinions/leanings (aka a 'rabbit hole'). So, for example, if you're predisposed to alarmism over the exercise of centralized power, you can easily fall into the Infowars/AJ 'media sphere' and avoid media that challenges your opinions to an extent never before possible. (This theory can be seen as a development of Marshall McLuhan's 'The medium is the message'.) To my mind, this model does an excellent job of explaining the phenomenal growth of bizarre CT beliefs since the advent of the Internet.
But it's not all doom and gloom, as the Internet also enables the spread of specialized media challenging the other specialized media - as we see with ISF and Metabunk challenging Infowars and AJ. And the Internet makes accessing opposing beliefs and disconcerting facts easier than ever before, to those who are so inclined.
BombDr
Senior Member.
That is true, but how would we measure success or failure? I have urged people to look at MB pages about their favourite hobby horse, but they often retort that is a 'proven disinfo' site. This week I signposted someone to the page about Noah Pozner's photo appearing in Pakistan, and they retorted that MB are clearly the 'cleaners for their mistakes'.
Its hard to have a sensible discussion with people so out of reach of reason.
Whitebeard
Senior Member.
I think our role here is less about helping those deep in the rabbit hole, I fear most of them are beyond reach. All we can do for them is drop down ropes they can climb should they ever really 'wake up'. I see MB as a bit like those people who hang around suicide hot spots and try to stop people jumping in the first place.
How many are kept out of wonderland we will never know, sometimes a seed of doubt planted in a CT mind can tale weeks, months or even years to flower into reason, and we may never see that revelation, all we can do is keep on being a beacon of reason and hope for the best.
tadaaa
Senior Member
I am not sure how it was reported in the U.S., but here in the UK we recently had a Fox News "expert" describe Birmingham (United Kingdom) as a "no go area" do to Muslim Extremism on US TV - this made the news in the UK (utter bunk btw)
http://www.theguardian.com/media/20...over-birmingham-is-totally-muslim-city-claims
He was rightly pilloried in all the UK media - and offered an unreserved apology - even our PM (and I am no fan of him, caught the general mood)
“When I heard this, frankly, I choked on my porridge and I thought it must be April Fools’ day,” Cameron said. “This guy’s clearly a complete idiot.”
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It was covered pretty much the same in the US.
Psychic
Senior Member
A governor, probable presidential candidate, and 'moderate' Republican named Bobby Jindal said something similar while he was in the UK, and got called out for it. (http://www.cnn.com/2015/01/19/politics/jindal-no-go-zones-london/).
It seems anecdotally that the 'sharia zone' myth is quite popular among right-wingers and is spread by right-wing media in the states. As per Ivan Krastev's model, if all one's news sources are right-wing, he may never be exposed to the fact that the whole sharia thing is a myth. (My right-wing American friends were entirely convinced that 'sharia zones' exist in the UK and France, until I appealed to a couple of friends from France who said they'd never heard of them.) Many American right-wingers also believe that France is at the threshold of becoming a majority Muslim country (about 6% of French people are religious Muslims; if 6% is 49%, then Canada and Australia are 110% Hindu). As a popular joke goes, 'What is the only Muslim democracy? France'.*
*Thus also revealing ignorance of the many democratic and almost-democratic Muslim countries, including Indonesia, Malaysia, Turkey, Pakistan, Jordan, Tunisia (bravo), and (drumroll please) Iran.
BombDr
Senior Member.
Hmmmmmm, Pakistan, Jordan and Iran are kinda democratic, but not in the western sense. Certainly not if you are female and hoping to run for office, but you still make a valid point.
tadaaa
Senior Member
What is quite apposite about news reporting is that it is 21.57 BST in the UK and we have been voting in a general election today
There has been a total news blackout about reporting it, other than the basic facts (I believe by law)
The polls close in 3 mins - and all hell is going to set forth in the media (apologies off topic, but quite exiting)
There has been a total news blackout about reporting it, other than the basic facts (I believe by law)
The polls close in 3 mins - and all hell is going to set forth in the media (apologies off topic, but quite exiting)
BombDr
Senior Member.
Spectrar Ghost
Senior Member.
I wish we had a blackout on election day in the US. That would make early November much more bearable for me.
tadaaa
Senior Member
I believe the French have a law that restricts the reporting of "polls" for at least a week before voting
But we in the UK have had a lot of debate about the U.S. tradition of televised "presidential" debates
Spectrar Ghost
Senior Member.
It's not worth it, IMO. I wonder if there are any studies about whether US polling numbers change over the course of the day? I bet they do, though whether it provides an advantage to the frontrunner or underdog is anyone's guess. But that's a subject for another thread.
BombDr
Senior Member.
I don't know about the most recent election in Israel, but in 1996 the rules were the news could not show politicians or their voices in the run up to polling day, and they had to communicate via political broadcasts, which is quite a challenge when you have over 30 parties.
It was also quite a challenge as in that one there was a suicide bombing a day at one stage, and they didn't know how to report them...
Israel is an odd country though....
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SR1419
Senior Member.
http://www.sltrib.com/news/2489059-155/defense-secretary-ash-carter-denies-internet
Defense Secretary Ash Carter is flatly denying the frenzied Internet speculation that a U.S. military exercise in Texas is part of a hostile takeover.
Asked during a press conference about the Jade Helm 15 exercise and whether the Pentagon was planning to overtake Texas, Carter simply said "no" as the packed room laughed.
Can we label this Debunked now?
BombDr
Senior Member.
Thats what they want you to think....!Defense Secretary Ash Carter is flatly denying the frenzied Internet speculation that a U.S. military exercise in Texas is part of a hostile takeover.
Asked during a press conference about the Jade Helm 15 exercise and whether the Pentagon was planning to overtake Texas, Carter simply said "no" as the packed room laughed.
"Its just a shower....."
MikeC
Closed Account
It was debunked a long time ago - but of course THEY want you to believe that!
And to be honest would he have said "yes" even if it was the case??
NoParty
Senior Member.
Now, I imagine that since I've posted here 1,383 times, that some would accuse me of being somewhat partisan...
but still, the way I see it, we're absolutely crushing the purveyors of transparent scare tactics!!!
"A good debunk gets halfway around the world before an
absurd conspiracy theory has a chance to get its pants on."
Drunken Winston Churchill
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Psychic
Senior Member
Way to go, Party.... I haven't seen anything so depressing in weeks!Now, I imagine that since I've posted here 1,383 times, that some would accuse me of being somewhat partisan...
but still, the way I see it, we're absolutely crushing the purveyors of transparent scare tactics!!!
Still, I like that drop around October. Anyone know what happened?
Probably a change in Google search algorithm.
Metabunk gets less than 4% the traffic of Infowars. But most of their traffic is repeat readers. Most of ours is people looking things up.
deirdre
Senior Member.
David Coulter
Senior Member.
This is shocking - complete disrespect for a US Army Colonel explaining Jade Helm. The CT's start up at around 1:30. I found the fact that people (presumably CTs) were taking pictures and videos a bit disturbing - more grist for the conspiracy mill.
http://launch.newsinc.com/share.htm...n=statesman_nws_loc_sty_ppap&videoId=28960637
http://launch.newsinc.com/share.htm...n=statesman_nws_loc_sty_ppap&videoId=28960637
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BombDr
Senior Member.
He did a reasonable job of handling them, but he could have said something like:
"Sir, when was the last time the US Army violated the constitution?"
I also thing the judge/councilman/clerk/mayor or whatever should have arbitrated the questions a bit more orderly.
They shouldn't have to pander to these weirdos, but perhaps a PR officer from Texas...?
metaception
New Member
As a Texan, that was embarrassing. The Colonel handled it very well. At the point when everyone started cheering for the one guy that said he didn't believe a word the Colonel just said, the Colonel's face was screaming "Are these guys freaking serious??".
His very last sentence summed it up perfectly, it was something along the lines of,
"These people want this to be something that it is not..."
which honestly seems to be the case. They have all fully convinced themselves that this exercise will usher in martial law to the point where they will not accept any other explanation. When I first heard about this conspiracy, it took me roughly half an hour of research to make an informed opinion that this exercise is just another exercise. These people look like they didn't try anything of the sort. I imagine them feeding their ideas off of each other without doing some honest investigation. Then again this is Texas and most of these people aren't the brightest belt buckle around.
Bruno D.
Senior Member.
The sad part will be when the military decides to be a little less public in the next exercises. This will cause some CTer to "undisclose" the new secret exercise, and that will prove it's shady.
If they try to do everything as public as possible to avoid suspicion, it's suspicious.
If they try to keep it "secret" to avoid paranoia, it's suspicious.
That's just nice.
If they try to do everything as public as possible to avoid suspicion, it's suspicious.
If they try to keep it "secret" to avoid paranoia, it's suspicious.
That's just nice.
BombDr
Senior Member.
Bruno, its even better than that for the Alex Jones' of this world:
If the exercise goes completely as planned, then they take the credit for alerting true patriots, thereby spoiling Obama's evil plot.
If some moron decides to do something dumb and threaten/shoot/ClivenBundiyise the Army, then it will be a false flag.
If nothing at all happens, its a psyop for the 'real' event.
If it gets cancelled, then the middle-aged, balding, unfit militia members defeated tyranny and scared away the drones with their pick-ups.
Its a win-win, whatever happens.
BombDr
Senior Member.
I don't envy the Col, but if it had been me I might have asked "Sir, why have you come to this meeting if you have already decided what is going on?"
occams rusty scissor
Senior Member.
AND the latest IW piece in the JH15 saga turns the paranoia up to 11, to the degree of just truly bizarre. It takes Alex just 3m55 secs to use my personal favourite quote of "They're training for the robots to come after us!"
Confirmed: Jade Helm Is For The American People
It's 49 minutes long, and to be honest I haven't the time (or strength) ATM to completely watch it. I will try edit later to provide a synopsis as per forum PG. But briefly, the majority that I have skipped through relates to them providing their own interpretation on the JH15 logo and speaking about what the motto "Master the human domain" means (hint- it's sinister!) re a 'fusion of the police and military gathering intelligence for use against Americans'. It also further explores the paranoia that "this is training for use against YOU...this is domestic" but only offers their own interpretation from videos mentioned in this thread previously from military sources. 
JRBids
Senior Member.
Hannity this after noon had two military men who basically said Jade Helm was an exercise that was not unusual. Both followed up their comments with statements that they "understand" people being afraid, because Obama is this and Obama is that and can't be trusted blah blah blah.
occams rusty scissor
Senior Member.
Unfortunately, Chuck Norris has jumped on the band wagon as well. Don't forget, once a celebrity says something, it's true:
It would seem that at this stage of the game virtually nothing will satisfy this anti-JH crowd in terms of information, short of actually letting them participate too.
The last paragraph is especially confusing where he asks for transparency about JH15, as I can't think of how much more the military can possibly give to set peoples minds at ease? As far as I can see, the US government has had to go a few steps further in terms of PR just on this one exercise than would normally be required. And the more info they give, the less they have been trusted.
...
Concerned Texans and Americans are in no way calling into question our brave and courageous men and women in uniform. They are merely following orders. What’s under question are those who are pulling the strings at the top of Jade Helm 15 back in Washington. The U.S. government says, “It’s just a training exercise.” But I’m not sure the term “just” has any reference to reality when the government uses it.
...
If Washington wants to cool the embers of controversy, then it should quit stoking the fire, as with the posting of a map of Jade Helm 15 “just” exercises that label some areas of the country, including Texas, as “hostile,” according to KHOU 11 News in Houston and verified by the Washington Post.
I have an idea: If the government insists on running expanded military ops across seven Southwest states, why doesn’t it move all that “military training” south and protect our borders at the same time?!
Whatever Jade Helm 15 actually is, I think it is more than coincidental that the FBI director just confessed in February that the presence of ISIS can be felt in all 50 states of the U.S. and that the Pentagon is suddenly running its biggest military training exercise with every branch of the military across seven Southwestern states. Whether deterrence, display of power or something more covert or devious, let’s not come with any patronizing nonsense of impotence and simplicity when its origin is in Washington.
...
It’s neither over-reactionary nor conspiratorial to call into question or ask for transparency about Jade Helm 15 or any other government activity. To those who merely think we should check our brains at the door of the White House and trust what the government does, I would reiterate to you the words of one of our government’s primary founders, Benjamin Franklin, who said, “Distrust and caution are the parents of security.” Again, he also said, “Security without liberty is called prison.” But then again, I’m sure some today would accuse Franklin of being conspiratorial, too!
...
It would seem that at this stage of the game virtually nothing will satisfy this anti-JH crowd in terms of information, short of actually letting them participate too.
BombDr
Senior Member.
Like watching a car crash, I sat through it: I didn't want to watch, but couldn't turn away....
There is the obvious Infowars'isms, of overwhelming the audience with unrelated snippets of information in a panting, breathless voice that suggests they are running out of time, then the outraged incredulity, "how can the head of asymmetric warfare not know whats going on? He's lying!"
I think the IW guys are wilfully missing the nature of the 'human domain' piece. This is something that has entered military lexicon since Iraq and Afghanistan (and to a lesser extent Northern Ireland and the Balkans) and it is now a planning stage called 'Human terrain', which we previously had not considered as we used to focus on physical terrain and enemy forces.
Iraq and Afghanistan exposed this weakness in our understanding of the battle space, and we now plan human terrain mapping of what ethic group lives where and what their alliances are. We then add an 'influence' overlay on the mapping and it becomes a factor in our planning.
Now this to me is prudent military philosophy at work - know who and where you are operating - but to IW its MARTIAL LAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
NoParty
Senior Member.
I definitely see the humor here. People who obsess on (non-binding!!) plans like Agenda 21
probably can't wrap their heads around how one of their overlords seems not to be the least bit familiar with it...
Yeah, they really got rewarded for trying to be super transparent, months in advance, this time, eh?
It cheeses me off, because gov should be rewarded for transparency...punishing them this time and making wild
accusations re. "martial law," etc., send the wrong message to the gov...that the people can't handle transparency.
And Chuck Norris? Really? Is anyone actually thinking: "I bet Chuck Norris has rational, insightful information to contribute" ?
Spectrar Ghost
Senior Member.
RE: Chuck Norris
I'd be more sympathetic towards him if he'd just share those cancer-curing tears with humanity. Selfish bastard.
I felt the Daily Show did a pretty god job on this one, though the fact that it even registered on their radar is slightly terrifying.
I'd be more sympathetic towards him if he'd just share those cancer-curing tears with humanity. Selfish bastard.
I felt the Daily Show did a pretty god job on this one, though the fact that it even registered on their radar is slightly terrifying.
occams rusty scissor
Senior Member.
I guess he once played a Delta Force commando in the movies, so that kind of qualifies him as expert, right??
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